2012 ARMAGEDDON: Which side are you on?

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
Also, very important, I do not want to let Jesus pay for my wrongs. It sounds suspicious to me that you can go to hell for taking responsibility and paying for your sins, and if you pawn them off and let someone else pay for them you get to heaven.

This is a particularly interesting statement, to me. I always thought that "going to hell" is "taking responsibility and paying for you sins". After all, if someone committed murder, wouldn't taking responsability for their crime involve doing the time for the crime? That is the whole point of the gospel, as presented in the Bible:

"The soul that sins shall die."

"God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him, shall not perish, but have everlasting life."

"The love of God is manifest, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

In essence, to quote Keith Green, "Some people won't find out till it's too late that they have to pay a price. You can pay it yourself, or let someone else, but who would be that nice, to pay a debt that isn't His? ... You know your gonna find out, no matter which way you choose, but I pray you find out by His love for you."

The Bible teaches that Christ willingly laid down His life for us, so that we can be freed from the wrath of God, poured out on the ungodly. We are all "ungodly (ie, not like God)", so the question is whether we have accepted the mercy freely offered, or arrogantly claimed to have no need of it.

Believe it or not, that's up to you, but if you honestly believe that everyone has the right to believe what they choose, then you have to accept the fact that this is what someone who believes the Bible believes, because it is what it clearly teaches. Add to that the fact that if anyone honestly and sincerely believes this, but doesn't warn others, of the implications of their belief, they betray the fact that either they don't truly believe it too be true, they are more afraid of peoples reactions to their warnings, than their fate, or the have no compassion, prefering people to go to hell, than to risk embaressment.

Returning to the thread topic, as someone has already mentioned, Armageddon is simple translated as the "hill of Meggido". Attaching a meaning to this, that goes beyond this, is similar to attaching meanings to things like "the Alamo" and "Waterloo", but if you are reading a book on French history, it would probably be wiser to read "Waterloo" as the geographical location, rather than it's allegorical significance.

Considering the the allegorical significance of "Armageddon", referring to "the end times" wasn't really that popular, as an expression, prior to the 1800's, it's equally unwise to force it onto a document written over a millenia earlier, even if it is the location of a great battle prophecied about in the Revelation, whether or not it has occured already.

Originally posted by CJaKfOrEsT
if anyone honestly and sincerely believes this, but doesn't warn others, of the implications of their belief, they betray the fact that either they don't truly believe it too be true, they are more afraid of peoples reactions to their warnings, than their fate, or the have no compassion, prefering people to go to hell, than to risk embaressment.

Why does it have to be they don't believe it, embaressment, no compassion or preferring them to go to hell? Why can't it just be that they understand how to mind there own friggin business and knowing when to shut up allready, you realize by spreading the word you have been solely responcible for more deaths than you've saved and in such a volatile time, spreading the word is only causing more problems. We get it, you think your doing a good thing, fine, thanks for the effort but you arn't helping and I honestly feel that god would not approve of the division you have created.

Trust me, you have no reason to feel guilty, you just be good to yourself and the ones your close to. We all were born with a consiounce if someone fails to utilize it they have no one to blame but themselves.

Originally posted by queenofangels_17
reply to post by MinMin

 

Is the TRUTH so hard to believe?

God sent down the truth to His messengers, " There is only One God " same message from Adam to the Prophet Muhammad. The confusion came when Jesus died and his disciples were put to death, and Jesus' true Gospel was annulled by Satan, making him as God and/or son of God.

3:31 Say, (O Muhammad, to mankind): if ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

Peace!

well, this is kind of a double edged sword for many of us raised w/ christian beliefs. think about this, you are quoting from an external source that neither you, nor anyone else alive today was around when it was produced. same thing can be said of the bible and the bible says basically the same thing, only the prophet (or messiah, as there are many different view points on this) is Jesus.

