Get to close and you`ll get burned!!!!!!

page: 4
30
<< 1  2  3   >>

log in

join

posted on May, 18 2008 @ 06:51 PM
link   

Originally posted by dhardeman
Here's another item in the pot that doesn't smell right-

OK- so it is under the assumption due to the guys story that he was 'very close' or 'right next to' to the craft as this vent ejected SOMETHING.

So- let's look at the angle of attack here:

He is a vertically standing human- as we all are, with very uniform wounds in a perfect grid pattern on his chest and shirt- lining up vertically with his body.

If the drawn diagram of the craft is actually from him, then he would have had to have been bent almost completely backwards (like almost in a crab walk) in order for the angles to match up. PLUS- he would've had to have been VERY close or pressed up against it to get the detail shown in the wounds and shirt damage.


Look at the drawing, then look at his wounds/shirt- NO WAY they could've lined up unless he was DIRECTLY in front of the vent with his body aligned parallel to the vent- this means he was either doing the crab walk under a UFO in the woods, or he's just full of BS like I mentioned earlier.

I WANT TO BELIEVE TOO! BUT DON'T BELIEVE THIS GUY!!!

For just a second think like an actual investigator minus the emotional attachment to the UFO issue, and you will see all that I have seen. Just because you are honest and sane doesn't mean everyone else is..




That's another interesting point, although hardly definitive.
I can think of two scenarios right off the bat that would still cause the damage, even from a distance, and both of them have already been mentioned in this thread.

1) Microwaves - As long as he was standing in the beam path, and close enough to be within the resonant frequency burst, these beams would still cause the damage at a distance

2) Ionized Gas - unlike normal gas, Ionized gas could be directed easily with a magnetic field, minimizing the theorized dispersal pattern you mentioned above.

Now please, don't get me wrong here, I'm not drawing ANY conclusions yet in this case. I'm not saying I think that's what it was. However, when investigating a case, it is imperative that all of the possibilities are included in the analysis.

While you're points are well made, I'm just not sure that they rule the man's story out.

I'm especially not sure before tracking down a medical report on the victim.

As an actual investigator (don't worry, I didn't take offense at your comment, I'm just illustrating) I would be properly embarrased to have dismissed this case based upon such arguments, only to see another investigator track down the medical report and find results that disproved my analysis.

That's all I'm saying here. Some good points have been raised about this case. There are certainly some questions about his story, when viewing from a 'that story is impossible' standpoint.

It is the mark of a true skeptic to be able to comprehend both sides of the argument as possible, and to then let the evidence of the case dictate his/her theories.

Without anything being definitively proven, I still think this case has a lot more to be investigated.

-WFA




posted on May, 18 2008 @ 11:26 PM
link   
reply to post by WitnessFromAfar
 


I agree with you wholeheartedly- with one discrepancy- the angle necessary to imprint the shirt and cause the wounds.

His diagram shows the crafts 'vent' on the bottom of the craft. This means it was facing DOWN towards his head, at the very least a slight angle of attack from above. He drew the 'vent' on the BOTTOM SIDE of the craft at what I measured with a protractor was roughly at a 20 degree angle. This means he was looking either up at it, or directly across to it- not looking down at it like it was a small craft sitting on the ground.

So - if something was ejected from this vent- anything- while he was standing under it, those marks on his shirt and chest would've been on his head and face. If he has standing in front of it facing the craft, the vent would be angled down, and the marks on him wouldn't have the perfect uniform composure that they do- they would have offset spacing from the angle of the holes in the vent being different- the top holes would be spaced close, then further apart towards the bottom. Plus the marks would be oval shape- not the perfect round circles they are.

Geometrically this does not match up. -Even with a wave guided microwave, the beam would still be oval at that angle it was hitting his body at as he stood vertically. This means he was either doing the crab-walk under his ufo, or his own diagram is misleading, or it's all hogwash. It would've been MORE believable if the marks were on his back- then I could maybe see him bending over to look at something or leaning back against it, but nothing lines up with the wounds on his front torso.

What explains the 'border' on the shirt?

This is one of those cases where the evidence provided is TOO good- the shirt burns and his wounds IMHO are too 'perfect' in symmetry and spacing for an accidental occurrence. I believe the wounds and shirt burns were deliberately done as part of an elaborate hoax that this fella concocted.



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 03:42 AM
link   
reply to post by IgnoreTheFacts
 


i remember something about that incident from in searchof back in the late 70's.. i think someone said it could have been burns from a still that blew up.. or something to that effect but the case for that wasnt conclusive . hard to remember it was a long time ago.. i'll see if i can look it up..



