Ok..this list is realllyyy corrupted by fanaticism.
I thought I`d meet people with head on their shoulder here, but no....just stupid tward who are too ashamed to have the guts to sign with their "real names" than you.


Here what mr. freemason write to me:


>Those great greeks you speak of killed to gard their >knowledge


Oh yes, I can imagine Plato, Diogenus or Aristote with big bazzokas kiling for knowledge.


Yehp...go for it man..kill for knowledge...you just do that.
And build huge tours in Ivory while you`re at it. It`s fun to die alone "knowing".


>Knowledge is to be shared, but only to those whom >will respect it.


Duhhh.. If knowledge is at any rate useful, you respect that knowledge by making use of it... If you don`t use it..you don`t need the knowledge therefore don`t need to respect it.


(who`s a freemason?ÈÈÈseek out..here it comes
>Anyone....the boundaries is in your mind, not ours.


Wow....clap clap... same #ing response as anyone being into any religion (thinking THEY are the ones, THEY are the best, etcc...). Same answer from me:
YOUR boundary is Freemasonry. Period.

(that must be why you hang in here all day to obscure those who are here to seek out some relevant information)


>they know enough of science to know there is no god, >but not enough to realize that there has to be a god.


Ok..I`m an agnostic... Ever heard of agnostism?
The philosophy branch ? Great greeks killing for knowledge?...Yes in fact....people used to GET KILLED for admitting that no truth permits to absolutely believe that there is a god while none permits to absolutely believe that there is none. Besides, I am certain that we should be dealing we human issues much more than we do with beliefs.


> blames those inside instead of himself.
>there's something in you that burns.


Yes..you got my friend going nut.
If YOU were my friend I`d think you gone nuts too.
That makes me both sad and mad.
I wouldn`t take it seriously if you wouldn`t
take it so seriously. But see what muslims have done ??? Fanaticism is not a joke.


>If you tell me what he's been saying that's angered >you so

I`m angry cos I think he`s going nut.

He`s been telling about "secrets" that he can never reveal to me, like suddenly he found people..... total incognitos who become "stronger brothers" than a close friend like me. That`s kinda alienating.

I might have to cut out this relationship.


Why is he telling me he knows stuff that he can`t say ??
Why not just keep his #ing mouth shut ?? I think he was trying to titillate me into entering this "thing" (group whatever). Hoping I`d get a nut like he is, but of course HE CAN`T invite me as I`ve read.....so he talks and talks about the thing...and I figured that this WAS HIS WAY of trying to tempt me ask for getting entry.


If I EVER do it, it would be just to seek out what drove him like this.

I thought that asking around I`d get info much more easily.

Alas.....I fell on a bunch of fanatics....


My email is centiment@hotmail.com
if any has info they might want to send me.

Agnosticism..made a typo there.


and the Than you at first linne was Thank you


I`m sure they are tons of others..

Cedric

Centiment, sadly you are not an inquisitive and misguided individual, but a raving maniac.

>Those great greeks you speak of killed to gard their >knowledge

Yes they did, I suggest you research about the Group/Cult of Pythagoras. A philisophical society that has numerous accounts of murder to protect what they were discussing and theorizing one such incident is when they killed 12 people whom were going to tell the rest of the people about pythagora's theorum.

Duhhh.. If knowledge is at any rate useful, you respect that knowledge by making use of it... If you don`t use it..you don`t need the knowledge therefore don`t need to respect it.

If you believe that crap then you should look at your nation's schools and see why it is they don't want to learn. Knowledge is not respected even when it is useful, look at Copernicus and Galileo, and an even better example is of a man whom I've heard of many times but sadly don't remember his name. Whom some 20 years before galileo first looked at the stars, theorized that every star had a world like earth, with people such as us, and they burned him at the stake.

Wow....clap clap... same #ing response as anyone being into any religion (thinking THEY are the ones, THEY are the best, etcc...). Same answer from me: YOUR boundary is Freemasonry. Period.

You're not even coherent here, and obviously you don't understand even something a child could grasp. That anyone can be a freemason, from all walks of life. And yet here you ramble about some "fanaticism" thing, as if you even know what the word means.

Yes..you got my friend going nut.

No I think you're the one going nuts, not your friend, perhaps you should read just one sentence of what you write.

But see what muslims have done ??? Fanaticism is not a joke.

How can you compare charity and good will towards all, to Fundamentalist Islam and their insane suicide bombers?

Alas.....I fell on a bunch of fanatics....

This "fanaticism" is knowledge, and us fanatics are people who know what we are talking about.

