Get Ready to Spend $6,000 a Year on Gas

Originally posted by jasonhb
What about the water/ hydrogen gas? Or was this debunked? www.waterforgas.com

This may be the worlds savior if true. Hmm.

Ooops! www.water4gas.com

Originally posted by Britguy

3. Given the fact that the oil companies are paying more $USD per barrel to the producers and the subsequent rise in price at the pumps, I'd expect to see a drop or, at the very least, a flattening of oil company profits. However, all the big oil companies are posting never before seen record profits. Then there is the extra revenue to the government from the increased prices. I wonder how much extra the treasury has received from fuel duty in the last few months, against the same time last year?

I smell a great big dirty rat.

Thank God I am not the only one who smells that rat.

The government (U.S.) is making a hell of alot of money from taxing the oil companies. The oil companies just pass those costs on to the consumer. Its a sweet relationship between the two, the government gets to whine and say they will do something like tax the oil guys, they both make huge amounts of money, and we all get the shaft.

What is worse for us Americans, refiners are starting to have troubles with the higher oil prices and the reduced fuel demand. The only way to solve this issue is for the refiners to decrease their output. For some strange reason the fuel prices have been rising even with reduced demand. I wonder what will happen when the fuel supply decreases overall because of refinery cutbacks?

Other than that, I already am spending $6000 a year for fuel even with my 30 mpg Honda. I can't take public transportation because of the nature of my profession. I won't take public transportation because the exciting nature of public transportation in the Los Angeles area isn't for me.Luckily, my driving is mostly for business and I get to write off around 50 cents per mile.

On the good side, I noticed that Los Angeles traffic is much better.

Originally posted by jasonhb
What about the water/ hydrogen gas? Or was this debunked? www.waterforgas.com

This may be the worlds savior if true. Hmm.

Well electrolysis of water to create hydrogen isn't a new thing.

I dunno how to fit the whole contraption into a vehicle and I don't know how an internal combustion engine reacts to hydrogen gas but I hope it is true also.

reply to post by 44soulslayer


That calculation only works if you ignore the other costs of car ownership (depreciation, tax, insurance, maintenance...) add those in and that bus trip will start to look pretty cheap. Take your yearly bills for each of those things and divide by your milage then look at that journey again.

Originally posted by jasonhb

Originally posted by jasonhb
What about the water/ hydrogen gas? Or was this debunked? www.waterforgas.com

This may be the worlds savior if true. Hmm.

Ooops! www.water4gas.com

I looked into it for my lumina since I only get 20mpg. Turns out its BS and also a combination of very risky tricks such as adding acetone to your fuel.

Acetone in any amount that would benefit you, is highly dangerous as it will eat your lines. In small amounts its safe, but you will not see benefits.


The guy pitching the product is a conman according to my mechanic. Wish it were legit, but cant say it is.

Better off investing in a conversion to veggie oil.


As for public transportation, the only place in the states that has a decent system is downtown new york. Before I got my car I used public transport here in Tampa and it took 4 hours out of my day just to go to class, it was so bad it didnt allow me to get a job. Now I have a car, and the job markets gone to hell . Funny how it works.



[edit on 5/15/2008 by AndrewTB]

My fathers work pays for all our petrol.

I love our V8.


But seriously, isn't it true that it's mainly America feeling the squeeze? Because over here I've noticed crap all diferance, sure people are buying more fuel efficiant cars, but noone appears to unhappy about oil prices in Australia?

Good, thought provoking thread as usual, budski. I agree with you that ethanol (particularly from corn here in the USA) is a bad idea, though Brazil seems to have done some good things with sugar cane, and there are some grasses and such which could be used efficiently.

As to public transport, it’s used fairly extensively here in the USA where it’s feasible, such as the Megalopolis of the NE coast, and is even being developed here in wide open spread out Dallas. LA could probably use a lot more of it, but then la la land is it’s own little world. The problem is that you need quite high population density for it to be efficient, and that simply doesn’t exist here outside of the big cities. British rail is wonderful thing, but there’s a good reason that Amtrak (our version) is a ridiculous mess. If Dallas, Denver and Chicago were no further apart than London, Manchester and Liverpool, we’d have a lot more public transport. Also, public transport isn’t going to get food from the farms to the cities. Looks to me like much more of the food we eat is going to be grown locally in the future, and frankly I think that’s a good thing, from a health standpoint as well as one of energy conservation.

Relax.. It will not get that high.. If it does you wont drive.. as the economy will be completely shot and you will not be able to afford to drive at all.. If diesel gets much higher trucking will disappear.. Trucking runs trade which runs the economy... MaddMaxx here we come.... better start digging for your fuel tanks...haha

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
reply to post by 44soulslayer

 

That calculation only works if you ignore the other costs of car ownership (depreciation, tax, insurance, maintenance...) add those in and that bus trip will start to look pretty cheap. Take your yearly bills for each of those things and divide by your milage then look at that journey again.

Yeah, thats a fair point.