SO YOU ARE ASKING A GENERATION THAT IS LOADED WITH SO MANY DIFFERENT VIEW POINTS TO MAKE A CHOICE? and we had better be right or we will go to hell?

uh-uh NO WAY!!! i DON'T buy it!!! i can't or i am lost no matter WHAT path i take bc it then it means it is a game of chance and not a matter of the heart.

sorry, i can't claim any of it, but what i can claim is that which is subjective; being what is of the heart...... the pull w/in me to be aware and to do what is right. it is all i have in this world of objectiveness to go by.

your way and everyone else who says "THIS is the only way" is worthless to me at this point. if only one of you is right, then i am lost anyway and i have only one question..........

WHAT THE HELL WAS THE POINT OF PUTTING ME HERE ON THE EARTH SIMPLY FOR A WICKED GAME OF CHANCE???

[edit on 8-6-2008 by justamomma]

Locoman8,

Hi. There are a couple of things in your post that have drawn my attention. Firstly, it is interesting the conclusions you have drawn regarding "Simon Magus" and "St Peter". I'd be interesting in looking at some of the source material about that. I have always wondered about the historical timeline of the descent into Roman Catholicism, but it is hard to get a hold of anything but second hand opinions.

There are a couple of comments you made, which I would question, however:

Originally posted by Locoman8
The tribes of Israel would also become a powerful influence on the planet. Israel has been through much trials and tribulations because of their swaying from God to worshipping Idols. Solomon, the son of David was guilty of worshipping false idols, even as a great and wise king of God. But because of this, upon his death, Israel divided into two kingdoms who would be at ends with each other. The northern 10 tribes of Israel and the southern tribes of Judah, Benjamine, and Levi that was considered Judah/Judea. After the Babylonians took over the northern tribes and exiled them, they were considered the "Lost 10 Tribes" and no one was really able to figure out where these tribes ended up at.

The idea of 10 lost tribes is quite facinating. One thing that is often ignored, is the there was representation of those 10 tribes in the Southern Kingdom. Devout Hebrews who desired to continue with Temple worship, as prescribed in the Torah, left the idolatrous breakaway kingdom, remaining in Judah. It is interesting to note that Anna, the prophetess who recognised the infant Jesus, as he was brought to the temple, is descrobed as being from the tribe of Asher (Luke 2:36-38).

The prophets spake of a remnant being spare, from each of the 12 tribes, albeit more from the South than the North. The idea of British Israelyism is quite obviously a European ploy to claim the right to rulership, nothing more.

(to be continued...)

Originally posted by Sheeper
Why does it have to be they don't believe it, embaressment, no compassion or preferring them to go to hell? Why can't it just be that they understand how to mind there own friggin business and knowing when to shut up allready...

Friend, I think you missed the point of my post. Would you say the same of someone who was firmly persuaded, with evidential support, that their neighbours kids were being molested, and yet simply "mind(ed) there own friggin business and knowing when to shut up allready"? The point I raise is consistency between belief and action, not even implying that you have to believe it yourself.

Having said that, because I do believe it, there is a moral imperitive to present the "facts", for consideration, bearing in mind, my beliefs are as "factual" to me, as yours are to you, and yet for some reason you feel the need to state your, without admitting that they are merely your beliefs. I am equally within my rights to state my beliefs as "facts", and in fact (mind the pun) the only reason for my not doing so is to show you respect by not discarding you beliefs as irrelevant, even thought, if I am honest, I consider them to be.

All this, because my Holy Book calls for me to have a logical answer to my beliefs, but also exhorts me not to be contentious. It is a fine line to walk, my friend, and as you have pointed out, some who can't handle hearing a different opinion, would rather fight than discuss (and amongst them, evey ideological viewpoint is represented, Atheism included). War's are caused be selfish imaturity, and lack of self control, regardless of belief.

