Was Hitler that bad?

Hitler had some greatness to him. He had some good ideas. He knew how to rule. He inspired many. He was also an evil man. Just because I praised him does not mean I like him. The way history is re-written every day, it might be that he was not evil. Everything I have learned about him might be a lie. George Bush has been far more destructive than Hitler could have ever been. I know this to be the truth.

reply to post by earthman4


6 million jews might just have a different view of that Truth!

reply to post by earthman4


How many this destructive Bush got killed? Really so much more then Hitler or Stalin or Mao? Just curious.
And this great man Hitler failed at everything he started to do. He ruined his own country much more then it was ruined in WW1. I simply cannot understand how he is considered great leader.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


Bush has played a big part of the death of Americans and the Natives of Iraq and Afghanistan during the "War on Terror". Add both sides and your into the millions I believe. Not as much as Hitler... yet...

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


because after WWII he was dead so your only considering when he was alive, he was a great speaker he brought his county up from nothing to being a world superpower. thats pretty impressive.

Originally posted by caballero

because after WWII he was dead so your only considering when he was alive, he was a great speaker he brought his county up from nothing to being a world superpower. thats pretty impressive.

The magnitude that he brought his country Up, is far outweighed by the magnitude that he brought his country Down.

Serial Killers are impressive in that they are skillful. That's the extent of it.

Wars in Iraq and Afganistan are tragedies and a lot of people died. Bush has his part in this, of course. But it is still very far from the guys mentioned before. In Vietnam a lot of people died , in Korea, in Afganistan vs Soviets, in Chechnya, in Israeli-Arab wars, India-Pakistan war, in African wars and in WW1 of course. Bush is still looking like a regular war monger, as a lot of people in this century and before. Once he will start to phisically crush opposition (he does not have enough time though) and invade everywhere he can - and US can invade in a lot more places then Iraq and Afganistan - he will join the monster club. This is my opinion, and i could be wrong of course.

reply to post by caballero


He died in WW2 that he himself started. To call him great because he had several "good" years for Germany - is not wise. He failed to secure good allies, he made a lot of enemies, he constantly pushed his ideas even if his counselor/general stuff opposed, he ended up dead with country that accepted him as a national leader ruined and divided.
A person is judged by results. His results are poor. And ,once again, he failed at everything he started. Except Volkswagen beetle maybe. Great achievement from a great man and politician indeed!!!!! All the dead bodies throughout the world really were not spent in vain.
If he was that great - he would have stopped at anschluss. All that he did afterward was political mistake after political mistake.
And why did he fought to the end? Oh, sorry - why did he made German kids fight for him while the end was known for months? Just to earn time to let Nazi officers escape with plundered riches to start it over sometime.... Great leader.

Well, he was a pretty good dancer. See, he was not all bad.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


could you rally millions of people to believe in your crazy notions on how the world should work? i dont think the greater half of todays leaders could rally as much as hitler rallied.

[edit on 15-5-2008 by caballero]

Originally posted by caballero
reply to post by ZeroKnowledge

 

could you rally millions of people to believe in your crazy notions on how the worlsd should work? i dont think the greater half of todays leaders could rally as much as hitler rallied.

Bush did it! Its simple really and we fall for it every time.. How did Hitler get all the suport that he got? By burning the Reichstag, How did Bush do it, 911 samething!

Check this out!


video.google.com...

[edit on 5/15/2008 by XcLuciFer]

I just recently saw the movie Max, which i think is sort of relevant to this thread. It's about Hilter in his early days as a struggling artist. Good movie.

Originally posted by caballero
could you rally millions of people to believe in your crazy notions on how the world should work? i dont think the greater half of todays leaders could rally as much as hitler rallied.

When fear is your primary motivating factor, then people soon learn to follow or suffer the consequences.

You obviously know little about the SA, or the SS that followed. Obedience to the Reich and the Fuhrer at all costs.

You must have missed the Hitler Youth too, with children being indoctrinated and programmed into Nazi ideology from ages as young as 4.

You talk about Hitler with such casual blindness to the air of purposeful mistrust, fear, propaganda and hatred that was deliberately spread as part of his machinations and his "vision".

