Originally posted by azzllin
The only problem i have is a lot of you wont let it drop, if he wants to rant them let him do it, we are allowed to rant when we want to [...] John Lear had his rights and to be honest i cant blame him for flying off the handle because some members went out IMO and deliberately tried to provoke him into going off the deep end.

Yes, John Lear (and everyone else) has the right to rant all he wants, but he doesn't have to right to (knowingly) spread lies.

In the video, he acts like he always knew ATS was being run by the CIA or whoever, and that he got banned from ATS for posting the real secret stuff. Give me a break! That's not ranting, that's spreading lies!

I know a lot of people like John Lear simply for the kind of man he (apparently) is and/or the stories he told/tells. I too enjoyed many of his participations here on ATS and ATSMIX, but that doesn't mean just because we like someone or their stories they are exempt from the rules and most especially from ATS ideology and standards.

In someway I kind of understand why some people would have a different standard for judging John's stories and theories and everyone else's, but they shouldn't. Deny Ignorance, remember? No one is exempted.

Stop excusing the things John Lear said/says with his personality or how funny and enjoyable his stories were/are.

In regards to this episode, John Lear is spreading lies, period. There's no other way around it. It's time to stop excusing and judging the things he say using double standards.

Originally posted by weedwhacker
His yarns are wide....but the only lie I know he spins, is the one I refer to up above, about the 'Simulator Test'

Even if you for some reason believe or have doubts if ATS has been infiltrated or being run by CIA/NSA/etc he claims that he was banned for posting the real secret stuff, and we all know better!

Like I said in my first post, I always had my suspicions, but from witnessing this in first hand and seeing how much John Lear distorted this whole thing, and is out right lying about his reasons for leaving ATS, when thinking in retrospect the things he has been associated with and has claimed, I'm inclined to believe that he is some sort of disinformation agent.

That of course is my opinion, but there's one thing that is a fact: he is lying about ATS and why he got banned.

He didnt actually state that as solid proven "fact", the way he said it was as though it was his theory - he put a reason on what happened. The way i see it, was some dodgy communication, the way we get the events from both JRitzman and Springer leads to the conclusion that it was just that, nothing more.

But the way John interpreted it was that they were out to get him, for posting his "juicy stuff" - which was almost the most ridiculed because it was pretty nuts (fair enough).

So I wouldnt say he was LYING, just because you say something that isnt true doesnt mean youre lying! You have to know youre not telling the truth for it to be a lie...

Stop excusing the things John Lear said/says with his personality or how funny and enjoyable his stories were/are.

In regards to this episode, John Lear is spreading lies, period. There's no other way around it. It's time to stop excusing and judging the things he say using double standards.


Im not excusing anything, what i am doing is trying to point out that the site is well maintained by Moderators and the owners together, i rely on that to be informed when something is fake or false, i dont really need members to tell me when something is silly, ever heard the phrase regarding well i can only use it regarding soccer, the phrase goes 22 players on the field and 40,000 referees, everyone in the crowd thinks they are right, thats why we have 1 referee on the pitch, the mods and the owners are good enough for me, it doesn't really help having the other 40,000 referees screaming foul because it does not fit in with their ideals, because somebody does not like John Lear or his threads does not give them the right to go in all of his threads and make a post on their own personal feelings for the fella if somebody dislikes someone its normal to stay away from them.

as for the video i have no interest in it as im not a fan of project Camelot period, and listening to more of their interviews just clouds my mind, and my own theories.



[edit on 5/5/2008 by azzllin]

Originally posted by h3akalee
Toot Toot TOOOOOOT.

That's the sound of Mr Lear blowing his own trumpet.

Take care.

Regards
Lee



[edit on 4-5-2008 by h3akalee]

Still, his trumpet sounds a lot better that most. It is still a messy part of ATS history IMO. I am of course a short term wittness yet.

And there is at least one problem with this website, but I do NOT know the cause. After visiting ATS in the first half year of my membership my router got bombarded with data packages from all over the world the minute a visited this website. And the ones (ip's) that came out of the US I was unable to identify (companyname withholded). Could be my paranoia, but still, it happened. It seems that you visitor's are screened, but I do not by who exactly.

[edit on 5-5-2008 by Pjotr]

Originally posted by downtown436 John Lear has some theories that I know to be true.

Ummm would you be so kind as to elaborate on this? like ermmm WHICH ONES? for starters?

