I like the way you think Howie, it is good to know that we are on the same page. Let us focus on the good things, because I look forward to the good things that will come also. No more of this materialistic fabricated world.

no religon is correct and none TRUE, religion is the tool of man used to direct the hand of humanity. thats why everyone says to live a moraly good life.

anyone who interperates any religon farther than that, are to weak to survive alone without guidance. The only good use for sheep are wool ( your money) and slaugher (bullet dolls for greedy people), people that want you to continue being sheep.

your masters are the corrupt that have wirtten the books you hold so reverently but thoes books are still only written by corrupt men.

science is so far along now days how come items from that past are not put to the tests of today?. Science will disprove religion once and for all soon enough and the reality of the righteous will certainly fall from the heavens ( pun intended)

The ONLY reason why the zionists need to occupy Isreal is because the final battle must take place in the Megiddo Valley in order for biblical prophecies to be fulfilled.

Any intelligent human being knows that a WWIII, or armageddon, if you will, type scenario will be fought over most of the globe, however, as long as a large scale battle takes place in the Megiddo Valley im sure it will be enough to convince the religious types.

This is why Isreal exists, this is why tensions are perpetuated in the middle east and this is why the US (which is full of zionists) backs Isreal.

If god will punish me for using my brain and not blindly following some idea than how can this "being" be regarded as good?


I don't believe in Jesus. I don't believe that the bible is god's word. Its a book written by human beings. Jesus is the superman of his time, just a character in the most popular book of all time.

Well I guess ill be the referee of the fight :p

Originally posted by mavman
If god will punish me for using my brain and not blindly following some idea than how can this "being" be regarded as good?

The answer to that question is in the book of Genesis. It was Satan that tricked Adam into eating from the Tree of Knowledge. It wasn't until this was done that Adam and Eve became self-aware (best term I can use to describe it).

Originally posted by mavman
I don't believe in Jesus. I don't believe that the bible is god's word. Its a book written by human beings. Jesus is the superman of his time, just a character in the most popular book of all time.

The Bible was written by man, but the passages were inspired by God and the Holy Spirit. How can you believe that Jesus was a "superman", that such a person as he would exist, but that a book inspired by God could not?

OP, 2012? I didn't realize there were sides. And sadly, 2012 is a non-issue like so many "doomsdays" that have been predicted and passed us by. Plan for doom if you want. That certainly isn't healthy mentally or physically. But....you want to live that way? That's a shame....

I do believe that the Bible is not the literal "word of God" but, as are all ancient religious texts, SYMBOLIC documents that were intended to provide a moral guideline for the masses. Encoded within those documents are some truths and predictions about future events, but to take any of them literally is to blindly submit yourself to a control mechanism. I am absolutely against the New World Order and I am a seeker of knowledge and truth, spiritual and otherwise, but I cannot allow myself to submit a belief system just because "the Bible says so." That just goes against everything that truth really is.

Consider these points...

First of all, the Bible and the Judeo-Christian religions themselves, if you study the stories, symbolism, characters, moral lessons, etc., are essentially religions for the masses that are based upon a hodgepodge of bits and pieces from many various pre-existing pagan, occult, and ancient religious practices. The "Christ" figure is not unique to Christianity at all. The only religion that has existed since the beginning of human civilization, and is the basis of all religions since, is the occult. The term "occult," by the way is NOT to be equated with Satan. It simply means "hidden." And occult knowledge can be either used for good or evil...sort of like nuclear energy (you can either power a city or completely destroy one, it depends on your inclinations). More often, it seems to be used for evil, however, so this explains why it is often associated with "Satan."

Second...The Judeo-Christian religions are based upon a primitive (ancient), outdated world view. If the ancient peoples who created these religions had such a limited understanding of their own physical world, then as such their understanding of what "God" is and could be is also very limited by that understanding. Logic tells us that as we come to evolve and understand our world more, our concept of God must also evolve as well (eventually leading to a merging of science and spirituality, which I believe is not far away if we don't destroy ourselves first). So clinging to 2000-year-old dogma as absolute truth can only lead to problems, as it feeds a "Holier Than Thou" attitude and results in blind submission to a perceived authority that is based on a very primitive understanding of the world. This is why hardcore Christians often use circular reasoning to defend their arguments, which, inescapably, always comes back to "because the Bible says so."

I believe there is absolutely a divine presence in the universe that is positive in nature. I also believe that all life is connected to this force and is an extension of it. Perhaps there was once a time where there was only good in the universe, but evil was almost born out of necessity because without evil, how can we learn the value of good? How can we experience what love and light really are unless we are forced to learn to triumph over fear and darkness?

This comes back to my argument that Christianity CAN BE dangerous (that is not to say that it always is) because if people just think that God will save them just by believing in Jesus and living by the Bible, then that completely erases all responsibility for the individual to take charge and try to create change, instead relying on some obscure outside force. To beat the New World Order, you must be spiritually oriented towards good but you must also be prepared to take action and make sacrifices when the time comes. So I caution those who view this struggle from a strictly Christian perspective to realize that the world is not black and white as you are led to believe. It is much more complicated than that. You may be free from the NWO but you're still a slave to Christianity.

I leave you with this. The highly-regarded Christian philosopher St. Anselm said that "God is something greater than which nothing can be conceived." I can conceive of a God greater than the God of the Bible, and I'm sure you can too. Think about it.