Another one bites the dust...

I recommend people take mixed martial arts classes as an alternate means of self-defence because if...lets say someone were not able to pull a gun out in time they can drop the guy easy...even if he is armed
as for me i recommend Krav maga, jiu jitsu, and muay thai
well...its helped me before at least

I can't say I have any problems with someone shooting an intruder in their home, I would do the same.

My first experience with home invasions was when I was 18 (a long time ago) in scenic Camden, NJ, I chased the guy off with a machete in my underwear

The Joe Horn case got a lot of attention because he shot two unarmed guys in the back (against the orders of police) which strikes a lot of people as cowardly and unnecessary. It's one thing to defend yourself or your family, it's another to appoint yourself judge, jury, and executioner.

But that's a different story from a clear-cut home invasion case like this one appears to be.

[edit on 5/22/08 by xmotex]

Originally posted by 3vilscript
Where does it end??

It ends when the last scumbag thief is dead or in prison. The fight against crime is never ending. You cannot take a vacation. An armed citizenry is always the best defense against crime.

Originally posted by xmotex

My first experience with home invasions was when I was 18 (a long time ago) in scenic Camden, NJ, I chased the guy off with a machete in my underwear

[edit on 5/22/08 by xmotex]

How in God's name did you keep a machete in your underwear? You must have some heavy duty underwear.

the best defense is prevention...

prevention such as education and ending poverty (which go hand in hand)

Ya' know what....

Someone gets into my home, I'm not breaking out my Martial Arts, my Ninja Sword, or my baseball bat. ( all 3 are in this room now ) I'm not sicking my dogs on 'em either. ( in the kitchen )

I dont sleep with the front door open, and I bet you dont either.

They intend me HARM, and I can imagine a lot of 'pain' and 'suffering' for ME if I dont use "the bare minimum rapid force" necessary to neutralize the situation.

I personally know some MEAN MF'ers, and I can call them friends. I also know that they are TAME compared to whats out there right now, a block away, wanting my DVD player and truck keys at minimum, for an 8 Ball or a bump, till morning, when they start coming down and looking for more. You think I'm exaggerating.... I promise you I'm DEAD serious.

They are not here to do my dishes, or tell me I won a free Vacation trip to Tahitti. They did not confuse my house with thier "crib". ( Ohh... it was just a simple misunderstanding.... we both have 'porch lights'... Yeah right)

I'm old now, and I smoke. I have about a minute and a half of fight in me before I'm on the floor wheezing. I'm in fear for my LIFE , immediately.

I'm NOT going to be SUED for 'injuring' an intruder. I'm not going to be sued by their family for 'maiming' an intruder either. I'm not doing the court 'BS' 'civilly' either. I'm not hitting them with a BAT or cutting their ear off with a sword. I'm not going to hold hands and sing "Kumbya" and try to understand their 'misfortune in life and why they 'deserve' my hard earned possessions. I'm not going to listen to how their childhood was 'ruined from the beginning' because their daddy wanst there for them, and how they never had the opportunity that I did. And how its ALL MY FAULT, and that I OWE them. They are entitled, and I should apologize.

No one Here is Going to Protect Me. ( including the Police ) No one here will pay my medical bills. I cant miss more that a few days of work, or I'm up crud creek. I cant be put in that situation without immediate , decisive reaction. Everything I've worked for is immediately at risk, including Loved Ones.

I'm not going to even PLAY that I'll 'talk them down'.... I'm not even entertaining that thought. That cost precious seconds and second guessing is not the thing to do. I rebuke that. I'm not saying a word.

I'll just be' tried' by a Grand Jury of 12, in the light of day.

I'm not gonna be carried by 6, or even 2 paramedics.

Take it or leave it.

I suggest the latter.

In 2008, EVERYONE knows that when you break in to someones home, if your caught, you might get a one way trip straight to hell.

And thats how it should be.

Best regards to those who are not criminals.

Blitzkreigen









[edit on 22-5-2008 by Blitzkreigen]

[edit on 22-5-2008 by Blitzkreigen]

[edit on 22-5-2008 by Blitzkreigen]

I highly recommend keeping a decent sized dog as well. Dogs are great deterents. When they hear a large dog start barking, they know the resident will be quickly up and about. Chance are good that someone with a dog also has a gun.

Someone breaks into you house, chances are they aren't going to rush into your bedroom to attack you, they are going to try and grab something quick and run off. This gives you time to unlock your gun from the safe. If they continue to come inside even with your dog barking, its kill or be killed as far as I am concerned. Get to the range fairly often, learn to shoot accurately within twenty-five feet without looking down the sights, and chances are you will do fine. Get the head shot if you can, all movement stops immediately.

Originally posted by Lone Star Patriot

WTF does someone not paying taxes have to do with a home owner shooting a slimy criminal? Go back to your corner.

