Why are Atheists...Atheists?, page 3

reply to post by bigbert81

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It was more of an advertising effort for you.

Ok, thanks! I just didn't know if I was understanding you correctly.

reply to post by leearco

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You never set out to make mistakes, you just learn and move on whatever it is.

Oh, I have!!!

I have deliberately done things that I knew were wrong and were a mistake, but it was a choice that I made. I don't believe in being a victim, just a volunteer.

reply to post by Anonymous ATS

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There's plenty of wisdom in most of them, but it's easy enough to live a good, honest, worthy life without a religion and without a belief in God or Gods.

I have done amazingly well without religion. But in my case I will give God at least a little of the credit, lol!

There is nothing that beats a communication from God through a person that does not know you, and you never heard of them, but they come up to you with a message regarding an answer that you are pleading for, and they tell you Gods message. They also are not ignorant of the commission, for it was not a happenstance.

Compound that with innumerable so-called happenstances, and you are looking beyond coincidence.

Doubt is soon abolished by evidence of reality.

[edit on 23-5-2008 by MatrixProphet]

reply to post by LockwithnoKey

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And yes, I repeat. I would kill an animal if it tried to kill another wrongly.

You're still avoiding the question by throwing in the word 'wrongly'.

If I told you to kill a dog, or a deer, or a bear to save someone's life, even if that animal was not the threat, would you? I believe your answer will be yes, therefore you do understand why people are a higher priority to animals.

I really don't understand the excessive value placed on human life. It is thought that we are above all else,

All life is sacred, but saying that people should suffer instead of animals tells me that you are far too exposed to the dark side of humanity.

And look at your own life when you think about this. Do you have a pet? Would you rather your pet or your loved one die? Once again, this answer will bring you to my above point. Think about why you answered the answer you did, and you will have my point.

[edit on 5/23/2008 by bigbert81]

I am a self proclaimed atheist, I have come to my conclusions by way self analogies and consequences of action and fault. There is no "God" because "God" didn't allow me too do anything, I did it on my own accord and with some bad judgement calls, I have paid for it by either learning the easy or the hard ways.
The bible to me is the best selling novel in history, not knocking the believers, but it is the way it is.
Without religion in my life, "I" stand accountable for either learning from the mistake or taking one step farther to causing myself more despair and self harm.

Early modern thinkers distinguished between theoretical or speculative atheism and practical atheism. The theoretical atheist was someone who claimed to believe that there was no God, but for whom this belief had no real pragmatic consequences. It was a philosophical position, not a moral, social, or devotional one, and it had little effect on his behavior. The practical atheist, on the other hand, was someone who, while probably not really denying "in his heart" the existence of God, nevertheless led a dissolute and immoral life and engaged in the overt mockery of religion. While there were undeniably many such libertines in early modern Europe, there was great debate at the time over whether there were, in fact, any sincere theoretical atheists. The idea of a providential God, some asserted, is innate in the human mind. René Descartes (1596–1650) argued as much in his Meditationes de Prima Philosophia (1641; Meditations on first philosophy). Although the concept of God may become obscured by the more vivid and compelling material from the senses, ultimately—in dire circumstances or as the end of life approached—all professed atheists were said to acknowledge God.

www.answers.com...&r=67

The above quote is something you would never find me doing, I have no need for thing's that don't exist and therefore, have no desire to waist my time thinking that there will be anything else short of my own ramifications. There have been very, very many different categories of the "Atheists" and what things they do and don't believe, which leaves people like me, absolute denial of anything remotely linking the human soul or it's counter parts into a place called "Heaven". The redemption that most religious people speak of comes from only one place, "With in themselves." And if you think that statement is incorrect, then why go to something that can only be signified by pure speculation of the truths of our realities? "We have to forgive ourselves before we become smarter or wiser to the experiences in life, if we allow ourselves to keep faltering, the reality changes and there is nothing left but self accountability."
I have read the posts in this thread, and I usually try to stay away from threads like this, but with the advent of the way that some are referring to them selves as "Atheists" , I would be more to lean towards that they are "Agnostics" and hold on to that part of some kind of forgiveness when it is all said and done. What one should really be doing is allowing there inner self to be able to diagnose and in an assertive way to distinguish between right and wrong before the act and creating an altered realities from what couldve been and what is.
So, "Atheism" to me is a clear conscience way of being held responsible and accountable for my own actions throughout my life with no safe haven to run to too allow myself just to feel better about who I am or what I have done.

