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Global Poverty Act S.2433

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posted on May, 16 2008 @ 06:16 PM
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Originally posted by Alxandro
I think it means that if everything this bill is true, we lose the last of our remaining freedoms and the end of the American way of life, I think it means Obama will go down in History as the worst President ever, the one that destroyed the US.


Now THAT would be a real horse race against Bush!




posted on May, 16 2008 @ 06:23 PM
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It sure is lame how rich Elitist Liberals think they can charge the hell out of the shrinking middle-class and lower classes to welfare some other countries. Talk about ignorance.

They'll tell you it will mostly tax the rich, but they are rich, and you know dam well they're not going to pay a cent of that tax.

Obama wreaks of Marxism, why vote for this guy? We could just become a Chinese colony and get the Maxist results he wants that much faster.

So long as he is rich and gets to keep his money, he could care less that you have to do without.



posted on May, 16 2008 @ 06:45 PM
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reply to post by ZindoDoone
 


I am sure you have done your research , but i just read the full text of the bill itself and the Millennium declaration and cannot find a reference to taking away our guns. Can you post a link?

I did find this:
To take concerted action to end illicit traffic in small arms and light weapons, especially by making arms transfers more transparent and supporting regional disarmament measures, taking account of all the recommendations of the forthcoming United Nations Conference on Illicit Trade in Small Arms and Light Weapons.

Is it that you want absolutely no law or oversight on stockpiling of illicit weapons?



posted on May, 16 2008 @ 11:00 PM
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OK, I had never heard of the Millennium Development Goals, so that was an interesting twist. I do notice that in the post above there are references to regional disarmament, which would suggest that we would get rid of the guns one region at a time.

However, the problem is that if we have already signed on to this, we are bound by it until we unbind ourselves from it. Of course, I have serious issues with this and even further issues with the falsified reports claiming that banning guns decreases violent crime. Why do we insist on living in a fantasy world where everyone cares about everyone else?

I think that this global poverty act is analogous to the guy who goes out and does everything for everyone else while neglecting his own family. No one respects that guy (least of all his children), so what would make this a good idea for us, considering the fact that our reputation in the world is already so ridiculously unfavorable.



posted on May, 17 2008 @ 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by ZindoDoone
reply to post by JMurdock
 


Its tied to the UN Millinium act. The cost quoted and the small print on this UN resolution forces us to agree to the UN small arms act which negates our 2nd amendment. It creats UN courts whos rules take away 5th, 4 th, 7th, and 9th amendments. Creats a global carbon tax that our economy cannot afford. We would have no sovereignty left. We would be forced to knuckel under to those wonderfull humanitarians in the UN. MOST of whom would ruin this country for fun. Thats where the problem lies and it is in this bill by Obama.


Zindo


Ok I was unable to find any info on the UN Millinium act. I found some info on the United Nations Millennium Development Goal.

www.unmillenniumproject.org...
www.un.org...

Reading through the info I didn’t see anything about carbon tax and taking away amendments.
Does anyone have a link to the info.



posted on May, 17 2008 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by JMurdock
 


JM,
You've done some research and you have found the pertinate documents but the gist of what you've read doesn't tell you what the UN thinks are 'small arms' and how they intend to carry out the "Confiscation" here in the US. I would referance one Roberta Peters to investigate. The carbon tax is in the Kioto accords that is included in this conglomeration known as S.2433. It binds the US to the UN laws because we are the only country with a constitution that says we must abide by any treaty we make internationaly. Others can sign it but they are under no legal obligaton to follow through. Look you can believe what you want ,of course, but what I'm telling you will happen if this is signed.
Zindo



posted on May, 17 2008 @ 02:25 PM
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reply to post by scarlett1125
 


I read regional disarmament as something other than small arms as small arms are mentioned separately.

I would have thought it would be easy to materialize concrete evidence that the UN has a Constitution overturning agenda given the plethora of apparently unsubstantiatable claims for the same made on this thread and others. I suppose I was hoping for too much.



posted on May, 17 2008 @ 05:03 PM
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Maybe these links to info on IANSA and the links to the UN might give you a better view of what the UN thinks they can do to our constitution.

Zindo


www.irinnews.org...

technorati.com...

www.socyberty.com...\

frontpagemag.com...



posted on May, 17 2008 @ 08:13 PM
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reply to post by ZindoDoone
 


These links are pretty much what you and your ilk say the UN wants to do. Where is the paperwork?



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 10:14 AM
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Well, I'm glad that those of "MY ILK" outweigh those of "YOUR ILK" . Its running 4-1 at senate offices against this bill. I guess others manage to find the info they need to understand exactly what this bill means and where the info leads them. If you like the idea..fine with me. Just don't come here for the money, Or my guns and don't think for one minute I will abide by any UN court!!!

Zindo



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 11:00 AM
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reply to post by ZindoDoone
 


So....no footnotes then? I would have expected better than anecdotal evidence from you. Your posts are usually more thoughtful.

