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America is the most powerful nation EVER!!!

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posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 11:54 AM
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The simple matter is...

If we stopped policing the world, it'd eat itself alive.

People would do exactly the opposite of what they do now.. Instead of saying "Just because you're so powerful, doesn't mean you can police the world." They'd say "Look at how #ing powerful you are.. why dont you do something about this #?"

Just so everybody knows... if we cut off economic aid to every #ty country that didn't assist us in the war in Iraq, we'd be out of debt in 2 years. Tops.

So all of you can get off of your moral high horses because America does more good in the world than bad. We dont just stand around with our *snip* in our hands and thumbs up *snip* like everybody else.

Maybe that's why in 200 years we've become the strongest nation ever...

hmmm...? i wonder




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[edit on 23-4-2008 by 12m8keall2c]




posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 12:19 PM
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Sorry about the potty mouth.



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 12:30 PM
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There's a lot of nationalist bluster in this thread.

The US is bogged down in 2 wars, it's airforce falling apart and ageing rapidly, it's army on the brink of systemic failure, it's armour in need of replacement, it's economy in ruins, it's people endebted and enslaved, and then someone starts yelling 'USA, USA, USA' and making wild claims.

Everything mechanical has a lifespan. It can be short or long, but after a certain number of hours of operation, aircraft, tanks etc. will be structurally worn out and either scrapped or rebuilt. The more hours the aircraft is flying, the tank is driving etc, the faster they wear out. They will then need to be rebuilt or replaced.

The current US equipment are products of the cold war. In the 50's and 60's the US commisioned a series of studies, which showed that the initial 30 days of any future largely conventional conflict would decide the outcome. The reason being that the soviets focused on short term gains and produced warfighting equipment that would be more more numerous, efficient, but with shorter lifespan than US equipment. To counter this, the US needed to focus on the first 30 days of fighting and make equipment that would survive in that scenario as well as outclass soviet equipment.

This is the reason that so many aircraft and vehicles were put into service while being poorly suited for a protracted war. This was the reason that the Mig-29 had disposable engines, cheap electronics and poor structural integrity. Essentially, the pilot would be dead long before the engines needed a rebuild or structural integrity became a problem. The M1A1 was designed to use either a truck derived dieselengine or a helicopter derived gas-turbine engine. The turbine gave it much shorter range, but more power and greater speed, which gave it an edge in the initial 30 days. After 30 days, the winner would be dicided anyway, so it didn't really need to be fuel efficient.

Total world war with 24 hour intensive fighting didn't come, but now the US equipment built to fight that war, is used to fight longerlasting but less intensive conflicts, where the US has absolute advantage and the equipment will return mostly unharmed. This means that the US has great numbers of equipment being used more, costing more to keep in working condition, and no replacements on hand when replacement is needed.

At the same time, the professional army, all volunteer force is being stretched to it's limits. The US is involved in 2 'conflicts' with personnel trained to fight an intensive but short war with massive casualties, not a protracted war with no actual victory in sight.

And now this system is being prepared for a 3rd front in Iran, increasing the strain on all parts of the fighting-force, possibly breaking it, with no recovery in sight and little replacements available. Essentially gutting the force, and reducing it to a much smaller scale. Meaning that this will propably be the last big adventure of the US, and a decade from now, the US will have to decide to forego empire, or go bust. Attacking Iran will just make it that much more urgent to make a decission.



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 01:09 PM
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reply to post by Daniem
 


Actually there are winners in war. The problem with the Iraq situation is that it isn't really a "war." A major war is about eliminating the enemy as soon as possible with no regard for life. You simple destroy them before they destroy you and one side surrenders and the other side wins. The only true way to defeat radical Islam is to wipe out its existance, which means killing all those who practice it. Unfortunately, this won't happen anytime soon.



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 01:14 PM
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1st of all.. economy in ruins? Incase you forgot our economy is still the largest in the world and is pretty much the backbone of the entire planet? The ONLY reason China is catching up is due to it's slave labor and lack of quality assurance.. Lead painted toy trains anyone? No thanks. I like being able to see.