Originally posted by Locoman8
If we go back to the time of Abraham and see where our cultures separated, we would learn that many aspects of Islam, Christianity, and Judaism have truth in them. Islam is the "submission to God" which all should learn to do. Christianity knows that through the messiah Jesus, we can all be saved and Judaism knows that God will soon save this world. Truth is, we should submit ourselves to God and know his only son, Jesus the Messiah died on the cross in order for man to be saved and that through Jesus, God will save mankind from destroying ourselves. The only way to view religion in this light is to learn the ways of the early apostles who continued the true teachings of Christ through the gospel.

While these are interesting speculations, there are a few problems when you consider the actual people you are speaking of. You have said, "..we should submit ourselves to God and know his only son, Jesus the Messiah died on the cross in order for man to be saved.." and, as a Christian, I totally agree with your statement. The thing is, most Muslims that I have dialogued with, claim that Jesus didn't actually die, but that Allah made Judas Iscariott appear to be Jesus. This poses a problem, in that, if Jesus didn't die, then man cannot be saved, according to your statement.

Also, the Koran teaches that Allah is neither begotten nor begat, meaning that Jesus cannot be God's only son. To the Muslim, Jesus was merely sent as a sign, born of a virgin, in order to turn Israel from their idolatry. He didn't die, but ascended into heaven, to return as judge, which is similar to Christian doctrine.

Biblical Christianity, on the other hand, says that Jesus is not only the Son of God, but that He is God come in the flesh. A Muslim could never tolerate such a statement. Jesus lived a sinless life, as typified by the Judaic Passover Lamb, being "without spot and blemish", thereby qualifying himself as being the "lamb of God, that takes away the sin of the world" (John the Baptist). His death simultaneously demonstrated ultimate obedience, even to death on a cross; as divinity, He presented the only perfect sacrifice possible to replace all humanity; and qualified Himself to be the Judge of all the earth.

So as the crucified, he is the victim, dying as a result of mankind's insurecction; as the sacrifice he is the ransom paid that we can go free; and as the resurrected he is able to be both advocate and judge, knowing both the sting of the consequence of sin, and therefore having the right to forgive.

Take away his divinity, and his death is meaningless. Take away his death, and there is none that has taken our penalty for sin. Take away the resurrection, and there is no basis for forginess. If death could hold him down, then death will hold us down.

As far as Judaism, well that gets a little complicated. There are some who say Jesus was a prophet, but not the messiah. Essentially the same as a Muslim. Then there are the Messianics, who terstify that Yeshua (Jesus) is the Messinah (Christ). In other words, they are the true "Christians" and we of the "non-Jewish" variety are merely grafted into the Jewish vine.

And then there are the Jews who consider that Jesus is totally irrelevant, requiring them to discard the vast quantity of prophecies contained in their Tanakh. Could they be considered anything but a mere ethnic group that has ignored there Hebraic roots?

In summary, there can be no compatibility between the Islamic and Christian belief systems, without compromising the tenets of their faith, and it is naive to think otherwise. Note: I am not implying that Christians and Muslims can't get along. To vouch for this, I can point to many Muslim freinds who know where I stand, and in spite of both admitting that our religions condemn the other, are more than kind to each other.

Side...?

Oh , yes of course....we are talking about singular humans. Always about sides (easy for a primal brain to grasp)...yea, great 'cause in choosing "Sides"then there must imply both negative and positive, force, domination, strong against weak....

Aaah but then where would we be without the simpleton kinda thinking...perhaps it (life) is like a football/baseball game...

'Unbelivers' are honest and therefore not in danger of going to any 'hell', witch by the way doesn't exist anyway. There's no room for any hell anyway in the christian faith, just ask the pope.

Anyway, god has no reason to single out unbelivers as they don't oppose any religion. Only religious people opposes other religions than their own. We unbelivers however keep to the truth (that's why we're unbelivers in the first place) and we see that there's no holy book. There's no book that is written by god himself; therefore no book is holy. We study history and find that the so-called holy books have been written by fanaticks with their own agenda. There are no religions that are supported over the others (miracles happens in all lands and people, not just religious ones).
It's also thanks to us non-belivers that we've progressed so far; discovering that earth is round, Columbus' trip to America, electricity, that Earth orbits the Sun, physics, well all we know, really. Belivers did always disbelive the facts we now know all about. Only after a few generations did the belivers turn around and recoginze the facts for what it was.

