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Why Obama.....WHY?!

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posted on May, 27 2008 @ 03:23 PM
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They can protest until the cows come home, but only before or after the funeral. This is just common sense!

Obama's decision is a wise one and shows respect to the mourning families.

Obama for president




posted on May, 27 2008 @ 03:42 PM
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Are you kidding me bigbear?

There are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too many other rights that have been shoveled behind the government building to bitch about such as "free speech zones" for an easy google look up. A Million other examples. are out there.

But you get upset because Obama wants the peaceful mourning of a family???

R E S P E C T is what he is trying to tell you to deal with.

protest anywhere else other than hallowed ground and make as many waves as you need



b



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 04:03 PM
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Looks like Semper got it on his first post. Those who don't understand, go back and read it again.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 04:03 PM
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reply to post by bigbert81
 


I think this thread is completely ridiculous, I totally agree with Obama that at the funeral of dead soldiers people should not be allowed to protest and it should be punishable by law. Half the people who protest at these things anyway are complete and utter nutbags aka avanglists and born-again christian groups. Funerals are made for family and friends to pay their respects not for a gang of unruley idiots to chant your son/daughter is going to hell because they participated in a war. To be honest if this is the reason your going to lose your faith in Obama as a politician you may want to take a whole new look at politics cause your way off.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 04:21 PM
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Ordinarily I would say err on the side of freedom when free speech is involved. However, freedom of speech ends when you enter a private space such as a church or funeral home. If someone disrupts a Sunday service, for example, the police can legitimately be called. The same would apply to a funeral. The sidewalk outside a church or funeral home could be called public space, so that might be more controversial. The same goes for a private cemetery--a public one would be more problematic. A legal precedent was set when it was ruled that anti-abortion activists have to stay a certain distance from the entrance to an abortion clinic. Given this precedent, it would not be a stretch for a court to rule that funeral protesters have to maintain a certain distance as well.

I do not support the "slippery slope" argument that if funeral protests were limited in what they can do or were prohibited outright that that would be the beginning of the end of our right to free speech. Common decency and good judgment should prevail. When they do not, people have to resort to the law.

[edit on 27-5-2008 by Sestias]



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 04:30 PM
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posted on May, 27 2008 @ 05:09 PM
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reply to post by bigbert81
 


Why ban protests at private funerals? Are you serious?

Banning protests AT the funerals is in no way infringing on free speech. It's like saying banning protests in somebody else's living room is a ban on free speech.

Personally, I think people who protests at funerals have absolutely zero decency, and are infringing on other people's rights.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by bigbert81
reply to post by ezziboo
 


First, chill. I was just making a point in the regards that the way you are thinking, (and trust me, you're definitely NOT alone), is the way people think when they take away your freedoms.

Look at the FCC for example.

The problem is that you let your own personal feelings and offenses take over instead of looking at to why this country is SUPPOSED to be great in the first place.

What good is being proud of your country if they strip the rights that founded this nation because you offended someone?

[edit on 5/26/2008 by bigbert81]

well atm your doing the same thing, your letting your emotions drive you.

and another thing...its taking away "our freedom" not our freedoms...
~sorry for some reason im being mean to idiotic members today, forgive me~



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 05:32 PM
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SESTITAS,great point....
People should read that and understand,nobody is trying to take away your right to free speech(well technically the government would love to)by stopping protest...You don't like the war,protest at an ARMY recruitment office.Better yet,go around a Military base where there are lots of soldiers and protest.In fact,bring a camera and post the video so I can laugh my ass off when they run you off.
We are talking about a funeral,a place where people are saying their goodbyes and paying their last respects.I am definately for free speech and for voicing opinions.I have no problem with someone saying they disagree with the war and protesting it.Just not at a funeral.Come on,it's called decency.
Like I said,this isn't a free speech issue,it's common curtousy and respect.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 06:40 PM
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Hey, I've been readin ATS for a month or two now, most of the discussions I like because they are based on peoples vieuws & opinions. I was interested in most of the topics I read, but this is the first one who touched me enough to post my opinion.

It is a very clear one.

Me being from Belgium (you may have noticed by now how bad my English is), I strongly recommend people to be able to be disrespectfull to fallen soldiers, who fought for their native country & paid the ultimate price. They should be be able to express their sentiments towards war & the cruelty that goes with it.

I know many people will be offended with this.

But on the other hand I also would allow soldiers & veterans to wear arms on that funerall & they should be allowed to shoot at anyone disrespectfull to the fallen soldier. I want to make one thing clear, people should have the freedom of speech at any possible time, but when they are the lowlifes that disrespect honorable soldiers who have fallen for their country, they should be shot at sight when they think the funeral is the place to express their feelings.

Freedom of speech is a good thing, respecting your fellow citizens is even better.

I have been to New York once, it was in februari, after the fall of the twin towers. I've been at ground zero, I have cried when I read the letters of the children who wrote to their murderd parents that died on 9/11. It was the first time I realized I could take up a gun and kill someone if they pushed far enough. I'm not stating anything about who started the war, about who is the bad guy & who is the good guy. (face it, if the germans had won WWII they would have been the good guys to the common people, the winner is always right).

I live near ypres, for most of you guys this will mean nothing, but for some people who know their history, they will know there are ten thousands of graves here of fallen soldiers (even of german ones). The most heroic (and absurd) battles of history have been fought near where I live (I'm about 100 metres from the place where they first used mass destruction weapons - mosterd gas/Yperiet/mostard gas/ don't know the english translation for sure - ). If there is one thing I learned from the stories I've heard from the elders around here, it is that for every soldier (the good AND the bad one) only one thing mathers, the well being of their homeland (although it may be obvious for us that they may be mistaken). I respect all graves in my country, even those of the Germans.

