Recent trip to Area 51- Guards cross the line

Which validates the point of the skeptics. If "these Cammo Dudes" mean so much business, lethal if neccessary, wouldn't logic tell someone who had an encounter as such to LEAVE immediately ?? Does personal safety take a backseat because "oh well it happens..." ??

The intent of the OP's thread is to obviously reflect a more than "average" camping trip. An encounter with highly trained, super secretive, and again authorized LETHAL enforcement, but the couple remained...after the fact that these Cammo Dudes ransacked their campsite to give some sort of warning, rather than engaging in juvenile/military antics ???

Originally posted by _DISAVOWED_
Which validates the point of the skeptics. If "these Cammo Dudes" mean so much business, lethal if neccessary, wouldn't logic tell someone who had an encounter as such to LEAVE immediately ?? Does personal safety take a backseat because "oh well it happens..." ??

The intent of the OP's thread is to obviously reflect a more than "average" camping trip. An encounter with highly trained, super secretive, and again authorized LETHAL enforcement, but the couple remained...after the fact that these Cammo Dudes ransacked their campsite to give some sort of warning, rather than engaging in juvenile/military antics ???

Well there was a recent change in the warning signs at area 51. The use of deadly force authorized was covered over. So we knew we couldnt be arrested or hurt. WE were not about to let the cammo dudes force us to just leave camp and have to drive back the 2 hours to Vegas.

And besides they only have real power to harm, if they still do, after you cross the border. We did not, and assumed nothing more would happen.


Also, keep in mind, we had been going there SOOOO many times, we didn't really grasp how to handle this. We aren't pro's at dealing with them. Heck, the first 20 times we went they would wave at us as they drove by.

I personally believe the OP. I've seen personal body guards secretly pop locks to the trunks of peoples cars before, look for what they wanted and then put everything back in place and sail off into the night. it's not that uncommon.

One friend of mine does this routinely and he's just a bodyguard to a mid level celebrity. Whenever he or someone on the security team sees a paparazzi (sp) that they don't know they generally trail the camera man for a few days to find out who, what the person is. Even go through the guys stuff, the paparazzi seriously don't figure it out. then again most paparazzi I've met were complete druggies. seriously.

So do I think it's strange that the Cammo dudes went through his stuff and took his camera. Not at all. it's to be expected to happen eventually.

I think the two ladies that got busted crossing over the border line of the base were the initial source of the problem to the cammo guys. maybe they just didn't buy their story and investigated( followed) the two back to Rachel. they saw them talking to you and your girlfriend. Went hmmmmm maybe they are working as a team, coupled with the fact that they have seen you (recorded your license plates and comings and goings around Area51) and decided to find out who you guys really were. Watched you the whole time, waited for you to split for a moment went into your camp. While searching for your stuff then decided that they wanted to send you a message that this place was no longer hospitable to you, because now due to your conversations with the two ladies who were busted, they didn't trust you nor tolerate you, even though you are on public land. They truely didn't know about the camera. How would they? They had a small time frame to get the search accomplished. They didn't have the time to look for a potential camera.

They scattered the firewood to compel you to leave,and to intimidate you. When you came back to camp they were watching you to see your reaction. to see if you'd leave or not. Watched you pull out the camera, and thought to themselves "damn! they had a camera! whats on that camera. is it us rummaging through their stuff illegally, or were they trying to film black projects" so they had no choice but to go back in and get that camera. They needed to know more about you. They weren't quiet enough you woke up. they had a guy nearby over watching you and he cocked his gun. just in case you went crazy and confronted them. They don't know how you'll act. Luckely the situation didn't go into a violent direction.

I say you did the absolute best thing by laying low and not coming out of your tent. who knows what they would have done to you at that point. not worth losing your well being.

Hell next time leave a note out by your camp. saying who you are what you're doing there. they will probably read it label you as not a threat although they'll still watch you just in case (it's their job) and leave you in relative peace.

Also don't be so sure that they can't do anything to people physically. It's a big desert out there. people disappear. COPS can kick someones ass with little to no repercussion so I'm sure Cammo dudes can and will. Also, making somebody disappear is easier than we all think. there are professionals who do this stuff all the time and never ever get caught. ever. being non confrontational to these cammo dudes was the right way to go. Remember they are the real world. us camping near their black projects are not.

