Secret Societies Forum Debate Archive

In an effort to further the motto of "Deny Ignorance" that we here at ATS so espouse, we're starting a new initiative here. This thread will be used for the explicit purpose of posting results to debates in regard to Secret Societies.

As such, anyone having a question about a topic in this forum should refer to this thread before posting any questions to the board. The questions debated here will have direct links to the debate's first page, and to the right of it, have the winner's name.

If anyone has any questions that weren't answered in the debate, or has more evidence that may overturn a debate ruling, they are more than welcome to post a new challenge to anyone they like, where the evidence or questions that they have will be given an opportunity to be asked. Should one of the debate rulings get overturned, we'll make the necessary amendments to the previous debate, by posting a link in it to the debate that overturned it's ruling.

The idea here is to encourage the development of ideas in a constructive way, while helping to answer some of the hard questions that all that come here ask. Anyone having any questions regarding this is free to send a U2U to me, and I will get back with you shortly.

A few rules regarding this though:

1. Debate challenges are to be done in this thread, with the member challenging announcing the challenge, and whom they'd like to debate.

2. Following 1, a U2U should be sent to either myself or another SS Forum Moderator, so that we can get a hold of the Debate Forum Moderators, and get the debate lined out.

3. When posting challenges, please keep the challenge to a minimum length. All we'll need will be the question to be debated, and the member that you wish to debate.


Ok, with that out of the way, one final thing that I'd like to say before I post the first concluded debate is that this thread is to be used ONLY for debate results and/or challenges in this forum. Please keep all comments in other threads. Doing so will help to keep this thread concise.

I thank you all for you're support.

TheBorg
Forum Moderator

The first Secret Societies debate to be concluded using the Socratic Rule:

Is Masonry taking over the world? - Winner: Rockpuck 2-1


Added on 8-20-2008:

ALightinDarkness vs Rockpuck: A Mason Conspiracy - Winner: ALightinDarkness 3-0

emsed1 vs Ian McLean: The Mason's Just Need A Few Good Men - Winner: Ian McLean 3-2


[edit on 20-8-2008 by TheBorg]

I believe the secret society thing is a bit overblown, in general they exist
with their theory, I'd be glad to discuss further.

Your thoughts?

I agree overblown. I went though 1st interview. Paid the 75 dollars or am about 2. They said i will be confirmed on the lodge masters recondimnation. Nothing but kind people, involved in more charities than any other organization im America. It is about helping those,and when your in a position to help then u doing the same. The only reason for the secretness. Its a secret brotherhood, the wants quality people in it for the right reasons, to help there fellow man. Once you have proven to be a giver, yes they do help advance you in life, if it is in ther power. But no one wants a bunch of ring knockers in it just for there own benifit. Thats just a perk. The main objective is charity, and helping and alliviagting suffering of others. Im hoping once i show them i love to do such things, they could maybe help me facilitate my way into politics, and not for sinical reasons, and I will stay a member even if they cant help in that area. Dont let initiation cerimony storys scare u away. They are safe and thats all i will say

I agree overblown. I went though 1st interview. Paid the 75 dollars or am about 2. They said i will be confirmed on the lodge masters recondimnation. Nothing but kind people, involved in more charities than any other organization im America. It is about helping those,and when your in a position to help then u doing the same. The only reason for the secretness. Its a secret brotherhood, the wants quality people in it for the right reasons, to help there fellow man. Once you have proven to be a giver, yes they do help advance you in life, if it is in ther power. But no one wants a bunch of ring knockers in it just for there own benifit. Thats just a perk. The main objective is charity, and helping and alliviagting suffering of others. Im hoping once i show them i love to do such things, they could maybe help me facilitate my way into politics, and not for sinical reasons, and I will stay a member even if they cant help in that area. Dont let initiation cerimony storys scare u away. They are safe and thats all i will say

There is a ritual at intiation, that might scare many. It is just the way they have been doing it for hundreds of years. The blindfold, in your underwear, while the knife is put to your throat, while you a to promise certain things really is not a threat more carrying on tradition, no on has been hurt and i think people want it to be serious, so they can believe they are apart of something that is so significant, that there life is threated to keep secrets, dont fool your self no one dies here. maybe gets kicked out. but the cloaks and knife add a degree of drama, i think the new member is looking for

If you dare take a peek at the true nature of wisdom I suggest you try my book> The Little Book of Light. You will then be initiated into the world above ours.

