The powerful white light God is Evil

reply to post by Siren

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I'm not being disentive, I might not even be disagreeing with you, I'm just confused. I'd like to see the source of the claims, where is it from? The Bible? The Book of Enoch? The Book of Giants? I see the connection, but I don't see the source of the connection.

-Jimmy

This is a typical result of FEAR. Most humans are afraid of death, pain, suffering, and the thoughts of flesh and blood. It strikes horrible visions in your mind. But to God, DEATH DOESN'T EXIST. "Energy can not be created or destroyed." Energy is God, and God is immortal, it can not be created or destroyed. To God, nothing can truly ever die, you just move on to somewhere else. You have to think of God at the sub-atomic scale.

For example, the skin cells on your face. Thousands of those skin cells live and die at a constant rate. Where is their God? Sperm cells from males live and die. Where is their God? Death is natural, no matter how good or evil the death was. This is why God doesn't really consider death to be as important as humans consider it. Just as though if you were 100% certain about life after death, then death wouldn't be a big deal. To God death isn't a big deal.

When I read the Bible, and the quote above, I can't help but think on the sub-atomic scale. On the sub-atomic scale, what is so important about your blood? What is so important about your flesh on a sub-atomic scale? When you eat flesh, does it have benefits to the human body? When you burn something, whats happening? Are you releasing energy? Are you breaking down energy to a more more basic energy? Energy from one form to another? When you burn something, are you returning matter back to is its original state before the big bang? Returning something back to its source. Sending it home, closer to God?

Humans have a problem of seeing only parts, but not the whole.

Stare At The Sun

[edit on 11-5-2008 by ALLis0NE]

Although I am not a worshiper of any god, it is not god who kills...it's humans who kill, but in the name of "god", of course.

Click here for more information.

I do not understand why so many people believe that we humans are going to be saved.

We have freedom a freedom that we have chosen.
Acording to the bible man had the choice to live in bliss and not know emotion and good and evil OR choose to be like gods and know what good and evil is.

Lucifer gave mankind that choice he did not lie to us he did not exaggerate he simply said DO YOU WANT TO BE LIKE GODS, and so we are.
Insted of living in bliss we know what hate is we know what love is but we must learn this things that is how we become true gods.

The creator is not coming to save this world and rescue us from it, why you ask because we made the choice we as humans are crated to make choice a choice that determines what kind of soul we are.
As many of you know we have serial killers rapists and many other evil people but all so many good people, you as a person make a choice to bask in posotive pure energy and advance to god in that sort of energy ,
OR you choose to live in chaos hate strife and advance down a different path.

Both are not right and both are not wrong it is simply a point of view and because god is all evil good positive negative right and wrong.

so altumatly it comes down to YOU not the person next to you not your world leaders or your family you make the choice of what you want to become and how you will become it.

God is fair and absolute we make a choice we stay with it, we want to be like gods we must pass the test as individuals.

As for the op, ask your chosen god for wisdom and remember that he was also made and created, he gave us freedom from bliss but he himself respects and talks to god just as much as any other angel. He is still a seraphiem in some ways so i suggest if you truly devoted your life to such ideals learn the ideals of your chosen god then make your outcomes.

reply to post by Vimes

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Well the truth of the matter is that any being that claims to be all knowing, all seeing, and all powerful cannot be, as to believe oneself as these proves that one cannot be. One cannot see everything, one cannot know everything, and one cannot have all power, for such concepts are infinite. A universal truth is that the more one comes to know and understand, the more one realizes how little they truly know.

Any being that truly embodies love could never embark in racism. A chosen race better than the rest is nothing more than racism. Why are the Israelites better than you? Because you are not an Israelite, nothing more. Why were the Aryans better than the Jews? Because they were not Aryans. Any supposed god that calls him or herself the one true god is deluding themselves.

I have asked this many times: what is the difference between a god and a being with all the powers of a god with a god complex? Very little, but that difference makes all the difference. Just by psychoanalyzing the personality of the behaviors and statements of the god of the Old Testament, one will discover any number of mental illnesses that fit within that mental framework that is presented by the bible.

Antisocial personality, homophobia, and narcissistic personality disorder are just a few of the blatant afflictions presented by this so-called perfect god. If any human were to make the claims of the being of the bible, that person would be making SSI checks in no time!

I personally believe that everlasting salvation was a means to maintain everlasting control over the souls of the dead to perpetuate the control of a select few. We see this pattern all the time. GW is a prime example, giving tax breaks to the richest companies around to solidify his power. Only a being of pure delusion would believe that a god would select him to be a war president or to see him or herself as a perfect god.