However considering I drove about 8k miles last year, and considering the cost of public transport exceeds £1 a mile regularly, it still doesnt make sense.

As I have stated though, even if a car costs me more than public transport I will continue to use it for the added comfort and convenience. Not to mention the fact that public transport does not make some places accessible. There really are some places that you can only drive to conveniently, whereas public transport would take hours on end.

reply to post by 44soulslayer


Very true, which is why I advocate an expansion of the public transport system, which should be initially subsidised by a portion of the fuel tax we currently have.

We all know that in the UK the 65p out of every pound (roughly) that the government makes on fuel, does not go into "green" projects, apart from a minute amount.

We don't have to have double-deckers on country roads - mini-buses would be a viable alternative, and may even prove to be cost effective enough not to need TOO much of a subsidy.
After all, the supermarkets can afford to run "hopper" services to take people to out of town stores - and not just once a day, they run all day, every day.
Using smaller vehicles in rural area's would also bring down the cost of travel on them.

reply to post by budski


Bud, I'll agree with that sentiment on one condition.

And that condition is that we copy Switzerland's public transport infrastructure down to the last molecule!

If we had a system which was that efficient, reliable and where the word "delay" is unknown, Id happily stop driving.

Originally posted by 44soulslayer
reply to post by budski

 

And that condition is that we copy Switzerland's public transport infrastructure down to the last molecule!

If we had a system which was that efficient, reliable and where the word "delay" is unknown, Id happily stop driving.

Absolutely and completely agree. Why is our system so bad when we have a perfect, shining example in another country. I doubt the swiss would mind helping us iron out all the bugs in our system. A system as efficient as theres may cost slightly more but the reduction in delays would easily scrape back the outlay.

Yes copy the swiss model, absolutely.

Hi There,


My name is Alex Luke and I live in the England (UK) and fuel prices here are very high indeed, it is well over $2 per litre meaning already i have to limit the usage of my car, diesel is now comparative to petrol so no saving there.

We need Hydrogen powered cars......quickly.

I feel the US really has to take the lead here there are 143,781,202 cars in the USA making that just over 2 cars per household. Thats more than Europe (thats not a country) and Africa put together, and by far the worlds number one user of cars.

It would seem Americans get it easy on the fuel prices we pay £1.01 average you pay £0.34p (california) per litre.

My point is that the American way is about convenience i am not suprized or shocked whenever i see fat americans being craned out of their beds or having drastic stomch surgery, come on guys leave your cars at home.

The USA will be the end of this planet for one reason or another. It is plain to see from the rest of the world that the US destroyed a nation just for cheap petrol think about that and just contemplate the image the US is projecting across the globe.

I have done alot of reasearch into the 'American Petro-Dollar Cycle' and it is no co-incidence that the trading standard for buying oil is the Dollar, so if for example Japan wish to buy oil they must exchange thier Yen for dollars giving your federal reserve a massive boost in terms your economy. 67% of the US Economy is supported by these means so an oil exchange trading in Euros would be a disaster for the US economy so well worth spending hundreds of millions of dollars and throwing away many hundreds of US soldiers lives along with other nations sons.

All for cheap Fuel - Think about it ignorance is not bliss!!!!!


Saddam wanted to trade in euros as the exchange rate is better than the lowly Dollars.

Iran also plan to open an oil exchange trading in Euros - i wonder what will happen there then??????? I give you one Guess

reply to post by 44soulslayer


Well that's my idea mate - to spend the money where it's needed and improve the services to make them clean and efficient.

And maybe introduce the boris law number one - no alcohol or drugs on public transport.
Anybody who does, to be banned.

They can walk with their beer/cider/whatever.

My idea is for an efficient transit system that people will want to use, and if that means being harsh with some people who don't respect the rights of others, then so be it.

Originally posted by ben91069
I don't know who is to blame, nor could I care - because frankly I am powerless to do anything about that.

However, I do have advice for anyone affected by this. Do not wait until next year. Do not wait to see when fuel prices will stabilize. Do not wait to see how much you can afford. Gasoline will forever increase in price now so you need to act now.

The sooner you sell your trucks, SUV's, and low mileage vehicles the better. You may take a loss on them, but you will be better off later. If you wait until next year, they will be the more difficult to sell or the trade in will be lower. Don't hesitate as if things might become still manageable - they won't.

Get rid of the vehicles that are costing you a fortune and buy an economy car - it doesn't have to be a new hybrid. An older Honda or something similar with a 4 cylinder would suffice. You need something that has enough space to get to the grocery store and to haul a little bit and can hold at least 3 people. This would be your primary transport.

Also think about getting a motorcycle, scooter, and bicycles. Whenever you are needing to get somewhere and you are only bringing yourself. If you can fit your belongings into a backpack and the distance is short consider these as your main transportation.

I mention bicycles, but only for the most hearty. I realize everyone doesn't live within short distance of where they are going, but it is incredibly cheap, doesn't require fuel, license, registration, or insurance. Also, it is healthy for you and you'd be amazed at all your missing by driving in a car.