So in short, the unbelivers have always been the true belivers; we belive in facts not some writings in a book made by roman rulers (the new testament) or persians ('the hadit' that many, like this 'al-quaida' group, pretends to be the quran).

reply to post by queenofangels_17


For a more profound treatment of St. John's Apocalypse, see the recent release of "The Book of Revelation and the Work of the Priest" by Rudolf Steiner:

uncletaz.com...

Cheers,

Tarjei

reply to post by justamomma


So, God said 'There are no other gods'.

Nice. And if you were selling your house and I told you I was the only buyer, there are no other buyers, so you must accept my lowball price or not sale... then this would be manifestly true?

Because, IF there are other gods and Worshippers are how they gain there power, then there would be a reason to persuade people that others don't exist so that you are the only one with Strength.

So, while I feel there is only ONE God, I won't take such a line as "There's only one because He says so" as Fact. Religious sentiment, yes. Fact, not at all.

There could be NO gods. There could be INFINATE gods. There could be ONE god. We simply have no way to prove ANY OF THESE.

When God finished his work on the garden he placed Adam in the garden to keep it. To one person, Adam, was the entire world given for all time. Everything that happens on this earth, while ultimately is of God, is done through Adam.

Adam is the control panel for the entire planet. From time to time his adversary has been able to usurp this authority, but it always reverts to Adam. As it is today Adam has the control. He recovered what is his on 5 November 2005. Yes, living in this earth today is a person who is Adam. His name may be something else but it is him. That's a fact. Everyone knows it they just don't want to talk about it. Some are cowards. Some are following orders. Some can't handle the truth. All the dead are trying to capture him so that they can remain in this space with the living.

This war you are fighting was started to prevent Adam from taking back his world. That failed. The only reason it is still being fought is because the adversary has no other choice. Either fight and be destroyed or surrender and be destroyed. It is quite a mess they've gotten themselves into.

When Adam's son is born, the war is finished. That's a wrap. In a flash the world of the living will jump to a higher level of reality. The enemies of humanity will be contained in a reality which would require a machine that can travel faster than light to escape.

Things hum up there; probably because the world will be operating according to how it was designed. When Adam walks through the world the beasts and birds turn to him and his bride to acknowledge their presence. Its like liquid crystal; its quite beautiful.

Any physical/material conception of Armageddon is incorrect. No book, name, ritual or religion is going to help you there. This is not opinion it is fact.

You are either Adam and Eve's kids or you are not. But, the choice is yours. As far as Muslims being Adam's family. Some are, some are not. Christians, some are, some are not, etc. Its true/false-like binary. All systems are apparently based on binary. When a false signal is given in a binary system what happens?

[edit on 9-6-2008 by bruxfain]

[edit on 9-6-2008 by bruxfain]

Originally posted by CJaKfOrEsT
In summary, there can be no compatibility between the Islamic and Christian belief systems, without compromising the tenets of their faith, and it is naive to think otherwise.

A: The Word of God was sent to the House of Israel first.

B: Jesus appears as the Word of God made flesh on earth, fulfilling the old covenant and forming a new. The beginning of Christianity.

C: ~ 600 years later the Word of God comes to Muhammad and the formation of Islam.

We have 3 major faiths under the same Word. We operate as separate minds under the One Word of God.

The house of Israel and Persia were united at one time. Read the book of Esther and the decree under Xerxes. So to say that they cannot come together is not correct for the Persian empire protected her at one time.

Islam like Christianity, has its two faces. Those that choose to practice and live a Godly life while accepting others, and those that choose to forcibly exercise their beliefs which result in oppressed societies and communities. ( ie Taliban ). The crimes and perversity that has been created in the name of religion under misapplication of the Word is mind boggling.

