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Jehovah's Witnesses?

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posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 06:29 PM
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I read the first page of the comments, and I just have to comment. I'm an agnostic/very close to being atheist. This being said, I was raised in a catholic church when I was young, I then went on to a baptist church, moved to a presbyterian(spelling), checked out a buddist temple, and even a Satanist cult. With all this being said one thing that I have learned is that its not the church, its the people who can be cult like. I actually studied with some witnesses for 3 years, absolutely great people. I went to there church, and found some craziness, but the truth is, I have found that where ever I went. Even the Satanist had some good points, and yes there was some very strange people in there, but there we also others that truly followed the religion, i.e. do no harm, unless provoked, and if forced to act destroy completely. They also of the philosophy of just not being a mindless slave repeating the same mantra only slightly modified which tends to be the case of all religions.

I guess in summary, everyone puts poo in there garden, some flowers are gentile and beautiful, others can have a deceptive thorn. you don't just say, forget it, and not plant if you get pricked by a thorn, on the same token, maybe next time when dealing with that type of flower, maybe you should be a little more careful.

The best advice I can give is, keep an open mind, everything you see, touch, feel, and do have goods and bads. It is our consciousness and ability to reason that allows us to way the bads, and see if the goods outwiegh them.

Never stop learning, Never let someone reason for you, Never give up, Never surrender.

Cheers,

Camain




posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 06:43 PM
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Jw's have always been polite when approaching me at my front door. I accept their literature and read it. It's interesting to read of their beliefs and how they view the world. Around here in central Kentucky it's not just white-shirted, tie wearing boys on bicycles. There was a family who used to knock on my door once a month and leave the literature and not pressure me. But eventually they stopped coming around, maybe because I was drunk the last time and wearing only my underwear and leered at that cute girl in the long dress.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 07:10 PM
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I was raised a Witness as well, and I think they're very good people. In fact, I'm considering returning to their faith now that I've finished college...

One thing that bothered me though was their perspective of marriage. Since I wasn't married (or planning on it) anytime soon, I was considered somewhat of an outcast. Most young women marry very early - and I'm talking 18 or 19. Since they do this to avoid fornication, it generally results in an early divorce as well. I've seen this several times...Dating is looked down upon - they want anyone to date with a view to marriage ONLY.

Also, the Witnesses encourage people to study a trade rather than go to college. A lot of them end up not finishing a 4 year degree simply because of all the negative comments they get. Also, most college aged people end up married and starting families, which was something I wasn't ready to do...



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by Trams
I was just wondering what you all thought about them. I did a quick search and found some interesting things. But I didn't find my answers. What do the ATS members think about Jehovah's Witnesses?



They have unusual beliefs. Their leaders can on occasion get overly-aggressive in trying to induce new members. I've never know one to cause me any problems.

I see no reason they should be discussed on a conspiracy site.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 07:40 PM
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Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by hildar
 


For one thing Witnesses only do door to door service during a certain time in the day as to minimize disruptions for those home owners. A scond thing would be that if someone answers a door and is not interested that persons address is taken off a call back list.


This is untrue. I've had them appear at my door at any given time, granted it was never TOO early in the morning or TOO late at night but frequently at dinner time or even a little after. They've been told numerous times we werent interested, and they've come back time and time again, so I'm assuming my address was not taken off thier list.



Originally posted by Trams
 


MissValentine,
Like I said before their just trying to help. I'm really sorry for what happened, but lets not base one man on the whole. Thats close to being prejudice.



Oh, no...I'm far from prejudice. I have nothing against them at all, or anyone else for that matter. I just feel like they dont take no for an answer and they have a very braisen way of shoving thier beliefs down your throat. I'm just not interested in thier beliefs, not because I dislike them or feel any prejudice against them, dont think that.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 08:04 PM
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If you're wondering about the characteristics that are common to cults...

1. a leader who claims divinity, demands unquestionable obedience.

2. communication between friends and family sharply curtailed, ex members
shunned.

3. the cult goal is given priority over individual concerns such as trades, careers
or education.

4.guilt and fear of excommunication keeps members submissive and active in
the organizations work.