[edit on 18-5-2008 by wytworm]



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 11:24 AM
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I am totally with Budski on this one. End the war. Bring the troops home to watch our borders. We are fighting in Iraq for the privelige of eventually paying ten dollars a gallon for gasoline. I would rather see the government fighting the rich oil company executives and torturing them in Guantanamo than having them fight the poor Iraqis who have DONE NOTHING TO AMERICA TO WARRANT THE TREATMENT THEY ARE GETTING.

No Iraqi's were responsible for killing Americans, UNTIL WE INVADED THEIR LAND.

Al Queda was not in Iraq until we toppled Saddam and then they came in droves to kill Americans.

Barak is not ready to lead. He is still finding his way. Throw him back in the water and let him mature some before calling him to leadership. He lets others lead him, instead of being the leader himself.

CHARITY BEGINS AT HOME. Eliminate poverty in America, then worry about the rest of the world. There are plenty of problems right here to spend money on.


[edit on 5-18-2008 by groingrinder]



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 02:58 AM
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reply to post by budski
 


You can complain about the war, it has nothing to do with Taxing Americans to death, to give it to people, when we are in dire-straights ourselves. Lets see, how about; schools, roads, bridges, hospitals, homeless, energy technology, high-tech R&D for American Corps (small) to actually build something here, so people can have jobs which allow them to live as they should.

If you want to help the feed the rest of the world, there is plenty of land out there, plant what you need.



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 06:30 AM
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I dun envy the situation of everyday Americans. Having to live with a debt-ridden economy. At the same time, wanting to maintain your "civil liberties".

At the end of the day, which is the most important issue of all? Being the police of the world, or having enough money to feed your own citizens?

I'm not American, but I can say that the best leader you guys could have is the one who can come up with the right policies at the right time. Now seems to be a good time for isolationism. What I mean is try to fix the problems you have at home first.

Charity begins at home.

Are "civil liberties" so important? I believe if you look at Maslow's Heirarchy of Needs, food and shelter (which you guys are having a problem with due to the subprime crisis) has to be taken care of first before "self-actualisation".

You could do with some "benovelent dictatorship". Take a look at Singapore for example, a small dot of land where I come from. We have a one-party government with little or no opposition. The Govt operates solo and is virtually all-powerful. Yeah, we're like mindless cows sometimes, but hey, our "middle class" is hell a lot richer than yours! We can't care for the problems of other people unless they are in dire need due to natural disasters, and dont care nuts for other peoples' wars.

Our economy is in major surplus and while our GDP may be smaller than yours, at least we're not in debt. In fact, we have one of the largest nett amounts of foreign reserves in the world.

Who cares about civil liberties if you have no food or no oil to heat your homes?

We gripe about our leaders too, but we cannot deny the fact that they at least ran the country right (ie profitably).

No point being all righteous but hungry, right?

US should try this for once. Model your country based on mine, screw the liberties till AFTER you set your economy right. I'm not against your civil rights, but you guys got to prioritise matters.

And in case anyone wants to say that Singapore is a small pissant country, take heed. You guys are using our textbooks.... so your children are at our mercy! We'll make them smarter than you are, we promise!



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 05:19 PM
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Originally posted by Drapan
[There's nothing wrong with this. It's time for you (americans) to take your responsibility, I'm not saying you aren't helping people, but it's far from enough.

It's not like you would be the first to do it, even small countries like Sweden, does it and we have 9 million citizens and we're a welfare state (one of the top).

Also, Don't only think of yourselves, If you haven't noticed there's other people on this planet as well.]


Ok in your opinion we don't give enough help to other countries, let me give you just one example.


Between 1949 and 1997 America has given a total of $84,854,827,200 in aide to Israel. That comes out to total benefits per Israeli of $14,630. but total cost to Americans per Israeli of $24,240. Do those numbers seem right to you ?

The reason that we pay out over $10,000 more per Israeli than they recieve in aide, is that we pay anywhere from $50 million - $60 million a year in interest. We pay this interest because of the fact that we BORROW money each year to give them thier aide in one lump sum within the first 30 days of the fiscal year, which we do with no other country. Maybe Americans are upset with the fact that we BORROW money and pay such enormous interest on that money, not for ourselves, but to give it away to another country. How much money would you BORROW and pay interest on to GIVE away to a stranger ?


Now i don't have a problem helping others, but i have a problem helping others when we have over 700,000 homeless people in this country, and millions of children that go to bed hungry every night, as well as all the people in this country that can't seek medical attention due to lack of insurance.

Maybe you think that all Americans are wealthy, well we're not. There are too many of us that are living from pay check to pay check and it's still not enough. They start wars and use our tax dollars to fund it, without consulting us first, they spend billions of dollars for foriegn aide every year without asking us, they use our hard earned money to do with what THEY want and we have no say so in the matter.


