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The ATS Issues Thread

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posted on May, 18 2008 @ 12:47 AM
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I got banned for responding to a thread entitled "Cointelpro at ATS?" by the duckster.

I was asking questions about possible theories and possible reasons for the recent surge in "anti-ATS"-isms.

They took this as "sock puppet dissenting" when really I had questions of my own since an incident that happened a while back which I hadn't even thought about until a few people alerted me to recent bannings and John Lear's side of that whole episode with him.

That's fine if they want to control this site because it is theirs, but you forget who's paying the operation of the site.... the advertisers, yes... are paying for advertising time on this site... but there would be no revenue for the advertisers, and thus ATS, if it were not for the members and the members feeling that this was a good place to discuss these great topics.

So the members DO have the right to complain, because the owners of this site hopefully encourage open discussion about any type of conspiracy, even ones about ATS itself. As one mod said "This IS a conspiracy site".

Now... to go ahead and bash staff for no reason, or for reasons that could be handled in an adult-like manner, NO. BUT If the staff feel insecure about the honest and open discussion musings of "ATS COINTELPRO" conspiracies enough to ban people because it threatens their image or their pride, while we're at it, let's ban all dissenters of the US gov't which allows free enterprise and sites like this to exist, let's go ahead and ban everyone who says that the economy is just a control mechanism to keep our minds and our actions occupied with pointless endeavors, let's ban EVERYONE who questions the status quo that is harboring this business's existence.

I mean... you can't not discuss things just because someone is letting you be to an extent. This is what America was supposed to be about, freedom of speech, and that right is disappearing at an alarming rate. It's all because of money and the hope of economic success, and we're all guilty of bowing down to it.

The dangers of corporatism is why these things are being questioned. I certainly don't mean to hurt anyone's genuine feelings, and I'm truly sorry if I have... but you've gotta understand that, in America, all you have to do is look away if you don't like something. Business or otherwise, we're still holding these truths to be self evident.

They have the right, but there's also moral responsibility.

Imagine if you were defending Monsanto's right to do whatever they pleased and we just had to accept it. That's a completely different ballpark, but you get the picture, don't you?

A business about denying ignorance should do just that, or else it is false advertising, and therefore illegal.

I'm not accusing anyone of anything, other than someone has lied about me in relation to this site, and the staff should know if a staff member is lying... because if this is all innocent, we as their associates in business (in a way) need to inform them of corruption and/or faulty judgement and mistakes that have been made.

A mistake has been made. I'm not complaining about being banned. I'm informing the staff that I was banned, and then someone went and told people that I wasn't.

I just want to thank the staff ahead of time for hopefully clearing this whole misunderstanding up.



[edit on 18-5-2008 by dunwichwitch]




posted on May, 18 2008 @ 12:48 AM
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Originally posted by seagull
reply to post by dunwichwitch
 


You hint that there is some sort of anti-whomever agenda on ats, yet you provide no proof (big shock, that), only veiled and vague accusations. You defended ATS on "another" site you say? Proud of ya.

As many have said, including myself, in one form or another...it's their sandbox...their rules...get over yourself.




I was providing an example of accusations made in the past by different folks.

I don't know whether that is true or not. So.... please don't think I was saying that as an accusation.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 12:51 AM
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Well thank you for posting why you got banned and your response to my post. So now, about your story, where are the links of an ATS staff lying about why you got banned on the other site you were on?

What was your name, the name that got banned here on ATS so we can all look at your posts under this name and judge for ourselves?



[edit on 18-5-2008 by LateApexer313]



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 12:57 AM
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Sure.... my name was indierockalien.

I can't post any links to that other site without staff permission, or else I violate the TandC, unfortunately.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:05 AM
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Also.... (you will say conveniently enough... eh) apparently I was never "officially" labeled as banned.

This is why I would've said it was the servers malfunctioning, but it just so happened to coincide with my posting at the thread "Cointelpro at ATS?" authored by the duckster.