To be honest, I feel that holiness is no different than evil, save the energies that are projected. Darkness out of balance personifies evil, and Light out of balance personifies holiness. If any one denies this, then explain why so many lives have been lost in the name of that which is holy? Hitler could have easily said that his cause was the cause of holiness against the evil of the impure. Obviously that is not true. He could have said this though, and his followers would have believed him. Period.

Really, what does this mean? Look to common sense. Have you ever met a perfect being? NO. I know this because a perfect being cannot exist. Perfect is a concept and a flawed one at that. Merely by using logic, one can easily contradict the unrealistic claims of the bible and with enough of an open mind can still accept some concept of spirituality, and better the lives of themselves and those around them. To tell others that one is perfect is a lie, and any being who believes this, well you can all see the results. Easily.

reply to post by Vimes

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I personally won't make any excuses for God. He doesn't need my help.

I won't try to explain away all the evil we see on the earth and in man's history.

I certainly won't say a contradictory comment like; God loves everyone, for I don't believe it.

I won't say that he is a great achiever, for at times he seems to be an underachiever.

I don't believe in going to heaven or going to hell. There is enough of that on earth.

I certainly won't encourage you to go to religion, for I barely made it out myself. Religion is part of the problem not the solution. Just read some of the previous posts! They rarely agree!

What I will say is; regardless of how you feel about God, he does exist, and he is the only game in town. If you can't beat him - you might as well join him and find out who he is - with no filters.

You might be interested in a couple of my threads:

www.abovetopsecret.com...'
www.belowtopsecret.com...

Christians are brainwashed from birth and it is an extremely effective form of brainwashing. It's so effective that even after a decade of being a non-Christian I still have part of me that fears going to Hell.

This is why it's so effective:
Imagine if someone tells you as a young impressionable mind that if you do good things you will go to Heaven. A beautiful place where God resides and you have angels looking after you. You will meet all those who have died and gone to Heaven like Grampa and Grandma whom you miss so much, etc.

Then you tell this same child: If you do bad things you will go to Hell. A place where you will burn in all eternity. Some have replaced this with spiritual fire, etc, but generally people believe Hell to be a place of real fire and torment. Can you think of a worse way to die than burning to death? The pain is unbelievably excruciating. Imagine burning for an eternity!

Imagine teaching that to a person for his entire life. He/she is taught that the Bible is the Word of God and even disbelieving THAT is a sin.

To a person like that you can show him all the terrible things done by "God" and in the name of "God", but he/she will find a way around it. Their brainwashing is so strong that they will call you an Atheist / Satanist / etc and close their minds even further. So good luck to those trying to convince Christians that their belief is wrong. You're banging your head against a brick wall.

I believe in a creator, but I believe that the "God" and "angels" in the Bible are pretenders. They are either aliens or an advanced race who got a "God" complex when they found these primitive humans. I don't know but I think they were aliens, because they left in things that "thundered and smoked during the day and gave light at night."

reply to post by Vimes

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Ah, the thread I've been waiting for. Star and flag. I haven't read the whole discussion. My guess is that it's decayed into the same religion-good/religion-bad argument that I've seen a million times before.

But to address the OP:
Yes! If God and Satan do in fact exist, well, history is written by the victor, and this applies just as much theologically as it does politically. If Satan dared rebel and lost the battle to remain in heaven, then God would surely have painted the story any which way he chose to. So quite obviously Satan is going to be defamed to an extreme degree. God isn't the good God, he is just the one who won the most powerful of all thrones.

I like to compare God to President Bush. Look at all the people who voted, once stood, and STILL stand behind him. These people were/are convinced that he is the best choice, the one most worthy to run the most powerful nation on Earth. But most of us with a brain know different... and most of us with a brain identify God in a similar way that we have defiantly identified Bush.

You have to ask yourself - why would anyone wish to worship a truly evil deity? Why would Satanists choose to worship a God that has no regard for happiness, contentment or security. Satanists don't worship Lucifer because they want to burn in hell for all eternity? As much as Christians would like to believe Satanists are all mad, it isn't the case. So the only explanation can be that Satan isn't evil like he's portrayed to be. Satanists realise this and that is their great awakening from the lie. Lucifer is freedom - not freedom to kill and sacrifice, but freedom to empower oneself and LEARN from the vast array of resources that God will not allow his children to learn from. Lucifer is strength - not the strength to rape and harm , but the strength to see through lies (both theological and political) and the strength to be your own good self in a world of conformity.