Try it here. Tell me what you think if you decide to purchase.

store.payloadz.com...

Originally posted by mapsurfer_
I believe the secret society thing is a bit overblown, in general they exist
with their theory, I'd be glad to discuss further.

Your thoughts?

I think if you start with the issue of income inequality, it becomes clear that there is socio-economic and political engineering being perpetrated by an elite class:

Income Inequality as Statistical Proof of a Conspiracy:
Income Inequality, Proofs of A Conspiracy


From here, check out the quotes straight from the mouths of the elites:

New World Order Quotes – Quotes from world leaders and industrialists highlighting the conspiracy:
New World Order Quotes

And if there was no influence by an organized elite, how could this take place?

Economics and Money Creation - How the Federal Reserve System and Fractional Reserve Banking have forced the masses into debt slavery
Money as Debt - Debt Slavery

Here's some background on how they do it:
Politics and the Occult, Bohemian Grove, Beginnings of the Round Table Groups, The Rothschilds, Freemasonry, The Georgia Guidestones, and much much more:
Occult Mystery Schools - Illuminati - NWO

New World Order and Interlocking Corporate Directorships - Today's corporations are so interlocked that you must start viewing all American corporations and government bureaucracies as a single entity:
NWO - Interlocking Directorships

Here's the end results:

This is a comprehensive analysis of our current financial crisis:
Modern Economic Crisis

New World Order and the Modern Police State
NWO Today - Police State

Globalism and Empire in the New World Order - How the IMF and World Bank allow modern corporations to enslave the third world:
Globalization - Empire in the NWO

9/11 Truth - A compilation of video clips highlighting the inconsistencies behind the "official" story of the events that occured on September 11, 2001:
9-11 Truth Conspiracy

I say that the world is big enough to let you know nothing

I always thought of, what if the accusations against the masons are wrong, and they are really the good guys. But with what I discovered just today, It's really hard for me now to believe in the explanations of Masons. Something just made them superficial big liars. I hear rumors that Queen Elizabeth ii is somehow associated with the masons. The masons laugh about that rumor and smirk about it saying, that can never happen since it is a fraternity and it is impossible for a women to become a part of it and they don't accept women in the association...almost believed it. but if that is so...then*Snip*?? who is Elizabeth Aldworth???!!! What the *Snip* is she doing in the freemasonry? Don't tell me she's a tranny.LOL

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

I wen to a meeting with the illuminati and let me make a long story short, i was scared for my life and i ran out of that building so fast my shoes came off and i still get creeped out when i drive by the building. I had never seen so much black magic in my life and they were gunna try magic on me untikk i sprinted out of there. never again will i ever ever do something like that. it was like being right next to the devil. I HATED IT.

A Message from The Agency (Updated) A lot has changed since we sent the first message to you. The message has not been broadcasted nearly as much as we would have liked. Nevertheless, it probably worked out for the best, because the message has become largely obsolete, due to the neutralizing of the satellite that we initially warned you about. The satellite is still due to enter the Earth's atmosphere on November 8th, 2010.


It is still utterly urgent that we create a channel of instant contact with as many of you as possible, so that we can disseminate information regarding other future events. Specifically, we have time sensitive information regarding four portals that are located close to the equator. We remind you that once you are aware of the locations of these portals, that you keep away from them until you hear from us. This is one of the primary reasons for why we have created this website, as a communication channel to you.


We are doing our utmost best to provide evidence to you, that we are people "in the know", and we ask that you bare with us as we endeavour to organize displays for you. We are aware that if we do not create grand displays, our message will not reach many people, but we ask you to consider what we are forwarding to you today, from your heart, and not because you saw a spectacle in the sky.