[edit on 21-4-2008 by BASSPLYR]

its all about give and take. The OP didnt give them enough justification for them to take it to a more lethal level. He has been out to the site 25 times and you get a feel for what these guys will and will not do, and its all based on your own behavior. The higher level of threat your behavior is deemed, they higher level of reaction will follow by the cammo dudes. I had a similiar incident where me and my g/f drove too close or actually OVER the border near the Ranch road..and had a terrifying experience with these guys so i personally know what lengths they will go.

Once they left him, they had what they wanted, why would the OP leave? Hes experienced enough to know that and that he is safe at that point.

reply to post by BASSPLYR


Bass, that about sums it up. Thanks!!! Still wont do much to answer the naysayers, but alas, the world still turns

reply to post by hiii_98


And on top of it hiii, i remember trying to set up a big camping trip last summer. Ive posted here before. Why now would i make up some crazy story for attention? Usually hoaxers register and post the hoax right away.

I think bass summed it up nicely though.

Wow you crossed the border and didn't get a ticket? Lucky lucky.~~!!!!!

i posted that adventure somewhere on here a while back. Long story short they almost ramed my parked jeep, then chased me offroading through the desert and onto the highway. Scared THE HELL out of me. I didnt even realize we crossed or were hovering on the border until i recently saw a picture on google maps near the medlan ranch. yikes!

[edit on 21-4-2008 by hiii_98]

Originally posted by hiii_98
i posted that adventure somewhere on here a while back. Long story short they almost ramed my parked jeep, then chased me offroading through the desert and onto the highway. Scared THE HELL out of me. I didnt even realize we crossed or were hovering on the border until i recently saw a picture on google maps near the medlan ranch.

yikes!

[edit on 21-4-2008 by hiii_98]

When was this? I saw a red jeep, i think it was red.... that had kind of a tit for tat with the cammos. was this you?

I remember on one of my zillion or so camping trips to Area 51, I came back to find my campsite was rummaged through too. Too bad they didn't know about my ultra secret camera I leave on just in case this happens. I played it back, and what do you know...It was a friggin' saquatch and the loch ness monster. Who would have thought?!? Unfortunately, I screwed up the camera or something, so I don't really have anything to show for it...but damn, you should have seen it. Lucky there is this nifty place online where I expect people to believe me without question, so here I am.

If your campsite was messed up, it was probably some disreputable folks that happened by. Being in that area you keen to fantasize about some sort of conspiracy so here you are. I don't believe a word of what you are saying other than perhaps someone messed with your campsite (which happens pretty often, unfortunately, but it doesn't mean some government types are messing with you....your not that important...I know that hurts to think about it, but your not).

[edit on 21-4-2008 by IgnoreTheFacts]

I disagree,

It's common practice to go through others stuff when you are in the field of performing security. The civilian world does it, and you should be aware that the military/federal world does it too.

It's a easy simple thing to do. especially for black ops people, who are no strangers to breaking and entering. A camp site is an easy target. You can leave no evidence as to who did the search. the searchers get answers easily, and can deny everything. It's a no brainer to go through your camp while your not there, and to run a psych ops against said camper to scare them off.

Also, these guys are Nasty Car rated. Basically they graduated from the black ops school of offensive driving. they could take a jeep with no tires just rims, through the desert dunes and still run you off the road and into some arroyo and make it look like driver error on your part. they are seriously trained dudes and should not be messed with. They if they want to be they can go onto a whole other level.

Like I said they are the real world. we on our armchairs typing on the internet and camping out in the desert are not. we are very naive regarding their capabilities.

Everything the OP did would be considered normal human behavior to me. We need to stop thinking that when crap hits the fan we are (as humans) aggressive to expose the truth or fight for justice. Most times our instincts kick in and we lay low, live to fight another day. This is why we generally don't challenge cammo dudes, or when I saw my own UFO I wasn't spazzing out but strangely quite and stunned. If I were video taping it I would have been silent and seemingly calm although stunned and boggled would be a better fit, but outwardly our reactions aren't what we would expect to these situations.

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
Most times our instincts kick in and we lay low, live to fight another day.

Yup, exactly why staying and going to sleep is so odd. Move camp, go home.....nearly anything makes more sense.

I believe the story makes more sense than some of the crap people post on here, its common knowledge that the guards listen to every word spoken out there with their microphones, which i understand can hear a knat fart from 5 miles away, so as soon as the OP went back to camp and mentioned the camera, they where coming back for it.

May i say that the OP has more balls than most people ive ever met just for going back so many times, he has proven he has trips out there with his link to the other site, i dont get what the problem is, seems like jealousy raising its head, would you pop your head out of your tent if your heard a weapon cock right after you make a noise? i very much doubt it, i know i wouldn't and i consider myself fearless in a lot of situations.

