Shards of the Illuminati, page 3

reply to post by Illahee

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The White Eagle Trust; interesting. I had not heard of them. More in depth studying would need to be done before i could make an accurate judgment. That said, they seem to attempt to amalgamate Christianity and Buddhism; many within our order would not "approve" of that, therefore i would say we would be indifferent to them either way. They do seem to have an interesting background though. Thank you for the post, i will do some more research into them regardless.

- Maban

reply to post by Anonymous Avatar

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Do you have any allies? Are there any organizations secret or not that you work with or help each other?

Honestly besides our fellow Shards, no. This has been a sore issue with many Illuminons; a combination of necessity and mistrust envelops this issue. Small partnerships for specific operations have gone sour in the past, reinforcing the mentality of independence. Many Remnants do work with each other. In most part we have "insider' Illuminons in key locations to provide intelligence and safeguards.

- Maban

reply to post by cornixman

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Just a quick question for you, what are your impressions of Leo Zagami? Is he a real Illuminati whistle blower or a fraud?

He certainly holds many "true" facts. Although, his lack of "distinction" between Shards and Remnants leads me to the conclusion that he is either a Remnant propagandist or someone shouting to the world incomplete facts and some sophistry. Either way I'd say take his cries of "wolf" with a grain of salt as any. He may be, he may be not; unfortunately there is no "black or white" clear cut definition. There are many "individuals" who try to play both sides of the fence (secretly) so it is always hard to say. My first inkling is he managed to collect enough facts to make a good argument but is missing the critical elements to totally convince me. I would say if he where unmistakably (to us) a proponent of a Remnant, action would have already been taken.

- Maban

reply to post by MITCHEL

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Originally posted by MITCHEL
reply to post by Maban

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...

You are left with a choice: either let the collapse happen under the weight of corruption, or take proactive action to cause a controlled collapse. Either option is unwieldy, but spending all your precious time and resources on damage control means the world controls you instead of you controlling the world and taking it in a direction toward the peace and happiness you refer to.

...

Your ‘dark brothers’ consider peace and happiness undesirable because it is stagnant. This begs the question: does dysfunction, dependence and suffering progress toward something which is genuinely redeemable? If it is redeemable, is it only redeemable for the purpose of evil? Or, is it all pointless madness and dysfunctional stagnation? I do not see a problem with functional stagnation. I only see a problem with dysfunctional stagnation. Constant warfare is dysfunctional stagnation.

Firstly, "controlling the world.. and bring upon a controlled collapse," well... In theory this looks good, and this is certainly not the first time this idea has appeared, however there are several subtle inherent flaws. Ever heard the saying:

"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men."
- Lord Acton

Well it's true, even with the Shards; as noble as we are, we are still human, and still susceptible to destruction by attrition. We fear if any such action where to be taken by anyone, there would be a cataclysmic loss of life. It would be equivalent to say shooting yourself in the femoral artery to prevent you from dying of an embolism. The rationale would be if you had no blood, no clot could form. If the world slowly crumbles it can be controlled and the loss of life can be mitigated. If it is all brought down at once it is the effect of the sky falling. Many forces are trying to "bring down the sky" but, our preventative measures are mitigating this very fall as you suggest. In fact what we are doing now is in a "sense" a sort of controlled demolition; ensuring only small numbers are lost, those who we simply cannot be saved. We don't like losing anyone,it is not our way. We despise the concept of "the greater good," and how "an end justifies the means." We are trying to ensure that the transition form modern day to the AGC "new era" will be as smooth and peaceful as possible. Many would look at any such transition as dark or sinister. So i would put forth this question.

Is this all that humanity can amount to, total annihilation?

Humanity needs to move beyond it's origins and become something anew. This does not call for the shedding of familiarity completely. We simply need to recognize that our current lifestyles and path are leading to a bleak and desolate end. We need to embark down a new path, one in which humanity is united, not countries. one where peace reigns, not conflict. We need a world where people are able to move beyond their selfishness and become selfless.

Stagnation of any type is self defeating,one must always evolve with one's environment or their archaism and backwardness will hurt the collective (i.e. racism). Redemption is available to every and all at any point; but only if they genuinely seek it.

