Court: Texas had no right to take polygamists' kids, page 6

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reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 07:07 PM by Howie47

reply to post by SuperSlovak

Since the only legally marry one of their wives. It is none of the states business, what other women they have sex with. Just like everyone else in the state of Texas.. That is why I say it is all pure hypocrisy and religious persecution.. It there was any child abuse going on; it could have been handled on an individual case. Get a clue!

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 07:11 PM by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Howie47
reply to post by SuperSlovak

It there was any child abuse going on; it could have been handled on an individual case. Get a clue!

Really? And how were they going to do that when the children will not speak with them or don't even know who their real parents are? Get a clue!

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 07:17 PM by eradown

reply to post by FreeSpeaker

Freespeaker it would be stupid to allow cps workers to interrogate your kids. They are biased against parents. You should not trust CPS to tell the truth. They have been caught red handed lying about the ages of the women. This even though the pregnant women gave CPS their drivers liscences. Just say it does not make it so.

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 07:29 PM by FreeSpeaker

reply to post by eradown

I have always been of the opinion if people have nothing to hide they should have no problems ansewering law enforcement questions. If I was accused of breaking the law I would want to clear my name by all means, and if the gov tried to take my kids for no reason well.......I don't want to end up on a watch list so I'll just shut my mouth about what I'd do.

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 07:49 PM by raven bombshell

reply to post by jasonjnelson

Yes, I do believe in liberty. Im just saying that the secrecy plus the fact that there have already been women who come forward about their experiences coupled together has caused people to attack these groups. It is suspicious. I dont agree with what the government did in Texas. They screwed up. Maybe I wasnt clear on that.
On the other hand, it is not right to raise a child to believe she is supposed to get married as a teenager to whomever her parents and church leaders pick. The husbands teach them about sex. That sounds to me like women are being groomed to be sex objects and brood mares for the men and it is deeply disturbing and offensive. Not to mention the incestuous aspect. You have a limit to the gene pool in a sequestered society. The women are not allowed to find someone for themselves, and they are not really educated, given the chance to go to college, have a career, etc. The girls say they choose this, but they have been brought up to choose this. That is not liberty. You cant compare this to gays in the military.

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 08:43 PM by eradown

reply to post by raven bombshell

CPS has many of the same problems you have with FDLS. Foster care girls usually do not go to college. Foster care girls more often than not become pregnant while minors. The state always gives the kids of the minors who become pregnant in their care away. The way I see it the state deliberately puts girls into certain foster families which encourage promiscuous behavior and CPS gets the boone of a fresh baby to sell. I do not see foster as an escape from a dreary lifestyle.

The FDLS are all being equally abused now. That is not a good thing. In 2004, 187 children placed in foster care by CPS ended up dead. So far FDLS has killed 0 children. I am very worried about the 411 non pregnant children many of whom are beneath age five.

The days in which good nuns educated their wards to the point some of them went off to college at 13 and did well for themselves are over. Until it is known for a fact that the five young looking pregnant girls are minors and not women , the state should return all the kids. CPS should clean up its act.

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 10:38 PM by raven bombshell

reply to post by eradown

Yeah, Im hearing a lot of bad things about CPS now and I have always heard bad things about foster care. I dont know which is worse (kids with the CPS or FLDS), and I cant offer any answers. I certainly dont think that in this instance (in TX) the State was right in what they did, but it really bothers me that there are possibly groups getting away with systematic abuse. Do I think that our government should be allowed to go storming into the compounds seizing people's kids on unsubstatiated hotline tips? No, certainly not. That would be like cops coming to get my kid just because the neightbor called and told them I was abusing her and not due to any real proof. I guess I just want everything to be right and go my way and all kids to be safe, but it aint gonna happen.

reply posted on 23-5-2008 @ 11:20 PM by eradown

reply to post by raven bombshell

It also may turn out these pregnos the state is currently holding only look young. It appears the group did not continue all the old practices. A doctor found one of the 14 year old girls is still a virgin. I don't think this group threw out teenage boys. Many of the boys taken into custody were obviously older teenagers. The state should never have been given the little kids under any circumstaces. There was no danger of abuse just fear that their parents would teach them that statutory rape was okay. There are alot of places where statutory rape is common. The state is in trouble they said 31 of 53 girls were pregnant that number is now down to five. CPS wrongfully imprisoned several older women. If it turns none of the five girls remaining are minors or that those girls where not actually raped by older men there will be consequences for whoever or whatever is behind this travesty. There will be consequences anyways because the state should not have hurt so many on account of so few.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 12:21 AM by LostNemesis

No. You guys, this is STILL not cool. I don't CARE if CPS has found to be in the wrong. The point is, this is just how they do things. This is how they always have done things.

