What is your reaction if you discovered NWO and Illuminati a hoax?

"If we do not follow the dictates of our inner moral compass and stand up for human life, then his lawlessness will threaten the peace and democracy of the emerging New World Order we now see, this long dreamed-of vision we've all worked toward for so long." -President George Bush, January 1991

These quotes are horses**t.

The speakers quoted are using the term "new world order" as a political term, meaning a new international arrangement of power and institutions.

They are NOT talking about "NWO" group.

This shows how shallow the conspiracy cranks like to twist and misinterpret terms and take them out of context to support their drivel.

Don't be misled by false propaganda.

wake up.

reply to post by Ickey


Another non-response from Ickey!! (What a surprise!)

Ickey simply repeats his "horse manure" mantra...

The NWO is not a group Ickey, it's usually an idea. Illuminati is a group, but there are no indications that this group refers to itself as Illuminati, although they surely believe to be illuminated.

Did you know that the Bilderberg group did not refer to themselves as anything until CTs (Jim Tucker and the his anti-semitic Spotlight magazine) and later on the media started calling them the Bilderberg Group? WE named the unnamed.

Please tell me what is the difference between "a new international arrangement of power and institutions" and what CTs ascribe to the NWO?

You can't. You won't.

It doesn't seem like you have studied conspiracy theories a great deal. Do you mind telling us what you have read on the subject? Why are you so readily able to discount the whole thing. It does appear that you have studied the subject only superficially, probably reading reports (not the books themselves) of the whack theories of David Icke or Jordan Maxwell. Or perhaps you studied the Christian fundamentalist views of the NWO?

As I pointed out to you before please read on the subject and educate yourself before discounting it wholesale. Start here:

A Chronological History of the New World Order

and here on ATS:
The Corporate NWO: Research Project

More importantly, why to you come to the New World Order forum on the net's largest conspiracy website and assume that you can educate us on a subject you seemingly know little about?

So George Bush's New World Order is the same as your New World Order?

How do you know that?

George Bush's New World Order is the post cold war New World Order.

That is his New World Order in his 1991 speech.

So what is your New World Order?

reply to post by Ickey


Since it's your thread, why don't you define Illuminati and New World Order.

Maybe, I'll agree that the version you present is indeed, horse crap. I'm pretty sure this is simply a semantic debate.

Quigley took offense to anti-Semites using his work, and I can understand. However, he did expose some of the power elites' shenanigans in his book. Quigley fully supported their goals and methods and believed the public should be told about the Elites' accomplishments. It is not only anti-Semites who use his book, for example Cleon Skousen wrote "The Naked Capitalist" as a response to Quigley's book.

Check out William Engdahl's A Century Of War: Anglo-American Oil Politics and the New World Order a book I recommended in a recent thread. Even if you disagree with the books' conclusion, at least you will see that not everyone who uses the term "New World Order" is a crank.

We are ruled by a relatively small minority, can we agree on that much?


[edit on 3/5/08 by ConspiracyNut23]

Depending on where i heard the news, my reaction would vary from instant distrust to oblique curiosity - i would, after all, be interested in the reasons why such an elaborate ruse was initiated.

It's entirely possible after all that the Illuminate merely stand as the most obvious pursuers of an NWO agenda, and that there are actually schisms within the group, with one side pursuing one thing and the other pursuing the opposite in secret.

It's also entirely possible that the ruse was merely generated as a means of keeping those members of society whom could be considered dangerous to a NWO agenda entertained by fantastical conspiracies, in order to stop them from paying attention to subjects which matter (like 9/11 perhaps).

Also possible, but less fantastical - is that the idea was cooked up by a small circle of hicks in a trailer park somewhere as an idea for how they could scare people into getting what they want, and they never told anyone about the fact they made it up because they would lose what they had gained (Fear).

If i heard the news on ATS, i'd probably be distrustful and demand more information or at least to hear some sort of flawless reasoning on why what the person is saying is the truth.

If i heard it on the news from the MSM, i'd probably just ignore it and keep my eyes on the people around me to see how they react.


[edit on 3-5-2008 by Anti-Tyrant]

the actuality of the situation is thus..

it's infinitesimally impossible for the Illuminati and the plan for the New World Order to NOT exist... ..at some point.



why, you ask?


answer: logic

( I know, it's a pesky thing )



boil all human existence down to a purely logical, and simple, IF / AND / THEN process.


note: I use "HIM and HE" .. as the "enlightened man" and can be plural, although that's a paradox

because the enlightenment is that "all is one" , but you get the point.

ok..


