The Secret Of Gravity Revealed - Scientific Experiment Included

Originally posted by ALLis0NE

Originally posted by johnthebon
I believe he meant "virtually" no mass. Now answer his question please.

Just a while ago John after I said some words about God, you were telling me how you don't like to talk about things that can't be 100% proven. Yet you are forcing me to comment on the rest mass of a photon.

If you can find a photon at rest, let me know. Right now the only photons at rest I see is pure Gold, and everything else that exists...

[edit on 29-5-2008 by ALLis0NE]

I didn't want you to talk about paranormal studies because most scientists will agree that they're just superstitions. Yet you are trying to support a controversial theory here and you evade my question. You're theorie can't be 100% proven, yet you keep on yabbing about it, so why shouldn't I?
So, please, answer the question ...

Originally posted by johnthebon
I didn't want you to talk about paranormal studies because most scientists will agree that they're just superstitions.

Most scientist don't understand that our bodys are like magnets. I can take the magnetic force out of a magnet, and put it in a coil, so that it is not longer a magnet but just a plain old chunk of metal..

Your soul is just like magnetic force, when your metal (body) is no longer capable of holding magnetic force (like heat), your soul escapes somewhere else. They just don't understand it fully on a quantum level, but they see it in their MRI's.

Originally posted by johnthebon
Yet you are trying to support a controversial theory here and you evade my question. You're theorie can't be 100% proven, yet you keep on yabbing about it, so why shouldn't I?
So, please, answer the question ...

Already did answer your question, and I do have proof of everything I say, thats the funny part lol..

NOTHING IS AT REST

The only reason I wanted you to answer was to see if you fell for the same trap I almost did. "REST MASS" LOL!!!

Nothing ever rests, and is always moving. Just like your universe is supposedly always expanding?

[edit on 29-5-2008 by ALLis0NE]

[edit on 29-5-2008 by ALLis0NE]

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal

Originally posted by Anomic of Nihilism
Light DOES NOT create darkness my friend. The ABSENCE of light creates darkness,

And the absence of darkness is light.

Light and darkness are not the same force, darkness is devoid of information, light is not.

No. Darkness is devoid of light, not devoid of information.

[edit on 27-5-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Oh God, please spare us this jibberish. You are not an intellectual, you are not born with some "special" insight, you are just playing with words & talking nonsense.

Light is a form of energy. It does not contain "information" & neither does darkness - if it does I defy you to demonstrate.

Darkness is just a place without light. Light does not "create shadows," shadows are simply areas where the light cannot reach due to physical obstructions.

I had posted an anonymous reply since I forgot my login explaining - simply mind - why this "theory" is rubbish. It hasn't been posted & I can't be bothered retyping it, but any half brained human could definitely dismiss it in 30 seconds flat.

I HATE idiots who come on here babbling a load of bull# & trying to pass it as scientfific fact, & that goes for the OP & the replyer above.

Originally posted by Power_Semi
I HATE idiots who come on here babbling a load of bull# & trying to pass it as scientfific fact, & that goes for the OP & the replyer above.

Wow, really? Sounds like you have some heavy emotional issues to deal with before you can really think about any of this very clearly.

Magnetism and electricity used to be seen as two separate forces. Any half-brained human could "see" that they were two separate forces! Duh!

Now they're understood as a single force: electromagnetism, thanks to Maxwell. Now any half-brained human can "see" this new truth.

It's so easy when everybody else does the thinking for you, all you have to do is be the cheerleader!

Originally posted by Power_Semi
Oh God, please spare us this jibberish. You are not an intellectual, you are not born with some "special" insight, you are just playing with words & talking nonsense.

Another condescending hater projecting his/her own self. Yes, poster. I am an intellectual and words are my playground, but not only do I play with them, I know how to understand them and have them make sense. I swing from the speaking monkey bars of syntax and conjugation.

Light is a form of energy. It does not contain "information" & neither does darkness - if it does I defy you to demonstrate.

You seem to have a lot of information about an informationless light there Mr./Mrs. contradiction. There is information in the dark. Just because a room is not "lit up" and is therefore "dark", doesn't mean that no information exists in it.

Darkness is just a place without light. Light does not "create shadows," shadows are simply areas where the light cannot reach due to physical obstructions.

Yeah, because of light. With no light there would be no shadows and the physical obstructions would have nothing to obstruct.

I had posted an anonymous reply since I forgot my login explaining - simply mind - why this "theory" is rubbish. It hasn't been posted & I can't be bothered retyping it, but any half brained human could definitely dismiss it in 30 seconds flat.

