Was Hitler that bad?

reply to post by caballero


no *snip* hitler!
my polish grandma lost her sister to hitlers sick twisted regime!
right in front of her eyes her mother was shot through the shoulder and it went all the way through and hit her sister clean in the head.
luckily her mother survived.
she came to england just after the war, with her mother were she met my grandad(who was in the ukraine army, tank regiment i believe)
and they had a happy life over here.
still my nan wouldnt tell me much else about it because she saw terrible things that she could never talk about again.

so yes hitler was that bad, worse. one of the worst "humans" to excist.

"Germany has concluded a Non-Aggression Pact with Poland... We shall adhere to it unconditionally... we recognize Poland as the home of a great and nationally conscious people." Adolf Hitler - 21st May 1935

Peace

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[edit on 14-5-2008 by GAOTU789]

[edit on 14-5-2008 by dakattack]

Originally posted by XcLuciFer
Think about the lab animals that are in tiny cells being tested on crying in their cells and ask you self what did they do to deserve such treatment. What about the animals that are hunted and killed only to have their head cut off stuffed and placed on a wall. Who cares right!! their just stupid animals. Keep in mind what goes around comes around, I hope I'm not alive to see the day when we become the stupid animals being tested on lock in small cells crying in pain! When it happens to us we will all swear that our captors are evil and what they are doing is wrong. Can you even imagine women being locked in a facility only to produce eggs and have them taken away so that some other type of life form can eat them!!! How would you feel if the tables were turned?

[edit on 5/14/2008 by XcLuciFer]

Malarky.. Plenty of vegans out there and many "traditional people" take the hunt very seriously. They don't feel bad or guilty, but are grateful and respectful. You just feel bad about that stuff because you're really thinking about yourself. Feeling sorry for yourself in an abstracted way. Many hunters acknowledge their prey as their equals and know that one day their own body will be food for another life. You are neither greater nor lesser than any other life. Pity is only for the self. Trees don't waste energy on pity. There isn't time for that crap.

I believe the reason Hitler is personified as the epitome or exemplar of evil dictators is because he was the first of his kind to enter fully into the mainstream public consciousness of western society, and in particular the United States. While Hitler's crimes and the atrocities for which he was responsible are not in question, his personification and stature in history as taught in schools and presented in the media are the result of how recently his impact was felt, how many countries with related economies and cultures his actions affected during the same period of time, and the advent of global media coinciding with his genocide. From roughly World War II on, little of such importance could happen in the world (unless intentionally concealed, as may often be the case) without the world in turn knowing about it. Hitler was the first of his kind to have his actions disseminated so fully in this way, and as such, is the prototypical tyrant of the modern era in the collective consciousness of most societies today.

That's my explanation for it, at least. I too feel that it's vital not to minimize the impact of others like him in the name of galvanizing the memory of the shadow he cast. There is a danger, in my opinion, in seemingly "lesser" future tyrants being seen as somehow paling in comparison to the scale of his actions, and thus potentially ignoring threats they might pose to humanity. As another poster said, genocide is genocide. For instance, situations like Darfur not getting the attention that Hitler's genocide does decades after it occurred concern me greatly.

Hitler was the Allied Force's enemy in World War II. Stalin was on our side when he approved the massacre of thousands of Polish Officers in the Katyn Forest and blamed it on the Nazis. The official story was just released as the Soviet Union Collapsed in the early 90s. Reasons like this are why we hear about Hitler more than Stalin, because the U.S. supported Stalin because they were instrumental in defeating the Third Reich. Evil, without a doubt, they both are. You need to read between the lines to sort through the bias in history.

Extraordinary! I've scrolled down this conversation and read about 80% of the contributions. Unless I've missed it nobody has mentioned Pol Pot.

Why should he figure in this list of evil? Well unlike any of the others, he succeeded in having murdered more than one third of his own people. Nobody, Hitler, Stalin, Mao Tse Tung or any of the others slaughtered such a large proportion of their own people.

Lest he be forgotten, kindly add Pol Pot to the Hall of Evil.

Originally posted by djerwulfe

Originally posted by XcLuciFer
Think about the lab animals that are in tiny cells being tested on crying in their cells and ask you self what did they do to deserve such treatment. What about the animals that are hunted and killed only to have their head cut off stuffed and placed on a wall. Who cares right!! their just stupid animals. Keep in mind what goes around comes around, I hope I'm not alive to see the day when we become the stupid animals being tested on lock in small cells crying in pain! When it happens to us we will all swear that our captors are evil and what they are doing is wrong. Can you even imagine women being locked in a facility only to produce eggs and have them taken away so that some other type of life form can eat them!!! How would you feel if the tables were turned?

[edit on 5/14/2008 by XcLuciFer]

Many hunters acknowledge their prey as their equals and know that one day their own body will be food for another life.