Somebody's feelings must have been really hurt, or they misunderstood my intentions, because wham there I went shortly afterword. Followed a day or two later by three consecutive days of IP ban.

I'm on here daily. I post daily, usually. Apparently, I also posted a couple days after I was post banned, as well. That strikes me as odd, also.


Just look at my posting record. I have been absent for quite a few days as indierock. I had a neat avatar and a bunch of points. Why would I wanna start a new name just to bash this site? I wasn't gunna say anything more about this, until a staff member lied on the other forum. Was it all a misunderstanding? I really hope so. I'm holding out so much hope, it floats.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:12 AM
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Originally posted by dunwichwitch
Apparently, I also posted a couple days after I was post banned, as well. That strikes me as odd, also.


I could've gotten my dates mixed up here. I'd have to be shown the post in question there to be sure. May 11th was the date in question, if a staff member could be so kind as to look the posts up from then.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:14 AM
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Originally posted by dunwichwitch
I got banned for responding to a thread entitled "Cointelpro at ATS?" by the duckster.

I was asking questions about possible theories and possible reasons for the recent surge in "anti-ATS"-isms.

They took this as "sock puppet dissenting" when really I had questions of my own since an incident that happened a while back which I hadn't even thought about until a few people alerted me to recent bannings and John Lear's side of that whole episode with him.


I don't believe this explanation for a moment, sorry. You were just asking questions huh...well, what was the name you used that got banned? Are you TheDuckster? Is that the thrust here? You're TheDuckster and made another name to do exactly that, "sock puppet?"


So the members DO have the right to complain, because the owners of this site hopefully encourage open discussion about any type of conspiracy, even ones about ATS itself. As one mod said "This IS a conspiracy site".


I never said the members had no right to complain. I am just questioning why they whine and complain so much, and actually, for a site this huge, I am struck by how it's a very small group, with their OWN agenda, that feel the need to constantly stir the pot, to constantly attack the owners, the mods and continuously state the same garbage over and over...without ONE SHRED of evidence to back up their claims, in fact, it seems to be the small few that get banned, who come back and make new names, that rail against ATS, over...and over...and over.


Now... to go ahead and bash staff for no reason, or for reasons that could be handled in an adult-like manner, NO. BUT If the staff feel insecure about the honest and open discussion musings of "ATS COINTELPRO" conspiracies enough to ban people because it threatens their image or their pride...


And here again, you are doing JUST that, you are bashing the staff, for NO reason that you'd care to document... I ask ONCE AGAIN...where's your proof?? Where are the links??? Where is the copy of e-mails? U2U's?? You claim a moderator badmouthed you and lied about why you got banned...you produce no proof...


The dangers of corporatism is why these things are being questioned. I certainly don't mean to hurt anyone's genuine feelings, and I'm truly sorry if I have... but you've gotta understand that, in America, all you have to do is look away if you don't like something. Business or otherwise, we're still holding these truths to be self evident.


What does this have to do with a staff member here on ATS badmouthing you and lying about why you got banned, and about you being banned for just asking questions??


A business about denying ignorance should do just that, or else it is false advertising, and therefore illegal.


If that were illegal, then every single product manufacturer advertised on TV or the net would be in jail.


I'm not accusing anyone of anything, other than someone has lied about me in relation to this site, and the staff should know if a staff member is lying... because if this is all innocent, we as their associates in business (in a way) need to inform them of corruption and/or faulty judgement and mistakes that have been made.


PROOF ...produce the proof or quit whining.




[edit on 18-5-2008 by dunwichwitch]



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:14 AM
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reply to post by dunwichwitch
 


Yeah, they do have a sort of "silent ban" function, where your account doesn't officially say "Banned" but you get locked out of it, IP banned for a few days, and then allowed to come back under a new name.