IF
if one man, realized that all human conciousness is in all actuality, a local budding intelligence, a locally evolving conciousness, inseparable from all existence's conciousness, essentially, (from whatever perspective) absolute conciousness..
such a "being" as man's conciousness would have to literally BE what it had been envisioning all along as "God".
A SUPREME "BEING" ... Man "is" Man "Bes" (yes pronounced "BEES")..
HE... IS this "BEING" he is... "BEING". both noun AND verb.

AND

IF
-if this man realizes this, AND is within a society that is dominated by the paradigm of religious ideology that commands him into a submissive position, thusly limiting his ability to blossom and gain intellectual freedom.. under the idea of a SEPARATE "being" outside of himself.. OVER HIM... trapping him at every side through the "Reality" that every neighbor holds in their heart as complete cannon...

AND

IF
-if he desires to actualize and sculpt the world around him according to HIS OWN desires and vision.. FREE of these "imposed limitations" of whatever current social paradigms, and create a new world completely revolutionary to the world he inhabits...

...

THEN
-Then he is forced into a role as "The Rebel" in our history, it has been known as "Lucifer" (light bearer) .. bearer of wisdom and enlightenment.. angel of rebellion.. and/ or "Satan" "the adversary"..., and must take on that costume, that position, and wear said costume with his fellow brothers in arms, yet mask and cloak himself in order to survive as efficiently as possible under whatever current paradigms / environments he finds himself in.

THEN
-HE must accumulate the highest level of wisdom through the most prudently logical sources through the ages; philosophy. technology, and methodology.
-He must keep this knowledge secret,
to keep this knowledge from his enemy towards which he rebels, and only disseminating it gradually through his establishments to those that prove themselves through thir actions to be worthy of entrusting these secrets to.
-HE must preserve all things within his kind that are truly the highest manifestations of Beauty, Strength, and Wisdom.
-HE must accumulate substantial wealth and eventual control of the currency of human effort.
-He must infiltrate all areas of power, through secret sharing of wisdom and wealth.
-He must use the most dominant and brutal personalities at his disposal to enforce his will, until they are no longer necessary or desirable.
-He must destroy all "reality paradigms" (religions) that are incongruent with the aimed actualization of his goal.
-He must destroy the concept of "divided lands" (nations) in order to have complete control and most efficient fluidity of currency through his environment.
-He must sculpt HIMSELF into that which is most efficient in enabling him to experience himself and manipulate his surroundings ( both inseparable )..





[edit on 3-5-2008 by prevenge]

THEN
-He can embody and enjoy freedom, having shed the "rebellious" role (as upon completion, he's no longer the rebel when there's nothing to rebel against)
-He can finally don the "Godhood" role ( though this is only prevalent if there is someone below him to observe his intellectual advances as dietic )
-He can freely experience himself and the universe, to the highest degree imaginable.

AS

The etymological organization of words in the most "official" language of the world, English, represent exactly what these entities MEAN.

the "Illuminati" title would fit the bill as far as what it means.
"Those who bear the light." "Those who have been enlightened with wisdom"

the "New World Order" title would fit the bill as far as what it means as well.

does "The Glowinati" or "Flouresceinatus" work?
how about "Fresh Global Paradigm"... or wait... "Novel Planetary Hierarchy"

hmm... lacks the "OOMPH" that "Illuminati" and "New World Order" have.
it is what it is.

If A.W. (or the men behind him) hadn't thought of bringing their movement into reality...
then someone else would have...
and I doubt grammatically, that they would have chosen anything that derived very far from exactly the words that describe the purpose of what they represent.
It's what they mean.




If they didn't /don't do it.. then someone else.. with the same exact names would have or will.


...eventually... someone under creatively stagnant authoritarian spiritual and social rule, realizes "what actually is"..
..eventually...someone understands that we are all one conciousness experiencing itself subjectively... one organism of man.. cells of awareness..of the whole.. "experiencing" in order to "find out what works best"

eventually someone realizes this...AND applies that knowledge.. into a formidable force that actually sculpts his own reality.




I see the Illuminati / NWO phenomenon.. as a vital step in man's consciousness's evolution and development.


I do however regret not having taken the chance to attend Phillip's Academy and Yale, as my father did, and desired me to with all his heart...and have developed myself towards a more refined discipline..
Accordingly, I now find myself on the outside of this global effort, looking in, and most likely a knowing victim of not only the crushing iron fist of what needs to be done, in the end stages of this country's demise, and rebirth..