Satan's greatest trick was convincing the world he doesn't exist... but God's greatest trick was convincing the world that he is the good one.

reply to post by chise61

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It starts with the parents, then moves on the Sunday school then Church (usually).

In my case it was my Mom. To be honest I'm not sure about my Dad's beliefs, but he does not go to church and we never speak about religion. My Mom is in the church choir and all kinds of things in the church. I did the Sunday school and confirmation thing, but I've always had doubt.

If you believe the Bible to be the Word of God, then you believe God is responsible for all the atrocities in the Bible. As you can see from my last post God ain't in the Bible.


[edit on 12-5-2008 by Lannock]

reply to post by Lannock

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May i ask you what religion your mother is ? I do not seek to attack you or challenge your beliefs, as your beliefs are your right. I ask because i am new to ats and before i came here i was truely unaware of how many people seem to have a hatred for christians. I have not led a sheltered life, but i have never before coming here, seen so much christian bashing.

I am trying to understand where all this anger towards christians comes from. Is it mainly from one denomination or is it all christians in general, because not all christians believe the same way.

I would like to thank you for you polite, respectful, civil reply to my previous post. It shows great character that you responded to me with civility, not hostility.

My family is Anglican and you may attack or challenge my beliefs. It won't do you any good .

I certainly don't hate Christians as that would mean I would hate my entire family . My obvious problem with Christianity is that they believe that the Bible is the Word of God and I believe otherwise.

Lets play around with words. Let's pretend you never heard about God, the devil, etc and someone tells you the following:
1. God either killed millions himself or ordered their deaths.
2. He is responsible/accountable for thousands of other atrocities (which you can find all over the Old Testament).
2. God wants man to remain ignorant (don't eat from that tree).
3. The Devil wants man to gain knowledge, by deceptive means, but still, he wants man to be as knowledgable as "The Gods".

Then you tell us who is the "good guy" and who is the "bad guy".



My pleasure sir and thank you .

[edit on 12-5-2008 by Lannock]

Why are you trying to make out that there is a good guy and a bad guy this is not humans we are talking about.
We are talking about beings that have infinite wisdom and power.
The irony is you condemn yahvew and say he is responsible for horrible acts but in the end it was man that did the acts he was asked.

Do you remember how god fed the Israelites in the middle of the desert how he empowered moses to defeat the cultists of the Egyptian pharaoh, or how he sent use the help of the seraphium to defeat the nephilim. Or how he gave eligah the power to res erect body and soul or how he gave us freedom of will.

now i am not saying you have to believe a single word in the bible but don't start arguments and use the bible as your back up and not let others use it to show the positive

ALSO lets keep in mind this is old testament so lets not pick and choose what to read and what not to read.

Old testimate is all about blood violence war rape murder and power, they were the values that people held most and sought most.

Just keep in mind that yahvew did give humans a gift that gift is the holy spirit and that protects us from demonic posesion from evil spirits.

p.s the atrocities were committed under orders of god true enough but they were committed on the enemy's off his people and the city's of pure sin (sodem and gomora) they were at war with the gods off egypt and they won the war.

reply to post by syress

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This is true, but, the reality is if you live for truth you will die for truth and be persecuted in between.

As you can see from my previous posts, I believe that Yahveh (or whatever) and Lucifer (or whatever) were neither human nor "gods" and they certainly did not have infinite wisdom or power. Hitler and Idi Amin were responsible for the deaths of millions even though I doubt they killed many (if any) themselves. History is filled with people like those. They are still held responsible.

I need to repeat myself here. I'm condemning "Yahveh" the alien (or whatever) and NOT the creator (or whatever you wanna call him/her/it) as the "God" of the Bible is not the creator.



I won't respond to all of this as it won't do any good (read my post about Christians being brainwashed). "God of the Bible" ordered genocide to a grand scale (man, woman and child, just keep the virgins for yourself). Nice huh?

Do you really believe that "your God" is capable of ordering murder and rape???? Doesn't sound like "God" to me. Sounds like Hitler / Pol Pot / Kim Jong Il / Nero / etc.

I can see your point - again a lot of this is allegorical.

But take the left hand path and the right hand path.
The left is evil and the right is good.

Lets step back for a moment and consider that only 'good' guys when wars.
Now its easy to say with this its because of divine influence.

Well lets look closer and realize that while the war is going on that both sides are seen as good. There is never a side that is evil.

One could argue, that the divine weeds out and reveals the truth with the victor.
Well, I would disagree with this, because the fruit of the victors of war (or the losers) do not align at all with the teachings of Jesus.