We are sending this message, because we fear that we may not be able to contact you for much longer. We may not be able to provide the evidence that we have endeavoured to provide. In such a case, we can only leave you with these words.

We are concerned that you will not heed our advice, and will not realise that we are genuine , and did truly try to help you, until it's too late and your fate is sealed. Please understand, we are sincerely trying to help you. We are not all powerful. A saying of yours fits very well: "Our hands are tied". Our hands are truly tied. Please receive this message, today, not with your mind and your skepticism, but with your heart and your inner knowing also.

We have warned you that your establishment and their televisions are not to be trusted. We have warned you that what ever you see on your television is not to be regarded as truth. If you want to find out what the establishment lies are, watch your television, and you will gain a great and vast knowledge of confusing lies. If you want to know who is lying, look at your television. If you see a persons lips moving, and it is on your television, that person is, almost assuredly, a liar, or they would not have been granted the access to your mind.


Your televisions are not for entertainment. They were created and installed in your homes so that when these days arrive, you can be directed. We advise that you turn them all off, and forget about them. It is better that you listen to a radio, or read, if you want to keep up with news. What you see on your television is not news.

We also need to you know, and understand, that the same establishment, which is controlled by a mostly non human hierarchy, are working to destroy most of you and enslave many others. But there are things you can do to help yourselves. They keep you now, only because you are being protected. They must live with you, so they control you.

What will they do when that paradigm changes? What will happen to you when that protection ends? What will happen when it is time for you to stand up and demonstrate "your" accomplishments to the rest of the universe, who are all watching? Then you will truly understand the world that you created, and you will fall to your knees. You will fall to your knees, because you created nothing. You have nothing. When you fall to your knees (which is inevitable), who will you look to?


That is why we are trying to help you; to try to give you one last fighting chance, and to remind you that you should not worship your televisions or your establishment. But you want to see flying firecrackers. Twenty three thousand years of development resulted in a populace that wont help themselves, unless they see flying firecrackers?

Do not follow any orders from this hierarchy. If they tell you to tern left, turn right. If they say "this is bad", then it is probably good. If they say "this is good", then it is probably bad. If they tell you that you must come with them, for your safety, do not believe them, because they wish to hurt you. If they tell you they want peace, treat it as a declaration of WAR!

Do not agree to become hidden with your establishment, because that will be the end of you. You must understand. Do not believe their lies. Do not believe in their hoax "alien invasion", which is starting. This is one reason why we must prove that we are who we say we are, otherwise, your establishment will claim to be us, and you (of course) will believe them, simply because you saw a flying firecracker. But be assured, a real "invasion" is coming, soon. It will be the last invasion. An invasion to settle and end all invasions. Will you be caught on your knees?

We have more information regarding portals, but we must wait for the appropriate window of time before we can inform you. The time window will be very narrow, which is why we are trying to create a communication channel through your Internet. We cannot communicate to you though your establishment, or your televisions, or your radios. We cannot personally visit you all. However, your Internet is powerful.

This website will not disappear, unless we decide that it should disappear, or unless the entire Internet is shut down, which may very well happen soon. At that time, you will all go running back to your televisions. We suggest that you do not do that, but instead turn to each other. It is YOU who will save "you", not your televisions. You must love each other, not your televisions. Your establishment certainly wont help you. They will laugh at you. They are laughing now. Do you think they are running and hiding? No, they are so far ahead of you, you should regard it as an eternal embarrassment.

If we contact you through the Internet, and "YOU" decide to "broadcast" that message, there will be no stopping the message, unless the Internet is turned off. We are asking you to broadcast this message. We choose to communicate to you the way we are communicating for many reasons. We are aware of what we are doing, and we want you to understand that there is no better way for us to deliver this message than the way we are doing it now. We know that many of you are saving these messages to your computer. We know that you have the power to broadcast a message if "you choose to do so", even if this website does come down.

What if we make a giant letter "A" (for Agency) in the sky? Will you believe that we are "The Agency", "people in the know", then? Or, will you accuse someone of making a hoax?