I started riding bicycle for leisure last summer. This summer I plan to double my mileage and ride more into work, for which I already have a few times when it is warm enough. It is 10 miles each way, but it can be done just be leaving for work a little earlier.

It's time to quit complaining about it, quit thinking that if your voice is loud enough someone higher up will fix things and do something about it yourself.

Some of your points I agree with.
But you're argument is from the POV of the local working hero in his nearby 9/5 office job.
Unfortunately it's not that simple some of us have travel far and wide to get work and will need big cars to get us there.
It's the same with the public transport argument against cars. For some of us the public transport system will never be the solution
I work in the Oil and Gas Industry as a self-employed contractor and have to commute from Middle England to Aberdeen and back again for work.
I also work all over the place for inland contract work via my car as well.
Small, rink-a-dink cars are all well and good in the towns and cities, but on the highways they suck big time and can even burn more fuel than a bigger cc car once you get up to 60 MPH +.
They tend to be uncomfortable for long distance and the shorter wheelbase doesn't bode well for long-range cruising and touring.
So yes for some folk there's wisdom in it, for others it's not so good.

reply to post by budski


Works for me.

It just occurred to me that my previous rant about chavs smoking weed on buses is rather a poor excuse for avoidance of public transport.

There presumably laws against such behaviour. What we need to do is enforce them.

In full agreement with Boris' Dictat #1! Though it wont stop the problem of people getting sh**faced, stumbling onto the bus and harassing others. Perhaps we also need to consider barring those who are obscenely drunk from getting on also.

reply to post by budski


One thing is the Dollar fall another is the Oil prices rising, and the oil prices are rising very little in Euros, this means that is not the Oil prices rising but the Dollar value diminishing...

Anyway, this doesn´t seams to make much sense to most people (we know they ´re all dumb...)

If this high in "oil prices" continues soon the wild globalization will be a thing of the past, at least for a few decades or so... Think with me:

How would the goods and raw materials be transported to and from the factories? How would the Chinese place their products in the west?

How would the trucks move the goods thousands of miles across Europe and US?

How would planes fly? at least at the current cost...

Easiness of movements is the guts of globalisation, is what makes this world small.

If prices still rising, goods will have to be produced locally, communities will return to what they were 20 or30 years or so ago... People will get their jobs back because factories will have to be built again... Small farms will return
...and so on...

AND we will pollute less because we won´t be using so much oil for transportation and power generation...

I think this will be a better world, just wondering, what is the magic number?

200 USD/barrel ? 300? 500?

We can´t spend 1/2 of our income to go to work!...

Better days will come, get ready for it in a short time... at this rate I´d say 3 to 5 years...

Some people already spend that much on gas!
With prices the way they currently are, I spend that much right now.
Between seeing family and commuting to work, that's my yearly gas budget.
I've had enough though. No oil company has invested in new refineries in 40 years. No one is tapping any new oil reserves in the US. Foreign sources are tightening their hold on exporting oil. Regular cars aren't upping their mpg fast enough to compete with hybrids. Refineries refuse to operate at more than 85% capacity. And the federal gov thinks suspending the gas tax will help, when the "stimulus" checks people get are only going to stimulate the oil economy overseas because prices keep rising.
As of 2009, I'm buying the most fuel-efficient gas-hybrid on the market.
The money I spend on gasoline will go to an American company instead of overseas, and fuel economy will be so good, I'll only have to fill my tank once every two months! Even with all the driving I do. Plus, I'll be driving a brand-new car that exceeds every crash standard and has next-generation airbags. (In the seat-belt.)
With the cost of food, oil, and energy on the rise, I've made the decision to be as self-sufficient as possible. Reasonably priced next-generation solar tech, hybrid cars, and homegrown food can reduce your costs drastically and take the bite out of the things in life that many consider necessities that are raping our income these days.

$6,000/year X 5 years = $30,000
Would you pay $30,000 for 300 miles per gallon?
(For reference, a Prius gets 45 miles per gallon and costs $25,000)

The car that won the $10,000,000 100mpg award:
aptera.com...

Think you kow how to save gas?
From cnn.money, posted on the consumerist...
consumerist.com...





[edit on 16-5-2008 by Area_X]

Couple of things.. Oil is not going to run out, it's part of the earth's carbon cycle and it is produced all the time. That's a proven fact.. Secondly 6k a year for Gasoline for any long period of time will put the world into bankruptcy and therefore the price of oil will drop as nobody will be buying it. Once the current President is out of office and the oil companies quit screw..g the public, the prices will drop.. In other words once the law is enforced, this kind of crazy stuff will stop...

[edit on 16-5-2008 by GrndLkNatv]

[edit on 16-5-2008 by GrndLkNatv]

Walking is all fine and dandy, but it will not drive business. My fuel bill was close to 10 thousand dollars lately, and I will pay that a few times a year.

If I could run all my equipment on something else I would.