As for endebted and enslaved.. endebted some, yes. Enslaved... you're just.. wrong. No simpler way to put that.

Armor doesnt need replacement. It needs advancement. EFPs were designed specifically to pierce armored vehicles. They account for 20% of the attacks and 80% of the casualties. Measures have already been taken to handle that problem.

You do realize that most of the planes that are flying may have been designed back in the 60's but have for the most part undergone structural integrity tests along with multiple mid-life upgrades and part replacements right? To date i'm pretty sure the F-15 air-to-air record is about 178-0.

The fleet is aging, yes, but it would still wipe any other air force off the face of the earth. Now we're rolling out F-22's. Ha.

Now.. one last time.. America is not going to invade Iran. We're just going to crush the infrastructure with TLAMs and air strikes.

Honestly we dont even have to. We could let Israel do it. I'm sure they'd be happy to.

I'm sorry your country isn't a superpower. Geez.



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 06:37 PM
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So all of you can get off of your moral high horses because America does more good in the world than bad. We dont just stand around with our *snip* in our hands and thumbs up *snip* like everybody else.


More good than bad... Do you have any idea what the US have done in the last 50 years in the name of 'national interests'. Killing millions of people every decade by proxy, unseating elected governments and imposing dictators and juntas on populations in every 3rd world country they could think of. Why don't you do a little bit of reading, start with 'John Stockwell', and then expand from there.



A major war is about eliminating the enemy as soon as possible with no regard for life. You simple destroy them before they destroy you and one side surrenders and the other side wins.


That is hogwash. You've seen too many warmovies. The objective is not to 'eliminate' or 'destroy' the enemy with no regard for life. The primary objective of any army in any conflict is to remove any offensive capability of the enemy. This is usually enough to force a surrender, and if not then the secondary objective is to remove the enemys defensive capability. Removing the enemys logistical system is usually enough to achieve both. All of this at the slightest possible cost in lives and money possible.

There can be no winner unless there is a loser. The US didn't just remove the baath regime in Iraq, they also disbanded the army, disbanded the baath party, disbanded the civil service, the police and virtually every other functioning part of society, thus creating a void that the islamists were quick to fill. In short there was no longer a losing party because the republic of Iraq was litterally disbanded by the US. This is why the US is still bogged down in Iraq, fighting 30 different groups of very angry people. Had the US done some planning, they could have used the existing state apparatus to debaathify the country, maintain order and secure the borders. This is what was done in Japan and Germany after WW2.



The only true way to defeat radical Islam is to wipe out its existance, which means killing all those who practice it. Unfortunately, this won't happen anytime soon.


[sarcasm]
The only true way to defeat radical Zionism is to wipe out its existance, which means killing all those who practice it. Unfortunately, this won't happen anytime soon.

Congratulations, you just advocated genocide, I imagine that your parents will be very proud of you.
[/sarcasm]



You do realize that most of the planes that are flying may have been designed back in the 60's but have for the most part undergone structural integrity tests along with multiple mid-life upgrades and part replacements right? To date i'm pretty sure the F-15 air-to-air record is about 178-0.


It's not about integrity tests or upgrades, it's about service life and how many hours the aircraft is built to handle. When you upgrade an aircraft, you still use most or all of the original parts, so it may look nice and shiny, but most of the structural parts are old.

the air to air record is irrelevant if your F-15 disintegrates in mid-air.
[link]http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-f156nov06,1,6807945.story[/link]



The fleet is aging, yes, but it would still wipe any other air force off the face of the earth. Now we're rolling out F-22's. Ha.


Yes, roughly 200 F-22's to replace some 700 F-15 at a rate of 20 F-22's per year. That means the last F-15's will be retired at the tender age of 40.



Now.. one last time.. America is not going to invade Iran. We're just going to crush the infrastructure with TLAMs and air strikes.

Honestly we dont even have to. We could let Israel do it. I'm sure they'd be happy to.


Why so triggerhappy? Why do anything to Iran at all? They're not in any position to threaten the US!

