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The EU is this what you want

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posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 08:53 PM
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Originally posted by Europe
No they came AFTER cromwell ya clown and AT the behest of the crown. read the post


Cromwell did pretty much empty the land, so it seems logical that with all that space, people would move there.


Originally posted by Europe
Im sorry i didnt know that the scotts founded the british empire.
The difference on spending has to do with population density at least that would be my guess, unless you can show me that they get more on the dole up there.


Tis not what I said, was it?

The difference has nothing to do with "population density". Scotland is, on average, vastly less densely populated than England. And when measured per capita, density has no bearing. They get £1500 per head more than in England. hence why they get free prescriptions, lower council tax and free Uni.


Originally posted by Europe
The catholics are a minority but have a far higher birth rate and there at 40% and climbing,


Ah, this old nutshell. People have been saying that about those dastardly Muslims for years, yet haven't seen any evidence of it yet.


Originally posted by Europe
and this is true that the army originally came to protect the catholics from the abusive protestants in power but this soon changed when the british army started killing catholics on the street.


Hang on, you guys turned on the Army first! Don't bitch when they turn around and fire back!


Originally posted by Europe
I fully realise and acknowledge most of what you are saying, but you not being irish you dont know what hun means here, it is a derogatory term for british, and in 1922 there was support for staying part of the empire just not enough obviously.


No, obviously and I do not begrudge you your independance.

Also, I do not think you would appreciate being called a bogwog or Paddy, so don't start throwing around insults about us British. I offer you the same courtesy.


Originally posted by Europe
And our students out perform english students every day of the week.


Not true in the slightest.

English Pupils in the World Top ten


news.bbc.co.uk...



Originally posted by Europe
Ah so according to your logic ye must be roman! because they founded a lot of cities in britain,


Nope, because anyone with an ounce of knowledge knows that for the most part, Roman legionaires were forbidden from intermarrying with the locals. The bulk of the british population was ancient Brythyonic Britons.


Originally posted by Europe
or are ye actually irish because we built all yer modern cities


No "yer" didn't and how does being a labourer suddenly mean you took over the country?



Originally posted by Europe
, and the normans replaced most of the ruling class of both english and irish societies not the vast underclasses.


Indeed.



Originally posted by Europe
and it is proven that IRISH dna is distinct throughout most of europe, meaning we have remained virtually unchanged (despite all the stuff you mentioned) for 10000 years www.insideireland.com...


Same could be said of the "English". 70% of the current population can, gentically, trace their ancestry back to the original Brythyonic population.



Originally posted by Europe
ya hun



No need to be rude. Like I said, you wouldn't like it if I started throwing names around, would you?




posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by stumason



Originally posted by Europe
And our students out perform english students every day of the week.


Not true in the slightest.

English Pupils in the World Top ten


news.bbc.co.uk...



According to the HDI included in the UN (which is a bit better than the BBC) UK is 17th.... Ireland is 5th. Norway is usually the one that tops the list.

There are countless surveys around the world showing education standards, UK and USA usually fall low (ranging from 16th to 25th place – just look at your own link for secondary studies in the UK).

The majority of surveys and reports put Ireland in the top 5. Ireland is know for having one of the best education systems in the world.

Regardless, at the end of the day they are just surveys and reports, some biased, some not.

HDI

Mikey



posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 09:25 PM
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reply to post by Mikey84
 


Ha! Fair enough, that'll be all their EU money paying for their schools then....

But, you're right, we could sit here all day pulling out contradictory "reports" to prove a pointless point....

EDIT: Also, those HDI figures are the UK, not England. Even the BBC link I provided showed that Scotland and Wales were quite bloody awful, so if we get lumped in with them, we get dragged down....


In Scotland, primary pupils were ranked 22nd for maths and 15th for science and secondary pupils were 23rd for science and 17th for maths.


[edit on 9/12/08 by stumason]



posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by Mikey84
 


Ha! Fair enough, that'll be all their EU money paying for their schools then....

But, you're right, we could sit here all day pulling out contradictory "reports" to prove a pointless point....


Exactly, the same report says that Australia is high in Education terms (they put in 3rd in the world), and I can tell you after doing school in Ireland and Australia, the Australian secondary system is terrible.

SO it’s usually best to ignore those reports, majority of Irish and British people I know are smart enough, majority of Aussies I know are well......., proof is in the pudding.

And yep your correct, yes Ireland high standard has been helped by the EU funding (not long ago most people in Ireland didn’t even finish secondary school) now most people complete Uni and go on to get a masters. So there is no reason for them to whine about the EU, they have benefited so much from it.