If "you" wanted to, this message would be under the nose of practically every human being sitting in front of a computer within 24 hours. We are dismayed by the reality that you need dramatic displays of high technology before you will listen; not to us, but "yourselves". We can create MANY dramatic displays if you wish, but the hard part is proving to you that we, "The Agency" were responsible for those displays. Be assured, many of the displays you have on "YouTube" are caused by allies of The Agency. But we cannot prove that to you.


There is a lot you do not understand about time, timing, and reality, and we simply cannot tell you. You sincerely would not understand anyway. There are things we can and cannot say and divulge. We know that sounds like a "cop out". Trying to communicate with you is truly frustrating.

You are in danger, but we cannot tell you what the dangers are. You must research and learn yourselves. That is the whole point. We are in a "catch 22" situation, as you would put it. If we tell you how you are in danger, the danger will be postponed, or change. If we do not tell you, you will sit in front of your television saying "yes, sir, no sir, three bags full sir" to your televisions and to your establishment. How will you ever wake up? Nevertheless, we have told you everything you need to know.


We read your messages, full with contempt. "We demand PROOF! Show us PROOF!", yet if you look out your window, proof is all around you. It's all around you! Why do you not understand? What is wrong with you? You are a malfunctioning people, full with pride. You know everything, but you know nothing. Your eyes are open like that of an owl, but you are blind. You do not see with your eyes, you perceive with a clouded mind.


We cannot force feed you. We need you to spread this message. We need you to talk with one another and help one another. We need those that are leaders amongst you to help those who are not. Turn those televisions off. Turn that forsaken music off! You are not living in reality. You are living in a prison of the mind. You are dying a slow and horrible death. You have so much potential, but you are drugged and bedridden. You are truly drunk. You look at your establishment technology and you are amazed. You are in awe. We tell you that this technology is garbage. It is rubbish from the depths of darkness. Go outside and notice a butterfly. That is "technology", but you do not see it, because you are blind.

Every living thing on Earth, even things so small that you cannot see them with your eyes are superior technology. If you look through your microscopes, you will see technology that is so amazing that you truly cannot comprehend, so you say: "Ah! Technology invents itself!". Crazy people! Those Black Hawks, we laugh at those plastic toys, just as you would laugh at a paper plane, manufactured from and empty lunch wrapper. It is flying garbage.

Why are you in awe of these distractions? Do you believe you can justify your way of life, because you have flying garbage? Truly, you do not even know how this flying garbage operates. Will you declare that this is the world you created? You cannot even create this garbage. All you can do is watch television. Yet you look at the life around you as if it is worthless. What kind of madness are you suffering from? What will it take for you to wake up? A tsunami? A tornado? An earthquake? Maybe an "alien invasion"? If you see an alien invasion, it will be with plastic toys, and you will be in awe. But if you see your reward, it will not be with toys, and you will be in great danger.

Time is short. Wake up. We may not be able to send another message, but even if we cannot send any more information, you have all the information you need. You want predictions? Here is a prediction: You will understand what we've been trying to say when it is too late. We wont be here to say: "we told you so"; and even if we were, it would be no consolation to us.

Instead of watching your television tonight, please send this message to those that you love. Ask them to consider their direction. Discuss the world situation with them. Forget your television. Forget what your television causes you to see. If you push that aside, what do YOU see? What do you see when you look out your own front door? Do you see a man begging? Or do you see an opportunity to change the world, to prove to the universe, who you are, handed to you on a "silver platter"?

portalreport.webs.com...

The AgencyA Message From the Agency (Original)
====Briefing:

This is an utterly urgent message which we are relying on you to treat extremely seriously. We understand that you will experience the urge to delete what we have posted here, believing it to be fraudulent. However, we will provide evidence of foreknowledge of future events. We will provide unrefutable evidence that we are knowledgable with hidden matters that you know nothing about. ie: Black budget programs.

We emphatically implore you to get this message out for us. Please, spread it far and wide. We understand the viral nature of the Internet, as our team is registered with (and monitors) many of the Internet's alternative media and truth websites. We believe you (on the Internet) have the power to get this message out for us, "if you believe us" (which you must). We will post this message on as many forums as we can today, but we need (and are requesting) your help for the message to continue.

