Brain Implantation..Information is the Modern Day version of Warfare., page 4

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reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 11:46 AM by Ian McLean

Originally posted by Electricneo
The State creates a structure of reality that becomes the consciousness
of the masses.

Well I want to know what country you live in, because where I'm at, 'the State' (US government) doesn't create much at all, except bureaucracy and a monopoly on the use of force

. And as you mention, true creativity is an individual action.

I think my jargony use of the mathematical term 'state vector' was confusing. Sorry about that. A state vector is simply a list of measurements, like numbers, that describe a model. So, for example, if there's an implant connected between 4 neurons, measuring whether they're firing, and each neuron's firing 'state' can be represented as 0 or 1, the 'state vector' for the implant would be: {0,0,0,0} if none of the neurons are firing at a particular point in time, or {1,1,1,1} if they're all firing, or {0,0,0,1} if only the fourth one is firing. The data a passive implant would record would be a sequence of state vectors. There's no information (context) or functional correlation in the state vector, just data.

When you get to the level of truly thinking for yourself usually the person becomes creative as a bonus.

Interesting, because I just recently posted a little rant about this, that I was disappointed that no one responded to. But with something like this subject, really, too much creativity isn't desirable! I think what's needed is rational discussion, unconstrained by prejudice -- 'truly thinking for yourself' isn't exactly the best way to honestly listen to someone's experiences and try to understand and communicate about them.

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 02:53 PM by aleon1018

I've yet to start any thread about my experiences related to these types of stories. Because it appears to me that many ignore me as mentally ill and delusional, it's become increasingly obvious that it's usually pointless and regretful to do so.

I find it hard to accept that someone who has spent so much time here on ATS and probably searched all of these related subjects, wouldn't be capable of drawing a better or more accurate theory. So, where or what's the mental block? The claim of being an atheist seems to be part of it. Maybe you're just a conspiracy writer using this as a lead story to provoke a response by like minded people or alleged nutjobs? (...fish jumps out of water to eat CGI)

If religion (programing) is part of the overall conspiracy against us, then maybe you're rejecting some of these clues that are part of the overall puzzle?

I think that giving all of the credit of MK to the military and believing this is strictly our technology is naive. If this control technology was originated from ET's or other higher minded sources, then the theory or conclusion of this just being a human established experiment is probably wrong.

It's been my limited experience that these people are and have been most likely using clones in some way or another. Possibly to roll play being you, others around you or being human in society. I've recalled having met a few nervous ones that were apparently clones such as Albert Einstein. (hmm, why wouldn't they clone him?)

It shouldn't be hard to imagine that if there were physical implants in your body, any prior knowledge of you receiving any test to detect these would be to use a stand-in clone without them. They may even hand you someone elses records to give the impression they're yours. Blood tests could then also be swapped. Even our archeological history when we have any other similar tests or such as carbon dating might be to give us a false positive or negative. Maybe we humans or visitors have only been here 6,000 years?

Their alleged stealth technologies and ability to shut us off can be just an example of how this is possible. ( Science fiction? Darkman, Matrix, Xmen etc.)

I've had times where the voices became visits through other people who were apparently taken over and used temporarily. Sometimes just for a brief message. Then when I would mention why the person I was with had said it, they would deny saying it and or just didn't know they had.

Sometimes they would know and say: "Why did I say that?" or "Why did I do that?" or "How did I get here?" or "I'm lost" Sometimes the words are clearly not your own even though they came from you. It's just another form of possession whether it's demonic, spiritual, the claim of remote viewing or now explainable throught the use of implant technology and advanced science. It would seem from what you say that you have some amount of free will.

It may be that this is just an old form of knowledge and technology used on us long ago and finally being disclosed and understood. Religion has mentioned somewhere about people being mouthpieces. When people were called to prayer, such as muslims, this may have been a place where these technologies were housed and these people programed.

I recall watching one show of In Search Of in which it was claimed that some skulls of people several hundred years old had what appeared to be implants and these surgeries through their nose, just as was mentioned in the series Taken.

