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Skyfall, or, Was Chicken Little Really Crazy?

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posted on Jun, 2 2008 @ 07:43 PM
no, it was an order of magnitude LARGER than hiroshima or nagasaki bombings.

Hundreds upon hundreds of square miles was destroyed in a blink of an eye and a massive pillar of smoke and debris.

This was on a scale of todays nuclear weapons. Ill go dig out just how large it was.. BRB

posted on Jun, 2 2008 @ 07:47 PM
900 million trees flattened over 2150 square kilometers.... just think of that a moment. had that hit paris, moscow or london a whole set of devastation that even today is hard to imagine.

2150 square kilometers.

posted on Jun, 3 2008 @ 02:48 PM
reply to post by Dan Tanna

Hiroshima X 2000 is MASSIVE indeed.

And I agree that should such an event take place now, even close to a well populated area, the devastation would be catostrophic.

Also, in the link you gave I was interested to read about the Banjawarn Event in Austrailia in 1993. This needs to be investigated. I wonder what some of our Australian members know about this? It would be interesting to see what Google Earth shows in that area, provided one could locate the general area.

posted on Jun, 3 2008 @ 03:03 PM

TextThe author began private research into the nature of the "1993 Banjawarn Event" in early 1995. This work is still in progress today, and the event cause is still not fully understood, but it resembles an apparent "Mini 1908 Tunguska" type event. The event occurred on or near the Banjawarn sheep station (ranch), close to the Celia Fault/Lineament, some 130km northwest of the mining town of Laverton, in the very sparsely populated and isolated semi-desert Eastern Goldfields region of Western Australia. The event commenced at about 23.00hrs on the night of the 28th. of May 1993 with the sighting of a large aerial orange-red fireball plus a short conical tail low down on the southern horizon. This "object" arced low overhead at an altitude of some 1-2000 metres in a "nap of Earth" type trajectory at less than the speed of sound making a loud pulsed roaring "diesel freight train engine" type noise in flight, before apparently diving to a ground level "impact". The "impact" was hidden behind a range of low hills located northwest of Banjawarn sheep station. This was immediately followed by :- (1) a high energy flash of blue-white light (reminiscent of a night time nuclear blast) that "lit up the surrounding 100km radius of scrub bush like day", (2) a major long drawn out explosion and a concussion blast wave, and (3) a co-incident 3.6-3.9 Richter earthquake picked up at 23 AGSO seismographs around the western half of Australia, with (4) the simultaneous projection of a large column or "flare" of orange-red coloured light vertically skyward to an altitude estimated as several kilometres, followed (5) by the slow expansion growth of a large "two setting-sun sized" orange-red hemispherical opaque light form structure, with a glowing silver lining, that remained lit up for 2 hours, on the horizon above "ground zero", in the clear cloudless, dark - no moon, windless night sky, and (6) approximately one hour after the initial earthquake at 24.00hrs another very small blue-green fireball arced high over Banjawarn station following approximately the same course as the first fireball (but originating at ground level ?) - this then created a second minor ground "impact" with an associated very minor seismic "felt" event at 24.00hrs (but apparently of insufficient energy to be detected by the AGSO seismic chain), with this "ground zero" being adjacent, or in, the hemispheric light form structure described in (5) above. The seismograph data suggests that the first incident involved a minimum of some 1-2Kt of TNT equivalent and therefore was similar in energy size to a tactical nuclear weapon blast. This region consists of a very stable Archaean age cratonic crust which is generally considered to have no prior human historical record of natural seismic events. Inspite of a considerable aerial search by light plane and detailed examination of SPOT satellite imagery no crater or airburst ground damage nor relevant fire damage has been located. Two other identical orange-red pulsed noise emitting fireballs (in October 1989 and in May or June 1993) are now known to have previously flown the same course/trajectory over Banjawarn. Two other large orange-red hemisphere static light form structures have also been observed at night northwest of Banjawarn (in 1988 and in October 1992). This and other data mitigates against bolide impact as the probable cause of this event. Several possible causes are discussed including rock fault stress induced plasma fireball and "earthquake lights", clandestine military electro-magnetic Tesla type weapon tests, or covert exotic space craft drive tests.

