If only we could remember...

I just watched this documentary on this amazing chipanzee named Ayumu.
I don't know if this has been discussed here on ATS before, so here it goes....
Link to documentary

After watching this video, you will understand that chimps have a vastly superior memory than our own.

They put Ayumu up against a memory champion and Ayumu out preformed the human with flying colors.

After training Ayumu to recognize numbers 1-9, they are displayed on a touch screen and she asked to remember the numbers randomly selected locations around the screen. She is correct about 90% of the time.

When humans are put to the same test, 14 out of 15 chosen could not even complete the test. One person successfully completed the test in the street experiment.

Where have we lost our photographic memories?

Seems as though, if you have a photographic memory, society treats you as though you were smarter than the rest.

I would think that having a photographic memory would aid us in our daily lives.

My question is this...

Are our human minds being altered by outside influences?

Pay attention to the way I worded the question.

I did not say Are our minds being influenced by outside influences.

I mean ALTERED!

Why are a selected few able to enjoy the magnificence of a photographic memory?

And furthermore, Why would we as a species drop the gift along the way?

It doesn't make any sense!

Chimps have the advantage in memory, This is proven fact.

See for yourself!

You vs. Chimp




[edit on 23-4-2008 by IMAdamnALIEN]

One theory I've heard for our lack of memory is that we don't have to remember so much anymore, so we don't bother. For instance, can't remember what countries fought in WWII? Pull out an encyclopedia or google it. Memory isn't as much of a survival trait as it once was.

reply to post by DragonsDemesne


But what about all the great minds that have this gift?

Do they not have an advantage over the non photographic memory people?

Im not buying the whole we have Google now so we don't need memory.

It doesn't make any sense to get rid of a Ferrari and trade it in for a pinto.

Thanks for the reply!

I think that has a lot to do with it. We've gotten lazy I think. But, then again... I used to be able to remember a lot of fact on trivia, history and music. Now I'm lucky if I can remember what I had for breakfast. Then again, I'm out of school, and don't play as much trivia games as I used to or watch the history channel as much as I did. Music I can still hear a song and know who sings it, the song, and most of the time the words.

Maybe we have to keep training our minds? Be aware of the things around us and maybe we will have it again? I dunno. I can't remember a lot from when I was a kid... but according to my counselor I blocked a lot of it out.

Photographic memory (visual thinking) is not all it is cracked up to be. When I read a book I retain about 30% of the raw information but I can always retain a copy of each page as an image in my head.

Only rarely is the information that I need at the moment in that 30% I had previously retained. So I will have to recall the pages from memory and REREAD the parts I need. The problem here is that no ones memory is perfect and it takes a bit of concentration just to see the page clearly enough to read. Sometimes I have to close my eyes to see what I need clearly.

People instantly discount information that isn't arrived at quickly. People will think you are lying to them. They assume that the apparent effort it takes to retrieve information is merely a cover for trying to come up with a convincing lie.

You can see a visual thinker in action when you ask them a tough question. Their eyes will shift away from you to one side and get this blank look for a short period. A visual thinker MUST co-opt the use the visual parts of the brain during the act of recalling a memory.

You learn to live with the gift. For example, I rarely READ technical books anymore because it is a waste of time. I can just page through the book and index it in my memory. Then when I really need information I will know where in the book it ought to be.

The other side of the coin is that I can't understand something unless I can visualize it. This is especially painful when I am pretending to be a programmer or an author. I can work in text but I can only understand in diagrams, graphs, and charts.

Jon

reply to post by Voxel


That is amazing!

I am so envious of your memory!

You can photographically index a books contents in your head, and retrieve the information in your brain as easily as looking at the book itself?

Tell me thats not an advantage!

Just imagine how many of us would have IQ's over 140 with a photographic memory capable of visualizing and reading a book inside the mind.

Im curious, do you mind me asking what your IQ is, Voxel?