Mikey


[edit on 9/12/2008 by Mikey84]



posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 09:40 PM
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Originally posted by stumason

EDIT: Also, those HDI figures are the UK, not England. Even the BBC link I provided showed that Scotland and Wales were quite bloody awful, so if we get lumped in with them, we get dragged down....

[edit on 9/12/08 by stumason]


lol but you are happy to be lumped with them when it comes to the Olympics and get a high medal tally. You can’t have it both ways


Mikey

[edit on 9/12/2008 by Mikey84]



posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 09:59 PM
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Originally posted by Mikey84

Originally posted by stumason


lol but you are happy to be lumped with them when it comes to the Olympics and get a high medal tally. You can’t have it both ways


Mikey

[edit on 9/12/2008 by Mikey84]


Not really, I think most people would be pefectly willing for England, Scotland & Wales to be represented seperately at The Olympics.

Another example of how England cannot express itself; there were seperate homecoming parades for Scottish & Welsh Olympic athletes in Edingburgh and Cardiff, there was a British homecoming parade for British athletes in London, yet no English homecoming parade.

Not very important, but another example of the sort of thing that is increasingly beginning to annoy and alienate more and more English people.



posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 10:39 PM
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Back to the Original topic..........

I just want to show some of the scare tactics and exaggerations used about the EU that people have (unfortunately) swallowed.

British Passport Covers Banned

In this article they try to spin that because of the EU the British coat of arms has been banned. Further research will show anyone who bothers to look that it actually has nothing to do with the EU, it’s a case of a British company making Passport Covers and reproducing the coat of arms (reproducing the coat of arms is illegal without permission). Again, nothing to do with the EU.

--

EU wants to get rid of Queen from British passports

In this article they try to spin it that the EU wants the Queens message on the front page and the coat of arms removed. Further research will show that what the EU suggejest to all member countries that they put a passage somewhere in the passport stating that as an EU citizen they have the rights of locals when in another EU country. They EU never once suggested that the Queens passage or coat of arms be removed, The new passports which were issued after this article still have the passage and coat of arms, and looking through my British passport now I can’t see EU message, I also can’t see it in my Irish passport. Neither of my passports has the EU flag on, as suggested in the article. Again, this is more scare tactics.

--

Security fear as EU drops boarders

This one tries to scare people into thinking that waves of illegals will be coming. The boarders that were dropped where within the EU (so its citizens were already legally allowed to move to the UK or anywhere else in the EU). It just made the process easier.

--

Illegal Immigration to the UK

This article puts Poles and Eastern Europeans in the same category as illegal immigrants. They are not. The numbers of illegal immigrants (that’s people from NON-EU countries) has doubled and is continuing to rise. This has nothing to do with the EU or the EU enlargement; it has to do with the UK immigration policy that is currently in.

--

UK to lose millions in fees from EU incomers

This article goes on about how the UK will suffer because of all the fees they will lose, oh boo hoo. They forget to mention the thousands of British Citizens who go to other EU countries to study for free (Ireland, France, Denmark, Sweden and Germany where a lot head to). They forget to mention that the system works both ways.

--

These are just few examples, there are several thousand more, you see how people take what they read or hear in the media and they don’t look further into it, or stop to think about it.

The reasons people give for not wanting the Euro range from loss of national identity or higher taxes and even to the fact that they might have double pricing for a while. The only real reason the UK shouldn’t adopt the Euro was because the pound was a strong currency; the other reasons are mostly from uninformed people. Times have changed and the pound is not what it used to be.

Mikey






[edit on 9/12/2008 by Mikey84]



posted on Dec, 10 2008 @ 04:05 AM
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Mikey you can believe wholeheartedly in the EU treaty, that's your entitlement, but it still doesn't change the fact that the EU government is corrupt, it's fascist and non democratic and because of that, the majority of people in this country will oppose it in some way or another.

[edit on 10-12-2008 by kindred]



posted on Dec, 10 2008 @ 07:15 AM
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Originally posted by stumason
Cromwell did pretty much empty the land, so it seems logical that with all that space, people would move there.

Ah good ol british logic, my house is usually empty between the hours of 8 in the morning and 5 in the evening, move on in why dont ya.




Tis not what I said, was it?

Unfortunatly that is what you said



The difference has nothing to do with "population density". Scotland is, on average, vastly less densely populated than England. And when measured per capita, density has no bearing. They get £1500 per head more than in England. hence why they get free prescriptions, lower council tax and free Uni.

Scotland has less people spread over more remote areas, to get the same level of service that is available in england you have to spend more, common sense, but then england has never been good at that.
Because i imagine that is what they were aiming for, a certain level of service!