You can U2U me if your shy but I could use some new source material

Originally posted by dawa
So I wouldnt say he was LYING, just because you say something that isnt true doesnt mean youre lying! You have to know youre not telling the truth for it to be a lie...

He says he was banned for posting the really secret stuff. This whole thing started because of a discussion of the Billy Meier photos and hoax. Billy Meier! What does that have to do with "really secret stuff"?

If you honestly believe that's how John Lear interpreted as the reason for his ban, you are underestimating his intelligence. Having said that, he knows why he was banned and for some reason chose to say something else and insinuate that ATS is in cahoots with the intelligence community.

What is it that they say? "Admit nothing, deny everything and make counter-accusations".

I am really saddened by all this.

I like John Lear and believe he has so much to offer, I also like JR and DB and believe they also have much to offer.

I understand when disagreeing names that aren't all that nice are used like, stupid, moron, idiot and this has to stop these are belittling and for adults there is just no excuse.

It is shameful for ATS to lose so many good people over something like this. Everyone needs tostep back and think, how could this happen?

I believe JR and he also has a right to defend himself just as John does. This in some way has to be solved and I think the Amigo's have to go back and take a long hard look.

Stop and think it will come to you how to solve this, at least I hope you come to a conclusion for everyones sake.


[edit on 5-5-2008 by observe50]

Being new to the site im feeling a bit out of place with you all going on about something i know nothing about.So i will not make any comments on the whole petty squabling thing.With that aside i thought it was a very interesting interview and very informative weather he's right or wrong.

Thanks John

I have already said this many times

It really makes me sick watching people here talk rubbish about John, it is easy I guess since he can`t respond (I don`t want any moderator or member telling me he can again).

From the video it seems to me that John has good memories of ATS and that he enjoyed his discussions here, it was the interviewer who mentioned the CIA stuff.

I consider John a friend, I admired him for all the hours he put into responding all kinds of posts here and I understand the way he feels. I remember a certain post "gang" that followed him around the different sections trying to ridicule him, and discredit him, never did I see a bad reaction from him, with a refined sense of humor he was able to defend his ideas.

Although it bothered me, it kind of made sense that some people here were allowed to attack him all the time, sometimes personally, after all I thought, the moderators and owners must remain neutral and not take sides.

Now I`m not so sure.

Under the guise of moderation I have seen conversations disrupted and deflected or outright banned. SO..that said I lurk more and post less..and watch the enemy from the sidelines. The truth is all ready out there whether or not you have the courage to believe it or the skills to wade through the lies and misinformation. The pieces of puzzle will go together in a lot of ways but only one will give you the picture that mirrors reality.

Hello All

Fact! JL was banned - post banned or not, he was banned. WE have since covered this in another on going thread so fair enough.

Pretend member! Come on, and dont even go there. I could be a pretend member, someone to provoke things. I dont mean to upset but I get angry and ATS is a free opinion site so I should be able to say my piece. I know one or two brown nose types dont like my way thats tough. I dont have a belief yet I,m still learning.

Oh yes. If you can, and I think you can! Check my U2U stuff I had a thread ban on one of my threads and suddenly its not banned and, hey, hey presto its suddenly available to see again. Thats since my admitted rant ( allowed ) last night!

So! Tell me me that some body that mods are not changing things.

I know i come accross as an a-hole angry person. I,m not. I just say out loud what I think, got a problem with that tough, horse!

Hope ive covered most of your questions

Pierre

I think this whole scenario is nothing but a set-up. Or more specifically, a publicity stunt.

Each party, ATS and J.L are accusing each other, directly or indirectly of being CIA gov't dis-information agents.
ATS, by not banning those who call J.L. that but then having mods
here coming down on members who imply or accuse ATS as being backed by it is a dead give away. Lol.

What's going on here is a farce. Trust me.

Originally posted by wang_ke
I think this whole scenario is nothing but a set-up. Or more specifically, a publicity stunt.

Each party, ATS and J.L are accusing each other, directly or indirectly of being CIA gov't dis-information agents.
ATS, by not banning those who call J.L. that but then having mods
here coming down on members who imply or accuse ATS as being backed by it is a dead give away. Lol.

What's going on here is a farce. Trust me.

ATS mmmmm i,m losing my belief in ats. I,m waiting for a reply to another thread about this so called site where are you mods!

---

---