And IF you do have any implants, it may be possible to block these voices and signals. (duh) According to mythbusters: tinfoil hats give better reception.

And, If Satan claims to be god; how can he be an atheist?

(shortened due to rambling)

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 03:10 PM by MemoryShock

Originally posted by aleon1018
I find it hard to accept that someone who has spent so much time here on ATS and probably searched all of these related subjects, wouldn't be capable of drawing a better or more accurate theory. So, where or what's the mental block? The claim of being an atheist seems to be part of it. Maybe you're just a conspiracy writer using this as a lead story to provoke a response by like minded people or alleged nutjobs? (...fish jumps out of water to eat CGI)

Thanks for showing up. I was wondering when someone would post something as adversarial.

I will respond in more depth a bit later (I am working on my debate response currently) but I am curious as to what you would think is a better or more accurate theory...

Are you referring to the voices and mode of communication (beam of ultras sound as opposed to the implant)?

I actually think the implant is the more likely because the voices are not really affected by distance traveled (traveling to Arizona and Wisconsin).

I can appreciate your skepticism....and will return to this later...I placed alot on my plate.

[edit on 31-5-2008 by MemoryShock]

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 03:12 PM by seawave

Best brain implant is Television you all succumb to it.

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 03:15 PM by interestedalways

Talk about mind control.

The devil and angel smiley at the bottom of this page has the devil laughing and the angel smiley says "Oh, behave!"

Creepy enough.

Edit to add: Now it's gone!!!

Do the adds at the bottom of the page always change while you are on the page???

Hope this isn't considered a derail.

Since this thread has started I am seeing more and more testimonies of members experiencing similar circumstances.

Here is one from today.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 31-5-2008 by interestedalways]

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 04:30 PM by interestedalways

I found this link using a "deep web search" I liked this link because it had an assortment of many type of people experiencing this type of harrasement.

Being a victim of government surveillance is also, arguably, better than being insane. In Waugh's novella based on his own painful experience, when Pinfold concludes that hidden technology is being used to infiltrate his brain, he "felt nothing but gratitude in his discovery." Why? "He might be unpopular; he might be ridiculous; but he was not mad."

The knowledge of this means much, I am sure.

In general, the outlook for TIs is not good; many lose their jobs, houses and family. Depression is common. But for many at the rally, experiencing the community of mind-control victims seems to help. One TI, a man who had been a rescue swimmer in the Coast Guard before voices in his head sent him on a downward spiral, expressed the solace he found among fellow TIs in a long e-mail to another TI: "I think that the only people that can help are people going through the same thing. Everyone else will not believe you, or they are possibly involved."

It goes on to say that this man did end up commiting suicide, scary just how powerful this can be to the ones suffering with it.

The callers frequently refer to themselves as TIs, which is short for Targeted Individuals, and talk about V2K -- the official military abbreviation stands for "voice to skull" and denotes weapons that beam voices or sounds into the head. In their esoteric lexicon, "gang stalking" refers to the belief that they are being followed and harassed: by neighbors, strangers or colleagues who are agents for the government.

I think it would be very niave to say that everyone who is experiencing symptoms of this are insane. It is happening on a pretty large level. Then when you look at all the patents for this kind of weaponary it really reinforces the concept.

Source:
www.washingtonpost.com...

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 05:25 PM by aleon1018

reply to post by MemoryShock

Sorry, but with my kind of thinking, it's hard not to become suspicious and paranoid when someones story sounds too good or similar to be true. I have been called a liar here in a way. And if there's any truth to the so-called false prophet, than I guess implants and remote viewing can be a way also. But I'm also inclined to accept that our current sources of news information just as false, including the internet.

I had written much more to my other post and decided to edit it. And if certain technology that promotes and controls out of body experiences is real; then, yes, these people won't necessarily need any other technology such as brain implants to find and control you. GPS and any subtle way they find you, such as anyplace on your person may be enough.