The honest truth is, when it is only one family they are terrorizing, they will get away with it everytime. Why ignore this?? This case only pointed out to the world how they work. Now the rest of you can choose to believe what I went through, or not. But I tried to warn you all.

HOW the HELL can they be STOPPED?!?!?!??

EDIT: TYPO

[edit on 24-5-2008 by LostNemesis]

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 12:24 AM by jasonjnelson

reply to post by pikypiky

Once again, religion (i.e. any offshoots of Mormonism) is getting out of hand with too much corruption! This includes sexual abuse and child endangerment, whereby the laws of land are supposed to protect children. The children should play and have fun until they are ready to get married with their own free will and not be forced to make babies at such early ages with older men. That’s disgusting.

And the women should use their moral conscious to protect their children from these abusers than rely on the dogmas and teachings of their religious sect. This is the opportunity for the state of Texas to weed out the pedophiles from the general populace. It’s not fair to prevent the children for mingling with ‘outsiders’. There is so much to learn and people to meet outside the boundaries of this compound, a virtual prison for some.

Are you referring to the flds? or are you referring to one of the hundred or so countries I referenced earlier? Or are you referencing the Amish, who in every way fit the profile of the people you condemn to removing their children from them? I just want you to realize exactly what you are saying. Besides, this is much bigger than FLDS, this is about the right opf the state to remove, under arms, children who in no way were being abused. 411 kids for one faked phone call? ARE YOU KIDDING ME??????!!!!!!!

ARE YOU EVEN BEING SERIOUS????!!!!!!

Edit to show anger! And to say I am never going to catch up with this thread now. Thats good and bad. I want people to understand what kind of precedent this sets. That this means they can come and do the same to your daughters. Yes, I know most, if not all (wink) of you are not in polygamous marriages somewhere in the desert!

But do you go to church? Belong to an independent party, or militia. Or gun club, or book club?

Or do any of you belong to any web sites where you may, or may not, post what some might consider to be subversive or counter government material?

Do you hear that knock at the door?

[edit on 24-5-2008 by jasonjnelson]

[edit on 24-5-2008 by jasonjnelson]

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 04:03 AM by verylowfrequency

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

I have always been of the opinion if people have nothing to hide they should have no problems ansewering law enforcement questions.

I was raised with the same attitude, but as I have seen as soon as you engage in with the system it is their goal to make you part of it. They are professionals at putting words in your mouth or taking statements out of context in order to process you and indoctrinate you in the system - their business.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 04:10 AM by verylowfrequency

12 Children have been released, there is a catch the three families that they belong to, have to agree to stay in San Antonio under CPS's scrutiny and may not return to the ranch. Some sort of deal.

Also, CPS says it cannot return the rest of the children because they don't know who the parents are, as they need to finish their DNA testing.What a crock of BS.

The saga of state sponsored child kidnappings continues.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 08:15 AM by mybigunit

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
12 Children have been released, there is a catch the three families that they belong to, have to agree to stay in San Antonio under CPS's scrutiny and may not return to the ranch. Some sort of deal.

Also, CPS says it cannot return the rest of the children because they don't know who the parents are, as they need to finish their DNA testing.What a crock of BS.

The saga of state sponsored child kidnappings continues.