So now that we realize that everyone declares what is good based on their perspective we see what is at work...duality.

Now duality is really singular.
Lets take the north and south pole as an example.
One could be located at the north pole, and yet another at the south...both could believe with the utmost that indeed they are separate and are at polar ends.

The reality is ever so evident if they move from their spot to see the bigger picture, that north and south is connected with land and sea inbetween...the planet is a whole - not two spheres separated from each other.

So religion in essence, although in its allegories the light of the truth shines through - a lot is obscured by the ego - which is a tool that has not been used so in turn uses us.
In reality we are but babes still on the teat not understanding that which is before us.

We are told stories and then cling to one aspect and take a 'polar stance' and not a 'world' stance, believing that we are somehow disconnected from the rest.

So back to the right and left path.

Good is now that which pushes down the other path. Good says its good, and no one questions 'goods' motives as it is 'good'. - your evil if you question!
(oft we forget that Jesus says search with all your heart and you will find. This is often taken as search within the confines of ones own dogmatic belief system, away from evil.)

Am I saying that evil is good and good is evil?
One must realize that words are pointers which point beyond what they are saying - and there are many layers of understanding.

Its this discomfort that we must overcome - that is the unwillingness to face the unknown, or face up to our own ignorance...that indeed we dont konw anything at all, really, when it comes to the bigger scheme of things.

After all knowing does not come from the head. It comes from the greater source...God, collective conscious, etc. - thinking is duality and keeps you in the game.
the game can be fun if you know you are playing it and that "the world is but a stage and the people its actors, and all will have their turn and then pass..."

But it would make sense, as I mentioned, on one level - to have that which is the dominant ("I am right" - "I am good", male aspect, pushing down the subservient (female aspect) and saying "you are wrong" - "you are evil", etc.)

In other words its ego pushing down consciousness - but that may not even be correct, as true consciousness cannot be pushed down, so in reality its pushing down an aspect of itself.

There is much more 'thought' that can go into this...but 'thought' wont ultimately be the tool that rescues us from the state we are in. Jesus pointed out how this works quite nicely...and no its not according to todays fundamentalist, evangelical Christians, etc.

I find it funny how someone can throw out a statement and everyone just believes it.
i.e. Obama "Change...Change you can believe in" - and the crowd goes wild!

Yet he is willing to bomb Iran - sounds like old energy (people who we currently have in the white house) to me.
Also, the democrats were voted in office to get people out of Iraq...didnt happen, but people believe change happened.

Im reminded of what Eckhart Tolle said, which was along the lines of "Ego says it wants change...but if there is a change in government its just the same thing and sometimes worse than before.)

The point is we really dont understand the nature of reality...we dont understand the true nature of how things work...if we stay polarized, we stay in Satans realm as it were...again a game is fun...but do you know (or want to know) that it is a game?

People claim they do, but I fear their actions say differently.
Again, look at politics to see. Its all superficial. Yes the seed is their for true change, but its always been there - and it starts within each and everyone of us.

We "perish" for our lack of belief, as the Bible put it. And big time.
When we read the Bible we cant see the elephant (truth) in front of us, but believe the lies pushed down by an egoic agenda...because, we in turn, are 'possessed', as it were, by the ego.
- That is true demon possession if you ask me. - none of these silly, scary fire side tales with no proof. The proof is in our waking life.

You will never be able to convince anyone of anything or prove a point...well, if you do then all that happens is a polar shift where a person goes from one extreme to the other. As Jesus put it, the missionaries (of any faith) make the individual "Twice the son of hell" - check out my blog link below to see my article on this.

In essence, the ego is hard to change, but once it does, it is even more cemented in its story, and I have seen this time and again.

I will point out, for those Christians out there, something you already know, but the good book says you do not need a man to teach you, because you have the spirit within. For what its worth...however you want to interpret it...this is true.

But for the most part we are swayed by popular belief. So in a sense we are the ones that create the hell around us. The politicians and 'evil' government only reflect mass consciousness.

You may say that your afraid to step out...you are all alone.
Yes fear keeps one isolated, at least in feeling to the truth that we are all connected to the source of all life. (As God said in Psalms...even in Sheol I am there...and come to think of it, a Greek Orthodox priest had some good points in an article called the River of Fire concerning the nature of God and 'hell' - the article is partially in my blog link below called river of fire, along with the other article I pointed out earlier for those interested.)