Originally posted by caballero

could you rally millions of people to believe in your crazy notions on how the world should work? i dont think the greater half of todays leaders could rally as much as hitler rallied.

I don't think you have replied to any of my posts to you yet, which is okay with me, I will keep responding to yours

What is your point ultimately? He was a great leader because he could rally a lot of people?

There is much more to being a good leader then having exceptional public speaking skills and a nack for persuasion and ...teams of German scientists equipped with guns and mind-altering chemicals.

Like not leading your country into widespread moral decline. And not leading your country into senseless hate-motivated mass murder.

So he rallied a ton of people? Yeah, impressive. So what?

He was not a good leader. Don't you think being a good person is intrinsic with being a good leader?

He murdered 6+ million men, women, and children dude. He wasn't a good person and he wasn't a good leader. He has an infamously huge bad rap because there is enough good people in this World for that to be so!

[edit on 033131p://16u35 by Lucid Lunacy]

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


yes being able to rally MILLIONS of people is very impressive. but its not only that he always shared his goals for germany(for the most part), he connected to the people of germany. They loved him, we were the ones who hated him so our standpoint is very biased but from the standpoint of the german people he was a good strong leader. Speaking skills are very important to being a leader, he also dis obeyed the treaty of versaille i think it was and started building a strong army and taking over other surrounding countries so he was bold as well. And it was all in the best interest of the german people.

So far we have hitler as being a people person (only to his faithful aryan nation), a strong passionate speaker (to deny that speaking skills are needed for a good leader is ridiculous JFK, Martin luther king jr. was leader of civil rights movement so it counts, churchill they were all very strong passionate speakers), and he was a bold, courageous leader who was willing to defy international treaties to bring his country and his people power and respect.

So yes he is a good leader. You can hate the guy but respect him at the same time.

also sorry for not replying to your posts.

[edit on 16-5-2008 by caballero]

reply to post by neformore


why does everyone insist i no nothing of WWII or hitler and his reich?

yes he was using fear as a tool, against those who didnt like him. most of the aryans loved him though.

We are exposed to propoganda as well, so to use hitlers propoganda as reason he was evil or a bad leader is ridiculous. Uncle sam is propoganda for the way, norman rockwell painted american propoganda posters for the war and so did doctor suess.

the ss and hitler youth were the pride of the third reich. the aryans didnt fear nor hate them only those that opposed hitler feared and hated the ss and hitler youth.

reply to post by caballero


I think that me and you disagree on what is a good leader. For you it is charismatic figure that can do what it wants. For me it is someone who is achieving good things for people he leads. Thus Mao is to me bad and to you probably great. Or Stalin. And current Chinese leader for me is great (with all human rights problems and Tibet) because a lot of people live better (not sure about farmers - but in the worse case their conditions did not improve). But since he is not that much of an orator ad does not lead his country into war with US or Russia - i am not sure you will hold him in high regard.
And since i am a nagger:

courageous leader who was willing to defy international treaties to bring his country and his people power and respect.

Did he brought his nation power and respect? I would like to ask you why war ended when it did, with Russians in Berlin. Had this people leader hopes for something? Unlike Stalin he did not have 1/6 of Earths dry land. "His" Germans died for what exactly?
You of course know that Hitler never received votes of majority of Germans. He had more then Democrats or Communists but still not enough. And once he became (with Communist party help) top guy - it is not hard to make people love you. Stalin was loved. Was he a good orator? A people person? Nope. Propaganda machine and concentration camps produce people love in needed amounts.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


his ultimate goal was to bring aryans power and respect, however he never saw that goal. You guys you cant deny he was a good leader until his fall from grace, if you will, where he made a series of stupid mistakes that sealed the fate of the third reich.

One mistake being that he guarded calais instead of normandy, because d-day insured the allies victory over germany after d-day it was down hill for germany and down hill for hitler as well.

reply to post by caballero

What does it matter what he wanted? If formula driver in his first race wants to win but crashes, ruins his car and other cars and dies - would you call him a good driver because for X lapses he was in the leading group?