Are there 33 shamans on ATS?

If so, here's the place for you to go and join hands.

I'm not much into joining hands. The germs and stuff seem to put me off.

Still, thanks for the offer.

reply to post by mrwupy


Can't you cast a spell on them or something...? An incantation, perhaps?

Personally, I don't mind holding hands - as long as there is no chanting and/or swaying...
Not really the "Kumbaya" type, you know. :-)










[edit on 19-4-2008 by Vanitas]

I would but...

I'm kinda busy "self-medicating" for the prevention of prostate cancer.


If you know what I mean.

reply to post by Vanitas


You have to be a little more specific on what kind of shamans. Apparently the "black" shamans are dark masters, and the "white" shamans are the good guys/gals.

"The legend says the spell will be broken when 33 white shamans (White shamans are mostly engaged in healing) come to this place. They will join their hands and create a circle with Podkova, the love of their hearts reaching the spirits. The gate to the parallel reality will open again and the white shamans will be given wisdom, strength, and an answer on how to protect our world and how to help humanity."

I'm ok with holding hands too, but I don't have the time this summer to travel to Siberia. I have to learn more about agroecology sorry .

I'd love to hear what their answer for protecting humanity is though. That would be awesome.

ATS should sponsor a more spiritual member here to join the 32 other shamans. That would be some publicity huh?

"So AboveTopSecret community, how does it feel to have found out how to save the planet?"

"You know, pretty good I guess."

wooopsy daisy double post

[edit on 4/19/2008 by biggie smalls]

reply to post by biggie smalls




Agroecology is good. I am sure there's a need for agroecologists in Siberia, too...
So, what's your next excuse?







[edit on 19-4-2008 by Vanitas]

I'm kinda busy "self-medicating" for the prevention of prostate cancer.


If you know what I mean.

I probably do, but I scare easily...

Excuses, excuses!

My next excuse will be that I am in school for the next few years. After that I'll have a farm to take care of and won't be able to leave for more than a week. Not until my permaculture food forest has started producing and I can leave it to work its magic.

I'd love to participate in a global consciousness project though. I'm down for saving humanity and the planet .

Use of the term shaman does seem to wind a few people up, so I would say I am shamanic, or on a shamanic path.

I also have a friend whose uncle takes groups to Sibera. Both she and her uncles and father are jews harpists, and have a lot of links with that part of the world.

Personally I am going to Peru this year for 3 weeks into the rain forests, but yeah, an interesting article.

Here's a video I made of Spiridon, a Siberian shaman. He wrote the soundtrack to a film called Shaman, and was laying at the UK's first jews harp convention

www.youtube.com...

He will also be playing at a shamanic full moon ceremony in Munic this summer, that I have been invited to drum at. Can't wait.

Si

reply to post by yogifootballer



Well, you know where to go...
Munich can wait.
(Even though it is a wonderful city!)

Seriously: even though I posted the thing just as an "interesting item", nothing more, I suppose there are worse ways of spending one's vacation... :-)

And thank you very much for the video!

reply to post by biggie smalls



Oh well, since I cannot interest you in Siberian permaculture... do you at least have shamanoid friends who would be interested in going on an "alternative" vacation?

(And don't forget to mention to them that they could be there just in time for the 100th anniversary of Tunguska! )

reply to post by biggie smalls


You forget the "grey" shamans.
But black (evil) and white (good) is a human construct after all.
And that any "true" shamans know this.
But that is just my opinion.


[edit on 20-4-2008 by WraothAscendant]

[IMO]

The difference between what may be determined a 'normal' person and a shaman is the willingness to be aware of themselves and their surroundings.

Every human being (man, woman and child) is capable of being completely aware. It's just that most prefer not to be and refuse to explore their external environment or innate internal wisdom.

[/IMO]

grammar edit

[edit on 20/4/08 by masqua]

reply to post by yogifootballer



That man is very good.....sounds like a tinnier version of the Dijeridoo..
Very good though!!

reply to post by masqua


I couldn't agree more.
(Which is why my original question - see the subject line - was only partially tongue-in-cheek. )

Of course, it's wise to know beforehand that on your way there/here, Nietzsche's caveat about abysses applies...


In case anyone wants to see the area, here it is:

Alkhanay Mountain

It's beautiful, it looks like a rose - but I don't understand why the image is so grainy. So, no chance of finding the famous "Horseshoe" - certainly not via Google Earth...