So here we have it...in one swoop we can end all the silly debates and embrace both sides...yes, I understand that words are limited, and that we perceive what is being said through the filter of our mental grid system that has been established from the influence of our cultural milieu sense birth. - so the statment that you can embrace both sides may freak some out. - Open your eyes, open your heart...step by step you will see the truth...and it will set you free.

Hey Im an ex- OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder), so I know what Im talking about.
Again I have blogged about that to. For me Eckhart Tolles way of saying things helped to clear up some of the dry dogma that comes with most religious text...and no its not something to believe, its about practicality...

Peace

dAlen

reply to post by jimmyjackblack

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There are many sources, the Bible being the main source. The key is in the words of Jesus, He clearly defines “the truth” and “the world”. He corrects the allusions and illusions of Old Testament beliefs. One of those beliefs was human sacrifice, which is why He sacrificed His self in order for that pagan ritual to stop.

The Bible says that Jesus was the only begotten son of God, therefore Noah was not a son of God. The question remains: who was Noah?

Noah’s son Japheth (the Gentile Nation), the Gentiles had to be grafted into the kingdom of God. If Noah was of God, why would this be necessary? (Bible reference)

The Bible also says that the kingdom suffered violence and the violent took it. The violent are not of God, for it is written that “the meek will inherit the earth”.

The world was purged at the time of the flood (water), and less than a thousand years later, Sodom and Gommorah had to be annihilated by fire. (Bible reference)

I dont think chise61, that you will find that people hate Christians.
What you will find is that there appears to be a growing impatience with what looks like 'arrogance' in many peoples responses who come out of any mainstream faith really. (Doesnt have to be Christian necessarily - most have their roots in the ego, even if unaware.)

Those who are not rooted in ego are seen as heretics by those in their own faith.
i.e., Merton (his association with Buddhist priest, as well as trying to learn from them - someone outside of the Catholic/Christian faith - made many leery)

Again, generalizations you have to be careful with - because at the same time there are true seekers in each religion, and they are all at different stages...working through getting past their fear. So at the same time people like Henri Nouwen can reach out beyond his own influence of Catholicism and into the protestant religion as well...not so well outside of the faith, as one of his books confesses. - But that is where Eckhart Tolle comes in, although he is good for both those in the faith and outside.)

Back to the point is many Christians are unaware of how they come across.
The fact is people want the freedom to choose - even if they are wrong. And most Christians seem to want to save people, who frankly dont want or see the need to be saved. - they are over zealous.

I know about zeal. (apologetics used to be the name of my game.)
Having been a former zionist, evangelical, Christian - my whole milieu...my whole life...was in the middle of Christianity - and to some extent still is. I dont see that labels work any more, because the fruit is there or it is not.
But back to what I was saying, in my missionary/evangelical days I was quite the zealot...and I bet I was quite annoying. I knew I was right, and I was on a mission of truth.

So imagine an ex-OCD - obsessive compulsive disorder as a missionary, "God help us all"!
I will say, briefly, that religion had a big factor in why I was an O.C.D. - once you get what its really about, you can drop the baggage and move on.

Anyway, hope that helps...people are not anti-christian, but they do want their own choice.
And again, Jesus didnt come to bring a kingdom on earth - kind of got him killed - you know not supporting the cause for an earthly kingdom.

We have collective amnesia and tend to forget that.

I bring this up, because its zealots, of every faith, that are trying to change the world into their image...a small image for sure - and an idol at that.
They want a lot of "mini - me's"

Its this overbearingness that people here on the boards and elsewhere, I believe, are rejecting. Because inside they know its not true change.

Much like politics...you dont get true change by doing more of the same thing...time for a new system...no? I think so.

Peace

dAlen

reply to post by Lannock

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"I won't respond to all of this as it won't do any good (read my post about Christians being brainwashed). "God of the Bible" ordered genocide to a grand scale (man, woman and child, just keep the virgins for yourself). Nice huh?

Do you really believe that "your God" is capable of ordering murder and rape???? Doesn't sound like "God" to me. Sounds like Hitler / Pol Pot / Kim Jong Il / Nero / etc."


Its a shame you wont respond to it all.
you simply are doing with posts what you did with the bible take what you want to hear and leave the rest out.

1.it is not "my god" it is the god the creator off all
2. i am not a Christan nor am i brainwashed if you bothered to read my post you should come to that conclusion with ease.
3. In a war people will die this is fact the bible is very metaphorical.
4. God did not ascend and destroy army's on the battle field, if we are to speak of old testimant soldiers destroyed army's soldiers with faith in god.
5. Now this last point i don't like as much as i hate to say it but if god did create us then he has the right to destroy us.