This has got to be one of the most ridiculous statement I have ever read. If you think you are Equal to a wild animal go out and kill one with out a weapon! Use your bare hands to take the animal down and then you can be considered to be its equal. This kind of thinking is the very reason we find ourselves reapeating history we don't seem to learn anything. People love to make hitler out to be a monster, when have you ever heard anyone mention what happen to the Indians the Mayans or the Inkas when the Europeans cross the sea! Do you have any Idea what happend to those people? Again it was in our best interest to to stop hitler cause he was evil. It was also in our best interest to slaughter the Indains and all of the other true Americans so that we could take the land!

reply to post by caballero


the nazis were a team, hitles was the captain, some of the nazi regime ideas were not even his... Staline was 50 times worst than hitler, Mao was 100 times worst than Staline...

The fact is that the jews have a great propaganda machine, thats why we are so well informed about the nazi atrocities and not so much about the ussr or PRC...

so, what can we do about this? - Nothing! we just know about it and try to spot the signs before the same sh*t happens to us..

I think one of the reasons that Hitler gets a worse “rap” than other tyrants is largely because of the common image of him – which he himself helped create. That is, the whole imagery and symbolism of torchlight rallies, swastikas, death head emblems, etc…

He tapped into things that deeply affect peoples psyche - with intention and to great effect. Mao and Stalin were just sort of dumpy little guys, their propaganda was generally crude and unimaginative, and they just didn’t “project” themselves the way Hitler did.
Hitler created a lasting image of himself that was bound together with all sorts of intimidating and sinister icons. In doing so, he put himself in the company of personas (real or imaginary) such as Dracula, Darth Vader, Satan, etc. Those sorts of images are almost universally recognized and subconsciously understood by people. In combination with the actual horror of what he did, his persona will likely be used to terrify people for many generations to come.

I would have to say that your views seems uneducatedOP. However, you bring up an excellent point. GWB and his friends in GB and Isreal are no better than Hitler. If anything, hitler had the balls to do it from the ground, the Yanks and Brits and Isrealies have to do it from the Air. These three countries in the past view years have killed countless millions (i Dread to see what the actual figure is), and tell us it is being done in the name oi=f Democracy! YEAH RIGHT! War criminals are us is their orginasations name. Democracy the Wests way is full of crop! It consists of stealing Iraqi Oil, Driving the Palistinans out of their home land, Having their troops rape and murder innocent Iraqi's (women and children)-having pcitures taken to show this, threating Iran, Syria and just about every country that will stand up to them. Now, tell me what is the difference between them and Hitler?

reply to post by passenger


Dang it you beat me to the punch! That was going to my exact point!!!
I read the whole dang threat just to see if someone was going to say that...
ggrrrrrrr

I don't fault Hitler at all. His country was shamed and left in ruins by traitors in their government and he felt obligated to do what was necessary to bring glory and power back to all of Germany.

Of course, he did take actions that led to the deaths of many people, but he's certainly not the only leader in history to have done so. If you want to blame anyone for the genocide, blame the citizens of Europe who fell for powerful speeches. I think Hitler just saw the opportunity and used the Jews, Gypsies, communists and the rest as easy scapegoats. He might not even have hated them (at least any more than he hated anyone else).

I have friends from Germany, and they tell stories of what their parents told them. I am in my late 30's so, their parents were kids at the time. None of them will tell much, just that it isn't spoken of in Germany, that it is shameful and their parents witnessed horrific things.

XLucifer, I can't even imagine equating lab animals with PEOPLE. I am a huge animal lover and can't stand the thought of anything being in pain or tortured. What Hitler did to those in Auschwitz and other death camps is truly horrific.

Yes, there are others that have existed that were evil, maybe just as evil. But, Hitler was THAT bad. To even say "Oh, he wasn't all that awful" is a frightening thought.

Hi,

First time here. I find this an interesting topic. As far as I know, the reason we hear about Hitler more than the others are:

1. He was much more advanced and did use the symbolism to great effect.

2. The people who control the media make sure we keep hearing about him. Did you ever wonder why?

I'll tell you. Again, as far as I know: There is a group out there called Zionists. Many of them are fanatical. Most are Jewish. (This is important: I do not hate jews. In fact, I know many and like most of them). However, just as in ANY and ALL groups of people, there are 'bad apples'.

These Zionsts do have the most gigantic and effective propaganda machine working constantly on the peoples of this world. Why? Well, a previous poster summed it up excellently: self-interest. For example, when a man or a woman cheats on his/her spouse, it is mostly because of selfish reasons and not to intentionally hurt the spouse. Does this make it ok? Of course not, it just shows the selfishness of the cheater. The zionists control Hollywood. Therefore, look at the crap on TV and the movies nowadays? They are conditioning us all to be selfish and corrupt(just like them). Why? Because when you have a fractured society, it is easier to create conflict (divide and conquer). The zionists are masters at this(Ex: getting the US to fight their wars).