But even more painful, the longing that I will not be conscious of witnessing the marvels of the great work, nor have had the pleasure of contributing my great potential to the glory of the revolution of creativity that will take place in the coming decades / centuries..

I guess I inherited too many of my mother's creative genes, and not enough of the disciplined business minded genes.

now i sit here writing this, with motile filaments crawling through my flesh.. slowly dying..
and yet .. hah .. marveling at the magnificent amount of genius that must have gone into engineering such a pathogen as what causes Morgellons syndrome.... no doubt tied into the endgame destruction intimately.
fathoming in awe that which swims through your very being, invasively... how perverse.

yeah boo hoo.. self-responsibility.. not worth it anymore.

though, gotta laugh as you face certain death...and a torturous existence..

gotta laugh.

because it's ..US.. its all US. everything is.


The Man in the Bear Trap is cutting off his foot in order to be free and survive.
Takes some cremating that dull care of attachment to the foot..
in order to bravely push through what needs to be done.

Are you a cell in the foot?
or are you a cell in the head?
in the heart perhaps?
or are you a cell in the hand responsible for the actions involved in holding the saw and using it for it's purpose of evisceration?
or are we all stem cells, capable of being any type of cell

man I'm tired of this all... so tired...
- IF.. THEN... AND THEN... AND THEN...
- no AND THEN

[edit on 3-5-2008 by prevenge]

Originally posted by prevenge
answer: logic

( I know, it's a pesky thing )

The question lies within whether or not we live within a logical universe - in a logical one, logic is indeed a pest.

In an illogical Universe, Logic becomes our saviour and our guide.

From this point, the question is one of preference; Would you prefer to have twisted logic, or to exist within a twisted universe?

*cough*

[/rant]


On another point, Prevenge;

You're describing an individual's attempts to attain ultimate power - the same kind of ultimate power that the emperor probably wanted in star wars.

The NWO doesn't want ultimate power, it just wants to enslave humanity - to forever place themselves in the "I Have" category while everyone else is in the "Have Not" Category.

you did NOT read all that that fast.

I JUST POSTED IT.

read it.

its only the Emperor if you maintain the ideology of divisibility.

Sure, I think that the Hegelian Dialectic is being followed, as man's conciousness evolves en masse, in order for effort to be exacted, there needs a hierarchy, and each level of the hierarchy is a slave to the master above him and so on.

Until a massive genetic change occurs, that changes our very chemical reactions that produce our current psychology en masse, I find that this model is the one aimed for and used most efficiently.

untill a great unhappiness passes, all will not be realized as one .
and when all agrees, then individuality will cease.
and you have to ask yourself... would you want that.

and maybe being a slave is merely playing your part, until you have the reigns..
and maybe this process.. is an evolutionary model we have to become, in order to have order... and then evolve THROUGH.. it.. towards something more representative of a sphere shaped society.


you can have the illusion of equality now...

but until we are all actually psychologically, physiologically, spiritually, and genetically equal, you'll have hierarchy.


and hierarchy embodies delegation of Will through subordinates.

it's not as simple as "they want to make us their slaves"



i think it's something you have to "deal with" as an idea.

-







[edit on 3-5-2008 by prevenge]

[edit on 3-5-2008 by prevenge]

Originally posted by prevenge
you did NOT read all that that fast.

I JUST POSTED IT.

read it.

Granted, i skipped a fair portion of your second post, most of it towards the end.

Relief!! I don't know why any good person would want the NWO and Illuminati to be real. You'd like to see people die and be enslaved just so you can tell everyone you were right?? I don't know why anyone would want that. I sure would love if NWO was not real but all the signs points to it being real.

prevenge, the way this being your talking about will do things is that of the emperor in Star Wars, were slaves having our beliefs held down the person gets evil to us in person ect ect ect, and then at the end of our merry stay you say.


"Until a great unhappiness passes, all will not be realized as onw, and when all agrees, then individuailty will cease, and yes you have to ask yourself would you want that"?????


Well what the hell is the question if i say no, i don't want that from that being you described, i want individuailty then were is my choice?


I'm all for directing energy and learning more and more about the human parts of the brain but i would never go along with all of that.



[edit on 10-5-2008 by Codex.MK2]

[edit on 10-5-2008 by Codex.MK2]

Actually, if the word were given, in such a manner as to be believed, I believe it would be a terrible bit of news.

It would indicate that we as a civilization have much work to do.