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 11:36 AM
link   
reply to post by dhardeman
 


Well I must admit your reasoning and rationale is sound.
I can understand your position here.

I'm unfortunately still in the camp that says this case needs further investigation, but I'm perfectly willing to do that investigating with an open mind to the fact that it's a possible hoax (in fact, I sort of approach most cases with that mindset, even cases of alleged hoaxing
)

I see valid arguments on both sides of this case, and to be perfectly honest I'm the sort of guy (I think you most likely are too) that when faced with opposing (seemingly valid) viewpoints, I let the evidence decide for me.

I just think that more evidence is required here, before I'm prepared to rule the case out.

I'll tell you what, I'll try to find out some info on the medical records. Those should exist. Those findings should answer a lot of my remaining questions.

But I do thank you for approaching the details of the case individually, and making a strong case for your arguments using physics.

And I'll also take a moment to thank you for your civility. It's much more pleasant to disagree with (and/or debate with) someone when they're not calling you an idiot every other typed line


I'll let you know if I'm able to find anything...

-WFA



posted on May, 20 2008 @ 04:09 PM
link   
I never heard of holes before on a UFO saucer.
But who ever got that close.

I wonder why it stopped and opened the door.

The ETs or human pilots were just goofing around until
told by superiors to move out.

Perhaps they needed a breath of fresh air.
Or it was a daily routine.

Only the triangle got close views and a waffle joke made me think that
a few visible holes were reported.

In fact now it makes sense to hold onto static charges to have
a lot of holes.

When the hole get dirty the effect is ruined and sparks appear
and diminish stealth if anything.

Pass this on to the Illuminati CIA or ET UFO control agents.
Failure analysis has just got another star.

Wash those saucers.



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 01:47 PM
link   
I posted a response regarding the craft and plasma fusion technology. Anyone care to critique?

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 02:22 PM
link   
reply to post by nikolat23
 


Sure- I'll take a stab at it...


Do you realize the temperatures involved in fusion? If these were indeed vents off a fusion reactor, I doubt there would be much left of Steve. At any case his cotton shirt would've instantly burst into flames at 15 keV (that's roughly 150,000,000 degrees C)- and probably everything else in his immediate surroundings as well. This is depending on what type of fusion is occurring, but either way, I doubt Steve would be here to tell this tall tale if this was the case.

X-Rays and UV rays that look violet to the casual observer? I don't recall having EVER casually seeing any wavelength that is impossible for our primitive eyes to detect.

The type of radiation exposure that you are exclaiming he could've possible went through IMHO would've killed him very quickly. Lasers, violet hues and industrial scents just add to the facade.



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 05:26 PM
link   
reply to post by dhardeman
 


Thanks dhard. Let's see what the scientific facts are and if the reasoning is flawed.


Do you realize the temperatures involved in fusion? If these were indeed vents off a fusion reactor, I doubt there would be much left of Steve. At any case his cotton shirt would've instantly burst into flames at 15 keV (that's roughly 150,000,000 degrees C)- and probably everything else in his immediate surroundings as well. This is depending on what type of fusion is occurring, but either way, I doubt Steve would be here to tell this tall tale if this was the case.


Based on our current knowledge(public) of fusion we know the reaction is not always dependent on temperature. One example is Muon-catalyzed fusion However, according to Michalak, he observed an extreme bright light when the hatch opened. It was, visually unbearable but obviously contained along with any heat. Judging from the brightness, its extreme heat was contained. – His story regarding the interior is consistent with plasma. Research hydrogen and sulfur lamps for examples.

The expelled gas was hot enough to burn Michalak and set his clothes on fire instantly. Determining the source of the gas shouldn't be difficult. Look for the hottest part of the craft,..the center!


X-Rays and UV rays that look violet to the casual observer? I don't recall having EVER casually seeing any wavelength that is impossible for our primitive eyes to detect.


I apologize, X-rays actually have a blue glow.

X-rays are faintly visible depending on strength. Roentgen and Tesla saw it themselves. It has a blue glow. There are health risks in exposure so don’t expect this to be common knowledge. Other visible colors depend on the plasma,..I am still wondering where the red color came from. I highly suspect sulfur and hydrogen is involved due to the smells that were reported, their properties, and other curious UFO incidents involving water siphoning. Check out these pics:

Sulfur lamp:


Hydrogen lamp:


look similar?


The type of radiation exposure that you are exclaiming he could've possible went through IMHO would've killed him very quickly. Lasers, violet hues and industrial scents just add to the facade.


If Michalak’s observations are true,.. what theory fits better than the fusion device theory? It all fits perfectly. Only plasma can emit a full spectrum in that manner along with high frequency energies. This is well within our current understanding of physics.