Sort of a slap in the face to people who are basically good members, but who go a little overboard and start violating the T&C etc



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:16 AM
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reply to post by dunwichwitch
 


People post links to sites from all over the net, every 5 minutes. Give me a break. If you can't or won't post the link, U2U the link to me, thanks.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:22 AM
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reply to post by LateApexer313
 


The link to that particular site is filtered by ats management so he cant post it.


edit to add, or u2u it, others were banned for sending the link via u2u.


[edit on 18-5-2008 by sinema]



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:28 AM
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Ahhhh I see it all clearly now....

I just found you as your "old" name "indierockalien" and low and behold...
here's a copy and paste of the comments on your profile section:

Comment from: biggie smalls on: 17-5-2008 @ 11:44 PM
You're banned? Sucks dude.
Comment from: indierockalien on: 11-5-2008 @ 11:29 AM
Good italicized use of the word SPIRAL in your post responding to "reality: the grand illusion"

I'm u2u banned right now, but have a fractally spectacular day.
Comment from: goosdawg on: 20-4-2008 @ 02:13 AM
Kewl! Check your email about eight hours from now....must sleep...
Comment from: goosdawg on: 19-4-2008 @ 07:20 PM
We've got some friends in common, give me a shout

Goosdawg got banned and did the same thing as you're doing now, stirring up drama....going to another site, badmouthing ATS...in fact he actually ranted on Twitter in the ATS members section of Twitter, ranting and raving basically about the same things you are here...

Posting that other site over and over...trying to "recruit" members of ATS to go to some other site, being obnoxious, immature, rude etc. For 2 days this went on until I blocked him in Twitter, for all I know he's still going on and on.

How convenient he's on your banned name's profile...

When oh when will you people that get banned, just move on, and accept responsibility for your actions that got you banned from here and grow up?

I have said my piece here...and I really wish people like you would move on if you don't like it here and quit this ridiculous campaign against ATS.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:33 AM
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I started laughing, man... LateApexer... Do YOU have your own agenda? Or are you tying to get me banned again? Cuz I can't do what you are asking me to do, man. TandC states that links to.... and this is the confusing part... "competition" are forbade and are terms for banning.

I am indierockalien, not the duckster. Wow I've never been accused of being someone else, sans the times I was accused of being my doppleganger.

Anyway... I am not accusing anyone of anything. You are most definitely putting words in my mouth.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:45 AM
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reply to post by dunwichwitch
 


LOL nope, I just have hard time with people that bash this site, its staff and owners ENDLESSLY, I have no agenda, except to speak my mind. I am sorry I didn't know that it was against the rules to do what I asked you to do, I have no agenda like wanting to get you banned again, I am sure you shall do that on your own.

I just really wanted to understand all the drama, and I want the truth, that's all, and you keep claiming that a member of the ATS staff lied on another site about why you got banned...I simply wanted to view this for myself is all.

Actually, I am amazed I am the only one challenging you tonight, that shocks me actually...so I will bow out of this thread since I have no "dog in this fight" so to speak, you will or won't survive in your new name after getting your old one banned, and once again, IMO you will have no one to blame but yourself.

So have a good evening, continue using this site and it's resources, free of charge and continue to whine and badmouth the staff as you see fit. :-)



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:47 AM
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Originally posted by sinema

The link to that particular site is filtered by ats management so he cant post it.
edit to add, or u2u it, others were banned for sending the link via u2u.


Interesting... as that would imply that they monitor U2U's then?

Funny I have noticed on occasion my U2U's not being highlighted when I have not read them... thought it was a 'glitch'

How do you know they got banned from posting that site in U2U?

[edit on 18-5-2008 by zorgon]



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 01:48 AM
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goos invited me over there in a way that wouldn't violate TandC, and I had no idea why he was inviting me over there... but yes I went over there, and there was some interesting material about ATS that I took into consideration because I have had experiences of being censored in the past, and I liked how I was able to read two sides of the john lear story, and I definitely considered it a grave possibility, some of the things they were saying over there. That isn't wrong, nor is it wrong to bring concerns over something I have read to the attention of people. Happens all the time on this site. People read something, they bring it to the table, and there's discussion about it.