I compliment the OP on his and his girlfriends determination not to allow the fear these guards have over many people get to them, its people like you that make the likes of ATS worth while reading, just to know there are those who wont bow down to intimidation and let the naysayers get you down.

S&F for courage.

Hey I used to live in Rachel for a couple years back in 94'. I remember Connie when she was with Ray! And Oat and Joe owned the lil Ale'inn. You're right, you wouldn't be doing them any favors with this story because that is all that whole town is, a bunch of stories. Though they probably have a lot more figured out now.
What should be apparent to you is that they (the gaurds not the town folk)will use ANY means they feel necessary to protect themselves and the security of the facility. Don't be naive to their lack of thought on your behalf for your own sake. Its good that you didn't pursue the evidence, as it was more than you were prepared for and I feel you reacted appropriately. Besides what would it have proved? They would have simply stated they were searching for evidence that involved national security and wuttaduya know they are absolved and empowered. Take what you can from the experience.
Now that you are more aware you will take measures to prevent this I hope. I wish I was there with you as I am 24 myself and really into this stuff because I feel it is of the utmost importance to be aware of these secret factions that are controlling our egos because they think of themselves so much better.
Its too bad you probably didn't get to see groom lake from Freedom Ridge before they closed it. That was my only experience with all of that you are dealing with right now. I remember (I was young teen) watching the adult guys drive the security line mooning all the snipers and rangers watching, a final "kiss my ass", if you seperate from us, and hide w/e it is they're hiding if anything.....I wish you the best luck man and please remember they watch movies too

oh and pay as little attention as possible to those who want to argue arbitrary facts, it's a true waste of time unless you really think they deserve they effort.

Edit: Recieved a star and decided I would fix my grammatical errors. I am usually good with that, but I was pretty excited to be hearing about this for multiple reasons.

[edit on 21-4-2008 by eerieleary]

[edit on 21-4-2008 by eerieleary]

[edit on 21-4-2008 by eerieleary]

reply to post by bknapple

Yea we could of high tailed out of there. But we knew who did it. We figured we were safe. And it was getting cold and dark. Our tent is very big and very annoying to take down in the wind and cold with light fading away by the minute.

And ther e was zero chance we were going to leave after knowing they broke into the car because it was about 4 in the morning. Pitch black and about 40 degrees outside, perhaps colder...

I thought you were scared of them, thus the reason you didnt confront them while they were breaking into your car and stealing. You just sat there and didnt even say anything to them? But now you are saying you felt safe so you stick around? How would you know they wouldnt come back?

And you went camping with no flashlights? You couldnt turn your car lights on and quickly take everything down and pack it up?

I mean, if this story happened to anyone else...they would have just thrown their tent, etc in the car and fled. Darnkess and coldness wouldnt matter.

And can you explain how your long lasting battery, never turns off camera was filming them and was NEVER disturbed while they ransacked your tent?

The fact that you chose to stick around after being scared, vandalized and a victim of theft just makes this story seem completly made up. Nobody in their right mind would just shrug their shoulders and keep on camping out amongst the big bad mean security guards.

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
reply to post by bknapple

 

Yea we could of high tailed out of there. But we knew who did it. We figured we were safe. And it was getting cold and dark. Our tent is very big and very annoying to take down in the wind and cold with light fading away by the minute.

And ther e was zero chance we were going to leave after knowing they broke into the car because it was about 4 in the morning. Pitch black and about 40 degrees outside, perhaps colder...

I thought you were scared of them, thus the reason you didnt confront them while they were breaking into your car and stealing. You just sat there and didnt even say anything to them? But now you are saying you felt safe so you stick around? How would you know they wouldnt come back?

And you went camping with no flashlights? You couldnt turn your car lights on and quickly take everything down and pack it up?

I mean, if this story happened to anyone else...they would have just thrown their tent, etc in the car and fled. Darkness and coldness wouldnt matter.

And can you explain how your long lasting battery, never turns off camera was filming them and was NEVER disturbed while they ransacked your tent?

The fact that you chose to stick around after being scared, vandalized and a victim of theft just makes this story seem completely made up. Nobody in their right mind would just shrug their shoulders and keep on camping out amongst the big bad mean security guards.

Ugh. Well thanks to the other posters who dont feel the need to ask the same questions, just in different ways. LEo, Ive watched you post for a while and consider you to be a wise poster. I just dont get the need to keep attacking my story from different angles.

Heres answers to your questions....