Intriguing and engaging post, I look forward to more of your questions.

reply to post by BrokenVisage

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Originally posted by BrokenVisage

...

However, how you answered this important question concerns and agitates me, especially if you're so willing to disclose other aspects of this cult.

...

Are you afraid of reprisals? Does the church hold more power and know more about our origin then we are led to believe? Is the claim that they are associated with visiting aliens factual?

Well, firstly i would like to apologize, I did not mean it to be any form of insult or detraction from your question. firstly we are not a "cult" many Illuminons take this "label" as a slap in the face; however i am versed enough that i can see the confusion. Merriam Webster defines a "cult" as "formal religious veneration: worship," this is neither accurate nor true. We many share Buddhist "Idealism" however we do not regard it in a "spiritual" context in line with the Shards. We may practice spirituality in our own council, however this is permitted to be a "ruling" mechanism within any Shard. the point i am attempting to make is this, we are not a religions institution, we do not practice any sort of rituals, nor do we advocate for spirituality. At first glance it may appear to be a cult, but by no means are they.

In regards to your question, my aversion is born of caution not fear. Reprisals by an "church" are little to none, we are virtually invisible to them. I avoid this subject mostly because it typically detracts from the greater message. "Religion" has a tendency in such consorts to bog people down in the "nitty gritty" details, something i wish to avoid at all cost. Bickering over religious points never brings about any sort of resolution; in fact typically the opposite. The Shards support idealism, not faith nor spirituality. This said, the religions of the world diverged form several core "facts," fact upon which civilization itself and our origins are build upon. These "facts" are startling and dangerous. These 'facts' are facts that would cause the "apocalyptic" scenario I previously entertained. I say what i think needs to be said, i say what can be said. I do not say anything that is a direct threat to our cause, nor our origins. I know this will be undoubtedly seen as a point towards my dis-accreditation. regardless i will not jeopardize so much for so little. I will say this, religion and science are opposite sides of the same coin, both born of the same visage. The founder of Illuminism said:

"Science can tell us how, spirituality can tell us why."

I will leave you with that to contemplate, hopefully my answer is satisfactory for the time being.

- Maban

reply to post by Merle8

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Originally posted by Merle8
Is the goal of your shard to essentially get people to live in a crappy agrarian society (no matter how well organized it would be, it would still suck to live in) without technology? Is it going to be done by using up all the resources and causing wars until living off the land is the only means of survival?

Wow; i honestly don't know where that one came from... Well no. We where the architects of the Transhumanism Movement actually, although it has taken on a life of its own. Imagine paradise, that is what we are trying to create, I think that makes th point clear.

- Maban

reply to post by andreas b

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Q: Which are the biggest conspiracies your Illuminati shard considers to be false and hold no truth?
A: Of the conspiracies i know of in totality; most "conspiracies" hold a shred of truth in all honesty, however small. They have to start somewhere, reality is usually square one.

A:Which are the most important conspiracies currently taking place according to your shard of the Illuminati?
Q: To be obvious, the Illuminati. The NWO, bastardization. And most importantly NIA's actions and plans; we do not fully know their intent and purpose so we are still investigating them thoroughly.

Q: I feel the dumbing down on society through poisons like fluoride, bad news and television are very real , whats your shards take on it and what are you doing to prevent it?
A: Unfortunately much of this is either "sophistry" or subtle subterfuge. The goal is not to specifically "dumb down," people, it is much more blunt; and in effect cunning. They operate through pressure, status quo, and vanity. If they present what "normal" and "acceptable" is to people while providing "threats" real or imagined they gain total control. They work on two fronts, sensationalism and coercion (media), as well as fear and warmongering (terrorism, fluoride). And yes fluoride is lethal, but so is anything in high quantities; if it where in high quantities everywhere it would be obvious. In our eyes this is just another "imagined" threat, they work in many ways but all with the same the same two tactics.

Q:You feel genuine but i just wonder why you feel the need to have a funky looking robot as your avatar? Wouldn't something more sophisticated give a more credible appearance?
A: Ha ha, you like? Well with any "symbol" it is the meaning behind it,not the object itself that is important. i am sure some have recognized it; if not it pains me, it is quite a good movie. Watch the movies Appleseed, and put your attention on Olympus. At which point you will truly understand "why" I picked him. So simply to say, this "symbol: echoes all that i have stated here.