Your friend isn't spouting drivel to entice you to join (though he may be but doubtful) it's just he's going through that phase where he is being told what all Masons here, and is frustrated he can't tell you.

And I'll tell you, until you've seen a lodge room in action, you'll never understand.

And that's not a fanaticism thing, that's an excitement thing, as much so as if you were to see military precision for the first time, for Masonry is more precise than even an Annual Inspection. And not as boring too...

Also, fix up your english, it's attrocious.

Sincerely,
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>Centiment, sadly you are not an inquisitive and >misguided individual, but a raving maniac.

What---ever ???


>Yes they did, I suggest you research about the >Group of Pythagoras. A philisophical society that has >numerous accounts of bla bla

Nothing to do with Pytaghora himself. Read a book on his life. And this has to be an exception and thanks to
humanity, the masons didn`t keep that away from common people use nowaday.

In fact..soon or later someone else had found out. Knowledge is in "nature"..it`s out there for anyone to access it.


>Knowledge is not respected even when it is useful


knowledge is always respected when used. It`s the only hommage you can render to knowledge is by making use of it. Too many people teach knowledge without ever making use of it.

If I use knowledge in an experience that damages nature, I do not respect nature, but i still respect knowledge. Respecting knowledge doesn`t imply that I respect the source of that knowledge, but this is a different topic.


>That anyone can be a freemason, from all walks of life.

Poor them..because from the last info I got, it really really sounds like a ridiculous thing to do.


>How can you compare charity and good will towards all


Respect a muslim for one thing baby...... He too believes he`s doing what he does for good will....
Try to comprehend that. Use Pythagoras theories cos surprisingly they might help.

>And I'll tell you, until you've seen a lodge room in >action, you'll never understand.


I expect soft s and m and people getting naked with ropes around their necks.

It`s just a game of trust. A game of being obscure for the sake of it. It`s redundant.


I have more balls by claiming I`d tell all the truth about masonry at the sake of my life. Enough of stupidity.
I have much respect for the people who exist here on this earth to enlighten and not hide and obscurate everything.


I`m surprised the masons refused Hitler.



>Also, fix up your english, it's attrocious.


I`m czech, not english.


Dobry DEN,

Cedric

Well if you give me the lodge name of your friend, I'll figure out if he's even a mason, with how crazy you all sound I'm finding this less believable.

I think you should study more about greece...they understood that the masses don't respect philosophy.

This "Dobry Den" that wouldn't happen to be ... ŸÓ·•Ë ”Â̸! Now would it?

Sincerely,
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[Edited on 12-1-2003 by FreeMason]

I find it ironic that you don't understand the quotes that you post. The question is how can Pike be so contradictory and still maintain the validity that Freemasonry ascribes to him. I've quoted other authors, Manly P. Hall, Albert Gallatin Mackey, and as well, other works (that apparently you've never read) by Pike that support what I've been saying.
Pike can be contradictory because, as I've quoted, the members of the outer portico are kept in the dark with regards to the true meanings. Simple, and illustrated with his words. Another way is the interpretation of his words. When he speaks of the marriage of intellect and reason to enlighten the man (my own words, based upon your first quote in this thread) what he is speaking of is the principle of Gnosticism, or the principle that man is god, which is the philosophy of Freemasonry.
see: The Invisible College by Robert Lomas -you like those mystery novels, so I figured you might read that as opposed to something more tangible...

Secondly, your patronizing attitude, and magnificent ego is why you were asked to join Freemasonry. Such people are easy to manipulate, and never question themselves.
Third, the Freemason swears allegiance to the Freemasonic Order and those therein, whether they be from another country or not. History has shown that Masonic structure is only for itself, its own interests. Look into the history of revolution in Europe, and the American Revolution. Freemasons were behind them all. Is that allegiance?
Fourth and final, why do you have such a hard time getting your hands on the resources I have? Being a Mason, you can, if you are interested in doing so, find much more damning material about your organization than I can, and yet, you completely ignore that...You talk about objective views and at the same time, don't bother to investigate whether or not what others are saying is true. You have the ability, why not investigate?
Let the truth be your guide, be truly objective. Investigate the possibilities, unless of course, you are bound by oath not to read certain books and manuscripts available to you...in which case..you are a fool.

Ugh that "outer portico" thing you keep slinging around just doesn't work with me because I'm no longer a member of the "outer portico"...most no mason is. Albert Pike like any other masonic author, speaks to people who know about what he's speaking about, much like the bible makes more sense to "believers" these "contradictions" you speak of are not contradictions, but "plot devices" at the most, that lead you exactly to what he is getting at. Which means you must read the whole book cover to cover.

More importantly though, give me these "contradictions" and I'll be glad to show you how they are not.