Yes we felt... safe.... as in we knew we weren't in any physical danger. They came for the camera and left. What is the big deal here?

We did g ocamping with flashlights. I stated before that I found some wood scattered accross the site with my flashligh, please re-read before attacking. And yes we could have turned the car on and repacked. But it was 4am. Um kinda tired. Kinda cold. I guess you would leave, but we didnt. We weren't in any physical danger.

What is so odd about a battery that lasts 4 hours? Not sure what kind of camera you have, but all of mine since about 1999 can last at least 3 or 4 hours. I turned it on when I left and it was alive and well when I got back. And you use the word ransack, it give the impression that everythign was thrown out of the tent.

AGAIN, the camera was in a position that only caught anyone coming in or out. and anything that happened i the front of the inside. It is a very big tent fitting 10 people.

YEa how easy for you to say that they are big bad mean guards without ever going there yourself. And if you have, then it goes against many other stories of confrontations with the cammo dudes. I suggest you google other stories. You'll find mine isnt so far out.

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
I remember on one of my zillion or so camping trips to Area 51, I came back to find my campsite was rummaged through too. Too bad they didn't know about my ultra secret camera I leave on just in case this happens. I played it back, and what do you know...It was a friggin' saquatch and the loch ness monster. Who would have thought?!? Unfortunately, I screwed up the camera or something, so I don't really have anything to show for it...but damn, you should have seen it. Lucky there is this nifty place online where I expect people to believe me without question, so here I am.

If your campsite was messed up, it was probably some disreputable folks that happened by. Being in that area you keen to fantasize about some sort of conspiracy so here you are. I don't believe a word of what you are saying other than perhaps someone messed with your campsite (which happens pretty often, unfortunately, but it doesn't mean some government types are messing with you....your not that important...I know that hurts to think about it, but your not).

[edit on 21-4-2008 by IgnoreTheFacts]

Well considering I saw the media of who did it. I know it was not just some disreputable folks. But thanks

The rest of you condescending post is too lame to respond too. You could have just said you dot believe me and move on. But , i know this will hurt, Im not going to lose sleep if you dont believe me.

Moving on....

Originally posted by MrPenny

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
Most times our instincts kick in and we lay low, live to fight another day.

Yup, exactly why staying and going to sleep is so odd. Move camp, go home.....nearly anything makes more sense.

Ok again, cause you are too lazy to put the pieces together. I said that we went to sleep after putting the camera away and built our fire. WE knew who did what and knew there was no physical danger. They then came back at around 4 and we woke up. After that 2 minutes of nervousness, we couldnt really get back to sleep but both agreed that it was far too cold and dark to take the tent down now. So we waited till about 8 am or so and then left.

If you're planning to go back again, get a small camera that you can hide. Not like a regular video camera, but maybe a spy type camera. I would bet that if you set it up in say, the grill of your car, you may even find them snooping around when you sleep. Just don't set it up while you are there, in case they are watching nearby.

Originally posted by bknapple
Ok again, cause you are too lazy to put the pieces together

Just ignore them, they're acting like a pack of wolves circling you, and gloating at each others attacks on you, so ignore them. I find the attacks rather pathetic, personally.

I don't see anything wrong with your story at all. I certainly believe I would have acted the same.

It seems all their original intent was simply to intimidate you into leaving. Had they wanted to inflict harm on you they would surely have waited or followed you. So once you returned and reviewed the camera, finding no evidence that they intended to return, there was no reason to believe you were in further danger.

Given the fact that it appears they then realized you had possible footage of them giving them reason to return well into the night, I too would have considered my options and most likely opted to lay still, let them get what they want, and not confront them.

Anyone claiming they would have done otherwise, IMO, is full of it.

If they had wanted to inflict harm on you, they would have done so. So once they left, where is the need to pack up and flee. To repeatedly use that as an argument is merely argument for argument sake.

So ignore the pack wolves.

IF you did not cross the boundary and the did in fact steal your camera or damage your goods; file a formal complaint with whichever law enforcements jurisdiction you were under. Then you will have it on record. Getting public about it is probably the best method to get them to leave you alone.

If you were or had broken the law or crossed a boundary that day or in the past; they have you on tape, so I'd drop the subject.

Are just doing this to push their buttons? Do you need to be so close? IF they are still testing prototype aircraft there, you could run afoul of something considered to be a national security issue. In that case they could do pretty much whatever they want to you. Trying to photograph secret aircraft would be a genuine national security issue.

Have they done any work on the Little Ali-Inn? I was there a few years ago and it was a mess with garbage piled up everywhere and no customers.