Hahahaha - serves him/her right

I agree my guns are there for a reason - I learned how to use them for a reason other than just for hunting.. If anyone does that to me, mt family or my castle - you can bet your tush you'll find them inside verses outside the home.. No need for a hospital here, straight to the morgue!

Originally posted by 3vilscript
Touché. Switzerland is an exelent example of how everyone owning guns could work.

I don't think it is completely fair to compare Switzerland to Amerika. It's a very different country and culture and they don't have a lot of big cities and big city problems.

The Swiss people have a very different mindset, I mean come on, they run through the mountain pastures, pick flowers and sing songs, they're to happy and laid back to even think of invading someone's crib, or shooting their guns.

I think I can sum things up:

1. Every law abiding citizen should have the right to own a gun but not everyone should have a gun.

2. If you are serious about gun ownership you should make it priority 1 to be thoroughly trained in the use, safety and maintenance of said weapon.

3. In a critical situation, critical thinking is at hand. You are now faced with a choice that could in fact change your life forever and you have to decide in a split second.

4. Think about the entire scenario of taking another human life prior to bragging that you'll kill anyone that spits in your direction. If you don't think killing another person will have a profound effect on your life then you are either lying or sadistic.

5. Big talkers are usually the least equipped and most likely to pee their pants or make a critical mistake in a life and death situation.

6. I sincerely hope that I'll never be faced with the decision of having to kill a home invader.

7. If you shoot someone in your front yard, drag them into your house.

reply to post by Blitzkreigen
All kidding aside, Thanks, I believe that sums it up!!

reply to post by BlindWatcher1


Here I thought I "summed it up" pretty good but I was mistaken.

In all seriousness I can truly understand that kind of frustration as more and more the law abiding citizen ends up as the accused.

reply to post by enigmania


The only country the Nazis feared attacking.

The only country with a sig 550 battle rifle in every household.

The only country where every man and woman is military trained and provisioned with 50 rounds of ammunition for emergency scenarios.

Switzerland and the Swiss people are no joke.

Coincidence perhaps, that they are such a peaceful nation? National character has nothing to do with it.

The Swiss are peaceful because they are vigilant and armed at all times.

reply to post by jbondo


There was an incident a year or so back, here on the Border of Texas.

A couple of ILLEGAL Aliens crossed the US border and were taveling on foot into Texas. They came across a Farmer and his Ranch near the Border.

I believe it was at night time, and they broke in looking for a place to hide or something to eat. ( Entitlement- Whitey 'owes' us )

The Farmer Shot them Both with "Bird shot". They did not get killed. He called 9-11 to report the incident. They were taken to the Hosptal and treated ( On our dime as well )

They came back and SUED the Farmer AND HIS WIFE for everything they owned, and guess what... the ILLEGALS WON!

I believe that they had the Mexican Consulate , or a representative of the Mexican Government representing them in the US trial in US courts. Guess who paid for it.... not the Illegals.

He lost everything including the farm. It had been in his family for over 100 years. Now the Illegals Live there with THEIR family, straight from Mexico.

What part of that should not be frustrating?

No second guessing here... I already made up my mind.

The only rights that you have are the ones your willing to fight for.

People will simply RUN YOU OVER if you let them. I do not trust the Court System anymore either.

YESTERDAY--Locally here, a City council member was found guilty of embezelment from a CHURCH to the tune of 1.5 million dollars. He used his city council seat as a tool for an enormous crime scheme, while representing our fair city.

He got 6 months 'in house arrest' and had to 'aploogize'.

If I stole a TWINKIE from a 7-11 I"d get 3 to 5 years.

Its so screwed up it broken.

I dont believe the system anymore.

Morals and Values have NOTHING to do with Justice.

Best Regards,

Blitzkreigen

reply to post by jbondo
Hey, I for one and I don't mind admitting to the world and to the members here, I refuse to take anothers life for any reason. All that mumbo jumbo from my other posts is just me talking "typing," from my rear end and not my heart.

Yes, I would protect my wife and myself but not to the point of taking a life. I'm sure I'm going to get blasted for that, O well. I have been in the position to do so and could not, will not, would not.

Call me anything you please. I know I am not a coward or any other words that are going to be said to me but bottom line is I would rather die than kill anyone or anything.

reply to post by BlindWatcher1


Have you asked your Wife if its ok for YOU to let HER die too?

You can make that decision for yourself, but are you not somewhat responsible for your Loved ones, that really CANT defend themselves?

Blitzkreigen

reply to post by BlindWatcher1



You sound like you have a deep respect for life.......why do you have so little self regard as to deny yourself that same respect???? Your logic is greatly flawed!!

Zindo

I thinkt it's time to clear up some misconceptions here about Switzerland, the Swiss people and our relationship to our guns and our army.

Firstly, not everybody is required by law or otherwise to own a gun. In fact, gun ownership, carrying and transfer are regulated pretty strictly. I will go into detail about this later.