Well, I would take anything posted by you with a grain of salt anyway. You don't comprehend much. You must be a half brained Human, go find your other half, please.

I HATE idiots who come on here babbling a load of bull# & trying to pass it as scientfific fact, & that goes for the OP & the replyer above.

Then learn to love yourself.

By the way, the rest mass of a photon is infinite.

Peace, enjoying the thread ALLisONE. Just ignore the zoo escapees.

Let's bring this back to topic. Allisone, the theory you're claiming is actually Ed Leedskalnin's, almost verbatim, but I want to thank you for reviving this subject! Whether or not it is correct, it's still close enough for jazz.

For those interested, the underlying concept Leedskalnin was attempting to show was that electricity and magnetism are two sides of the same coin. How you define that coin depends on what side you want to focus on. Manipulating one causes an equal and opposite reaction in the other, so long as the medium is balanced, but we already know this. It seems that just as you can have an electrical capacitor, you can have a magnetic capacitor (or for those who are into pop culture... a flux capacitor! heh heh).

Do the experiment to make what Leedskalnin called his Perpetual Motion Holder and see for yourselves. If you want to see it online look it up on youtube, (An Australian guy by the last name of Emery made a really nice one for his science class). I made one out of inferior materials and observed the same effects, albeit not as intensely as Emery's did. Now this might be common knowledge in scientific academia, but they sure didn't teach us anything like that in our college science classes! The focus was on electricity, not magnetism.

Anyway, I'm building a scaled down version of the rotor device in Leedskalnin's tower, taking into consideration the concepts he proposed, my own experiments, and even re-examining Egyptian hieroglyphs more literally for additional info. It's slow going because of life's demands but if/when I discover anything I'll post the results.

Originally posted by ALLis0NE
The Earth has a magnetic field that attracts. This is well documented. If that magnetic field was gone, there would still be masses of rock and dirt and stuff left. On the sub-atomic level, these materials still have electromagnetic interactions. This is "gravity".

I highlighted The Key To Perpetual Motion here:
forum.lawofmagnetism.com...

It's short and sweet, and I K.I.S.S.


[edit on 29-5-2008 by ALLis0NE]

The earth's magnetic field attracts in a way. But it also repels. That is of the utmost importance when it comes to the solar wind. Without the magnetic field to repel that radiation we would all eventually die unless somehow we figured out a way to live deep underground or travel to another planet.

To look at it from one dimension (that the magnetic field attracts) is sort of flawed. The only reason an area highly affected by a magnetic field is effective is because of the lack of any other magnetic field in the surrounding area.. Therefore, the lack of a magnetic field is also very important to how we can even disseminate between what is magnetically active and what isn't.

Also,
The magnetopause of the earth's electromagnetic field is a bullet-shaped area with very distinct properties caused by constant bombardment from the solar wind. The tail of the magnetopause (away from the sun) is a cylindrical area that can extend as far as 159,275 km from earth's center (25 Re)
en.wikipedia.org...
The moon's average distance from earth (center to center) is 384,403 km.
en.wikipedia.org...

The magnetopause of the earth does not reach but about halfway to the moon. This shows that the moon is completely untouched by the earth's own magnetic field (although it probably is affected, to a degree,by the solar wind that is deflected by the earth's magnetopause). This shows that earth's gravity, which keeps the moon in orbit, does not necessarily rely on an electromagnetic field of any kind. The moon doesn't even have a dipolar magnetic field like the earth. The moon has an external magnetic field which is an extremely small fraction of earth's (1/100th about). Yet the gravity of earth holds the moon in orbit without any kind of magnetic interaction between the two. Only gravitational.

The same can be said about the sun and the planets. The gravitational interaction between the sun and the planets permeates 3-dimensional space even throughout areas with 0 electromagnetic field between the sun and the planets. This shows that gravity is not dependant on an electromagnetic field.

But it is harder to explain whether or not an electromagnetic field is dependant upon gravity. That relationship is much more difficult to quantify.

On the dynamo effect:
en.wikipedia.org...

I'm guessing what you are suggesting with this thread is that rather than a dynamo effect creating a magnetic field, The kinematic dynamo theory is the real cause which involves vector velocity fields. But I don't yet see why you are trying to link gravity and electromagnetism in this fashion as some kind of cause and effect relationship.

A magnet always has mass therefore a magnet always has gravity. Therefore it is almost impossible to prove whether or not an electromagnetic field relies on an interdependant relationship with gravity within an object.