A covert weapons / propulsion research base would be my guess by peoples not affiliated with any governmental offices.

heres another interesting snippet about the explosion and sightings...

It happens that at 11:03 p.m. local time on May 28, 1993,
seismograph needles all over the Pacific region twitched and scribbled in
response to a very large-scale disturbance near a place called Banjawarn
Station in the Great Victoria Desert of Western Australia. Some
long-distance truckers and prospectors, virtually the only people out in
that lonely expanse, reported seeing a sudden flash in the sky and hearing
or feeling the boom of a mighty but far-off explosion. One reported that a
can of beer had danced off the table in his tent.

The problem was that there was no obvious explanation. The
seismograph traces didn't fit the profile for an earthquake or mining
explosion, and anyway the blast was 170 times more powerful than the most
powerful mining explosion ever recorded in Western Australia. The shock was
consistent with a large meteorite strike, but the impact would have blown a
crater hundreds of feet in circumference, and no such crater could be found.
The upshot is that scientists puzzled over the incident for a day or two,
then filed it away as an unexplained curiosity—the sort of thing that
presumably happens from time to time.

Very interesting indeed, especially that its a non-governmental fanatical group.... scary stuff, but very poorly documented event considering its possible impact upon the worlds scene if it is Aum developing nukes!

[edit on 3-6-2008 by Dan Tanna]

posted on Jun, 3 2008 @ 03:58 PM
This is a subject that interests me, but for which I don't see a solution.

Even if we detect such menaces with enough time to issue a warning, I don't see what can we do about it if we have only two or three days, for example.

And those ideas from Dallas Abbott look a bit strange.

If a 300 metres object hit the Gulf of Carpentaria, where did it hit, land or sea? Judging by the rest of the text, that speaks of "debris, dust, and gases thrown into the atmosphere", I suppose that it is meant to have hit land.

If it hit land, was it the responsible for the creation of the gulf? In that case why is the gulf almost square?

But even if it was not the responsible for the creation of the gulf, such an impact, as she said, would have enormous consequences, but where are those consequences on Australia?

Is there any tradition among the Australian Aborigines of such thing? Australia was not a desert at that time.

I hope you understand what I mean, even if she is right about the scientists not remembering the water, I think she is over-hyping her ideas.

I don't know if this is correct, I am not a scientist and not even went to a university, but if water is 2.3 times more common than land on the Earth's surface then it would mean that, if the number of hits in the last 10,000 years, for example, was calculated as 5, the total would be 5+2.3*5=16.5

That would change the possibilities from 1 in every 2,000 years (10,000/5) to 1 in every 606 years, 3 times as likely as before.

As the (other) scientists think that such hits never occurred during the known history of mankind, I think that the odds are still very small that such things will happen soon.

But that does not mean that they won't happen, they can happen at any moment, statistics are only useful as statistics, they are useless to really know what will happen and when will it happen.

PS: if you can read this post it means that nothing hit between the time I was writing it and the time you read it.

Edited to add: my calculations may be completely wrong, I don't have any idea about their correctness.

[edit on 3/6/2008 by ArMaP]

posted on Jun, 4 2008 @ 07:47 PM
OK, I'm not good at so many things, (that's why I have so many smart friends), and I need help.

Let's say an object struck the sea, causing tidal waves. I'm looking for maps that might show rising sea levels that would revise current maps. I could extrapolate from these, and they themselves would be worthwhile in the whole "global warming" debate anyway. A site showing potential new coastlines due to rising ocean levels?

Is there a location on the web for such info? I haven't run across it, but then, I'm a dummy.

Thanks guys.


posted on Jun, 5 2008 @ 09:19 PM
It's been 24 hours, so I'm bumping to see if anyone has a location for maps that show coastline changes due to rising water levels.

