Originally posted by 44soulslayer
reply to post by Bigwhammy
Actually moral absolutism is what creates despots of men.
Why did Hitler massacre Jews? Because he thought he was right. He believed his own infallibility. He thought that he had the moral absolute.
That's called a delusion. What does that have to do with morality?
It is the exact opposite. It is always relativism that causes despotism. If there are no absolute morals then morality is subject to personal opinion.
Hitlers opinion or your opinion.
Hitler thought he was right. For some reason you seem to think you know Hitler was wrong. Why so? You know he was wrong? Who are you
His situation was relative - you're not in his shoes. Hmmmm?
You are making a judgment by appealing to an absolute standard. The moral absolute is that killing innocents is immoral. Hitler circumvented that for
his personal opinion (relativism).
What does relativism bring to the table?
Concentration camps, Gulags, and Killing fields. Abortion, illegitimacy, and single parent homes. The collapse of Western Culture - take a look out
your window it is happening as we speak.
I have a thread about it : The Decline of America
Well, I would consider myself a relativist. My moral code and your moral code will indubitably clash on many issues. For example, I believe it is the
height of immorality to force a woman to bear the child resultant of rape. No doubt some would contend this.
Let me clear something up for you. You do not understand what I mean by an absolute objective moral law. What you are calling "absolutism" here is
not what I or Christians believe at all. Disagreements over morals does not make them relative at all. The morals do not change because mens
perceptions of them do.
Perception is relative - the moral laws are absolute.
Again you are completely hypocritical. You just said "I believe it to be the height of immorality..." Why do you believe that? What right do you
have to impose you beliefs on anyone? Huh? Because you believe that the woman has an absolute moral right to control her own body. If your morality
were relative you would not be offended by it at all, you would say oh whatever... its no skin off my nose.
But to you just know it violates her right to control her own body. You place that absolute right above the Babies absolute right to live. Both rights
are valid. But because you do not believe a fetus is a child - you go with thwe womans right. If it were a 2 year old instead of a fetus your opinion
would change would it not? The issue is not the rights themselves but whether a fetus is a child and which takes precedence. Just because there are
complicated situations does not mean there are not objective standards.
Relativism allows us to have a more peaceful world. With moral absolutism there is no room for maneuver... It reduces the actions of men to black and
white, right or wrong. In reality of course, the world is a quagmire of grey.
Again you misunderstand my position. Of course there are complicated situations. that does not negate standards.
You mentioned that lying is always wrong, and that you would tell a murderer where your friend was hiding just to avoid lying... that you would
sacrifice a life rather than lie. Are you being serious- is this a view you truly hold? If so, no amount of debate will enable us to understand each
Damn you did not read what I said at all. I did not say that - you need to read it and I would appreciate an apology.
What I wrote:
originally posted by Bigwhammy
Using the objective moral law we still weigh these issues. Lying is immoral and murder is immoral. That's not an opinion but a fact. Sorry
relativists - that never changes. There's not situation that makes lying moral .
Because there 2 conflicting values we use our God given judgment. So we lie to save our friend - we just accept that it was the best thing possible
given the circumstances. But that doesn't make lying a MORAL thing to do by any means. It was made necessary. Necessary does equal moral. That is not
moral relativism. That is situational ethics. They are entirely different concepts -- a freshman philosophy student should know that. I seriously
wonder about the author's lack of credentials.
Moral absolutism will lead to men imposing their will upon others, and inevitably to bloodshed.
No Communism is founded on Godlessness and relativism. It has led to the worst mass murders in history. If killing is absolutely wrong - and you do
what is right - there will be no killing.
You've been sold a bill of goods. Relativism is a big lie.