But there are the peace makers in the world. Those that truly do Good will here on earth. Some are atheists, some are Christians, and others are Muslim, who work toward being the change in the world that their faiths quietly ask them to be without hate or injury to thy neighbor.

The argument regarding adam and the garden is over. There is nothing further to be addressed for that debt has been taken up. Our task as a people of Good will is to implement systems that work for millenniums and the answer can be found in that of living a Godly life.

The Truth is the Truth is the Truth.
The Truth terminates hate and restores the Truth.

Word of God to Moses is the same Word of God that became flesh, is the same Word of God that came to Muhammad.

Same God, one Word.

The result if honored, is a world where wealth and greed take a back seat and kindness and Love towards ones fellow man becomes the way.

Hence

Peace on Earth, Good will towards men.


[edit on 9-6-2008 by HIFIGUY]

Originally posted by radioactive_liquid
i think its another plagiarized belief on the mayan calander.

Armageddon has nothing to do with Mayan calendar also it will happen in dec/2010

i think people may have the wrong idea about the "tribulation period". This does not refer to end time events. No where in the Bible does it say that this refers to end time events. I answered something about this in a post a while back, but unfortunately i'm too lazy to go and find it. But, long story short, it refers to the Daniel prophecy, which as already happened.
As for the mark of the beast, I don't think it will be a computer chip. The Bible says it will be placed in the "foreheads" or "hands". In prophecy writing, this means sort of subconcious-like. Also, God's seal will be placed in the foreheads. you are marked as His, or you are not.
The mark to me, is sort of a NWO type thing I guess. I believe it will be a forced religion/belief of worshiping God on the wrong day (Sunday). you either accept this as true belief (mark placed in forehead), or accept this because you do not want to suffer consequences if you dont accept it (marked placed in hand). The ones who do not accept it will be jailed, maybe even killed in some other countries, and have a very hard life until the good Lord comes back for us.
God made one day for worship (Saturday)...man went ahead and changed that all by his little self. On what authority? Man above God? Isn't that called rebelling agains the one that created you?
If you believe in the Bible, it is all written in there. If you think the Bible is a funny story and choose not to believe, then that's your choice.

Anyway, back to the original thread. Yes, I would choose God/Jesus over anything else.

reply to post by CJaKfOrEsT


I'm not implying that every aspect of Christianity, Islam, and Judaism are truth because all three have some truth and some fault in them. For example, the Christian view that Jesus eliminated the Old Testament laws are false. He did eliminate sacrifices and such but not the commandments and holy day feasts. Islam's view that Jesus is a prophet but not the messiah is false because you can historically research the fact that Jesus was crucified and died on the cross. The debate comes from weather He rose on the third day or if the body was taken. To think Jesus never walked the planet or died is foolish. Judaism claiming to be God's people and not even living the laws and ordinances proveded by Moses would be false in their own religion like animal sacrifices.

Point is, the common link of these religions is the Church Jesus built which is the Church of God.... the only christian denomination in existence until Simon Magus created Catholicism. Further truth on the Simon Magus/Simon Peter debate is the fact that the Vatican is believed to be built atop of St. Peter's grave yet historians/archaeologists have discovered Peter's tomb in Jerusalem. Peter was sent to the Jews to preach the gospel yet the iconic "St. Peter" is said to have set up his church in Rome? The land of the gentiles? That was Paul's area. Why would one of, if not the closest apostles of Jesus start a church that went against nearly everything Jesus, or the old testament taught. Let's observe... and I'm not calling out people of the catholic faith but simply the foundation of this belief:

-Sunday worship was implemented by the catholics in contrast to the commanded 7th day sabbath in order to distinguish themselves from the Jews and Church of God as well as bring more pagans into the catholic faith in order for them to worship on the day of their sun god.