See just goes to show you. They have one goal and one only to break up the ranch. To brainwash the people to "join our society" and when they are all broken up and in our society go ahead and take over that $114 million dollars plus all the land and buildings.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 08:31 AM by Howie47

Let me put on my tin foil hat for a minute and venture this plot.
The rich elitist masters, that oversee this country, hatched this whole
attack, for a whole different purpose then saving the children. Obviously they too know how broken the foster care is.
The economic fall of America is a very real possibility. If it happens in a big way. We are going to have people grouping together for survival. Like in the Movie, "The Postman". These elitist want to send the message now. That even if this does happen, "your butts will still be ours, and when we send our posse army around to your little self sufficient town,
You will give up what ever we demand, for taxes, Your sons and daughters, for our army, (so we can continue to oppress you), and your very young daughters too. If we find them to pretty. We will need to take them, to protect them from your molestation..

[edit on 24-5-2008 by Howie47]

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 09:20 AM by phinubian

I believe that either the caller that first reported the accusations at the facility was either providing false information or someone impersonating a member, with that I also believe that the government (Fed and Texas) was not prepared to deal with the situation panning out like a Waco.
I think they knew they were not able to raid the compound without any real evidence but they were more apt to deal with this politically from a legal standpoint even if they were not right in raiding and removing the children.
In other words they would much rather deal with this monetarily and legally, than having it play out with a barricade or worse situation with hundreds dead as the result of some sort of forceful police action to remove individuals and sort it out.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 09:40 AM by Sonya610

Originally posted by phinubian
In other words they would much rather deal with this monetarily and legally, than having it play out with a barricade or worse situation with hundreds dead as the result of some sort of forceful police action to remove individuals and sort it out.

Were these people armed survivalists? I have not read about them being heavily armed or preparing for a standoff. I do not think the gov believed it could turn into a violent Waco type situation. If they had a lot of weapons I would expect the media would have focused on that.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 11:27 AM by eradown

reply to post by Howie47

I still think someone really wants that ranch. Although the elites are always afraid of the many gathering together in little colonies and storing wealth, I just don't think most of us could live like those people if we tried. They are living a colectivest dream. They seem to share everything. They have the right to live that way of course, but most people are too intensely private for that lifestyle. I think the land is on the sight of the Trans Texas Corridor. Many Texans are in for a nasty fight with the elites. Those in the Corridor's path need to band together pull resources for lawyers because many people will be facing trumped up charges and who knows what else. The people who want the FDLS ranch have no qualms about hurting the little children of those who get in their way.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 12:36 PM by Blueangel7

It is sad that the children were taken away from their moms, but the whole sect is brainwashed. It's basically just old men that want young women, very young, like 13 or 14, etc. All of them are brainwashed, so what do you do? The women have no contact with the outside world, thank goodness that some of them got away, and reported the abuse. Someone needs to start an immediate deprogramming. What these men have done is pervert the gospel. Using the bible for their own selfish purposes, and pervert the true gospel! That is antichrist! I hope that these people can be deprogrammed, instead of another Waco incident.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 12:46 PM by d11_m_na_c05

Originally posted by Blueangel7
It is sad that the children were taken away from their moms, but the whole sect is brainwashed. It's basically just old men that want young women, very young, like 13 or 14, etc. All of them are brainwashed, so what do you do? The women have no contact with the outside world, thank goodness that some of them got away, and reported the abuse. Someone needs to start an immediate deprogramming. What these men have done is pervert the gospel. Using the bible for their own selfish purposes, and pervert the true gospel! That is antichrist! I hope that these people can be deprogrammed, instead of another Waco incident.

I hope someone deprograms you .. Your obviously crazy and believe in imaginary things.. Your delusional and need help ..

Its so funny you guys can see how crazy religion is if it NOT YOUR RELIGION..

All you have done is pervert a 2k old book for your own Wants. And beliefs..

You just want control . You cant control these people so your all mad and make up stuff to suit your wants..

Get over yourself.. Just cause these people can live without killing and corporate powers controlling them . Don't make them wrong .. In fact it seems to me like you have been brainwashed.

reply posted on 24-5-2008 @ 12:50 PM by Sonya610

Originally posted by Blueangel7
The women have no contact with the outside world, thank goodness that some of them got away, and reported the abuse.

Uhhh....do you know who "reported" the abuse Blueangel? That person was arrested, and has a history of making hoax calls to the authorities. The person was not affiliated with the members in any way.

Have you bothered to read ANY articles on this case? What exactly are you basing your opinions on?