I have noticed many of the more vocal atheists get angry when confronted with evidence for God. It is not the sort of intense emotion that would be characteristic from a threat of "nothing" on their philosophy. C.S.Lewis said it best in that "Atheists express their rage against God although in their view He does not exist." Remember C.S. Lewis himself started out as an atheist. So I tend to agree with your first point Matrix, it best fits the pathology for the atheist disorder, "Atheist through traumatic events". The perceived injustice of the world creates that anger.

A psychologist author John Koster wrote a book called The Atheist Syndrome in which he discovered that strong atheists fit a particular psychological profile.

The Atheist Syndrome


My impression of many atheists is that they seem to think it is a slam-dunk case for atheism; that it is very clear that Christianity lacks any good evidence. They also seem to operate under the delusion that belief in God s clearly untrue because of alleged counter-proofs. If it so clear as they allege, and further, if atheism is true, then there must be an awful lot of Christians and other theists who are resisting this "obvious" truth. I think, as you might expect, that the theistic proofs are compelling and the atheist ones implausible and fallacious.

This should sum it up, better than I can. only 80 seconds, straight to the point

www.youtube.com...


George...man, I couldn't have said it better myself.

Personally I believe in Karma, that's about as close to religion as I'll come. I also believe in re-incarnation(not the typical kind, I have my own theories on it, but that's for another thread).

I'm a more of a ...for everything negative that happens in the universe, the EXACT amount of positive happens. Whether it be in life, science, physics, whatever. Perfect balance. I call it "the force". Not like in star wars, but sort of.

**Sorry for all the edits was trying to get the you tube video embedded in the post. One day I'll have my victory you-tube, One day, I shall get it!!!***





[edit on 23-5-2008 by Nola213]

[edit on 23-5-2008 by Nola213]

[edit on 23-5-2008 by Nola213]

[edit on 23-5-2008 by Nola213]

reply to post by Bigwhammy

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For the most part bigwhammy, I did take your statement slightly offensive. You of all people know that any psychologist doesn't do anything more than speculate the truths of what is happening and why.
I am no brain surgeon, but I am intelligent enough to go through my life with my own decisions and speculations of what is reality and what is not for me.
I once heard that 95% of the world is religious in one form or another, believing in something "Higher" than themselves. I for one find that odd for the matter being, "With all those believer's, including even our president, there should be such violence and corruption with the acknowledgements of "God" or a creator?"
The world is not my enemy at all, but I can be my worst enemy if I allow it to happen. I am in a very comfortable place with my inability of having religion in my life, there is nothing more simpler than being able to say "It was my fault and I will learn from this mistake, trying not to repeat it again for the rest of my life." opposed to , "Oh God , why me , why did you allow this to happen to little ole me.....Blah,Blah,Blah."
Believe what you want to believe in, I could care less, but when it comes to a stemming of some psych trying to make a logical conclusive guess at the expense of people like myself, "Back-Off" cause it is not the case for a true "Atheist" like myself.

I don't know if i am an atheist or not, because i believe 'something' created us, but i don't believe in God.

I, albeit loosely, subscribe to the Von Daniken 'hypothesis that many ancient civilizations' technologies and religion were given to them by space travelers who were welcomed as gods'.
Chariots of the Gods?

In saying that, that belief has no effect on my day-to-day living.

I go out of my way to live a good, moral life. I don't judge people by anything but they way they treat me, and i treat everyone i meet with respect and friendship.

I personally believe I live a far more 'Christ-like' life than most of the so-called Christians. However, i do not believe there is such thing as 'living like Christ'. It is simply being a good person.

*Prepares the fire blanket for the flame attacks to follow*

reply to post by kyred

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Sounds to me if you were experiencing an Ethereal situation. Which only grounds it as a form of being intangible for the experience to be explained for understanding. I do however believe in the "Paranormal" persuasions of experiences. If , for some reason, you had such a traumatic up bringing and subsequently horrid childhood memory, maybe it is what you needed to see to be able to turn canvases into your premonitions of the corner you spoke of.
It is your experience, no one can take it from you, but there may be more answers to the event than you have speculated on for all the possible reasons of the experience.
There are as many answers that lend question, but I do thank you for being open minded enough to have shared.

reply to post by OhZone

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I see a lot of people are saying that they are spiritual.
Do any of you have a definition of "spiritual"?
I used to say that, but then one day I realized that I didn't know what that meant; it just sounded meaningful.

Being spiritual means different things to different people. That is the beauty of it. It is hard to define, for good reasons. Religion I found, needs to pigeon hole concepts and teachings. That is why I can say that religion on the whole, is not spiritual.

Spiritual has a definitive quality but is elusive in terms. Another words, it is highly abstract. Think of: quantum physics.