It is not nearly possible for me to imagine that there are people that can be so disrespectfull, so low, so unimaginably bad, worse then any terrorist, worse then any soldier fighting for the wrong cause, that they would disrespect the funerall of a fallen soldier who did all he can to help his homeland (or at least he thought he was helping it).

I want to clearly express that I don't say the USA is fighting for a just cause in the middle east. I just want to express I feel that all people should respect other people that fell for their country, while believing they were fighting for a just cause.

I also want to appologize for my bad English and I hope that somehow I expressed my feelings in English as I would express them in Dutch.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:23 PM
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reply to post by Richard.M.J.Palmer
 


Well, aren't we a little cutie?


Tell me, did you think of that ingenious insult all on your own?

Please leave, it's people like you that really tarnish ATS.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:32 PM
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Originally posted by Sestias
Ordinarily I would say err on the side of freedom when free speech is involved. However, freedom of speech ends when you enter a private space such as a church or funeral home. If someone disrupts a Sunday service, for example, the police can legitimately be called. The same would apply to a funeral. The sidewalk outside a church or funeral home could be called public space, so that might be more controversial. The same goes for a private cemetery--a public one would be more problematic. A legal precedent was set when it was ruled that anti-abortion activists have to stay a certain distance from the entrance to an abortion clinic. Given this precedent, it would not be a stretch for a court to rule that funeral protesters have to maintain a certain distance as well.

I do not support the "slippery slope" argument that if funeral protests were limited in what they can do or were prohibited outright that that would be the beginning of the end of our right to free speech. Common decency and good judgment should prevail. When they do not, people have to resort to the law.

[edit on 27-5-2008 by Sestias]


Sestias, great post. This is something more to consider, the private vs. public properties.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:37 PM
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What's with this argument I've been seeing around ATS here more and more often?

People saying that if I get offended, I'll drop my values. Forget it. At the time, maybe, but for the same reason many doctors don't operate on their own family members, they become emotionally involved and sometimes make the wrong choices based off of that.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:44 PM
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I must have read something wrong ---- Protesting on a Dead mans grave site is a RIGHT? What are u smoking, have you not followed this story in the news lately where that whacko church was just fined for doing this and it was upheld by a state supreme court. Our you much more knowledgable then 5 to 9 State Supreme Judges when it comes to peoples rights.... First of all why would you even want to do that, sane people think your sick in the head for doing crap like that, and now you let us all know your an Obama Supporter,,, just makes me want to go McCain so much more now



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:46 PM
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I am so for Obama to win the nomination, thats like handing the Presidency to John McCain(an extremely honest and rational man).. Vote for Obama, vote for Obama, Vote for Obama... I would have been worried if Hilary would have gotten it, whewww



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:47 PM
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Thanks to MOST of you who can lay out your points without the need to insult. That speaks very highly of you characters.

I think that the fact that protesting at people's funerals is so reprehensible, that it goes to strengthen my points. People make exceptions to their given rights because they think that it's offensive. I don't think that's right. If we start making exceptions, no matter how reprehensible something might be, it starts a bad wagon in motion.

Maybe next time, we can ban protests at the US Capitol Building like the movie suggests. And then after that, we can ban the right to carry guns in Chicago or New York because crime rates are so high. Then, after that, we can erase our rights to privacy so that if a criminal breaks the law, we'll already know who it was. It sparks a fire.

The 'There's a bomb!' arguments do make sense, obviously things like that do need to be illegal, but it also infringes upon others, just as I do admit that these protests certainly should NOT have the capability of doing. Flyers Fan had a good post about it aways back.

Thanks for the comments.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:49 PM
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reply to post by semperfortis
 


Exactly, nice post. No freedoms are being taken away in this case. Only that while the funeral is going on there will be no protests. I'm sure once everyone from the funeral is gone home, then the asshats can protest there all night long. Not that they would, since their only aim is to disrupt the funeral.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:49 PM
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reply to post by bigbert81
 


After reading all the posts I would have to say:

bigbert81 you loose... I am so happy to see that there are tons of decent people on this forum. This is proof that humanity still exists, well for some of us, sorry bigbert81,,u still have Obama



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:52 PM
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1. I wouldn't like anyone protesting at any funeral that I would attend.
2. Anything Obama plans on doing should scare everyone because in reality he follows the marxist doctrine.



posted on May, 27 2008 @ 07:57 PM
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lol i BEG......DARE....any stupid person or persons ....to interfere with one of my family members funerals ....

because they would end up in a coffin next to my loved one....

then my family & friends would come and protest there stupid funeral calling them all kind of thing's and hold sign's.

why i sit in prison laughing about how...Dumb could someone be to protest a fallen soldiers funeral........ or anyone's funeral !!!!!!!!!!!

either way when....when you get to protesting dead people.
you truly have no life....

To even think its ok or its your god given right.......as a human to protest a funeral..is crackheaded or inbreed thinking.

this is why we need laws cause some folks got there values seriously faked up.

common sense..you call my underage kid thats alive bad names or spit at him ect..... and your a grown person....adult..
you are in for one hell of a arse whooping....

now cuss my son dead body that died for the country and ideas...that gave them the right to even protest his funeral...

what would happen is beyond words. but it would end up with alot of people in a box..
sorry but the subject to this day eats me up............



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