[edit on 23-4-2008 by aaa2500]



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 07:31 PM
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reply to post by aaa2500
 


"it's airforce falling apart and ageing rapidly"


ARE YOU KIDDING ME??????????

Where do you get your information?From Russian news?WOW,how IGNORENT are you?We have the most advanced airforce IN THE WORLD.I will say no more.Have you heard of the f-15,f-16,f-18,b-2,f-117,F-22......any of them?Not to mention our C-5's,B52'S,satilite's,cruise missles,drones,gunships............should I continue?

[edit on 4/23/2008 by jkrog08]



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 07:46 PM
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reply to post by aaa2500
 


WOW,you and someother people on here are in FOR A HUGE REALITY CHECK................HAHAHAHA,I cant wait,think what you want........even our "aging"airforce is 30 years more advanced than anything else.Um.......you are aware of the "F-35'Lightning'Joint Stike Fighter"right?


Also,you are aware our military is moving towards AI combat craft?Within 20 years(or less)over 75% will be unmanned.........but just as deadly.Also do you care to think of our "Top Secret" programs?

I guess our "Airborne Missle Defense System"That uses Particle Beam technology...........AKA laser.I guess thats old and outdated aswell?

Well it's funny no other country has this outdated tech.

The funny thing is you actually think you are right and our airforce is weak..............WOW,I really hope your country doesnt go to war with us...............cause we will straight "run in your mouth".



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 07:48 PM
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reply to post by aaa2500
 


"used to fight longerlasting but less intensive conflicts"


Kinda' like this thread uh?



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 07:56 PM
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Originally posted by jkrog08
Have you heard of the f-15


Apparently, you have less than 800 of them.

f-16:

Again, 800.

f-18:

400



b-2:

Less than a hundred.

f-117:

Less than 70.

F-22:

Originally 750, but that was dropped to about 200 due to budget caps.

In total, a rather amatuer estimate would be a total of about 2500 aircraft, many of which have indeed been around since the cold war.


My understanding is that the russians, having not decomissioned fighters they deemed as aeronautically inferior, have nearly triple that estimate.

Tech doesn't mean nothing if you've got a wall of fighters heading into your airspace, with each pilot in some cases more capable than your own men.

Btw, Hi again.



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 09:12 PM
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reply to post by Anti-Tyrant
 


'Tech doesn't mean nothing if you've got a wall of fighters heading into your airspace, with each pilot in some cases more capable than your own men. '

Actually it DOES................thats why the US didn't follow suit with Russia,rather it designed LESS,but MORE ADVANCED craft.


And we don't need alot of fighters because the one's we do have are "air superiority"fighters,which means one can kill many of the enemy and can control the air over enemy nations.

Less than 100 b-2'a.........yea,but you can't see them on RADAR,and you definatly can't hear them,I know cause I watched one fly overhead before.


Any "swarm"of enemy fighters headed towards the US would be shot down way before they got anywhere close.Shot down by what?Well by our Navy one,by our fighter's two.


The USAF is the largest and one of the most technologically advanced air forces in the world, with about 6013 manned aircraft in service (4,282 USAF; 1,321 Air National Guard; and 410 Air Force Reserve); approximately 160 Unmanned Combat Air Vehicles, 2161 Air-Launched Cruise Missiles, and 580 Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles;[3] and as of April 4, 2008, had 328,808 personnel on active duty, 70,303 in the Selected and Individual Ready Reserves, and 106,254 in the Air National Guard. In addition, the Air Force employs 141,573 civilian personnel.[3]