5. financial exploitation of members



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 08:21 PM
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So I was raised a JW and did not get out until I was 18. I can see how people who dont have a whole lot of contact with them could think that they are great people and for the most part they are. But... there are a few things that people dont know about them---
1) They believe every person on Earth who does not believe their doctrine is absolutely correct will be killed by their God at Armageddon(there are currently about 6 million JW's)
2) They hide child molestation reports given by their offending members to their elders unless required by law so the religion's name does not look bad. They currently have a database containing 20,000 names of individuals within their organization who have been accused of abusing children.
3) They believe that secular education(college) is evil and pointless unless you are going to a trade school, and they constantly tell their members not to go.
4) They believe the Earth is only 42,000 years old....and yes they still believe that humans have only been around for 6,000 years and that fossil records that prove otherwise were placed there by Satan.
5) When you decide you do not want to be a JW anymore your family that may remain in the cult are directed not to speak with you until you repent of your "sins". (I have seen my mother and sisters about four times combined in the last 5 years.

To sum it all up though I believe a lot of the people are good who are part of that religion but I believe the religion itself is a controlling cult just like every other religion out there!



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 09:28 PM
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Each and every JW receives instruction on how to carry out their preaching activity in a way that shows love and respect for the people they contact.

For instance in their Publication that all baptized witnesses receive every month, it gave firm council to:


8 Be Discerning and Tactful: As we contact people from door to door, we encounter a variety of reactions to our message. Some householders are receptive, others are indifferent, and a few may be argumentative or belligerent. In the case of the latter, on page 7 of Reasoning From the Scriptures, we are reminded that we are not seeking to “‘win arguments’ with people who show no respect for the truth.” If the householder is hostile, it is best for us to take our leave. We should never antagonize people by insisting that they talk with us or accept our point of view. We do not force our message on people. That would not be reasonable and could cause problems for other Witnesses and for the work in general.

9 Before starting to work in a territory, it is wise to check the territory card for notations of addresses where the residents have told us not to call. If there are such addresses, each publisher working that street should be told where not to call. No one should take it upon himself to call on these homes without the service overseer’s direction to do so.—See the June 1994 Our Kingdom Ministry, Question Box.


This is just one example. The last thing they want to do is make people angry at them. For the most part they are kind and very respectful.

That being said, it should be noted that JW's come from all walks of life and backgrounds. They are imperfect people, so some of them forget the instruction they receive. Some a new to the preaching activity and not as skilled or discerning or as tactful as they should be.


They come to our doors because they want to imitate Jesus and the first century Christians who were all zealous evangelizers.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 09:39 PM
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reply to post by Blueracer
 


Hi Blueracer,

I have had many friends involved in the JW's. I studied with them as will. I have had a witness put his foot in my door as I went to close it.

Some interesting info about JW's some may not know:

Charles Taze Russel who was the founder of the JW was reported to have been buried in a Masonic Cemetery, under a pyramid with Templar inscriptions.

Some say the Jehova's witnesses are of the same Illuminati bloodline. This is also a possible tie to the skulls and crossbones society,

Anyway...thats the goofy stuff.

The do refuse blood transfusions. Even if the blood is their own stored. There is no scripture to back this up, besides "Keep abstaining from blood"

They do no celebrate their birthdays. There is no scritpure to support this either besides the queen asking for "The Baptists head on a platter" when asked what she wants for her birthday.

They don't vote.

they don't smoke
They DRINK
and drink
and drink

They don't celebrate any holidays.

They do no believe in the holy trinity.

They have also predicted the 2nd coming of Christ 3 times.

JW's claim the rapture will be here before the generation of 1918 perishes.

Once that comes and goes.... I wonder what they will do.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 09:45 PM
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It should also be noted that many people deeply appreciate the JW's coming to their doors. That is one reason it is one of the fastest growing religions in the US.

They know that most people have their own religion, and that many people are not comfortable discussing Bible topics. They know that the vast majority of people will never become JW's. They do it because they believe that is is a commandment for all who profess to be Christians. They base this on scriptures like referring to the apostles;


..“every day in the temple and from house to house they continued without letup teaching and declaring the good news about the Christ, Jesus.”—Acts 5:42.


and the example of the apostle Paul who said:

; 20 while I did not hold back from telling YOU any of the things that were profitable nor from teaching YOU publicly and from house to house. 21 But I thoroughly bore witness both to Jews and to Greeks about repentance toward God and faith in our Lord Jesus. Acts 20:20-21


and finally this command from Jesus:

(Matthew 28:19-20) 19 Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded YOU. And, look! I am with YOU all the days until the conclusion of the system of things.”


Many of the accusations made against them are a lot of tripe.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 10:02 PM
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Witness2008,
I went to the meeting today. I go to a Romanian Congregation in Chicago. It was a great experience having someone from another City come to us and give a talk! The only problem with the congregations are when you try to join the Theocratic School, it starts getting weird then. People treat you different. Its like it changes your life!