I've been unemployed for over 3 months now, haven't found a job yet, i barely make my rent. Where are my tax dollars now, where is my goverment now, do they care if i can afford to eat, or go to the doctor if i'm sick ? When i had a job i worked my butt off and still had nothing, no extra money, not enough money to save, or open a retirement account, hell i could barely afford to buy food most weeks and my "health insurance " was a joke.


So you'll have to excuse me if you think that i'm a selfish American, but i can't even afford to take care of me right now, so no i don't want them taking any more of my money to help others. Hell i'm not even middle class, as a matter of fact i sit just slightly above the poverty line and i just can't afford for them to take any more of my money. Do you suggest that i should become homeless to help people in other countries? Because that is what i'll be if they take any more money from me.

Nobody should be allowed to FORCE another person to give thier hard earned money to others, it's bad enough that they already force us to pay income tax, which i might add is illegal.


I seriously doubt that you would take the food out of your child's mouth to feed another, so don't tell us that we should.


We're just fed up with our goverment taking our money to help others when they don't help us.


I myself am also fed up with so many countries bad mouthing us, and in the blink of an eye run to us for help when they need help with something.



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 05:32 PM
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reply to post by Drapan
 


Here's another set of figures concerning our foriegn aide for you to look at. Sorry but i couldn't find my numbers when i wrote my previous post.


In 2001 we gave $1.4 billion a year in aide to Africa, by 2006 the amount of foriegn aide to Africa had quadrupled to $5.6 billion a year. Add to that aide a $15 billion aids prevention programme which bush wants upgraded to a $30 billion programme.


So please don't tell us that we don't do enough, and we should stop thinking about ourselves, because we're not allowed to think of ourselves. We know that there are other people in the world. But can we take care of ourselves first ?



posted on May, 19 2008 @ 06:24 PM
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Originally posted by vision
[That is a cool thing to say. I think Obama's plans are not only good for us in the US, but could help out the rest of the world , too.

He admits he isn't perfect, but will do his best to steer us in a better direction.
I think thats good, he is honest with us.]


Do you really believe that he is honest with us ? Have you checked to see if his actions back up that opinion, or do you just believe him because of what comes out of his mouth?


If he was "honest" with us don't you think that he would back up what he says ? Take a look at his voting record and see what he really believes, what he really backs up, and what he cops out on by choosing not to vote on at all.

If he was really "honest" with us why would he have a problem with taking the political courage test ? Because he has continuously refused to take it.


Imo if Mr. Obama is elected president he will sell this country out so fast we won't even see it till it's already gone. Goodbye America, Hello NWO & UN.


[If we can afford to help more, we should. Lead by example right?]



Maybe you should do some investigating and see how much we already help out, And how many people in our own country are in dire need.


Yes lead by example, show the rest of the world how to take care of your own first!





posted on May, 19 2008 @ 06:35 PM
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reply to post by budski
 


It's too bad we either have to fund a war that isn't helping most of us or we have to fund fuzzy feel good measures that aren't helping most of us. We need to mind our own business. Make jobs in America. Help the homeless and sick. Educate ourselves so we can compete in a global economy. Look to the Statue of Liberty and Jesus for inspiration. Not what neocons say they said but what Lady Liberty and Jesus (read the sermon on the mount-don't listen to what your rulers say) actually said. Vote for a third party. Nader. Barr. Jingozian. Somebody. We need to get rid of the Democrats and the Republicans. If this turns into a class versus class thing the middle class better look out- the rich can buy survival and the poor have safety in numbers.



posted on May, 20 2008 @ 04:23 AM
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Originally posted by yourrolemodel
reply to post by budski
 


It's too bad we either have to fund a war that isn't helping most of us or we have to fund fuzzy feel good measures that aren't helping most of us. We need to mind our own business. Make jobs in America. Help the homeless and sick. Educate ourselves so we can compete in a global economy. Look to the Statue of Liberty and Jesus for inspiration. Not what neocons say they said but what Lady Liberty and Jesus (read the sermon on the mount-don't listen to what your rulers say) actually said. Vote for a third party. Nader. Barr. Jingozian. Somebody. We need to get rid of the Democrats and the Republicans. If this turns into a class versus class thing the middle class better look out- the rich can buy survival and the poor have safety in numbers.


Its been class vs class forever! Fix education and the rest will take care of itself



posted on May, 20 2008 @ 10:48 AM
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Originally posted by wytworm
I would have thought it would be easy to materialize concrete evidence that the UN has a Constitution overturning agenda given the plethora of apparently unsubstantiatable claims for the same made on this thread and others. I suppose I was hoping for too much.


Do you really think the U.N. is just going to put out a flier in bold-face print that says:"We intend to take guns away from everyone on Earth and tax the bejeezus out of the U.S. and other industrialized nations - effective immediately"? C'mon.

Of course the information is hard to find. It's intentionally made confusing and obtuse. Everything is buried in piles of verbiage and cross-referenced so that it's almost impossible to find a smoking gun. The U.N. may be crazy but they're not dumb ( al least not that dumb).Conspiracies of any sort generally require a bit of secrecy and they surely know how the game is played.



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