Originally posted by Nohup

Originally posted by Bigwhammy
Actually science has proven the existence of God. People are just in denial. The discovery of the Big Bang pretty much laid it to rest based on this piece of logic...

Wrong as usual, Bigwhammy. The notion of linear time is as old and stale as those little models of atoms with the electrons spinning around like tiny planets. And without linear time, with space and time bubbling back and forth through multiple dimensions, there's no need to point to a specific point at which the universe suddenly "began." And that leaves your Big Grandpa in the Sky without a job.

Here is another post I do not understand.

Why do you assume god is an old man in the sky.

If god exists, I'm pretty sure we don't understand 00000.1% of what god is.

If you don't know the answer to the most complicated mathematical sum.

Why do you think you know the answer to god, something more complicated than imaginable.

Be open minded about the "idea" of god, not what you've heard about god.

What is god? THAT is what science needs to figure out.


[edit on 6-5-2008 by _Phoenix_]

Originally posted by Nohup
Science would first have to define "God" good enough to set up a test for its existence. And since that's impossible, it's unlikely science will discover "proof of God" or anything like it any time soon.

Well ! I am talking about the God who created the Universe and Created us, and i don't think except monotheism religions there is any other religion that had clearly and specifically defined God, well i am Muslim so i am really stunned to see why are our Christians buddies are so confused about God's features and i figured it's because of the distortion in Bible..

I am getting more and more convinced as a Muslim about the existence of God as Science is making discoveries... Like i had belief that this world would cease to exist like our religion teaches us, and Science has literally proved that, i had a belief we are not eternal, we had a beginning and science proved it as well,

i don't see it as the failure of God not to convince 'some' of the folks about his existence i rather see it as a failure of science which has not made such 'discoveries' yet.. and if you look over the period of time, Science always has made 'unbelievable' or contrary to humans belief discoveries so no wonder if it makes another discovery and change the way we think about ourselves and the universe!!!

Originally posted by LOYAL
Somehow i am tempted to believe that sometime in the future most of the mainstream scientists would be convinced that ' God ' exists. How would it have impact on someone's life esp., to the ones who don't believe in God or not so believer in God.

This is an excellent question, how will it affect normal people's lives. In my opinion it won't change at all, as you can read in this thread, they hate the idea of such being. I bet that if it happens, their will be an uprise against it, just like the uprise against science by some religiouse sects.

Originally posted by _Phoenix_
Asalam aleikum.

I think it says in the quran? that it is impossible to imagine what god looks like?
Or did I hear that somewhere else?

walikum salam.

Yes! very well said, it's impossible to imagine God, however it's not impossible to realize the existence of God, God might have not told everything about everything what does it look like or other things in religious scriptures like Bible and Quran, However God has told enough in my opinion in religious scripture that can convince one about his existence... and infact too many people are already convinced... !!!!

[edit on 6-5-2008 by LOYAL]

I was never interested in science until I became a Christian and began to do things besides 'have a good time'.
I found God FOR REAL at 23 years old.
I had prayed LOTS before that, but, He still seemed far away.
When I asked him for forgiveness and told Him that I believed His Son died for me, I was TRANSFORMED! Changed into an innocent, happy woman!

What I think is, nature works always predictably.

So God must be like that.

We don't do so well in that department our inventions break down or cause problems.

I figure things are going to get to the point where the # hits the fan and then whoever is left over alive will tell us what God is like.

Survivors will fit in to God's plan that works out so they'll know what to say.

That just makes sense to me.

God is real, add another 'o' to the structure of the word and you have Good, the "Ah" in God is as of "Ohm".

In an alternate dimension, we would all be pawns of evil corruption, in another dimension we would already be on the light side and peaceful.

We are in a tetertotering globe with much Demonic presence, but there are those of us who strive for change, and those are the ones that are workers of the light, and of God, and there is the workers of the Demons, however, the Demons time is coming to an end.

God is real what do you think etherical energy is and sub atomic particles being harnessed into the flow of our dimensional cavern, we are highly inept to the truth.

Do some research on other people besides "Jesus", do some research on "Dionysus", look at how many miracle workers were born December 21-25th. Not many people here have any anthrapological science on their belts. More like.

You die and you die.

No. We are reincarnated. Period, I know this from factual statements of when I was 3 years old. I died in World War 2 my last life, and I am here again, with no better of a life -- And it doesn't bother me, either.

Find your damn point already. God is or isn't real whatever you want to believe this is all make believe we know less about this damn universe than we do know, so all of your points stratus no meaning to me, I'm beyond the box and I research paranormal activities. Go Google videosearch Mind Over Matter and Pyschokinetic Telekenisis.

Do you think Buddhist monks just sit around and do nothing with their lives? Finding the purity and silence is what we should all figure out how to do.

Originally posted by LOYAL

I just wanted you to assume, given that Science confirms existence of God what would you do? What possible change that can bring to one's life?

For me, personally, it would cause a disgust that would never go away. If it was proven scientifically, and without any doubt at all that god did exist, I would look at all the poverty, death, disasters, cruelty, evil and suffering that engulfs this planet w live on, and be disgusted that the so called 'creator' - the being that has supposed unconditional live for his 'children' - would let it happen and do nothing.