Battlestar,
Thats yet another great point of view, that we should go further into. Post some more interesting theories!

1-Cent,
I'm really sorry that happened. They can get annoying. But its the human nature really. One way or another, your going to get a new job.


Blueracer, Thats the same Idea I had, if they are wrong, and if they act so nice. Why do so many people hate them? Or at least dislike them.

Annee,
en.wikipedia.org...
That should help you out.


OhZone,
Thanks for the links man, that mighty kind of you!


Hypntick,
Its funny when that happens. I've seen it happen atl east once. During a meeting, the person in the hospital that suffered from a heart attack called to answer a question from the Watchtower. Talk about commitment.

mullet35,
I have pondered on this for a while now. Usually when you reproduce with family, the baby comes out with a disability. Great questions!

camain,
Anything is possible. It does get a little weird in the Kingdom Halls, but nothing you wouldn't see at another religious building.

kyred,
That poor little girl...

But seriously, thanks for the story, maybe you should try to talk to them again. Your choice really.

JediK,
Hey its your life man, if you want to go back, whats stopping you? I say go with your guts!

Blaine91555,
The reason anyone is talking about JWs, is because there are a lot of misinterpretations and disinformation about them.

MissValentine,
I'm really sorry, maybe I was getting carried away.

Won't happen again!

Razor1,
Thanks for the answers man, helped some people. I know it helped me.


blindtheory,
Not to be on the offensive, but how do you know about all that data, and information? Thank you.

Sparky63,
Thanks for every little piece of information you've provided. Thanks a bunch!



Anyway, thank you all for contributing. Thanks for all your ideas, so far.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 10:08 PM
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As far as strange religions go, JW's are fairly mild, and only likely to hurt themselves. On the honesty scale, I would say they are very trustworthy.

Cult? I don't know, I think the line that defines a cult should be based on how easy it is to quit the religion, and on that level, JW's are not a coercive group.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 10:09 PM
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Oh, yes one more thing.

"Jehovah

Jehovah's Witnesses believe that God's name is Jehovah. They view the use of the name as a requirement for true worship. Jehovah is regarded as Almighty God, the supreme being and creator of everything, the sovereign of the universe. They believe that Jehovah's main qualities are love, justice, wisdom, and power, and that these qualities are consistently demonstrated throughout the bible.

Jesus

Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Jesus is the only-begotten Son of God. They are unitarian, believing that God and Christ are separate persons, and that the Holy Spirit is God's active force.[3] As with most Christian religions, Christ is regarded as the only means by which to approach God in prayer, and the means of salvation.[4] They believe that Jesus Christ is head of the Christian Congregation, and all must obey him. His role as mediator of the New Covenant is limited to those going to heaven to rule along with Christ,[5] whose number totals 144,000."

Just to clear up some things.

Here is why they believe Gods Name is Jehovah, because it is found in ancient texts in the Hebrew Bible. Hebrews recognize the name, but don't use it. It can be found in many Hebrew Verses. Yahweh, in Hebrew.
www.wwyd.org...
upload.wikimedia.org...


[edit on 176America/Chicagof2008Sat, 19 Apr 2008 22:14:38 -0500America/Chicago 3010America/Chicago by Trams]



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 10:14 PM
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reply to post by CaptainObvious
 


Hi there.

The individual that put his/her foot in your door was not taught to do that by the JWs.

I've read your posts. You do know how stories get made up of bits and pieces here and there. Whether true, half true, or downright lies. Some of the stuff you posted is no different than some of the posts people make up here about 9-11.

They do not believe in blood transfusions. That part is true. And it is because, just like you said, the scripture that says "Abstain from blood."

They do not celebrate birthdays. Not because the bible specificly says not to, but because when birthdays are mentioned in the bible, they are shown in a bad light.

They don't smoke but they feel that drinking, to moderation, is okay because even Jesus did so.

No they don't celebrate holidays. Nothing wrong with that.

They have reasons that they don't believe in the trinity. Because it's not real.

I don't think they have predicted the return of Christ. Maybe you can clarify that a bit. I'm confused as to what you mean exactly.

Also, about the rapture. Jehovah's Witnesses do NOT even believe in the rapture. That is false doctrine to them and I agree.

That is what I am talking about. Some truth and some falsehoods get combined and it's kind of hard to sort things out. Being a sceptic of 9-11 I am sure you know what I am talking about.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 10:44 PM
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reply to post by Enthralled Fan
 


I am an x Witness, and yes we were encouraged to take our children aside to spank them, some of the women carried wooden spoons in their purses.