And not many people really regaurd Manly P. Hall as a really good source...nor is Pike really, of what masonry is, because no one person can ever speak for it...but Pike's work is the MOST misunderstood, especially by people who listen to the people who misrepresent it.

Now care to comment on the quotes in here that I have given? No? Why not???? WHY HAVEN'T YOU COMMENT ON THEM YET!!!! Muhahaahahaha....methinks your misinformation doesn't go so far so all you can say about them are that they are contradictory to the rest of the book, which is untrue.

Ohhh view my "friend to a friend - a brotherhood undevided" post, that is a great example of masonic "dignity" feelings morality whatever you want to call it.

Sincerely,
no signature

Oops. haven`t seen that one...

>More importantly though, give me >these "contradictions" and I'll be glad to show you >how they are not.


One of the major contradictions of masonry is that they refuse to speak politics in their meetings when the whole masonic system is a "politic", with its own set of social values, and/or morals (I won`t even start with the hierarchical game).


I think masons are much more politic than religious.
They do have politics on the religious (remember they started at a time when Church was still governing, not politics...hence their existence), but they failed to admit
that "they are" a society and therefore are afflicted by politics.

The "way" the masons function is one politic, and the danger happens when people are refused to debates politics when one politic governs a social system.

It`s like prohibiting discussions under dictatorship.


Cheers,


Cedric


(poor freemason..I keep banging on his head..don`t take it personally bro.. I know you just luvvv the masons
like crazy, I don`t know why and what they did for you but...anyway..we all need a passion in life..)

You don't bang on my head, you make me laugh, at your inability to even understand what you are saying.

Nothing in masonry is "Political" you can NOT speak about politics in lodge. While masonry does have its OWN governing system, no mason can discuss politics of their nation and such, and in fact I can say again NOTHING in masonry is political or politically motivated.

Sincerely,
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>You don't bang on my head, you make me laugh, at >your inability to even understand what you are saying.


Well that`s a presomptuous thing to say.

Masonry can be quite laughable too with all these superfials costumes and rites ?


>Nothing in masonry is "Political" you can NOT speak >about politics in lodge. While masonry does have its >OWN governing system, no mason can discuss politics >of their nation and such, and in fact I can say again >NOTHING in masonry is political or politically motivated.


Ok.

Duh. Politic is not "the president of your country".

It`s a social system, however restraint, with precise sets of value, order and goals.

One could write a thesis about how political the mason society is.



But you know, there would be symposiums and colloques on this topic that you would never see the Masons otherwise than your stubborn impression that it represents the absolution of brotherhood love that humanity could ever achieve.


You certainly won`t ever be MY brother until the day you got the guts to at least sign your name,

Cedric

Has anyone got any decent links or recommended reading on free masonry???

no such thing, only way to know about em is to be in the organization

"The practical object of Masonry is the physical and moral amelioration and the intellectual and spiritual improvement of individuals and society." (M&D, p. 218)

That was your quote, and I did respond to it. I'll quote my response, seeing as your reading comprehension skills leave much to be desired...
'When he speaks of the amelioration of the physical and moral amelioration etc.(above quote) what he is speaking of is the principle of Gnosticism, or the principle that man is god, which is the philosophy of Freemasonry.'
To further elucidate, Pike is referring to a 'guiltless' existence for man because of the reconciliation of physical situation ethics and moral judgement. To put it simply, 'Do what thou wilt, is the fullest extent of the Law.'

Well let us walk through the dictionary, since you are "defining" amelioration incorrectly.

First off I don't see how you arrive to the conclusion you do, since amelioration is defined as "a making or becoming better; improvement." and that is the ONLY definition. No #2s or 3s, just that.

So Moral Amelioration is to "improve yourself morally" i.e. not killing, cheating, and being greedy.

Sincerely,
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Originally posted by Truth

Oh the ideal of brother hood huh?

freemasons hate the catholic church and want it gone from society, and even had
plans of infiltrating it because they believe its a god tellling us what to do.


What god do they believe?

How can all men be of god?

They believe in freedom outside of religion, when they themselves are a religion.

if they would open their eyes and heart they would believe in christ who sent them miracles upon miracles, yet their goal is
the destruction of the church of god.

they hate the church.

But one of their teachings is, god is the center of their faith.

what god?

peace.

The truth will set ye free.

Actually I haven't seen the originator of this topic around in some time. I hope at the very least that his organs are intact in their appropriate locations...

Everyone seem to reconcile his belief systems with what he discovers in rituals and myths in Freemasonry differently. Some people just go for the fellowship and the booze. Others are really community-minded.