Have you seen the entire DVD version and commentary of the movie Suspect Zero? Remote Viewing may actually have a much more powerful capability that hasn't been disclosed that enhances it. I used to have what I believed was one. But, this might also have been an illusion with implants or visa versa. It boils down to some type of possession or influence controlled process.

Some stories such as this one and a few others here have given me a few glimpses of what might be remote viewing. Drawing partially from my own experience and possibly this remote viewing:

Your story suggested dissociation to possibly a childlike alter of yourself that spoke to your room mate. Breaking the window was supposedly the response to denial and a panic attack when he told you what you had said.The cut on the hand was either from a knife or the glass that didn't break when you used both of your fists to break the window. Supposedly a piece was still lodged in the left side of the window and you cut your self on it when it didn't easily come out. Maybe it's all just my imagination, but the story related to some of my own memories anyway. I have a few bizarre memories of broken windows and glass too along with panic attacks etc.

I think you can imagine how this story can be based on or suspect of a typical dissociation through denial of some traumatic event.

Breaking glass may probably be a typical way some people deal with these denials and also the need for air and escape during a panic attack and the lower brain kicking in.

I've been on Seroquel for over a year now and it was really hard to adjust to. I could barely stand 100 mg and have since cut down to 50 mg. But, because it seems that I was originally brain damaged, I can't say your response would be the same. It's as if I was using my lower brain function instead. The main problem I think with the seroquel is the resistance to it's affect and the feeling as if I needed to eat and was hungry.

No, I don't like this medication. But it did dull the affect of these memories if not almost erase them. It's like a pharmaceutical labotomy. Similar if not the same as another trauma drug now being used or tested. I did originally start off on trazodone to finally sleep, but it didn't blend well with the seroquel and cause a panic attack. My pulse was around 140 and that was scary. It may have been from my blood sugar though.

Who knows, maybe I had a parasite crawling around my brain causing these bizarre memories. Some parasites thrive on alchohol and sugars also. Maybe some of these anti psychotics are just bug killers?

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 05:52 PM by MemoryShock

[edit on 31-5-2008 by MemoryShock]

reply posted on 31-5-2008 @ 11:32 PM by P. O. W.

I had a bad day today where after several experiences that led to worst day of sort of handfull of last 2 years. It involved a loss of association to a girl knew last 3 months. I was telling parents I am going to a medical hospital ER and staying there till this is gone. Ridiculous and over 14 months and I gotta wait 3 months for a diagnosis from private doctor. I cant live most aspects of my life like this or move forward keep falling in careless oblivoiusness.
I was going off for an hour about with parents. Last 7 years of life napping on drugs I am forced to take, I believe wrongfully diagnosed for 6 years. And 5 years before that up hill battle disablity what has my entire life become, waiting for this to pass. Well they will put you in psych ward for complaining about headaches, I have been in their headquarters many a time I know how to talk with them and why go on living like this strive to change things for the better or try I dont have patience anymore. In autopilot crashing or not entirely aware or awake.
This is how my mentality is after headaches awhile and not trusting certain people entirely. I would imagine after hearing voices for awhile and some people out of characther changes how you look at the world. Recorded statements of tech. and using it on people and being conditioned into however they desire for form of mortal kombat or intelligence. The majority of society reinforces how to look upon legit and ill rogues like this and I can try to understand where he is coming from. A place of withdrawn speculation or things you have to deal with alone.

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 12:48 AM by Electricneo

Originally posted by Ian McLean

Originally posted by Electricneo
The State creates a structure of reality that becomes the consciousness
of the masses.

Well I want to know what country you live in, because where I'm at, 'the State' (US government) doesn't create much at all, except bureaucracy and a monopoly on the use of force . And as you mention, true creativity is an individual action.