There are scientists that believe laser-fusion is a possibility. What other use can lasers have in a space craft with a huge plasma chamber at the center? Interestingly, Michalak lost some of his eyesight from the encounter. He reported seeing "spots". This symptom is consistent with laser and intense light exposure.

[edit on 21-5-2008 by nikolat23]



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 05:53 PM
link   
reply to post by nikolat23
 


I don't deny that the story IS fascinating- but, I have to go with the evidence at hand, and that is a grainy photo of his apparent shirt, hat and glove, and the photo of his wounds as he lies in bed.

I have no experience in fusion or even any education on it- just what I can get my hands on. It is very possible that intelligent beings have figured out how to properly harness fusion, and I don't deny the possibility that this could be what he saw. It seems to me that in any case if we're talking about fusion, whatever was ejected was a ray of some type if it was able to imprint the detail it did- not a gas, liquid or flame. I just can't imagine such a craft wasting energy like this in the first place.

Those are close to perfect circles on his chest and shirt. I really can't see any other substance creating such precision other than a ray, or possibly a liquid- which he didn't report. None of this still accounts for the angle of the vents compared to his vertical erect body, nor the border around the circles on his shirt which to me, represent where his hand-held plumbers torch went over the edge of the plate he punched holes in to create the pattern on his shirt and chest. He wasn't about to torch his whole body. I Bet if you got a common 9" x 13" baking pan from that era, punched the same size holes in it, and you could EASILY recreate what this fella has done here. Plus the torch worked nicely on the glove and hat. Pretty desperate fellow.



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 06:23 PM
link   
reply to post by dhardeman
 


The markings on his body can be a result of hot pressurized gas. Length depends on nozzle design and pressure.

If the heat was from a fusion device other elements will likely be present. Any test results on his clothing will be classified.

His symptoms and observations make a lot of sense. He was actually sick for a long time. Why do you assume fraud?



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 11:49 PM
link   

Originally posted by nikolat23

The markings on his body can be a result of hot pressurized gas. Length depends on nozzle design and pressure.

If the heat was from a fusion device other elements will likely be present. Any test results on his clothing will be classified.

His symptoms and observations make a lot of sense. He was actually sick for a long time. Why do you assume fraud?


Please explain to us how the markings could have possibly been caused by hot pressurized gas. Please also explain which particles you are stating would be likely be present, and whether you think they'd still be radioctive enough to light up any nuke detector in a 50 mile radius.

In my minds eye all I can picture is any gas in any state billowing up under his chin and against his neck and probable bare arms and scorching the living hell out of them- which is not apparent in his recollection or in the photos. This was clearly not a gas of any sort that harmed him. If anyone can replicate those burns on a shirt with gas without being pressed directly up against the 'vent' and prove the neck and chin wouldn't be harmed, I'll eat my shoe.

IMHO it's extremely hard to imagine him with his chest and stomach pressed against the vent for ANY reason. This means to me that whatever supposedly ejected from the vent had to pass through our atmosphere first before hitting him- at a very acute angle mind you if he was standing up or even kneeling down according to his drawing of the vents position. I've made this point in my earlier posts.

I doubt a hospital was equipped for recognizing radiation poisoning in the sixties, nor do I believe they would have access to any equipment to determine if he actually had it. His wounds are inconsistent with the industrious assault he claims, and although he does paint a fascinating picture, none of his physical evidence supports his story in my book.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 01:03 AM
link   
I personally feel that his case has no merit for the simple, obvious fact stated above. The perfect grid make lift on his shirt and chest simply make no sense. Gas does not behave in that way.

As for the people asking for more information about the debunking of this story, here is something you might find interesting. The OP listed this link

www.theironskeptic.com...

apparently as further proof for the validity of the case. However, this is taken directly from here

www.theironskeptic.com...

a page that is dedicated to DEBUNKING the story!



posted on May, 29 2008 @ 01:19 PM
link   
.. A link relevant to this thread regarding laser fusion and sea water.

Lasers advance quest for energy from sea water

"THE dream of harnessing the energy source that powers the sun to provide unlimited supplies of cheap energy comes a step closer to reality last week.

A milestone is reported by a team from Britain and Japan in the effort to use lasers to harness fusion power, the Holy Grail of energy research.

Nuclear fusion offers the potential of vast quantities of cheap power from fuels such as sea water, without creating significant waste. However, despite more than half a century of research, there have been many false dawns."

LINK

[edit on 29-5-2008 by nikolat23]





new topics

top topics



 
30
<< 1  2  3   >>

log in

join