Thanks for all the good questions.

- Maban


[edit on 9-5-2008 by Maban]

reply to post by Spaxz

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It is good to see people who selflessly try to help others.
However, your statement is logical; therefore it could not even remotely be construed as a cult. Although i would caution, not to help those whom do not wish your help; that is the golden rule of Illuminism and Enlightenment.

- Maban

Originally posted by Maban
reply to post by cornixman

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Just a quick question for you, what are your impressions of Leo Zagami? Is he a real Illuminati whistle blower or a fraud?

He certainly holds many "true" facts. Although, his lack of "distinction" between Shards and Remnants leads me to the conclusion that he is either a Remnant propagandist or someone shouting to the world incomplete facts and some sophistry. Either way I'd say take his cries of "wolf" with a grain of salt as any. He may be, he may be not; unfortunately there is no "black or white" clear cut definition. There are many "individuals" who try to play both sides of the fence (secretly) so it is always hard to say. My first inkling is he managed to collect enough facts to make a good argument but is missing the critical elements to totally convince me. I would say if he where unmistakably (to us) a proponent of a Remnant, action would have already been taken.

- Maban

Thanks for the reply Maban,

a little more info if you please?

considering that he is not being believed by the majority of people and that he is being debunked by many SS people including freemasons who I don't think would have the relevant knowledge to be able to justifiably do such a thing, would you still think it necessary for 'action to be taken'?

Also would it be possible for him to have been an illuminati 'Remnant' and not have knowledge of 'Shards' or not consider them to be an important enough part of the picture?

I'm sure you are aware that we all have to come to some sort of conclusion on the information you share whether that conclusion is a 'probable', a 'maybe' or a 'probably not' so Zagami aside what one piece of information that you can share that you haven't yet seen on these boards would make us believe?

Thanks for your time again.

reply to post by Maban

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Thank you for your reply. I always make sure when someone does not wish to discuss those topics that i stop. By the way what movie are you refering to with that Avatar? I would be interested to watch it.

I have a few more questions if you don't mind. Whether you know the answers or not.

I just finished watching a very interesting movie that speaks alot of what you talk about. The movie seems to speak more truth about the origin of man and the planet than anything else i have heard. I was wondering if you have seen it and how much truth it holds? If you haven't it's app. 4hrs long. It is called "The Legend of Atlantis - It's Time To Wake Up"

www.youtube.com...

I was also wondering if you know of the Pleiadians and there role here on earth or if they are a false race of aliens? Either way i came across a video in which i posted a thread about. The video speaks alot of truth to me, but i was wondering on your take and if you believe Alaje is who he says he is? Part 2 was added by Inferno further down the thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I was also wondering if this member was a Remnant? Here is a link to his Thread or is he just a sad person looking for attention?

www.abovetopsecret.com...'

Thank you for your time Maban!

Love and Light

reply to post by cornixman

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Q: ...would you still think it necessary for 'action to be taken'?

A: If he truly where a major threat/misinformation agent; then yes action would be taken. Action in the form of intelligence and investigation, we would learn as much as possible and determine if indeed he was a member, and how much he really knew. To honestly state, Remnants as i previously mentioned are on the "back burner" so to speak; our attention is focused elsewhere. However, if he where an obvious threat at least one Illuminon would be tasked with investigating further.

Q: Would it be possible for him to have been an Illuminati 'Remnant' and not have knowledge of 'Shards' or not consider them to be an important enough part of the picture?

A: Well, it is very well possible, not likely mind you; but "possible." To most Remnants we are seen as the "bane" of the Illuminati's existence, "distorting it beyond the original doctrines." To this end, we are happy to oblige. Given their archaic and quite unsavory "methods," we are happy they see us as such. This said, it would be difficult for any remnant to have never heard of the Shards, if anything by circumstantial rumor.

Q: What one piece of information that you can share that you haven't yet seen on these boards would make us believe?