Oh, my. The Apes are going to take over, just like in Planet of the Apes!
But seriously. I think its because we have lost the ability to stay focused over the years. Because of all the electronics used in a negative way. Like T.V. or some types of music. Obviously it affects our Brain and nervous system. You don't need any links or scientific proof for that. It shows everywhere you go. Another thing that dumbs us down is drugs. Its medically proven that Heroine, Weed, and Meth affect the brain. It makes people who they are.

We technologically advanced through the midst 20th century. But we didn't take precautions, and realize what we were actually doing. Hopefully we can turn around, otherwise, it can lead to the destruction of the planet.

Nice Thread!

reply to post by Trams


Good point, staying focused has a big factor.

In the documentary, they said that chimps have this ability so they can navigate their jungle environment. Which logically makes sense.

Also, eating natures food is always a good thing. Fruits veggies and nuts are part of their daily diet. These foods have got to play a role in a developing mind.

We are so stuffed full of preservatives and chemicals by the time we are two, we don't even have a chance to develop our brains the way nature would like us to.

I want to ask the memory guy that posted here some questions....

Come back memory guy!

Where did you grow up?
How often did you eat junk as a kid?
Were your parents health conscious?
Do you remember having this gift all of your life?
What is your first photographic memory?

Thanks for the reply!

And furthermore, Why would we as a species drop the gift along the way?

It doesn't make any sense!

From the darwinist perspective (to which I don't usually subscribe, certainly not without reservations) it makes perfect sense: because when you settle down somewhere and start exercising "control" over your environment, being able to remove most of the external threats, your defensive barriers drop. Memory is no longer of paramount importance to self-preservation.

I am not saying that it is so; I am just saying that it does make "sense". ; )







[edit on 23-4-2008 by Vanitas]

I believe the sensational way these studies are broadcast undermines their value. A study like this should shed some light on how other species interact with their environment, and how they have adapted over time. It could even give us more accurate yardsticks with which to measure 'intelligence' in other species; something that's more than just, "How exciting! The badger can write his name!"

I believe there are substantial differences between "Control" human subjects and chimps. An adult human has associated considerably more information with the numbers that appear on screen, so as each number is observed, the human is distracted by first recalling what it is, or associating it appropriately. The chimp, on the other hand, learns of the numbers as symbols, and is aware that remembering certain symbol patterns will earn a prize. Since the motivation is different, the subjects interact with the task differently.

I believe also that a photographic memory is of great use to a chimp in a forest. Trees, rocks, and river locations -- the most important landmarks -- don't typically move; if a chimp can't remember what home (or the feeding ground) looks like, it won't make it there.

Humans, on the other hand, have less use for photographic memory. We learn by association, because we interact with many unique-but-similar things. I will name five items, and readers can think of five examples for each:

Keys
Shirt
Bottle
Bag
Mouse

Humans still have functional memories -- else, you wouldn't be able to read what I'm writing. As individuals, we are each exposed to far more information than our peers in previous centuries, or other species outside our society. It is necessary to therefore store information differently: in learning by association, we group things by their similarity to each other. That way, we can store more information in less space: You can recognize a car when you see it, even if it looks unconventional, because of aspects/visual cues that you associate with all vehicles.

I think we should stop looking at this from a "better/worse than" perspective. Different environments will generate differing individuals. The earlier we understand this, the quicker we'll be ready to deal with interplanetary species.

reply to post by IMAdamnALIEN

Why are a selected few able to enjoy the magnificence of a photographic memory?

There is little magnificence in a photographic memory. Imagine never being able to forget a traumatic event? You'll be stuck with that memory forever.

I'm glad my photographic memory's spontaneous.

reply to post by IMAdamnALIEN


WOW that is one fast monkey!!!! I would like to say that it is amazing but I have almost ceased to be amazed by animals now adays they are MUCH more intelligent that we humans ever gave them credit for. From monkeys on down to insects it is insane how much we can overlook by just being in the "dominant" frame of mind. Screw the taliban and Al queda, we should be watching for the animals who are readying to attack us, they would have a much easier time taking us over, at least we know that they exist!!!hehe

reply to post by Hyzera


I for one would love to have a photographic memory, I would just have to brush up on my coping skills to be able to live with traumatic events. We as a society could be so much more efficient and productive if we all were equipped with such a memory.