I haven't read all the post yet, BTW.

Things that stand out in my mind, people who leave the Witnesses are shunned, even by family members, this is not taken lightly.

You are encouraged to marry within the congregation

You MUST go door to door, and pledge so many hours.

They are good people for the most part.

They are a off shoot of the seventh day adventists.

I did learn a lot, but I learned more after I left and started researching them.

Charles Taze Russell , the founder studied pyramidology




Charles Taze Russell, founder of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, published his book The Divine Plan of the Ages in 1886. Each copy had a large fold-out diagram dissecting a pyramid and explaining the biblical events it prophesied.


www.watchman.org...

Here is his tomb

www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk...

www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk...

I think Russell was pretty cool, and a seeker, but his followers stopped searching, they are not allowed to think anything other then he taught.

They are discouraged from reading anything other the the watch tower and tract society literature.

You are not to read any Bible but theirs, and yes, it is different then others in very subtle ways.

I would say yes, there was an attempt at brainwashing, in my point of view, by the repetitive re-reading and preaching of certain scriptures.

I am to bullheaded to be brainwashed.

more later.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 10:52 PM
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reply to post by Blueracer
 







They do not celebrate birthdays. Not because the bible specificly says not to, but because when birthdays are mentioned in the bible, they are shown in a bad light.






No they don't celebrate holidays. Nothing wrong with that.

I was taught because they were pagan, which is correct.






I don't think they have predicted the return of Christ. Maybe you can clarify that a bit. I'm confused as to what you mean exactly.


Yes they have




1914 was one of the more important estimates of the start of the war of Armageddon by the Jehovah's Witnesses (Watchtower Bible and Tract Society). They based their prophecy of 1914 from prophecy in the book of Daniel, Chapter 4. The writings referred to "seven times". The WTS interpreted each "time" as equal to 360 days, giving a total of 2520 days. This was further interpreted as representing 2520 years, measured from the starting date of 607 BCE. This gave 1914 as the target date. When 1914 passed, they changed their prediction; 1914 became the year that Jesus invisibly began his rule. 1914, 1915, 1918, 1920, 1925, 1941, 1975 and 1994, etc. were other dates that the Watchtower Society (WTS) or its members predicted. Since late in the 19th century, they had taught that the "battle of the Great Day of God Almighty" (Armageddon) would happen in 1914 CE. It didn't.
The next major estimate was 1925. Watchtower magazine predicted: "The year 1925 is a date definitely and clearly marked in the Scriptures, even more clearly than that of 1914; but it would be presumptuous on the part of any faithful follower of the Lord to assume just what the Lord is going to do during that year." 6
The Watchtower Society selected 1975 as its next main prediction. This was based on the estimate "according to reliable Bible chronology Adam was created in the year 4026 BCE, likely in the autumn of the year, at the end of the sixth day of creation." 8 They believed that the year 1975 a promising date for the end of the world, as it was the 6,000th anniversary of Adam's creation. Exactly 1,000 years was to pass for each day of the creation week. This prophecy also failed.
The current estimate is that the end of the world as we know it will happen precisely 6000 years after the creation of Eve. 9 There is no way of knowing when this happened.



www.religioustolerance.org...

[edit on 113030p://bSaturday2008 by Stormdancer777]



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 11:01 PM
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Only 144,000 JW's will go to heaven only they are allowed to partake of communion, only a few are still living and they will come back to rule with Christ during the thousand year reign, the rest of the Witnesses, and only Witnesses will live on paradise earth,

All others go to hell, which they think is just not attaining eternal life or death/the grave, they don't believe in hell,

I agree with them, that there isn't a hell,

man it is all coming back to me after all these years.

So since I left the JW's I have kept searching, tried to go back in time and see where all this god beliefe got its start.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 11:01 PM
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reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


Christmas is a pagan holiday. It's no more Jesus's birthday than mine or yours. Even if it was, you should know that they would not celebrate his brith anyway.

As for the return of Christ, didn't he return long ago? What are you saying that they are predicting him to return from?

Websites criticizing the JWs are a dime a dozen. And that looks like where you are getting your info from on some of this.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 11:04 PM
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reply to post by Blueracer
 


Go back and read what I wrote I said I agreed it was pagan in origin.



posted on Apr, 19 2008 @ 11:05 PM
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Blue I was a Witness I am not going on hearsay.

I haven't said anything really damaging about the JW's .

I am talking from my experiences with them.

Do I think they are a cult?

What isn't?





[edit on 113030p://bSaturday2008 by Stormdancer777]



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