Ah, this old nutshell. People have been saying that about those dastardly Muslims for years, yet haven't seen any evidence of it yet.

Oh they have been saying this for years about the muslims? ive only heard this in the past 3 years myself!





Hang on, you guys turned on the Army first! Don't bitch when they turn around and fire back!

And it was actually The northern irish government called the soldiers in because of the civil rights riots, catholics had no rights and no representation in government, the soldiers banned all forms of protest which invariable led to civillians being killed.




No, obviously and I do not begrudge you your independance.

Also, I do not think you would appreciate being called a bogwog or Paddy, so don't start throwing around insults about us British. I offer you the same courtesy.

Thank you but i dont care if you begrudge me my independence.
I also dont care what you call me cause im so winning this argument.



Not true in the slightest.

English Pupils in the World Top ten


news.bbc.co.uk...


Sorry but its Very true, as covered in posts up above, ill take the UNs word in such matters.


Nope, because anyone with an ounce of knowledge knows that for the most part, Roman legionaires were forbidden from intermarrying with the locals. The bulk of the british population was ancient Brythyonic Britons.

The logic you used on me must also be applied to yourself, you said we were not irish because the vikings founded our cities, i turn around and apply the same logic to you and you say im wrong..........typical




No "yer" didn't and how does being a labourer suddenly mean you took over the country?

Again the same logic as above albeit with a slight twist. Its not my fault if you cant comprehend it.


Originally posted by Europe
, and the normans replaced most of the ruling class of both english and irish societies not the vast underclasses.


Indeed.

well when i said that what i meant was that the normans took over english society and as ireland was ruled by the english ipso facto they took over irlenad.



Same could be said of the "English". 70% of the current population can, gentically, trace their ancestry back to the original Brythyonic population.

very true but then i wasnt the one who brought up the whole race thing.

Originally posted by Europe
ya hun


I stand by my original statement



posted on Dec, 10 2008 @ 07:59 AM
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Originally posted by kindred
Mikey you can believe wholeheartedly in the EU treaty, that's your entitlement, but it still doesn't change the fact that the EU government is corrupt, it's fascist and non democratic and because of that, the majority of people in this country will oppose it in some way or another.

[edit on 10-12-2008 by kindred]


I’m still waiting for you to show me how you find it takes away your freedoms and is undemocratic. How do you find government corruption limited to only the EU and not your own UK government?

You say the majority of your country opposes the EU.... so why are you still in it? Your country is free to leave at anytime? So why don’t you and the citizens of your country, if they feel so strong about it stand up and demand they leave EU? Or are they afraid they might lose their homes in Spain?

From an outside position looking in, it would seem the UK has already lost a lot of its freedom and democratic ways...... none of which is down to the EU.

Mikey


[edit on 10/12/2008 by Mikey84]



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 09:32 AM
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I've already posted videos and links answering all your questions, but you've already made your mind up about the EU and no amount of proof will change that..


Sorry but the EU treaty or constitution is not democratic.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 08:25 PM
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reply to post by kindred
 


yes it is!



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 03:29 AM
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PROVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 04:09 AM
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I wanted to go into this deep but I dont know how to


One side is saying hey he has a point!!! "corruption/laws"

The other side says well the world is just that "only names for places/history"

But then I look back and think oh boy
shafted!!

Not much one can do, riot or suck it up i guess.



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 09:40 AM
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It appears to me & probably most other people reading these response's Europe you are not "winning" this argument your reverting to insult him cos his points are clearly more valid than yours




posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 08:46 PM
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reply to post by kindred
 


The simple fact that people are voting on it makes it so ya numpty.



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 08:49 PM
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reply to post by Bun-G
 


It appears to you that an english man is right when you are probably english and cant take the FACT that england has been commiting genocide in Ireland for 800 years.



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 08:50 PM
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BAA BAA

I dont want to read that.

I am a sheep.

You are crazy.

In a decade you will be a genius.

or dead....

One way or the other I wish you well.

[edit on 12-12-2008 by XXXN3O]



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 08:59 PM
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reply to post by XXXN3O
 


care to elaborate?



posted on Dec, 12 2008 @ 09:35 PM
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reply to post by Europe
 


Yes, for anyone seeing what is happening this is, what you will become in a decade or two.

If you cannot see it then you are not meant to see it until you understand it.

If you want to understand it ask the right question.

If you do not understand and fail to try and understand you are a sheep.

We all know what happens to the sheep as the past has already and still shows with a bit of research or a local abbotoir for the really stupid.

Hence the BAA

For the record I cannot quote for some reason and for that my apologies in relation to your question and my post above.

Cheers



[edit on 12-12-2008 by XXXN3O]



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