A: Well, that's a fair and good question. Some things I cannot discuss might, but would inevitably unravel this dialog rather than unite it. Other things I could talk about, but would likely be seen as more nonsense since much of it has never "really" seen the light of day. Also many "rumors" spread about us that are untrue in some way are common knowledge (at least here). There is honestly in my mind no "one piece" of incontrovertible evidence that would allow anyone to accept me beyond a shadow of a doubt, possibly short of a major CEO of a local corporation admitting it on international media; which as we all know has less of a chance of happening than a world ending comet. Even at such point, I would think that there would be many skeptics of his claims, even then. Thinking about it in whole, there truly is no "one piece" of irrefutable evidence that would prove our legitimacy and sincerity. The closest analogy I could think of would be equivocal to asking someone to "prove that they love their parents," or even to "prove they truly 'believe' in their faith." It is not something that can truly be "proved," it is simply a way of life and just... Is. I'm sorry i cannot provide you with a "complete' and evidentially answer, but in my earnest opinion, there really is none. However, if i do venture across such a piece of evidence of which you speak, and it threatens our being and cause in no way, I would be more than happy to share it with you. I will continue to seek this "golden nugget' of information, I duly understand and accept that this is what ATS'ers strive and live for, so it cannot go ignored; and I pledge it will not. Until such time the best i can do is continue answering as many questions to the best of my abilities.

- Maban

reply to post by Spaxz

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I am taking time to watch these in great detail; I will have a response soon. I will say that you dug up some VERY "interesting" information. More so than I have seen in one place, for a good deal of time.

reply to post by Sir Francis Bacon

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Originally posted by Sir Francis Bacon

Maybe necessity begs that I do ask you one quick question: Do you know how long, roughly, will you be here with us online?

Firstly, yes it is Appleseed, specifically Appleseed and Appleseed Ex Machina. Two very good movies which reflect the Shard's values greatly; if anyone has seen these you will almost immediately understand why. I thought I had answered this question earlier, but must have gotten confused in my excitement to answer all these insightful questions.

To answer your question, how long?

Well, hopefully for quite some time. I feel that you bring up a very pertinent point I should fully address. Typically an Illuminon in such a "situation," is only online for only the shortest of periods to "get the word out" so to say, and they retreat behind a security blanket of secrecy. This "fall back time" is typically up to the discretion of each individual Illuminon unless otherwise directed by their Shard's Council, or the Icelandic Shard's Council. I can assure you "others" are watching this very thread, both to judge how people in general respond, and how I personally am furthering our cause. I certainly would not call it "control," just cautious oversight." There can never be too many eyes watching the unknown. To return to your question, most Illuminons have not exceeded a "Three Month" "publications" period, simply for safety and security reasons. I feel I should add that I am one of a handful from all the Shards whom, "push the envelope," so to speak. At one point I had a nine month "Chat Room" sortie before my Shard asked me to withdraw. To honestly answer your question, I don't know, hopefully as long as possible. I will say this as long as we are productive and willing to listen to anyone and everyones questions, concerns, and opinions this could last a long time. As a promise to all of you I will notify you if i am requested to withdraw, and hope that the timing is not inconvenient. Far too often "informants" (if you will) go silent at the wrong moment, dissolving whatever structures of truth they had formed and solidified. I hope to finally "fade out" when none are interested in what I have to say. When any and all questions that could be asked, have. I wish to "fade out," when I am of no more use to either the public or the Shards in this regard. Hope that sufficiently answers your question.

reply to post by Skyfloating

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Originally posted by Skyfloating
What do the following symbols mean to you:

1. Three concentric circles

2. The number 5

3. A rose violet-blue

Well, Three Concentric Circles? Assuming you are remarking about the "appearance" of such phenomena around the world on major historical structures/ruins... I don't know, however I could fathom a guess. Given that they are circles and not "tear drops" I cannot "positively conclude" anything, except a common trait across all cultures, regions, and beliefs resonated across the world in a significantly impactive way; hazarding a guess it could even be associated with our origins. In the Shards, the number 3 holds great significance, it is perhaps the MOST IMPORTANT symbol of anything we hold dear, this is because it resonated with our very origins and duties. However it really isn't a "symbol," it is more of a subtle pointer to the past and future at the same time. In a sense it is a "type" of universal constant, positive, negative, and neutral; something inherent to any and everything.

Of the number "5" and a violet rose, I apologize but nothing specifically comes to mind. I will thing upon it, and if more comes to mind I will mention in reference to this post. hopefully this post is not a total waste of information.

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