Secondly, not every man and woman HAVE to be in the army.
Fact is, in the year they turn 18, every man has to go to a 3 day test, called "Aushebung". This is not mandatory, but possible for females. There it's determined if your fit enough for the army and what branch of service fits your performance. Then we have 21 weeks of basic training, splittet in 6 weeks general training and the rest in branch specific training. Here, you receive your service rifle, gas mask and some other stuff that you keep in your home.

After basic training, we have a reoccuring term of service. Every year, soldiers have a so called "WK", "Wiederholungs-/ Weiterbildungskurs", basically a 3 week refresher and to get people fit with the updates in tech and tactics. You also have to go to the 300m shooting range once a year and shoot a mandatory program to prove that you can handle your gun. This goes on until you have served your mandatory days or have reached a certain age. Then you give your stuff back, and, depending on some conditions, you either keep your rifle, or give it back. If you fulfill the requirements to keep it, it will be "neutered", meaning no more fully automatic or 3round burst fire.

Between basic training and the repeating terms, you do in fact keep a fully automatic assault rifle at home. This has caused some unrest with our leftwingers, because some people abused their rifles for amok runs, passion-killings and suicides.
Thus it was decided in 2007 that the soldiers can't keep the ammo, but continue to keep the rifles. This has stirred up the rightwingers that see our democracy in danger since it looks like the politicians no longer trust their "subjects".
Ironically, shortly after the ammo started to be withheld after basic training, a deranged individual killed a young girl with his rifle and a round that he had stolen during service.

The future of having one's service rifle at home is currently being widely and passionately debated, and our relations to the EU influence this debate as well.

Now to our laws of privately owning a gun. There are currently two ways of lawfully obtaining a gun that is not explicitly restricted:
You buy it from another citizen with a paper contract that you have to keep for ten years. This will be changed this fall when the Schengen/Dublin treaties come to full work, then you will need a permit for this kind of transfer as well.
Or
You obtain a permit, for which you need an extensive background check and a chat with the local authorities. You will get get your permit IF you haven't been convicted of violent crime (not sure where the line is drawn) or are taking any drugs that affect your judgement. The permit is also basically a registration of the gun you purchased, as a copy of it will be sent to the police.
However, you won't get a carry-permit EVER if you can't provide a darn good reason why you need this permit.

To get fully automatic weapons or silencers, you need a collectors license. I'm not sure about requirements to get one of those, but silencers were outlawed on January 1st 1999 and were freely available before, so there's a lot of pre-ban stuff around (that's not used in crimes, btw).

So, I hope I could shed some light on our situation here in the center of Europe. Should any specific questions arise, just ask, I'll do my best to answer them.

I agree with most everyone on here concerning double tapping intruders in a private residence, but more careful planning and trainging should also be used when using a firearm, not only should people be confortable with guns but should definate get some range time. Just because you have a gun doesnt mean that your gonna be ok. i personally have a hp35 9mm and 18.75" 12g if someone broke in they would not get out the door. Everyone should have a game plan that does not include waiting on the police. But people should not act like john wayne and try to clear a house (clearing a house or any location takes a professional DO NOT ATTEMPT). if your not in immedate danger hold your ground with your gun, find cover and call police, depending on the lay out of your house there might be a tatical advantage from your stairs to be able to defend yourself. Also most people have the advantage of knowing there residences, the intruder does not. Most people also think that just cycling a 9mm round or even a 12g will scare the intruder away, wrong thought, you just alerted the intruder to your alertness and position and also that you have a gun, they might just take it as a challange especially if they also have a weapon. i personally keep a magizine loaded all time in my house and my 12g by my bed, I pesonally have put thousands of rounds through my 9mm and know for certain where thoes rounds will end up because i know my 9 and have the utmost confidence of its functionality.

This type of story has just happend in colorado just a couple weeks ago in rural coloardo and the oldtimer killed the intruder after a fight over a gun, the intruder did not know the resident had a hidden loaded 38 special and the intruder was shot in the head point blank. I commend any person willing to defend their family, property and right to life.

I will dispatch any persons trying to endanger me or my family, NO QUESTIONS ASKED.

As for the whole wife bit being in danger, SHE SHOULD BE SHOOTING ALONG SIDE OF YOU AND BE JUST AS COMFORTABLE AS YOU. if not she should be the one calling the police and taking cover in a safe place.

reply to post by BlindWatcher1

Considering I live in a rural area a drunk would have a very hard time entering my home by accident or anyone else for that matter. Not to mention if someone has the cajones to break into my home they aren't doing it to sell me a Bible. They are there to steal and cause harm. So I'll put the hurt on them before they can do it to me OR my kids.

Something that just came to me about maybe why I feel so strongly about this is; I'm the mother to 3 beautiful girls. So I think this is just the protective mother coming out.

Shame on the fool that messes with my kids.