-The trinity is a man-made doctrine created in the pagan world in which 3 dieties form to create one. Truth is that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are misinterpreted. Jesus is the word of God. The Holy Spirit is the force that God uses within His people. It is what Jesus was baptised in. When you feel God inside you, it is His holy spirit baptising you.

-Christmas is said to be the celebration of Jesus' birthday yet it can be proven that Jesus was born in late summer, early fall. This on top of the fact that the date of Dec. 25 coincides with the winter solstice and the pagan rituals that were celebrated at that time of year. Catholics adopted this pagan ceremony and implimented christian beliefs within it. Instead of the birth of the Sun God, they celebrated the birth of the Son of God. Also note that early christians and jews did not celebrate birthdays but only the deaths of loved ones. Add in the exchanging of gifts, St. Nicholas, Christmas trees, wreaths, holly bushes, mistletoe and other symbols we associate with christmas and you will find the origins of these symbols coming from pagan god worship.

-Easter is believed to be the celebration of the rise of Jesus 3 days after the crucifixion yet Jesus himself said to celebrate the sacrifice or passover and not his ressurection. Easter is pagan in origin and is derived from the greek goddess Ishtar who was a fertility goddess. Easter eggs were the fertility symbol for females as the hare or rabbit were fertility symbols for males. Easter replaced passover through the rule of Constantine and the dates of the two would be separate. Easter would be celebrated the sunday after the first full moon of spring. Passover itself was celebrated on 14 Nisan on the Jewish calendar but is now nearly impossible to determine thanks to the elimination of the Jewish calendar and the placement of the Roman Calendar which was a pagan calendar.

-Though Jesus plainly states the opposite in the gospel, catholics wear embroidered garments and call priests, "father" and declair the pope as Pontiff or "human representation of Christ". The gospel states that all are equal in His church and that only one shall be called master or teacher and it is Christ. Only one on earth shall be called the father, the allmighty God. For he that is highest in the church shall humble themselves as servant to the body of the church.

-Council of Nicea was created as a man-made doctrine that added things that contradicted the bible such as the changing of the ten commandments. Now these man-made doctrines are followed moreso than the bible itself.

-Confessionals go against what Jesus said. Jesus said to lock yourself in a closet and confess your sins in private, not to tell a priest in a booth that you desire a woman that is not your wife.

These are just some of the points given that all started thanks to the impostor Simon Magus and his false christian, pagan ridden catholic church.

My next post is a snippet from wikipedia.

source: wikipedia

After Simon Magus' encounter with the apostle Simon Peter, he is recorded by historian Justin Martyr (writing in 152 AD) as having made his way to Rome and the court of Claudius Caesar in 45 AD. He took on the title of Simon PATER (which means father, of course). He either deliberately masqueraded as Simon Peter to the church of Rome, or they mistook him for Peter. In any case, he spread his heresies within the church of Rome, which were backed up by his reputed magical abilities -- he was Simon Magus (THE MAGE), after all. Those of us who actually believe in God and also in the power of God's enemies, the fallen angels, know where Simon acquired his powers. Simon Magus, AKA Simon Pater, became that first bishop of Rome, and its first Pope, quite deliberately on his part. Simon Peter, the actual apostle of God, was never given the commission to go to Rome, but to stay within the Jewish lands and to concentrate only on the Jews. The Bible does not record Peter as having ever left The Levant. Indeed, much internal evidence exists in the Bible that indicates that Peter was never in Rome.

A bit of history for ya.

In hindsite and in the good tradition of keeping this thread on topic, I'll just put my 2 cents in here and say that the Roman Catholic Church and the revived Roman Empire (EU) are the false universal religion and global political power before Christ returns weather it be 2012 or 2031 or whatever. Also, interestingly enough, if you know about bible codes and bible code prophecy, there is one that states on Dec. 21, 2012 a comet will aim for earth but the hand of God would stop it. Not that I believe that, it's just FYI.

reply to post by meanmug


meanmug,

I visited your vid and I must say that it's good, you got all the signs there.