I like both sites. I would like to stay at both without problems. There are problems, though, when I bring material from the other site over here and go "here's an interesting spin, whaattya think???" and I get censored and banned for it. Earthfiles gets brought here all the time. Many many conspiracy sites get quoted here... yet only a select few sites with two sides to an ATS-related stories gets put on the blacklist.

and then not only that, but I have people lying about me being banned and stuff. It is very concerning to me, at a site dealing with denying ignorance, that lies are being told to people.

Lies that don't have to be told because I had been changing my mind about ATS anyway, and then this stuff happened, and I had to face the possibilities of some of that stuff I had brought to the table agan.

I personally thought goos was gunna tell me about some ETs that maybe we'd both seen.

I am being honest and truthful. I gave you my old name in order to go snoop around.

Why was I post banned? because I told someone about the other site, because I'd been defending John Lear, and made no ill mannered anythings, no accusations, and yet my posts were being deleted. I was mad!

I stated that I know why I was post banned, and that is why.

Honesty. What else you wanna know?

[edit on 18-5-2008 by dunwichwitch]



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 02:03 AM
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Lateapexer... what I can honestly and for surely say about all the drama and stuff... is that I just don't know... but I am definitely getting rubbed the wrong way by some actions that have been taken abroad on this site.

It REALLY got started when i realized that there was a secret forum. I voiced my concerns about the secret forum, just as an innocent thought I had... and I think that I was warned, and my thread was closed because of that.

There was some stuff before that, where I'd post a thread like a few times in a row, and there was never any record that I had posted it at all. There were a couple of threads (these were all about the same subject) that were posted, got lost in the backpages instantaneously, and then when I went to look at all my threads, only two actually survived on record.

I had attributed that to some sort of server error for a while... and after my issue with RATS, I figured they were right, and I really had no need for a secret forum anyway... but after the whole defending john lear thing.... I had to entertain the idea and lay it out to people, and ducky's cointelpro thread came along and it was perfect. Ducky was approached because of that thread, i think on twitter (not sure) but apparently was too afraid to join because she feared banning from this site. I feared it, but said "ah they won't do that"...

Then I got banned...and then ducky got banned... they say she didn't, but they say I didn't either. I just don't know what to believe anymore. That is where I am at. I tend to trust someone who says "Go ahead, talk trash, go wherever you want, have a good time" over someone reprimanding me for silly things and such, and telling me what I can and can't do... and lying and confusing people into feeling like a dope.

I dunno what it is that is going on, but I'm getting rubbed the wrong way, and that's hard to do with me, man.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 02:09 AM
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Interesting... as that would imply that they monitor U2U's then?


I'm not sure if you're familiar with forum software or not but the simple fact is we do not need to "monitor" u2us to set a filter up that blocks a url from being sent.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 02:20 AM
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reply to post by dunwichwitch
 




I can't post any links to that other site without staff permission, or else I violate the TandC, unfortunately.


Your already violating the TandC by posting under a new name after being banned so why stop now?

CT



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 02:56 AM
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I am posting under a new name because I got unfairly banned, and the staff has allowed me back, after informing me that I HAD been banned.

Now someone is saying I haven't been banned at another site, and I have an issue because that someone is related to ATS. Therefore it's an ATS issue.

I didn't send any url's by the way. I said the name of the site with no url, and I was u2u banned about a week and a half after sending the actual u2u in question.



posted on May, 18 2008 @ 06:06 AM
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reply to post by dunwichwitch
 




I am posting under a new name because I got unfairly banned


Says you.



the staff has allowed me back, after informing me that I HAD been banned.


Gracious of them. I wouldn't have.



Now someone is saying I haven't been banned at another site, and I have an issue because that someone is related to ATS. Therefore it's an ATS issue.


Well I think its an issue that should be addressed at the other site. Whats the point of responding to points here at ATS when they were made in another forum altogether?

We dont care what someone else is saying at another site. If we did we would be posting over there.

CT



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