Ahmadinejad says Israel will soon disappear

Originally posted by RiotComing
reply to post by Mad_Hatter & jamie83

 

With all respect to your posts, this report has nothing to do with Obama specifically, so I'd rather this thread was kept on topic within the context I'm trying to bring to it.

Riot, in the current political season and with recent events happening (Bush's speech in Isreal and Obama's whining that Bush intended the jab at him) it's impossible for this thread NOT to arc off toward some political jib-jabbings. The very content of the thread is one of the major political issues at stake when considering Obama as a candidate here in the U.S.

We can try to keep the polticizing to a minimal, but I wouldn't count on it.

How many times and different ways does he have to state it?

It is pretty plain he envisions the State of Israel no longer being in existence as a Jewish State in the Middle East. Would someone care to dispute that with me?

Perhaps if he just says "I wish for all the Jews in Palestine that I consider Zionists (which is what percent ya think?) to simply cease to exist. Nah, I bet the apologists will still find a way to say that "that's not what he means". Maniacial despots have a way of stating their goals more clearly as time goes on.

Don't worry, Israel will take care of the problem themselves if the rest of the world fails to. Mark my words, they will not wait till the last second.

reply to post by RiotComing

The Hidden Imam is, according to Islamic tradition, due to reappear after a period in which the Muslims suffer great persecution and calamity. Muhammad, the Prophet of Islam, said that the Mahdi "will fill the earth will equity and justice as it was filled with oppression and tyrannyS" (Sunan Abu Dawud, book 36, no. 4272). The Mahdi will not appear until that oppression and tyranny have for Muslims reached levels unparalleled in human history: as Muhammad also says: "It will be a calamity which, in severity, shall be unprecedented. It will be so violent that the earth with injustice and corruption will shrivel for its inhabitants" (Ibn Hajar, al-Sawa'iq al-muharriqa, p. 161).

It is not beyond the realm of possibility that Ahmadinejad is calculating that he can hasten the coming of the Imam Mahdi by bringing about an increase of what he would regard as oppression of the Muslims - "oppression" that would in reality be a defensive response to an Iranian attack.

Ahmadinejad, by contrast, shares with Trotsky an apocalyptic world outlook. He favors direct action in pursuit of a permanent Islamic revolution that will pave the way for the return of the Hidden Imam, pave it with blood, sweat and tears. Indeed he'd like to speed things up, as you point out, and implicitly he hopes to achieve this by twisting the arm of the Almighty - no less so than the cloners of red heifers and would-be re-builders of the Temple hope to do as a means of speeding up the Rupture. The fact that he is more sincere in his beliefs and more earnest in his endeavors than the kleptocrats of the House of Saud are in theirs, is alarming but unsurprising. He is a visionary; they are Machiavellian cynics.

source

I'm not a sympathizer, rather a realist.

When I look at the whole scenario, I can't help but to think, actions speak louder than words.

Iran hasn't attacked anyone. Israel has. I'm sorry, but that speaks for itself. I'm not going to have a negative view on Iran until they do something that justifies it.
I don't care how much this one man shouts... he hasn't attacked anyone. He can keep shouting until he's blue in the face... the fact still remains, they haven't attacked.



Now, I thought I might just push this other little bit in before the religious get in here.
The Christian bible states that war is NEVER an option... however, there was a revision a while back, that claimed War is never an option until ALL POSSIBLE ALTERNATIVES are exhausted, and in that event, the war should only be fought on the grounds to seek peace with the enemy.

When you look at the world... the US and Israel have been known to wage war without exhausting barely any alternatives...
Then you look at Iran, and notice they aren't waging war at all.

Essentially, before the religious get in here and start blasting Iran... remember, you're the ones who are violating your own religions rules, not them.

If you're religion has any merit, then, essentially, you're the first to be sent to your "hell".

Of course, I don't believe in such things... but I know the religious are going to be flooding this area soon, so I thought I might get that out there before hand.

reply to post by cavscout


It's been pretty well explained before - you can read about it here.