(Might not be a good time, what with page problems on ATS. )

posted on Jun, 6 2008 @ 03:02 AM
Hi there - right, first off there would be no sea rise. It would slosh about, some horrific waves would be seen and they would reach hieghts undreamed of.

Now, after the initial impact millions upon millions of tonnes of water would be vaporised into steam. This would cause a terrible thick dark cloud and torrential rain over a vast area of the globe. We would see horrific flooding as that millions of tonnes fell back to earth.

Now, as for the sea level, nothing would change. the coast lines effected may have lost alot of land due to erosion, but as for levels per se, nothing would happen.

Hope that helps.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 11:46 AM
reply to post by Dan Tanna

Yes it does help. I found some maps to look at for sea rise changes. I realize there wouldn't be any perceptible change in the long run, but depending on the strike area/direction of force, one could expect any resulting waves to conform to about the same land contours as in a tsunami. Valleys that open to the sea would channel these waves, probably adding to their force, for many miles inland.

And as you so astutely pointed out, the resulting rainfall, I would think on the order of a monsoon, would then be channeled back out these same valleys. Effected areas would get a double whammy, inrushing and then outrushing flood waters.

While shorelines, as such, wouldn't really change much, the devestation from moving water, and possibly landslides, might be extreme. Heavy damage to effected infrastructure would likely result in severe hardships across a much greater area, as ports would be destroyed, along with many roads/bridges and rail lines.

When you start thinking about the aftermath of such a thing, it's mind boggling.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 03:19 PM
reply to post by NGC2736

At least I live in a place that I know is protected from tsunamis, it has already survived one on 1755, after the great earthquake that destroyed Lisbon, so I am more worried about a land hit, raining dirt is worse than raining water.

One thing I remembered the other day but forgot to post is that if anyone wants to know how many meteors may have hit the Earth during the last millions of years he (or she) only has to look at the far side of the Moon.

Being unprotected, that side of the Moon has been hit since its "birth" (or since it has reached Earth orbit, naturally or artificially, depending on the theory we choose) and the only thing covering the hits is the newer hits, so it may have much more statistic value than trying to find possible meteor created craters (some craters are from volcanoes) below the oceans.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 03:49 PM
I would also rather a sea hit say mid pacific that a land hit from a large astroid or space rock, and the percentages game is on our side.

HOWEVER - This assumes only ONE rock.

The bad news is that if you look world wide for 'footprints' of these strikes you see many daisy chained across a landscape.

A land hit would be devastating world wide, whereas a sea hit would be bad, it would not create the global havoc of a smae sized land hit.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 03:55 PM

The bright white is recent impacts - hence the brightness of the newer materials. This is the rea of the moon from a NASA TIFF image.

Its an eye opener to say the least.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 04:20 PM
reply to post by Dan Tanna

Yes, but if you compare the Moon, with only a residual atmosphere at most, with Mars with enough atmosphere to have winds and clouds, although much thinner than that of the Earth, you can see that the number of small hits is much smaller on Mars, so we can see the protective effect of the atmosphere.

Unfortunately (or not), the same atmosphere is responsible for the breaking of larger meteors, creating a "shotgun" or "machine-gun" effect instead of a larger hit.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 04:23 PM
I understand that completely - its the numbers I was pointing to !

I know the lack of erosion means these can be many millions of years old, but the size and scale means we are very, very lucky indeed that one of those huge monsters hasn't hit us!

The tunguska event was a small, maybe tens of meters object.... think what a giant rock would do..... especially if it hit down town London UK.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 04:32 PM
Heres the scientific thoughts of what would happen if a small tunguska event would hit london.

“The consequences for human populations and infrastructure as a result of an impact are enormous,” says Bailey. “Nearly one hundred years ago a remote region near the Tunguska River witnessed the largest asteroid impact event in living memory when a relatively small object (approximately 50 metres in diameter) exploded in mid-air. While it only flattened unpopulated forest, had it exploded over London it could have devastated everything within the M25. Our results highlight those countries that face the greatest risk from this most global of natural hazards and thus indicate which nations need to be involved in mitigating the threat.”