-ChriS

reply to post by BlasteR


Finally blaster, thank God for you. Someone who actually sums up the reality and doesn't actually get taken away by a theory No disrespect inteneded to anyone, debate is wonderful, but reality is what it is and i for one don't accept new theories just for their "weirdness value", although i do welcome them. great thread, i have learned a lot here, thank you all including the first poster. your ideas made me think.

Originally posted by Power_Semi
Oh God, please spare us this jibberish. You are not an intellectual, you are not born with some "special" insight, you are just playing with words & talking nonsense.

Nice tone, I see your intentions. Lets put you in your place shall we?

Originally posted by Power_Semi
Light is a form of energy. It does not contain "information" & neither does darkness - if it does I defy you to demonstrate.

Ok lets clear up one thing first. In no places does "dark" exist. "Dark" is only an illusion that most life forms have to live with. You see our eyes only see "visible light", so when you see "dark" it actually contains light that is not at the right speed/frequency for your eyes to see. You can prove this with an light intensifying infrared camera. When God said "let there be light" he wasn't just talking about visible light, he was talking about all electromagnetic radiation that exists in the entire electromagnetic spectrum which is also known as "light".

There only exists a "darkness" between the Sun and the Moon because there is not much matter for light to collide with in that area. This allows it to travel at higher speeds, which is exactly why we can't see it. Much like you don't even notice that your CRT or LCD screen is constantly flashing in front of you at a frequency. Yes, your computer screen is actually flashing but you can't see it because its so fast.

Actually the only reason you can see this font, and these words that you are reading from me, is because around these letters exists a slight darkness. If my font was black, you would be getting information from darkness. But since my font is white, you are getting it from light.

Actually, if it wasn't for light, you wouldn't even have been able to learn the alphabet, and come here and talk with us. If it wasn't for light giving you the information you know, you wouldn't even know anything. Light gives us opinions, all opinions come from light. All of your thoughts come from your opinions, which came from light.

On that note, have you herd of that spiral shape that makes every letter in the Hebrew language? There is a special shape, when you shine a light at it, and spin that shape, it's shadow creates every letter in the Hebrew Alphabet. Do you need more examples?

Originally posted by Power_Semi
Darkness is just a place without light. Light does not "create shadows," shadows are simply areas where the light cannot reach due to physical obstructions.

I can scientifically prove to you that within all darkness exists light that you can not see with your human eyes.

Originally posted by Power_Semi
I HATE idiots who come on here babbling a load of bull# & trying to pass it as scientfific fact, & that goes for the OP & the replyer above.

I think you need to learn exactly how all scientific data came to existence in the first place. Humans viewed it from light, and got their opinion. That is exactly what I did to find my truth.


-edit add-
I also wanted to mention, that light and dark are the same thing. Just like rich and poor are the same thing. 0ne can NOT exist without the other.

[edit on 29-5-2008 by ALLis0NE]

Originally posted by BlasteR
The earth's magnetic field attracts in a way. But it also repels. That is of the utmost importance when it comes to the solar wind. Without the magnetic field to repel that radiation we would all eventually die unless somehow we figured out a way to live deep underground or travel to another planet.

Earth's magnetic field will not die as long as we are in the Sun, because the Sun is magnetising the Earth.

Originally posted by BlasteR
To look at it from one dimension (that the magnetic field attracts) is sort of flawed.

You are really not paying attention at all. Look, when you have two magnets, no matter what they will naturaly want to attract. Even though both magnets have the ability to repel each other, their natural reaction is to flip, and attract! That is how "gravity" works. Your "mass" is magnetic force, if you have more magnetic force on the top, you will naturally flip over! ITS MAGNETISM!

Originally posted by BlasteR
The only reason an area highly affected by a magnetic field is effective is because of the lack of any other magnetic field in the surrounding area.. Therefore, the lack of a magnetic field is also very important to how we can even disseminate between what is magnetically active and what isn't.

All matter is held together by electromagnetic interactions. These "interactions" on a sub-atomic scale is what gravity is. When you have a big enough collection of "strong force" and "weak force" you have mass, and magnetic attraction! Of course you have repulsion too that is why water is diamagnetic. The atomic structure of all things decided how it reacts externally. The material structure of Earth decides how "gravity" interacts.

Originally posted by BlasteR
I'm guessing what you are suggesting with this thread is that rather than a dynamo effect creating a magnetic field, The kinematic dynamo theory is the real cause which involves vector velocity fields. But I don't yet see why you are trying to link gravity and electromagnetism in this fashion as some kind of cause and effect relationship.