[edit on 20-4-2008 by Vanitas]

reply to post by masqua


In my opinion, the difference between a normal person and a shaman is a bit different. To me, A Shaman is a person who no longer clings to any beliefs, even those that brought them originally down this path. If a person has any beliefs that they feel absolutely must be true, they are restricting their ability to heal and to feel. A Shaman has evolved beyond his or her belief system and does not have a bias as to what is "true", and also has a willingness to push forward and help others. Only by being free of even their own beliefs can they be free enough to perform their duty, in all situations.

According to my criteria, I am not evolved enough to be called a Shaman.

reply to post by TheGreySwordsman


That is an interesting perspective.

However, I feel the concept of "belief" should be clarified.

Is having "no beliefs" the same as disbelief?
Clearly not, or the shaman (or whoever) wouldn't be able to accomplish anything, except maybe the most pedestrian survival tasks.
(This may sound philosophically faulty, but in reality, in practice, that's how it is.)

Without "beliefs" there are no goals (I don't mean this in a utilitarian sense) for the attention to focus on.

And clearly they (shamans) wouldn't be able to go into the "netherworld" or "dreamworld", which is often mentioned as one of their activities, without belief in the existence of such a realm.











[edit on 21-4-2008 by Vanitas]

The term 'shaman' is not to be confused with any religious belief whatsoever. These are the people who take it upon themselves to learn the benefit of every plant, mineral or animal in their immediate surroundings for the better health and welfare of all those who have other 'careers' to fill their time. They know when or what to hunt and when or what to plant, how the processes should proceed and who is best suited for those functions.

They are also the ones to explore the 'inner worlds' of their fellows by seeking answers themselves. They interpret dreams after learning what the symbols in dreams mean. When you dream of a sea, it could mean you are dreaming of your mother or are looking for a wife, for instance. CG Jung (among other psychologists) is a wonderful source for interpreting dreams in much the same way a shaman would.

Shaman were, and still are, the medical doctors and psychologists of the primitive world and, imo at least, can be every bit as effective as their modern counterparts since there are plenty of charlatans posing as doctors/psychologists today.

'Belief' is the first step away from true shamanism, since it pre-supposes reliance on dogmatic thought; ie. "I don't know why it's so, but I believe it to be true because this is what I've been told."

A shaman doesn't trust in dogma- he or she trusts in the experiences gained through a life-long process of prescribed 'hands-on' learning no different than it is for a medical practioner today (except that it is one on one, not 500 on one as is normal in universities today). In that way, shamanism may or may not be a good thing, depending on the quality of the knowledge passed on by the teacher.

Shamanism has been given a bad rap overall by the religious communities and the medical profession in that they consistently focus on the idiotic methods some faux shaman have used while completely ignoring the harm chronic pill pushers are making within our own societies.

On one hand, in Gabon, ambitious people kill children and eat their organs thinking that their luck will increase by the practice.

On the other, our doctors are willing to create designer children in test tubes for the stupidest notions.

Finding the middle road isn't easy.


[edit on 21/4/08 by masqua]

reply to post by Vanitas


A shaman, in my opinion, has discarded all the trappings and nonsense of his own belief system. So many people go through the motions, attending churches, following a given routine, and having no idea why. A quick example, a friend of mine was Catholic, but he wondered, why the priest would chant in a language no one understood, what was with the fireballs and spraying water, and up down kneeling standing sitting. What did all of this ceremonial action have to do with the teachings of his God? It is all repeated like an annual children's play that no one wants to go to, but they feel obligated to do so.

Noe allow me to give you a more Shaman like opinion of the matter.

Why only celebrate Spirit on one day? Why do the people seem miserable? Why are they in a building, away from nature, the temple hand made by God? Why is so much time wasted, not teaching and discussing the actually church teachings? Are these Church teachings, or actually God's teachings? Which comes from God, which comes from man? What is this hierarchy of power in the church, when no man can be closer to God than another?

It is possible for a Shaman to come from such a ritualized background as well. Even native peoples had ceremonies, and customs, and teachings that the Shaman would hold in question. These dogmatic ideas, or ceremonies are created to fill the gap of knowledge that a normal person has about Spirit.

Further more a Shaman would actually question the teachings themselves, and base their current belief system on what they learned via revelation and experience. Holding no idea or belief so sacred that they are above evolution and refinement, for the Shaman knows that as they grow, they will continue to realize that things they once believed are incorrect, whereas a normal person may hold onto beliefs and not know why, or consider something taught as set on stone.

I hope this expands on my point of view more. A Shaman seeks to strip away all impurities to their perception, constantly refining and changing their beliefs, as their point of view evolves, so much so that their concept of reality eventually doesn't even resemble the beliefs that started with.