MIT astroid study

Now look at this map of the impact craters they know of... and look where mankind is populated!

A very good read is that MIT link. Shows just how concerned they are...

“The threat of the Earth being hit by an asteroid is increasingly being accepted as the single greatest natural disaster hazard faced by humanity,” says Nick Bailey of the University of Southampton's School of Engineering Sciences team

Sleep well.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 06:04 PM
reply to post by Dan Tanna

Interesting read, but I think that the fact that they identified those locations as those where asteroids have hit does not mean that they are more prone to be hit in the future.

How can someone realisticaly say that it is more probable that an asteroid will hit Australia than China?

I think that the fact that they only have found signs of those hits only shows that on the other places the erosion (both natural and human-made) may have changed the landscape and made those signs less visible.

And yes, a large asteroid can turn any day into a really bad day.

One site that I like to visit from time to time is the Impact Effects Calculator.

At a distance of 50km from the impact point of 500 metres asteroid, these would be some of the results:

Crater Dimensions:
     Final Crater Diameter: 7.78 km = 4.83 miles
     Final Crater Depth: 0.549 km = 0.341 miles
Thermal Radiation:
     Visible fireball radius: 5.83 km = 3.62 miles
     The fireball appears 26.5 times larger than the sun
     Thermal Exposure: 5.01 x 106 Joules/m2
     Duration of Irradiation: 78.3 seconds
     Radiant flux (relative to the sun): 63.9
Effects of Thermal Radiation:
     Clothing ignites
     Much of the body suffers third degree burns
     Newspaper ignites
     Plywood flames
     Deciduous trees ignite
     Grass ignites
Seismic Effects:
     The major seismic shaking will arrive at approximately 10 seconds.
     Richter Scale Magnitude: 7.2
     Mercalli Scale Intensity at a distance of 50 km:
          IX. General panic. Damage considerable in specially designed structures; well-designed frame structures thrown out of plumb. Damage great in substantial buildings, with partial collapse. Buildings shifted off foundations. Serious damage to reservoirs. Underground pipes broken. Conspicuous cracks in ground. In alluviated areas sand and mud ejected, earthquake fountains, sand craters.
          X. Most masonry and frame structures destroyed with their foundations. Some well-built wooden structures and bridges destroyed. Serious damage to dams, dikes, embankments. Large landslides. Water thrown on banks of canals, rivers, lakes, etc. Sand and mud shifted horizontally on beaches and flat land. Rails bent slightly.
     The ejecta will arrive approximately 101 seconds after the impact.
     Average Ejecta Thickness: 9.97 cm = 3.92 inches
     Mean Fragment Diameter: 30.6 cm = 12 inches
Air Blast:
     The air blast will arrive at approximately 152 seconds.
     Peak Overpressure: 88100 Pa = 0.881 bars = 12.5 psi
     Max wind velocity: 157 m/s = 351 mph
     Sound Intensity: 99 dB (May cause ear pain)
Damage Description:
     Multistory wall-bearing buildings will collapse.
     Wood frame buildings will almost completely collapse.
     Glass windows will shatter.
     Up to 90 percent of trees blown down; remainder stripped of branches and leaves.

At a distance of 100km it would be a little better:
(the crater would be the same, obviously, I only changed the distance to the impact)