"O/A-10A/C Thunderbolt
An-26 Curl
B-1B Lancer
B-2A Spirit
B-52H Stratofortress
C-5A/B/C/M Galaxy
KC-10A Extender
C-12C/D/F Huron
C-17A Globemaster III
C-20A/B/C Gulfstream III
C-20G/H Gulfstream IV
C-21A Learjet
C-22B
VC-25A (Air Force One)
C-26B Metroliner
C-29A (HS.125-800)
C-32A
C-37A Gulfstream V
C-38A Astra
C-40B Clipper
C-41A Aviocar
C-130E/H/J Hercules
AC-130H/U Spectre/Spooky II
HC-130H/N
LC-130H
MC-130E/H/W Combat Talon/Combat Spear
WC-130J
C-135C/E/K Stratolifter
NC-135B/E/W
KC-135E/R/T Stratotanker
EC-137D Stratoliner
VC-137C
CN-235-100
E-3B/C Sentry
E-4B
E-8C JSTARS
E-9A
F-15A/B/C/D Eagle
F-15E Strike Eagle
F-16A/B/C/D Fighting Falcon
F-22A Raptor
F-35 Lightning II
F-117A Nighthawk
MH-53J/M Pave Low III/IV
HH-60G Pave Hawk
Mi-8 Hip
NT-39A/B Sabreliner
OC-135B
M/RQ-1A/B Predator
RQ-4A Global Hawk
MQ-9 Reaper
RC-135S/U/V/W
T-1A Jayhawk
T-6 Texan II
T-37B Tweet
(A)T-38A/B/C Talon
Boeing T-43
TC-18E
TC-135S/W
TE-8A
TG-3A
TG-4A
TG-7A
TG-9A
TG-10B/C/D
TG-11A
TG-15A/B
UH-1N Iroquois
U-2R/S Dragon Lady
UC-26C
UV-18A/B Twin Otter
UV-20A Chiricua
CV-22B Osprey
U-28A
WC-135C/W



en.wikipedia.org...

You said what?


[edit on 4/23/2008 by jkrog08]



posted on Apr, 23 2008 @ 10:34 PM
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Originally posted by jkrog08
Where do you get your information?From Russian news?WOW,how IGNORENT are you?


See the irony here? Someone calling someone else ignorant when they can't even spell IGNORANT.



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 01:22 AM
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Originally posted by fozotronic
reply to post by Amaterasu
 

I couldnt beleive that bush got a second term in office i had given the american people more credit, must be that people beleive the propaganda they see on CNN, Fox, ABC.


You are aware that the votes were tampered with and that in Ohio - where the whole thing was decided, where they were using voting machines from companies like Diebold - the exit polls showed Kerry winning fairly well. When the votes were counted, Bush squeaked by. The results were skewed way off statistical probability of error.

So Bush was not elected in 2000, being appointed by the Supreme Court when voting issues arose in Florida and they didn't want to do it over. And then he stole it illegally in 2004.



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 02:22 AM
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"it's airforce falling apart and ageing rapidly"


ARE YOU KIDDING ME??????????


I seem to recall these averages
F-16, F-18 : average age around 15-20 years.
F-15 : average age around 25 years.
B-52,KC-135 : average age around 45-50 years.



Where do you get your information?From Russian news?WOW,how IGNORENT are you?We have the most advanced airforce IN THE WORLD.


Sigh... Age is about airframe service life, not about how advanced an individual fighter is.

Russian news is propably more accurate than Fox news.



WOW,you and someother people on here are in FOR A HUGE REALITY CHECK................HAHAHAHA,I cant wait,think what you want........even our "aging"airforce is 30 years more advanced than anything else.Um.......you are aware of the "F-35'Lightning'Joint Stike Fighter"right?


You don't seem to get the point. Advanced fighters are nice to have, except the advanced US fighters are rapidly approaching the end of their servicelife.

The F-35 is so far only a pipedream. Over weight, under spec and over budget, it is less capable than an F-16, and even though the US plans to buy 2500 of them, the price keeps going up. It's no longer the cheap low tech stealth capable F-16 replacement, now it's the expensive, low tech, less capable, stealthyish FUTURE F-16 replacement.

As for Stealth, secret projects, unmanned vehicles, and airborne lasers, these are also interesting but right now useless technologies, kind of like the Nazi A4 and ME262 during WW2. Nice in theory, but not enough or even in actual production yet.



The funny thing is you actually think you are right and our airforce is weak


You seem to think that an aircraft will fly forever and does so on magic alone. You think that Stealth is like magic, so the B-2 becomes transparent and then the ruskies can't see it. Did you ever hear the term 'Magical thinking'?