Back when I was in college, while I was taking some high powered classes like calculus and physics, I received a severe blow to the head. After the swelling went down, I had a little bit of a photographic memory. I could see the page and the page structure, but I couldn't quiet make out the words. I thought it would be a great advantage if I could make out the words on the page, but I never could focus that good.

I’m embarrassed to be compared to a chimpanzee and didn’t know how slow I was after seeing those numbers flash too fast for me. Perhaps some humans have devolved to the point of using up (or burning out) valuable brain cells for sports and entertainment.

I’ll also throw out from the dark that perhaps we spend too much time trying to communicate, for example, with each other and that certain areas of the brain have to be ‘shut down’ in order to focus on numerous activities at the same time. And the memory part of the brain has to be compromised as a result.

So with in this respect, I think our minds are already being altered by outside influences (maybe partly by ‘aliens’) but via televised programming – all those visual and audio bombardment that the brain cannot ‘rest’ or memorize anything important.

We all should just relax, take time out from daily stress and eat a few bananas for starters. Maybe that will help our memories.

I would love that. That monkey is fast. I wonder if his eyes work differently from ours. You know when you stare at a piture on your screen for a minute then look away and you can see a face or whatever. Maybe the monkeys eyes take less time to burn in the image?

reply to post by Hyzera


That doesn't make any sense at all!!!!!

If you were in a traumatic event, whether or not you have photographic memory isn't a factor in remembering the event for your whole life.

I've had trumatic things happen to me, I remember them vividly without a photographic memory!

Your logic confuses me....

I think some are missing the point here.

Just think how many brain-i-acks there would be to help the planet!

If everyone had a photographic memory, you would have no choice but to retain information and knowledge, which is never a bad thing. Being able to open a book so-to-speak, inside your mind has unlimited potential!

Please explain why a photographic memory is a bad thing.....

Also, no disrespect intended. I just have a different stance on the issue

Originally posted by IMAdamnALIEN

That is amazing!

I am so envious of your memory!

You can photographically index a books contents in your head, and retrieve the information in your brain as easily as looking at the book itself?

Tell me thats not an advantage!

Oh, it has advantages to be sure but the skill also has its disadvantages. Take names. In the course of a normal day we all meet new people and will promptly be told their name. I have tried all the tricks and yet I can not seem to remember names. The solution is to SEE the name written down or printed out and then I will never forget it.

Just imagine how many of us would have IQ's over 140 with a photographic memory capable of visualizing and reading a book inside the mind.

The ability to recall vast sums of visual information at will is not indicative of intelligence. As the monkey in the experiment proves, a good memory does not a rocket scientist make.

Im curious, do you mind me asking what your IQ is, Voxel?

To be honest, I am not sure. The tests available for free online produce a wide range of results and I have never been formally tested to my knowledge.

Jon

Originally posted by Voxel
The ability to recall vast sums of visual information at will is not indicative of intelligence. As the monkey in the experiment proves, a good memory does not a rocket scientist make.

Now, I would agree with you here accept for one thing that strikes me.

Its all about how you apply your memory!

First of all its not a monkey, its a chimp, which is basically 95% human. Although they cannot make choices like we do, or build proton accelerators like we do. They can only apply their memory skills to what they are limited to mentally. If the chimp had a concept of quantum physics/mechanics then they would be able to apply their memory to our human world.

We are, simply put, smarter. Not like an individual is smarter than another, but as a collective intelligence, constantly changing and evolving. That is our advantage over them. We are using our brains together to solve problems we all share.

A chimp on the other hand has a tightly knit social group and, at most, they can work together to hunt food, which is essential, but has its apparent evolutionary drawbacks.

Thanks for the reply!

Cool, here i am replying..

umm, What was the topic again?..replying to whom?...oh...better go back, i have forgotten the question. i will return...or will i? hmmm.

nice thread, who ever you were. scratches head, and pits... where did i leave that shiney thing?...swings away giggling...