I think my jargony use of the mathematical term 'state vector' was confusing. Sorry about that. A state vector is simply a list of measurements, like numbers, that describe a model. So, for example, if there's an implant connected between 4 neurons, measuring whether they're firing, and each neuron's firing 'state' can be represented as 0 or 1, the 'state vector' for the implant would be: {0,0,0,0} if none of the neurons are firing at a particular point in time, or {1,1,1,1} if they're all firing, or {0,0,0,1} if only the fourth one is firing. The data a passive implant would record would be a sequence of state vectors. There's no information (context) or functional correlation in the state vector, just data.

When you get to the level of truly thinking for yourself usually the person becomes creative as a bonus.

Interesting, because I just recently posted a little rant about this, that I was disappointed that no one responded to. But with something like this subject, really, too much creativity isn't desirable! I think what's needed is rational discussion, unconstrained by prejudice -- 'truly thinking for yourself' isn't exactly the best way to honestly listen to someone's experiences and try to understand and communicate about them.

The State decides what the curriculum is in US schools. If you lived
in Ancient Greece you'd get a lot more philosophy or if you lived in
Tibet of 100 years ago you would mostly study Buddhism with side subjects
such as herbal medicine and astrology. US schools want engineers for
innovations and the military industrial complex therefore math and science
are stressed. If you studied at a Tibetan monastery of today the main
thing taught is to not harm life. They don't teach that reality in US schools
they would rather you genetically engineer our food as long as there's
a profit in it.
And whether whatever science creates - even if it's the H-bomb
than that's just great to them as long as they can profit in some way from
it. If you go to medical school you will have only a couple of hours spent
on herbal medicine, nutrition and prevention cuz there's no money in it
for doctors. Whereas if you went to your local medicine man when
Native Americans ruled the New World you'd get a lot more info on
the local herbs etc. Plus the school has people thinking that
Columbus discovered America when there was already human beings here.
That my friend is creating your structure of reality.
Schools could have been primarily teaching solar and wind energy
designing a better steam engine or cars that don't run on oil
but until recently schools lost their funding when they did this.
The US government could admit that there are UFO's and share Roswell scraps etc.
and that would also change the reality of what is taught in schools.
Instead schools teach a sub-text of death before life and
ridicule those who study UFO's or have a galaxies are teeming with life philosophy.
US schools used to be a Death Kult but luckily it is slowly changing.
Too slowly but people are waking up.

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 04:33 AM by Skyfloating

reply to post by Ian McLean

Thanks for the expert input. I look forward to reading more.

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 08:19 PM by MemoryShock

Originally posted by Ian McLean
But each brain is different. No one has the same neural layout, and in fact individual neural significance can change over time. So how would such a device be intelligibly 'read' (if it were recording sensory input from the neural state vector it intercepts), or 'controlled' (if it were dynamically modifying neural activity)? I would guess that some type of calibration phase would be required to build the "neural state vector functional description" mapping.

Agreed. But I definitely hold some credence to the Sub-Vocalization.

That is not to say that the whole reading a mind's electrical output isn't a valid effort. It has been determined that the brain (neurons) communicate via chemical and electrical. So...given each of our subjective experiences regarding mental visualization, it is a relevant exercise to see if that 'visualization' can occur from a third party measurement.

That is not to say that I think that is what is happening with me. I don't think that at all. But this 'layman' expression is the best way I can interpret your clarification on the space vector 'definition'. Binary. Which, for all intents and purposes, is an extended trial and error exercise if it is used for exploratory means.

Originally posted by Ian Mclean
But if the 'functional description' is something that is more internal, such as unvocalized speech (which is always mentally distinguishable from externally-heard speech), it's more complex.

Yes. But I think that you underestimate the possibilities that an attenuation to sub vocalization presents. It is a movement of the vocal chords without an audio projection to another person. I do not mean to sound as if I presume you misunderstand this; rather a kind of clarification for the readers.

This definitely takes away from the complexity that one may assume regarding the measurement and interpretation of 'transmitted electrical impulses'...which consequently, in my opinion, should be recorded and correlated anyway (if this is going to happen at all.).