Ahmadinejad, keeps saying he will completely destroy Israel.. My opinion of this is...
They have a Nuclear Weapon (s) or are Close to having one.. and Israel will be their first target.. Israel also has many Nuclear weapons in their arsenal.

If one is ever detonated on Israel's soil.. Iran and their assumed collaborator countries will be utterly Destroyed by Nuclear attack.

I'm not sure of what will happen to the rest of the world.. When and If this happens.. But it can't be good.

~L

antichrist will rise to power soon

Israel and Iran just need to duke it out and get it over with this is ridiculous. The US shouldnt and does not need to get involved except to supply weapons and maybe some money to help our allies and thats as far as it goes unless Iran attacks us directly which I DO NOT see happening. Like someone above said Iran talks a lot of smack but you dont see them attacking anyone unlike other people we know.

I feel there needs to be a war to settle the Israeli situation because sometimes there is a long peace to be had after a good war. This needs to end and the US keeps sticking their nose into it and does not let this play its course. I think there is a lot of propaganda being thrown out there to get the Americans to be ready and willing to die for a war we should have nothing to do with. This policing the world HAS TO END because we are near bankruptcy and collapse and Iran knows this. We took out the Soviets with smack talk which forced the Soviets to bankrupt themselves buying all the military crap for a cause that never existed (war with us) and Iran and company is doing the same. Just wait soon you will see stuff like this....

Originally posted by johnsky
Iran hasn't attacked anyone. Israel has.

Sooooo, are we talking about just within the last year or two?

Iran held Americans hostage, remember? They fought a long and verrrrrrry bloody war with Iraq, remember? They took several British military members hostage for a week, remember? And, although I guess you cant blame them, they are supplying men and weapons to Iraqi freedom fighters. Right or wrong, they are fighting a proxy war with the US in Iraq AND fighting a proxy war with Israel through Hezbollah.

I dont support a war against them, however you cant deny that they aren’t the peaceful little victim just sitting by and being attacked on all sides.

They wanted regional influence, they wanted to fill the vacuum left by Sadam in the region, so their leaders put on big boy undies and started mouthing off and instead of ignoring them like we should have our leaders wont let them just bow out and take off the big boy undies.

The Christian bible states that war is NEVER an option... however, there was a revision a while back, that claimed War is never an option until ALL POSSIBLE ALTERNATIVES are exhausted, and in that event, the war should only be fought on the grounds to seek peace with the enemy.

I dont think Christ ever said that.

You cant, no mater what the Pope claims, revise the words of the Lord.

Can you please provide for me the verse where Christ said war was OK under any circumstance at all?

I seem to remember him telling us to turn the other cheek, even unto death, even 777 times if necessary.


[edit on 2-6-2008 by cavscout]

Originally posted by cavscout


Iran held Americans hostage, remember?

After our CIA overthrew their democratically elected government in 1953 we inserted the Shah who was our chump that is until the revolution which many people were mad at us for getting rid of their government in the 50s.

They fought a long and verrrrrrry bloody war with Iraq, remember?

Iraq invaded Iran in that war with our backing dont forget that....

You have to understand history to understand the Iranians dislike for us because we have been messing with their people for 60+ years now. I find it ironic the US points out things like the hostage crisis and they dont tell you what may have caused that crisis. Its always we are right and they are wrong and the government has conditioned the people to believe this hence the 85% sheeple population here in the states. The CIA calls situations like this blowback and our policing the world has cause ALOT of the problems we face today.



[edit on 2-6-2008 by mybigunit]

Why do they need to go to war? Let them have their nuclear power,stop kissing Israel's arse,i think we could find a vast number of quotes from israeli prime ministers that are not so nice,get Israeli troops of south lebanon,stop building homes all over the tiny little bit of land they have left and get round and talk.Btw Iran has not invaded another country for hundreds of years,its a great country...with problems no doubt..but not like many people in the west like to portray.I really despise all this War with Iran crap...they have done *nothing* wrong..yet people are discussing nuking a country?!..And Iran gives people in palestian AK-47's to defend themselves..meanwhile America via Uk etc give them thousands of bombs,illegal WMD's etc etc Everyone should keep their noses out of it...especially America,this would give them a good reason to come to a better conclusion other than war.