What I can say is that you have cracked God's signs and it's a work well done.

But all this just goes to prove the existence of God, don't you think, that is, the created proves the existence of the creator?

By the way, if as you claimed you found the Ark of the Covenant,then can you tell me where it is? And can you also tell me who the Ark of the Covenant represents?

The reason why I ask is because if you found the Ark, then you found the Mahdi that all Muslims are waiting for. For he will be the one to bring out the Ark of the Covenant, as a sign from God to all the Children of Israel.

What you found is really fascinating, like the bible code and the mene tekel code that I was just looking into the past weeks.

reply to post by HIFIGUY


Hifiguy,

I couldn't have put it better. I must say you truly surprised me here but pleasantly so and I thank you for the great contribution to the thread.

I believe that Muslims and Christians and even the Jews for that matter will become just one flock before the end times by the grace of God.

21:92 Lo! this, your religion, is one religion, and I am your Lord, so worship Me.

As it was once, it will be again.

You speak the truth when you say that, the WORD that came to Moses, the same WORD that gave life to Jesus, is the same WORD that came to the Prophet Muhammad. The Spirit of Truth is the Word of God, and whosoever accepts the truth that was sent down through the Prophets are sealed with the mark of God in their forehead, the seal being the faith in the true teachings.

[2] And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
[3] Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

And finally, for witnessing that the Prophet Muhammad is one sent from God along with Moses, Jesus and the prophets, I want to commend you and pray for God's blessing upon you for giving you faith and wisdom.

2:269 He giveth wisdom unto whom He will, and he unto whom wisdom is given, he truly hath received abundant good. But none remember except men of understanding.

In the day of Gathering, when all the Messengers are called as witness against all mankind, whoever confessed that Muhammad is a messenger of God will not be ashamed ;

4:41 But how (will it be with them) when we bring of every people a witness, and We bring thee (O Muhammad) a witness against these? -

And finally, God said to all Christians, Jews and Sabeans whoever will believe in the Prophet Muhammad and his message will have no cause to fear or grieve in the Last Day;

7:158 Say (O Muhammad): O mankind! Lo! I am the messenger of Allah to you ALL--(the messenger of) Him unto whom belongeth the Sovereignty of the heavens and the earth. There is no God save Him. He quickeneth and He giveth death. So believe in Allah and His messenger, the Prophet who can neither read nor write, who believeth in Allah and in His words and follow him that haply ye may be led aright.

2:62 Lo! those who believe (in that which is revealed unto thee, Muhammad), and those who are Jews, and Christians, and Sabaeans whoever believeth in Allah and the Last Day and doeth right surely their reward is with their Lord, and there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.

Peace!

The ark and the mahdi are in the American midwest. the mahdi is a woman, pregnant and not a muslim. i'll tell you one thing for sure, muslims are about to be 1.3 billion of the most disappointed people in the world when they find out that Hagar lied to them.

the creator of the forum is going to be disappointed when she finds out that muslims, to the extent they are muslims, play no more significant role than any other group in brining in God's Kingdom.





[edit on 10-6-2008 by bruxfain]

reply to post by bruxfain


Brux,

Can you give some hard facts about your claims?
The list is long of people who claimed to be the Mahdi, but the coming of the Mahdi will be accompanied by a sign that all mankind will recognize as the truth from God.

No, I don't think so that the Muslims will be disappointed in the near or distant future, by Him in whose hands are the souls of the believers.

So you claim that Hagar ( may God be pleased with her) lied to the Muslims?
Put forth your proof and your allegations before you slander a believing woman.

God's promise is true and it will all come to pass, however much the disbelievers and idolaters may be averse.

You will find in the end that what you keep rejecting is the rock that the builders rejected but became the head of the corner.

10:55 Lo! verily all that is in the heavens and the earth is Allah's. Lo! verily Allah's promise is true. But most of them know not.