As far a Hitler is concerned: Did any of you know that the World Jewry Organization declared war on Germany if the 30's? Probably not. Now why would the WJO do that? Selfish interests strike again. Was Hitler a racist? Probably but I am not sure. Now, what about the death camps. My heart does go out to anyone(not just jewish) who perished from such terrible violence. However, I heard there were swimming pools, orchestra's etc. for these people. I have also heard that once the German people started hurting the jews, Hitler put them in these camps to PROTECT THEM!

Now, I do not want to argue with any of you about this because the fact is that you nor I were there(thus we do not really know). Can you rely on the memories of the actual survivors. Perhaps. Perhaps not as we are now seeing the FACTS of many of these 'survivor' stories coming up as FALSE!

I have a major amount of knowledge about this and other things in this world. Another poster summed it up greatly: History is written by the winners.

Germany was built up after WW1 by the international players(bankers, etc.), including Prescott Bush! It seems that Hitler bit the hands that fed him and thus 'they' had to get rid of him. I cannot say much about why Hitler invaded Poland or anywhere else(other than he may have gone mad after his enablers turned on him).

Let us turn to the present day. We have much conflict in the world. All you need to do is to ask: who benefits from this? Then you will have the answer as to who is evil. Was Hitler? Again, he may have been, probably was. But, because he went after the jews, this is why we are constantly reminded of him(and the memorials everywhere-as if the jews were the only ones persecuted). And of course, the jews are in control.

The massive irony here is that the jews(zionists) committed terrible acts and continue to do so to this day(Palestine) and at the same time cry about the injustices done to them by Hitler. What hippocrasy!

Please try to keep an open mind here and think of the overall picture. I am willing to discuss any thing here that you want to and if I have made any mistakes here, will humbly admit to any. Thanks.

Read Please !

www.revisionists.com...

Fred A. Leuchter
en.wikipedia.org...

The Leuchter Report: The End of a Myth
www.zundelsite.org...

Institute for Historical Review
www.ihr.org...

David Irving
en.wikipedia.org...
Personal Page David Irving : www.fpp.co.uk...

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


It is true that there were Jewish organizations that worked to overthrow the government long before Hitler. However, that doesn't change anything and to paint the concentration camps as resorts is just ludicrous IMO. Not to say that you believe it.

FYI: www.auschwitz.dk...

reply to post by Melbourne_Militia


Well before Hitler Germany was stricken with poverty, it was humiliated by peace treaty and it had big political problems. But millions of Germans (i do not even mention the rest of victims of WW2 in Europe ,Asia and where not) are not yet dead in the war which Hitler is about to start. Germany is one country, without wall dividing Germans. And they do not have to feel bad about what their country did in WW1 - every side was wrong. And here enters Hitler. I would rather to live in poor country with nationalists clashing with communists, with reparations to pay then entering new phase with economical wonders based on stolen property and loans which will end in such a failure. Claiming that Hitler was good for Germany is puzzling due to the fact that we know what were the consequences of his reign.
As for reason why Hitler is more mentioned then other monsters - he left too many enemies alive and lost. Victory is written by winners. If he won - probably Stalin (or Trotsky) was on his place. But it does not mean that he is not a monster. Last century was monster paradise. I hope that this one will be less fertile for them.

Caballero is definitely making a good point here. The ONLY genocidal dictator I was ever taught about in school was Adolph Hitler. The very first question that popped into my head when I learned (independently) about Mao Zedong was "Why has this genocide not been taught in schools while we learn about Hitler almost religiously? Why are we constantly reminded about Hitler?"

From what I understand, Cabalerro's main point here is that there should be no hierarchy of genocides and dictators based on the amount of people they killed. And even though our society seems to place Hitler at the top of the pedestal of evil, there are other leaders who have had more blood on their hands than Hitler and Himmler, but we do not remember how evil they were.

I believe all murdering dictators are all equally as evil and equally important in learning to correct the mistakes of the past. Given the power and opportunities that Hitler had, I'm sure they would have done just as much.

But, again, why are we constantly reminded of Hitler?
I can only guess, but perhaps our Israeli-controlled government has influenced the education system to over-emphasize Hitler's evil so that we all grow up feeling sorry for Israel, and don't question the bootlicking and extraordinary support that America gives to Israel.

I would just like to add that if people REALLY knew their WWII history, they would consider FDR an evil mass murderer as well.

reply to post by Trauma


So Jewish/Zionist/Israeli lobby is guilty that Mao/Stalin/other bad guys are not in Canadian program? You are a Canadian citizen - why not write letter to your politicians and force it into the School books? Not everything in the world is like it is because of them zionists. I assume there are ex-Chinese citizens in Canada - are they doing something for this, or ex-USSR citizens? No it is Israeli fault-does not solve any problem.