It's really really simple. Mass = magnetic. I don't understand why that is so hard to understand, when you can literally look at any science book and they will tell you that ALL MASS IS MADE OF ELECTROMAGNETIC PARTICLES. The biggest flaw of all time is to think that an electron and proton "cancel each other out", or "neutralize". This is FALSE. They actually combine strength. This is what hold atoms together, is their combined strength. This is what "gravity" is. It's magnetic attraction at a sub-atomic scale, instead of just the atomic scale.

Originally posted by BlasteR
A magnet always has mass therefore a magnet always has gravity. Therefore it is almost impossible to prove whether or not an electromagnetic field relies on an interdependent relationship with gravity within an object.

-ChriS

I don't see why this is so difficult to prove to yourself and understand. The only reason a magnet has "mass" is because it is made of electrons and protons that are ELECTROMAGNETIC.

How is this so hard to understand?? I don't get it??

Why do you think a magnetic field only exists outside of objects? Don't you understand that sub-atomic particles have their own magnetic field?? This is all scientifically proven already!

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Finally blaster, thank God for you. Someone who actually sums up the reality and doesn't actually get taken away by a theory

No disrespect inteneded to anyone, debate is wonderful, but reality is what it is and i for one don't accept new theories just for their "weirdness value", although i do welcome them. great thread, i have learned a lot here, thank you all including the first poster. your ideas made me think.

Thanks for the compliment I am glad I can magneticaly stimulate your mind by sending you magnetic knowledge via light through your screen and into your electromagnetic mind.

Although it really upsets me when you say "taken away by theory". Actually, the only reason I am here today is to get YOU away from "theory". I have physical proof that what i say is real, and all you have to do is look at Coral Castle which ACTUALLY EXISTS!

Thanks.

I have seen some science papers attempting to link gravity and magnetism. The theory has a long way to go before it will replace General relativity. GR was Einsteins greatest achievement, he felt confident to say if the theory was proven wrong he would "feel sorry for god because the theory is correct". The math in the theory predicted that light would be bent a ceartain amount when passing stars and it also accounted for the perihillion of Mercury. Those results were confirmed eventually by experiment. Creating the equations that will also account for these things from magnetism will be an extremely hard task. Until that happens GR remains correct. It's good to look into new ideas though, especially if the new ideas are mathematically able to unite gravity with quantum mechanics.
Einstein was so "connected" when he came up with special and general relativity that it's hard to imagine he was wrong. These new ideas suggest that mass is not actually bending space-time then?

Joel Rivard

Originally posted by BlasteR
The magnetopause of the earth does not reach but about halfway to the moon. This shows that the moon is completely untouched by the earth's own magnetic field (although it probably is affected, to a degree,by the solar wind that is deflected by the earth's magnetopause). This shows that earth's gravity, which keeps the moon in orbit, does not necessarily rely on an electromagnetic field of any kind. The moon doesn't even have a dipolar magnetic field like the earth. The moon has an external magnetic field which is an extremely small fraction of earth's (1/100th about). Yet the gravity of earth holds the moon in orbit without any kind of magnetic interaction between the two. Only gravitational.

The same can be said about the sun and the planets. The gravitational interaction between the sun and the planets permeates 3-dimensional space even throughout areas with 0 electromagnetic field between the sun and the planets. This shows that gravity is not dependant on an electromagnetic field.

Blaster/ Chris

I applaud your effort to argue or counter with commonly accepted or taught "fact" and that you avoided being rude or harsh. Congratulations that will stimulate this discussion and is positive!

Far be it to attempt to provide bold explainations as the very " confident and assured" ALLisOne.... I am learning heaps here and don't profess to have it yet!

Please permit me to try to add something to the thread.

I refer you and highly recommend to a book written by Walter Russell titles "The Russell Genero-Radiative Concept" it can be downloaded from the internet just google it.

You may not have heard of this genius even the great Nikola Tesla commented he had knowledge that "ought be locked up for a 1000 years until mankind was ready for it.!"

In this book you will discover he conducted an experiment where he replicated to scale our solar system (including our moon) with... Magnets!!! It behaved exactly the same way! He also proposed very similar theory that OP is proposing!!!

In your challenge about Earth Moon magnetic fields and interactive gravity you are looking at them in isolation without reference to the impact that the Sun has. Just as Ed Leedskalnin's simple experiment with the two bent short fishing wire magnets where he shows the attraction and repulsion created by a 3rd introduced maget which maintains a constant distance so therefore it is so Sun Earth Moon (plus the others) has a combined effect.