Originally posted by Ian Mclean
Can you describe any experience like that? Perhaps where you heard internal sounds and were somehow compelled to parrot them externally? Or perhaps unintelligible internal became clearer over time as its effectiveness was externally measured?

I have thought about this and have experienced it. But I would change some terms.

I have indeed 'internally spoke', or Sub-Vocalized, at times to realize that the voices that I am used to hearing say consistent words seem as if they were repeating everything I was saying just a split second prior to my expression. This only occurs when I am in a "zoned" frame of mind, i.e. my [eyes are unfocused and thought is centered primarily on introspection.

Originally posted by Ian Mclean
The reason I'm asking is because the only way I can think of to move your claims beyond circumstantial and subjective is for there to be an objectively-measurable framework for the descriptions of the subjective experiences of those who claim to have been 'implanted'.

I am curious as to how my answering of the 'parrot' question would communicate that I am not misinterpreting my subjective experience...a question I do not mean to present in an adversariel manner, just an interesting point of ponderance...

Again, I appreciate your thoughts on this and in case you haven't noticed...there is a new debate....

Edit to Add: Ian Mclean(1943-2004)

Thanks for the reference...I never knew and wouldn't have. I will continue to google/research this fascinating individual...

[edit on 1-6-2008 by MemoryShock]

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 09:22 PM by Ian McLean

Originally posted by MemoryShock
I am curious as to how my answering of the 'parrot' question would communicate that I am not misinterpreting my subjective experience...

Ah, you can see why I'm not a professional psychologist

. First, I don't think there's any valid judgment of 'misinterpreting' a subjective experience -- who is to say what the 'right' or 'wrong' interpretations should be? Also, my use of the term 'parrot' was wrong -- that's a sort of an analogy, so connotations could interfere with the answer. I was thinking that if a sufficient sample set of those who suspect implants could be asked such questions, as well as other questions currently asked in psychological differential diagnosis, and the results compared to a control set and the results of those who 'hear voices' without any suspicions of implant experience, some objective correlations might be found. It might then be possible to say that there is definitive criteria for investigation of possible hypotheses of causation. That particular questions was exploring the idea of an implant injecting signal into the sound-recognition part of the brain, and a conditioned 'expression' response causing the individual to generate some measurable data ('parroting') which was then iterative used to refine the signal injection.

More comments later after a I read some texts and drink a beer.

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 09:46 PM by MemoryShock

Originally posted by Ian McLean
That particular questions was exploring the idea of an implant injecting signal into the sound-recognition part of the brain, and a conditioned 'expression' response causing the individual to generate some measurable data ('parroting') which was then iterative used to refine the signal injection.

More comments later after a I read some texts and drink a beer.

Iterating....which in a real world situation would be measured as a recognition of the fact that 'transmitted words and/or explanations' are being attempted to substitute an actual rational interaction.

For the record, I take issue with the fact that I seem to be dealt with/communicated with on a remote basis. I find it rude. And that severely impacts the validity of classical manipulation (authoritative perspective to submissive).

I mentioned earlier that I at times wake up in the middle of the night and find that the voices are not so static in their vocabulary; i.e. they are more verbose.

I personally have no concern on the validity of my situation, indeed the communication of such was predicated by frustration with my current personal interactions...which won't cease any time soon and I unfortunately feel responsible for....

But if I can in any way express a truth value over the internet..I'm game..

As far as the mechanics of the possibility (and I am fascinated by the Opthalmology)...I am all ears. Thank you for your centered expression....

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 11:00 PM by Ian McLean

reply to post by MemoryShock

Thank you for your centered expression....

You're welcome! And now let me be not so centered. I find the idea rude, too. I like that you put it that way, because of all the horrors of mind control, hidden experimentation, etc, etc, that people here worry about, and decry as abominable, hellish, etc, there's a certain beauty and elegance in the expression, "that just plain rude". It really shows a level of realism and civilized empathy that rises above. I've spent some time here reading threads about 'economic imperialism' and such, and the horrors in the world that can so easily be ignored, and I've seen how people can be shocked into depression when they look outside their little reality tunnels. Most don't want to do that.