Originally posted by Mad_Hatter
Jamie,

I don't think Obama cares much about Israel....at least not as much as he does the Palestinians. Just a thought.

You don't say?

I never would have guessed.

Is it fair to say that since Obama's father's side of the family is Muslim, he might be more inclined to by sympathetic to the Iranians, Palestinians, Syrians, et al., than he is to Israel?

Originally posted by mybigunit
I find it ironic the US points out things like the hostage crisis and they dont tell you what may have caused that crisis. Its always we are right and they are wrong...

Well, I will assume that was directed at because of the quotes.

I did state that I do NOT support a war against them and that I was not passing judgment against them in their proxy war with us via the Iraqi freedom fighters.

You did state that you are a realist, so I thought you would be interested in the truth, not protecting your side.

But what ever, hear only what you want to. Not my panties in a bundle.

Originally posted by jamie83
Is it fair to say that since Obama's father's side of the family is Muslim, he might be more inclined to by sympathetic to the Iranians, Palestinians, Syrians, et al., than he is to Israel?

Nor necessarily. Wasn’t he raised by his mother's family as a Christian?

I could be totally off, correct me if I am, I just dont care enough about the man to become an expert on his background.

post removed. should have read entire thread befoe posting. oops.



[edit on 2-6-2008 by JSR]

Originally posted by JSR
can you explain to me what he means by "geographically removed"?

I went and looked up "geographical." It DOES NOT mean metaphysical, peaceful or spiritual.

Dave would have us believe that what he REALLY meant in that speech was that he loves the Israelis and wants to go shoe shopping with them.

Originally posted by cavscout

Originally posted by jamie83
Is it fair to say that since Obama's father's side of the family is Muslim, he might be more inclined to by sympathetic to the Iranians, Palestinians, Syrians, et al., than he is to Israel?

Nor necessarily. Wasn’t he raised by his mother's family as a Christian?

I could be totally off, correct me if I am, I just dont care enough about the man to become an expert on his background.

You're right. If anything, the influence might be more from his step-father, Lolo Soetoro. Obama's mother moved to Indonesie with Soetoro and Obama lived there until he was 10, at which point he moved back to Hawaii.

So it's curious that Obama's father was Muslim, his step-father was Muslim, and he lived in Indonesia with his step-father until he was 10, but yet he claims he was always Christian.

Just seems like he might have been raised a Muslim in Indonesia until he was 10.

Oh, good. Someone is sticking up for the rest of the world and making their threats public instead of private (ahhem, U.S.).

I can only hope that this actually happens. Drop that nuke on the white house, and drop the other nuke on the Israeli Embassy, then drop 2 nukes in the center of Iran, and 2 in the center of Israel. Did I miss a place? China, Russia anyone?

Awe... *deep sigh*... I can't wait... finally.

Oh, and one on the Vatican! (and a few fanatical ATS members, too)

[edit on 2-6-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

reply to post by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal


Really, wasn’t that a whole lot of hate from someone who's avatar says "love" and who's mini profile would have you believe they are trying to "transcend" the human condition?

What are you, Rambo meets Mother Teresa?

Oh, wait, let me guess: you were just joking, right?

reply to post by cavscout


Oh no, I'm totally serious. Love surrounded by truth and truth surrounded by love simply means that the truth is love and love is the truth.

Love is something that many of you have yet to experience.

I mean heck, the majority of you look up to a man that you consider the son of God who proclaimed, "I bring the sword, not peace", and you use this man/prophet to spread peace? It's no wonder he comes up in such a beligerent speech.

This sure is a confused world, a few nukes going off in a few select locations might rattle some of your fanatical and illogical minds enough to wake up to reality... and remember, everything I do, I do because I love you

Trust me, I love you more than God or Jesus ever did, has, and ever will.

[edit on 2-6-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]