I relate in my experience to being spiritual as; a connection to God, or a higher power. Religion is not even in the same sphere because it is too material, too fleshly, and too down to earth - bogged down with rituals, and scripture. A corporal experience vs. a spiritual one.

I define it;

As a conscious contact with God. This involves connecting to a higher entity that is beyond our physical state. The more I connect and tune in to this entity, the more I am influenced by it. A connection that is logical, rather than mystical.

Here is an example of a spiritual clarity or moment: when you have a light bulb that goes off in your mind and you finally "get" something. You wonder why you didn't get it before, but now it is all clear to you. This is a rudimentary example. Apply this principle to a larger scale and you can arrive at being spiritual.

Being spiritual involves the intuition, your senses, a spark and refining of your perceptions. It involves a conditioning by God against an abrasive wall or block that forces us to grow. Meaning; that to be spiritual is to not be stagnant. It needs friction to develop! That friction comes from God.

It is a process that helps us to refine our senses and to understand what it is our senses are trying to tell us. Fight or flight. Who is safe or unsafe? When to leave a situation before a tragedy. Think of those whose senses told them to run to the hills with the Indonesian tsunami.

The day before 9-11 I was in bed all day very upset because I new something really bad was going to happen. My family needless to say was very concerned. The next day I found out why. I am not talking ESP or anything mystical. Just my senses telling me - alerting me as to a future event. Being spiritual means that you learn to listen! Never discount a sense.

On a more abstract level; a certain knowing, or insight, about so many things that may have nothing to do with you, and do not originate with you. You are also very aware of this at the time. Some of the revelations are staggering. Especially when you realize something and it happens later.

Also it involves sensing energy fluctuations and abiding by what you feel would be the right course or answer. It can involve hearing a little voice in your mind, or at times a very loud voice! I have found that the more I grew spiritually - it ceased being quiet - but is more pronounced. At first, one needs to listen quietly for the voice. But that is because we are so unfamiliar with it and not confident with it. And no, it is not MPD'S...LOL!

Have you seen the movie "Contact?" When Jodie Foster was in the space craft and went on her dubious exploration of the galaxy and beyond? She had been an atheist prior, but her views were so very altered on her "field trip." She received a glimpse of something so far beyond her understanding, that she was speechless. In that fictional drama she was put into over-drive by God, to attain new insight that would take her out of her tight box of limited thinking.

Growing spiritually means to be willing to expand beyond ones limited thinking, and to experience life and its meanings in a different context, realizing that 2+2 does not = 4. Also, being willing to fail, to get up and to try again. Beyond that, it is an unexplainable experience! It is easier to watch it take place in someone's life, than it is to define it.

reply to post by kyred

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Technically, you are not an Atheist. You believe in a form of the Divine. You have just rejected modern Christianity. (As that term is commonly used) Atheism means that you believe in no divinity at all, either because the thought of a divinity has never crossed your mind, or because you have been presented with that idea and have rejected it as true. Agnostics have some doubt about their (or anyones) ability to know what God would be, or how to believe about God, but they do not reject the idea of a Divinity.

Edit to clarify the third sentence.

[edit on 23-5-2008 by Illusionsaregrander]

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander

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So I really dont know. It does seem like a stand would be nice, to make us more certain of who others are, of who we are. But what in the material world is concrete and fixed? Even the mightiest mountain is in motion on the molecular level. And on the more mundane level it is being eroded, by wind, by water, blown apart by eruptions, plowed into the earths crust by tectonics. Nothing at all is fixed and certain in our world. Maybe certainty is inharmonious with God, or the Divine. Maybe more of us should be on the fence, if not in the belief that there IS a Divine, but at least in regard to the belief that we could possibly know what that means.

I like your message! You gave me your humble insight.

Let me add this; to take a stand, even a meager one, is to open up a door to new possibilities. Why? Because we took the risk to do it in the first place.

All risks involve fear or uncertainty. One of the biggest obstacles to overcome is the fear of being wrong! But it is in this exercise that we glean new information to base new decisions on. We would not be confronted by this opportunity, unless we took the chance.

We take a stand even if we are not sure footed, so as to see what is ahead, and how far we have come. That is called taking a spiritual step. It is like the old exercise: fall backwards, I will catch you. It involves risk that develops trust.

If you sense that it is right...do it. If everything tells you that you should stop...stop. Does it have a ring of truth? Right, wrong, or indifferent, does it feel right? These are the guidelines I follow.

reply to post by mrwupy

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We all must make our own way in the spiritual paths we choose. No two are alike.

Ditto!

So, it would not be hard to imagine that God would also have a personality, and one that adjusts, or accepts our differences.

I don't believe that he requires much - just recognition. Don't we?

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