Please understand that if this message doesn't take off, there will be no second chance. We will not have the ability to try again. We repeat: This message must take off. There will be no second chances. We will lose access to the Internet for an unknown period of time in three hours from now and may not be able to access the Internet (properly) until January 2011.

We cannot reveal where we are based as we are in active duty working under an international program that you are not aware exists. For our own safety, and for the safety of our team, we sincerely cannot disclose anything about our service. We understand that this will cause skepticism, but we do have knowledge of two events that will occur by the end of this year, 2010. These events will verify that we are indeed "in the know", and that what we are saying is factual.

====Evidence (of our foreknowledge):

A fireball [will] enter the atmosphere this year. You will not miss it. It will glow green. It will most assuredly be televised on every news network across the globe. This fireball is not a meteor. It is part of a larger plan which will precede further artificial astronomical and atmospheric anomalies. The object has already been launched, and we understand that it cannot be turned back or stopped, which is why we couldn't release this information before today (but now can). We do not know the date of impact with Earth's atmosphere, except that it will be this year. We do know why it was launched, but we cannot fully reveal that information in this message.

If we had written this message before today, the object would not have been launched. But now that the object is on its way, there's no way for it to be turned back. However, it is necessary that the object is launched for reasons that we cannot disclose at this time. The information we are providing to you now is known by many in the scientific, military and black budget communities, and by certain branches of government. Our lives are not at risk by divulging this information, as many people know about it. We are divulging the information because we need to establish credibility (with you). We understand that you require some kind of evidence if you are to believe our message and requests.

When the fireball enters Earth's atmosphere, you must go inside and stay inside for no less than three days. You need three days supply of water, food and any medication you require, in your home. You need to make sure you do not need to leave your home for three days, for any reason. If it is imperative that you leave your secure area, you must stay out of sunlight. This message is for the entire population, world wide. The air will be ok for the most part, but you need to stay inside for reasons we cannot disclose. There's no reason to panic or be alarmed if you simply stay inside. Do NOT go outside for any reason. Do not open your doors. Keep them locked. Close the blinds. Keep a TV or radio on.

Once this event passes, you will know that you can take what we are saying now, seriously:

====The Event:

Within 12 months of the green meteor, four large portals will open in places equally separated across the globe. We do not know the exact dates that they will open. It might be right after the meteor. It might be after 12 months. We do not know the exact locations of all of them, except that they will be close to the equator. These are not fake portals (ie: conspiratorial illusions). They are previously extinct, natural portals. There will be a lot of anomalies around these portals once they're opened, so you will know where these portals are at that time.

They will not be overtly reported by news networks (as portals). Those that live within 100 miles of each portal will know about them, because activityy will be visible around the portals. However, populations will be moved away from these areas due to manufactured disasters created by agencies who want to secure these portals for themselves, try to keep them secret, and use them for their own purposes. They will move populations away from these areas at all costs. We are with an agency that is working to ensure that these portals are not hijacked, but we can't secure them until we know exactly where they all are.

What we need you to do is stay away from these portals, because at the time we secure the portals, it will not be safe to be near them due to conflict. Also, certain organizations will stop at nothing to keep the portals secret. We can't tell you where they are (because we don't know yet, precisely), except that those living near them will see them (and will be relocated), and that's how the locations will become apparent. You need to use the Internet to find and spread information about the locations. Once you know where they are, please stay away from them so that we can secure the portals. You must stay away from these portals. They are not inherently dangerous (themselves), and the activity around them will not be inherently dangerous, but a time will come when they will "attract" danger. We do not know exactly when that will be, so it's best to keep away from the portals.

Recap: Keep an eye out for populations being moved (there are 4 locations). Once you know where these areas are, post the information to the Internet along with the message that people need to keep away from these areas (for a radius of 100 miles). Do not go to these areas, because once conflict starts, it will be extremely unsafe and we cannot ensure anyone's safety. Nevertheless, we must secure the portals.

portalreport.webs.com...

Signed,

"The Agency"