I don't get the impression you're blaming me for anything, but I guess I was caught up a little in the 'objective diagnostic' attempt started here on page 2. I chose to follow it with some thoughts of my own, that might have objectified. Sorry, and sorry that the world does that. It's an attempt to use rationality as a basis for empathy, and I'm sad/glad that that doesn't really work.

I've been a little frightened by some of the thing you're describing (not the objective events -- those are interested! More details as you're comfortable, please!) with regard to subjective mental state, and hearing 'voices'. I don't think you have to worry, unless I'm mis-interpreting you. I think everyone's mind works like that, to some degree. I've noticed that I have an almost constant 'internal monologue', and sometimes I have an 'internal dialog', where I'll debate things with myself. I think that's natural.

We all have a constant loop of perception in our brains, I think, that is input by our sensorum, and manifests as our worldview. It affected by our recollections (memories that pop into our heads, often from we-know-not-where), symbolic associations, past 'engrams' of trauma (about the only thing Hubbard ever said that's valuable, imo), and some undefinable creative spark.

These different parts of our mind work in parallel, and behind the scenes, so to speak. I believe the vast majority of our minds are not the transcribable 'stream-of-consciousness' that Joyce expressed so well. I think the impact of Joyce's work, in fact, is that it expressed the internalisms of the mind so well that it both inspires awe at what we don't know about the mind, and in parallel shows a common unity in our selves from that very effect.

So I'm quite willing to still entertain the idea of brain-implants, external manipulation, etc., (I have pages bookmarked!) but I'm also very wary of externally projecting that which should be the type of self-realization mankind has had to perform since the beginning consciousness.

PS: Have you read The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind? Interesting stuff!

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 11:14 PM by gobildygook99

I can honestly appreciate all that you are going through, and am grateful for your bravery in confronting this awful reality we share. What you have gone through has similarities to my own situation, but also differences. I believe I have several implants, one of which is able to project digital images that permeate my head. So that regardless of where I look, eyes open or closed, the project images are always there. These images are sometimes personal messages from my attackers designed to dishearten me. Other times they are directly related to what I have been viewing. For example, I watch ufc fights, and consequently for hours after words video images of fights of this nature are repeated much faster than real time and seem to be layered many times in various speeds, not sure if they are recordings of what I have been watching or only subjective representations. I am able to ignore it at times, but this is constant thing. The digital images are only part of the program, the light projected in this way causes discomfort from the fluctuations in the muscles etc responding to the light. Blending into a sort of vibration that in itself is very annoying. My situation began only about five years ago. I have the voices as well, but not constant, and only occasional seems to be in real time. These voices could be recordings. The real time ones though, always are very abusive and tend to reinforce their desire to control me, occasionally there is someone who defends me in these conversations and not always the same person. There is a revolving group of people that study me , and a central core that seem to always return.

It is not my intention to make this about me, I just couldn't follow this anymore without input.

Did my second u2u work, I am still learning how to use this site , I generally just read.

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 11:14 PM by MemoryShock

Originally posted by Ian McLean
reply to post by MemoryShock

PS: Have you read The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind? Interesting stuff!

No. But I have thought along those lines..oddly enough...

Subtle Evolutions

I would like to say that we are not arguing(am I misinterpreting?)

I am still looking into the words you have posted..and am refreshed by the clarity you have expressed...

And in my world...I am the last in the world to validate as such...

Again, Thank You.

reply posted on 1-6-2008 @ 11:17 PM by MemoryShock

reply to post by gobildygook99

Your second u2u worked...

Thank you for your input. This thread is for your experience as well.

I only ask that you slow down...

reply posted on 2-6-2008 @ 05:46 AM by Skyfloating

Originally posted by MemoryShock

I mentioned earlier that I at times wake up in the middle of the night and find that the voices are not so static in their vocabulary; i.e. they are more verbose.