First there would be the public validation of history, because right now, many of the CT's out there present alternate versions of history which had some source. That source, in MANY cases was quite unequivocal with what they have been teaching and authoritative enough to be believed. It would have proved so diametrically contrary to reality that its dissemination either represented true malicious intent or a devastating break from reality.

Such sources of contrary data that can cause entire groups of people to revolt and revolution must certainly, if actually true, merit the response of the common governments to eliminate no?

Hmmm..., I already don't like where this hypothetical has led me...., I will return with a second installment after I've considered further.

Originally posted by prevenge
my favorite magic word is "hoax"

any time someone suspects anything..

i just say the magic word "hoax"

and people lighten up.. confident through social conditioning to feel they're clever enough to not have been "fooled" by said "hoax"

i like using people's ego against their own interest.

they feel more comfortable and "in control" of their live .. once they are cozy with the final authorative conclusion that it was a "hoax" after all.. just a joke.

haaaay.. someone was tryin to scare me! tryin ta pull the wool over my eyes. .makin thousands of fake ufo vids and fake freedom of information douments promoting global genocide..


soooo happy to know that it was all just a massive joke.


man that magic "hoax" word works so well.

i'd rather feel confident that nothin can get past my scrupulous eye!

see i'm not one of those crazies.. i dont go around thinkin that people will do anything to make a profit while killing people.
I see humanity as a completely different animal than that of say.. 400 years ago when people DID kill for money..


see.. I'm with the crowd. I'm accepted by my peers as a cool minded attractive person that in no way is suspecting anything is going on without my knowing about it.


that word "hoax" works well on me.

puts me at ease.

because nobody can fool ME! no HOAX will get past my witty and upwardly mobile persona.

the people that control the currency of human effort LOVE me intimately.
they look out for my best interests and anything coldly logical in their development of the civilization as a whole is warm and fuzzy and has NOTHING to do with domination of me, my mind, and my health.

I AM AN INDEPENDENT AND FREE-THINKING NON-CONTROLLED MAN!
no hoax will get by me! can't fool me!
see it was a hoax! silly puny nutty crazy suspicious people hahah!

haha! I am victorious. my ego excels!
it was a hoax afterall!

-

this is some of the funniest stuff I have ever read....
Im going to try that out...
social conditioning is hilarious
some of the conspiracies are real, but only until you exit this 3 dimensional world...

i

[edit on 04/27/2008 by iiinvision]

reply to post by Ickey


I MIGHT think that the NWO and the Illuminati are throwing out some disinformation to confuse us. Too many people are finding out about them through the internet.

Is there another dimension, no.
There is no hoax.

"Fire and Guts" MacCain is talking now, would he think hoax.

Would we have to prove their existence of him.

He will find out soon, hope he tells every one if they are a hoax or not.

What if the New World Order is us? as in George Washington's Cincinnati Conspiracy?

Re George Washington's Society of Cincinnati:

CHAPTER XXVII THE CINCINNATI CONSPIRACY LINK
160 The Annapolis Convention
161 Aftermath of the Shays Rebellion
162 The Northwest Ordinance
163 The Secret Meeting at Philadelphia
164 The Plan for the Overthrow
165 The Ratifying Conventions
166 The Massachusetts Reservations
167 The First Republic Surrenders
CHAPTER XXVIII WASHINGTON'S ADMINISTRATION
168 The Second Republic is Started

The Annapolis Convention.

While these coups and rebellions were going on in New England, a different variety of convention was in preparation farther south. George Washington and his followers, the Cincinnati, and their sympathizers were attempting to take advantage of the economic depression to further their secret schemes for some form of oligarchy or dictatorship that would get rid of both democracy and the federate form of government, and centralize control in a few hands, with George Washington, the arch-aristocrat, as the supreme ruler, either openly or tacitly. Washington’s favorite plan for this goal, as we have seen, was through promotion of the Chesapeake and Ohio Canal, which would enable Washington to create, as a terminal canal port, a city on the Potomac near Washington’s home and under his complete dictatorship through possession of this city, eventually leading up to domination of the western territories, and, ultimately seizure of the United States itself. The main leader of the opposition to Washington’s schemes was removed in 1785, when the Cincinnati followers procured Thomas Jefferson’s appointment as envoy to France, so that, at least as far as the South was concerned, little organized opposition could be expected, at least of a kind which could cope with the secret and invisible organization of the Cincinnati.

[edit on 24-3-2010 by seataka]

[edit on 24-3-2010 by seataka]