Much like parents who let their child starve, or see their child playing with dangerous things and getting severely hurt, I would expect those parents to be charged with child neglect, if not child abuse, and have the child removed from such a detrimental environment.

Near 15,000 dead in Burma? Where is god.

There is far too much evidence to prove to me god does not exist, or that if there is a god, it surely is nothing to worship or pray to, but despise.


[edit on 6-5-2008 by bloodcircle]

Did you notice your complete lack of stars & flags?
This subject matter is divisive and requires the judicious examination of ones own prejudices and teachings. BELIEF in a Supreme being barring EMPIRICAL data is a matter of upbringing , teaching or indoctrination.
Look at the world we inhabit today and how religion does not seek to unify but to divide..The Christian from the Muslim the Muslim from the Jew, the Jew from the Hindu and so on and so on.
This multiplicity of deity's to worship mirrors the multiple ethnic cultures the world over. On a philosophical level I look out into the observable multi-verse I see such variety of stars and planets that I must concede that diversity is indeed the natural order of all things. I personally believe in a balance an equilibrium of all things Good Evil Light Darkness..Good=God & Evil=Satan
Salvation from Sin= Jesus. Now some of you will say God is an invisible friend for grown ups , a paradigm that if it did not exist we would have to invent.
Skeptics laugh and ask for proof of the unprovable seeking solace in prosaic answers because at least they can explain and understand. This may comfort them but for some of us we take comfort in the mysterious and inexpressible the miracle moment, choosing ? to believe in the tradition we were brought into or chose for ourselves later on in life.
I keep returning to BALANCE it exists at the Quantum level, and all the way through our plane of existence. We need a supreme deity to believe in ;our complex world presents problems which we ourselves created and yet have no viable solutions for. Without a supreme being there is little reason to hope that the triumph of logic ,science and reason will reassert itself as the dominant force for solving the worlds many problems. (This does not mean we should not try) It just means that all we know has brought us to the current state of affairs which quite frankly means another approach may have brought us to more equitable results. If beauty were truth and truth beauty what a different world we would all inhabit, its not but thats the world we pretend to promote. Truth is we live in a greed based society driven by rampant consumerism and corporate mass marketing. Spiritual and Religious
beliefs are co-opted as a Political convenience and used as they always have been as a means of social control. God, Holy Spirit, Jesus, Mary, Allah, Mohamed , the name really does not matter its how we choose to represent our beliefs that matter. Blowing up men women & children to receive 72 virgins in paradise is not something that my Lord & Saviour will condone.
(A B-2 over Baghdad differs in its intent) Its Ok for us to Bomb then? No
God exists in my paradigm, and therefore his son also, which leads me to salvation and the expiation of sin. God is like Schroedingers Cat...If you believe in HIM he is ..and if you don't he does not..and ultimately in this country your free to choose or change your mind at any time. For Me God is Was and Ever Shall Be.

Originally posted by bloodcircle

Originally posted by LOYAL

I just wanted you to assume, given that Science confirms existence of God what would you do? What possible change that can bring to one's life?

For me, personally, it would cause a disgust that would never go away. If it was proven scientifically, and without any doubt at all that god did exist, I would look at all the poverty, death, disasters, cruelty, evil and suffering that engulfs this planet w live on, and be disgusted that the so called 'creator' - the being that has supposed unconditional live for his 'children' - would let it happen and do nothing.

Much like parents who let their child starve, or see their child playing with dangerous things and getting severely hurt, I would expect those parents to be charged with child neglect, if not child abuse, and have the child removed from such a detrimental environment.

Near 15,000 dead in Burma? Where is god.

There is far too much evidence to prove to me god does not exist, or that if there is a god, it surely is nothing to worship or pray to, but despise.


[edit on 6-5-2008 by bloodcircle]

That's emotional judgement which has no bases. Don't get your emotions interfere with your judgements because if you do some people using emotion can as easily reject science.

Emotional arguments are not accepted in the 21st century it's only used as propaganda purposes. Think about it, FOX news is an example.

Originally posted by Ownification
That's emotional judgement which has no bases. Don't get your emotions interfere with your judgements because if you do some people using emotion can as easily reject science.

Emotional arguments are not accepted in the 21st century it's only used as propaganda purposes. Think about it, FOX news is an example.

It is emotional judgement because belief is emotional and in terms converting belief to fact, you don't get to ignore your emotions.

If you suddenly found out, after years of emotional distress, that your parents routinely left you with a neighbor who beat you, abused you and put you in danger, how would you react? Without emotion?

I don't see your reply caters to the OP's question about 'how you would change' if you found out god did exist, at any rate.

My point is that *IF* god were proven to exist, I would not suddenly be a believer in that this *god* was a being worthy of worship.

I would come to the conclusion that it is far from worthy of worship; infact if it were found to have planted the seeds of faith into the minds of humans throughout the ages via various prophets, then I say it would be guilty of inciting religious wars and persecution of millions of innocent people throughout the the ages.