Hope that helps.. hang in there this is extremely interesting.

ALLisOne Thanks for your reply to my questions.... still pondering but great food for thought and it makes more sense to now!





I

Yes, well, in a short while I figured I would just release 0ne actual method for levitating a 30 ton rock. Ok? Be back soon...

Yeah, Interesting.

However, all "valid" Scientific Experiments could derive some Equataions and/or Statistics to explain / support the phenomena. In addition, if I want to build an Anti-Gravity device in a larger scale, say, an Anti-Gravity device that can be applied in a Boeing-747, I need those Equations / Statistics to assist me in designing such devices.

I believe that "Scientific Experiments" should not be "You just do it by following these examples" without Equations / Statistics / Data behind them. Please provide all the supporting data / equations / statistics for your theories / hypothesis.

Otherwise, what you said, although they seem interesting, they are just Pseudo-Science......or Sci-Fi.

I also hate that "I know this and that, you are foolish and you will not know" attitude. If you think your theories could assist us to develop some devices that could better change our quality of life, limiting the pollution, and advancing our knowledge to a new height, please provide all necessary data / equations / statistics. I think all famous science journals, and all human beings, would love to know your theories.

Show me something, if it is really SCIENTIFIC.

Gravity is not a force like magnetism, but the consequence of the speed at which we travel through space.

Aside from the Earth's spin, it is also traveling through space, "around" the sun at about 65,000 mph. hypertextbook.com...

Just as when we're pushed back into a seat as the jet takes off, we're pushed back into the Earth.

There can never be an anti-gravity machine because of this fact. Except of course, a rocket that takes us far enough away from the earth.

This has been known for a very long time, but seems to have not made it into most textbooks.

While we're at it, the Moon does not raise the water from the Earth surface. In fact, the Moon is moving away from the Earth at a measurable rate. If gravity were a force, and the bigger the body the bigger the gravity, the Moon would long ago have crashed into the Earth.

Originally posted by Prometheo
If gravity were a force, and the bigger the body the bigger the gravity, the Moon would long ago have crashed into the Earth.

I was kind of following your post until you said this, which I cannot for the life of me reconcile with this law:




Maybe you are just in disagreement with that law? If so, then nevermind this post.

That the Moon revolves around the Earth in a path always tangent to it, and this keeps the two from colliding, I might buy that. But there is obviously some "binding" force that prevents the Moon from continuing out into space at any given moment in a straight line, just like slinging around a rock on a string and then cutting the string. The rock always travels tangent to the string until the string is cut, then it just flies out in whatever direction it was heading the moment the connection was severed.

Promethio gravity is caused by mass curving spacetime. At least that's what our current model is (General Relativity).

Wilson described his writing as an "attempt to break down conditioned associations—to look at the world in a new way, with many models recognized as models or maps and no one model elevated to the Truth." . . . "My goal is to try to get people into a state of generalized agnosticism, not agnosticism about God alone, but agnosticism about everything."

"Is", "is." "is" — the idiocy of the word haunts me. If it were abolished, human thought might begin to make sense. I don't know what anything "is"; I only know how it seems to me at this moment.

from the wikipedia on Robert Anton Wilson and his writings, they have helped me in more ways than i can count this lifetime.
en.wikipedia.org...


To all the haters, some of you can be very mean, and insulting. I've read the excuses on this same forum, -" some of us a are jaded bunch"-
good luck adapting to change.

I'm no one to give out advice, but I'll give out this one just for the heck of it, take it as you will : don't hold ANYTHING for granted, this is an ever changing universe!
This era's sad excuse of humanity, myself included , have been "aware" of our surroundings, or maybe i should rephrase, this era's scientists really don't know much , and never will unless they get their hands dirty on the task, GETTING OUT THERE and making sure that what we believe here on earth holds across the vastness of the cosmos, where everything, can happen, and does happen, humanity wont get there on rocket fueled dreams.

humanity will get there on electromagnetic generators, and all this debate on the nature of "gravity" will be just a thing of the past, just as we now see the ideas of the earth being flat, and the night sky some sort of roof with distant torches odd at best.

all is changing all the time, we are just here for the thrill of the ride!
some of the haters really should just relax, and keep their minds open, TIME
will set this debate straight, and ironically, the strongest supporters of the paradigms, can never witness in their lifetimes their beliefs shattered by new discoveries.... alas... the universe will keep on spinning...


-----

I'd like too see more of your experiments, i strongly believe in this:"AS ABOVE, AS BELOW".