Thermal Radiation:
     Visible fireball radius: 5.24 km = 3.25 miles
     The fireball appears 11.9 times larger than the sun
     Thermal Exposure: 1.09 x 106 Joules/m2
     Duration of Irradiation: 78.3 seconds
     Radiant flux (relative to the sun): 13.9
Effects of Thermal Radiation:
     Much of the body suffers second degree burns
     Deciduous trees ignite
Seismic Effects:
     The major seismic shaking will arrive at approximately 20 seconds.
     Richter Scale Magnitude: 7.2
     Mercalli Scale Intensity at a distance of 100 km:
          VI. Felt by all, many frightened. Some heavy furniture moved; a few instances of fallen plaster. Damage slight.
          VII. Damage negligible in buildings of good design and construction; slight to moderate in well-built ordinary structures; considerable damage in poorly built or badly designed structures; some chimneys broken.
     The ejecta will arrive approximately 144 seconds after the impact.
     Average Ejecta Thickness: 1.25 cm = 0.491 inches
     Mean Fragment Diameter: 4.87 cm = 1.92 inches
Air Blast:
     The air blast will arrive at approximately 303 seconds.
     Peak Overpressure: 23900 Pa = 0.239 bars = 3.4 psi
     Max wind velocity: 51.4 m/s = 115 mph
     Sound Intensity: 88 dB (Loud as heavy traffic)
Damage Description:
     Interior partitions of wood frame buildings will be blown down. Roof will be severely damaged.
     Glass windows will shatter.
     About 30 percent of trees blown down; remainder have some branches and leaves blown off.

Although I sometimes have problems sleeping, this is not one of the things that keeps me awake.

posted on Jun, 9 2008 @ 11:27 PM
The natural damage would be enormous, but there's another consideration.

Because we lack any coordinated effort at locating and tracking such targets, many people outside of the scientific community wouldn't have any warning. Perhaps whole countries wouldn't have any warning.

So what would be the military reaction to a devastating impact on the order of 1000 Hiroshima bombs hitting London? Would some unwarned, and "in the box thinker" with a lot of rank start WWIII out of panic and a sense of duty? Would missles be fired at Moscow or Bejing? Would retalitory missles return? How long would it take to stop the insanity?

Yes, I know we all have some capibilities of locating and tracking incoming rocks. But we don't have the communications set in place to avert a reaction from a nation that is hit by something it doesn't understand, and has to assume is of hostile intent. And the smaller, yet 100X Hiroshima, rocks would have almost no warning even to those looking for them. A hit like that would cause a lot of reaction.

I too sleep good. There's no point in worry over something where you have no control. Still, it would be a good thing for this to be taken seriously by the nations of the world. I don't want my grandchildren growing up in the New Stone Age.

posted on Jun, 10 2008 @ 05:37 AM
reply to post by NGC2736

I don't think that there is such a a danger of misinterpreting an asteroid hit.

Although we have means to find incoming asteroids, we can not be sure if we find them, I think it was last year or the year before that an asteroid was found after it had passed Earth, and that is not reassuring.

But the means to identify incoming missiles are much more accurate and active, so I think a hit would not be considered a missile attack by anyone.

The way the energy is released is also different (there are no ejecta from atomic bombs, for example, and there is no radiation in an asteroid hit), so that is also something that makes me think that an asteroid hit would not be misinterpreted as a missile/bomb hit.

posted on Jun, 10 2008 @ 05:29 PM
reply to post by ArMaP

Oh I agree that in a little while, those facts would come out. But from the time radar picked up incoming targets to impact would be pretty short. Right now, ID is mostly aimed at an earth origin, giving tracking from firing of the missle through it's whole flight time.

But it might be a whole other problem to recognize what it is when it comes zipping by at full speed from an unseen source. depending on angle of descent, locking on and tracking might only be two or three minutes before impact. Hard to get a firm read on a signatue in that timeframe.

And what if the incoming rock stuck a major city of some place that lacked the firmer command structure of most western nations? I could see a general from Uzbekistan firing a left over Russian missle in the confusion.

It's seldom those things prepared for that create havoc and mistakes, but rather the unexpected. One more reason for a majority of nations to pool resources to set up a warning system, even if there was no chance to evacuate those in the bulls eye.

[edit on 10-6-2008 by NGC2736]

posted on Jun, 12 2008 @ 04:13 AM
reply to post by NGC2736

I want to respond more, but before I finish your sources, I wanted to comment that I believe that between all of the seed vaults and the south pole telescope, the odds that something is coming strikes me as more than likely, or at least more than we know...

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