And we don't need alot of fighters because the one's we do have are "air superiority"fighters,which means one can kill many of the enemy and can control the air over enemy nations.


But when those ageing fighters are flying with restrictions(don't pull too many positive g's while manouvering, Only run turbines within safe parametres), they are severely castrated and no longer air superiority fighters.



Less than 100 b-2'a.........yea,but you can't see them on RADAR,and you definatly can't hear them,I know cause I watched one fly overhead before.


More like 20 and every aircraft is visible to radar. The issue is to tune the radar algorithms to detect even aircraft with a small radar cross section, while not falsely thinking that a bird is an aircraft. This can be done, and is part of soviet and russian radar systems built after 1989, and european systems built since the mid 80's. Don't forget that Stealth is based on soviet and german research from the 30-80's. Germany even developed their own stealth testbed in the 70's.

[edit on 24-4-2008 by aaa2500]



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 06:57 AM
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Originally posted by jkrog08
reply to post by aaa2500
 


I guess our "Airborne Missle Defense System"That uses Particle Beam technology...........AKA laser.I guess thats old and outdated aswell?

Well it's funny no other country has this outdated tech.


You seem to have this impression that the rest of the world will sit idlely on its arse while America goes about updating its technology. You think europe, japan, russia will all just wave there hands and say "aahhh well never mind! lets put the kettle on, we dont want to spoil there fun!"

You dont think that other countries may have advanced projects of their own? Okay not to the same extent as america, but you can be sure that other countries ARE updating software, creating more capable and advanced aircraft, generally researching new ways of waging war ACCORDING TO THEIR NEED. Sure you can say "yeah, but only america is developing superstealth-scramjet-powered-Laser-armed-automated-gunship drone whatever", but remember most countries have NO NEED of such exotic peices of kit. Most of the world only needs enough to defend its interests, not wage armageddon on anyone who looks at you funny.



even our "aging"airforce is 30 years more advanced than anything else

Wrong. Its been established that much of your frontline kit was first developed in the 60s-80s era, so for that to be true the rest of the world would still be using spitfires and messerschmits right? Does the Tornado/typhoon/su27/harrier etc not ring any bells? Europe had the prospect of a cold war turning "hot" too you know.

And by the way, a particle beam isnt a laser. Its a particle beam

Particle beam



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 12:11 PM
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JKrog you make me laugh you really do, if some one attacked your country you would do what? Well we know dont we, nothing, if we are to believe the official story of 9/11 a group of half assed rag heads killed 3.5 k people and what was the response, total panic.

So Einstein if you cannot protect your people or country from perps highjacking your own planes and flying them into your cities how the hell do you think your going to stop a concentrated attack. And just think only 6 million Muslims living in the US, just think of what a fraction of them could do, just 19 brought your country to a standstill. And what were you told, oh there were only 2 planes available, I wonder where all those others were.

You see thats your problem you understand nothing of war or the will of those who will take up the fight and for all your bluster you cannot win JACK [5q/, no win in Vietnam, Korea, Iraq 2 and Afganistan. How does your military might fail so consistently against basically 3rd rate forces yet well motivated and organised.

I'll tell you why its because just like you they believe in numbers and technology to do the job, you have poorly lead troops and troops that are not as good as you think they are, again history proves this. They lack the motivation of someone who is trying to exterminate them and who is killing their women and children is a big asset not to have.

But please dream on, the bubble will burst soon then you can have a big ol bawl about it. Perhaps when you are stood in the food queue's you may ponder your rash and arrogant views thats as long as you have not been drafted and get killed by a Muslim freedom fighter.



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 12:57 PM
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Whatever.........I guess we will just have to wait and see if we ever are attacked what will happen to that country.Oh and if we really wanted to take out Iraq we easily could,but we are not trying to totally destroy it.



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 01:03 PM
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America is a pawn to a evil King.

America, and China, are basically Satan.

America and the idea of reality as we know it will, WILL, WILLLLL be demolished by galactic warfare.

I can promise you the sattelites in the skies to belong to humans anymore.

=)



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 01:08 PM
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Originally posted by TheRealYoda7
America is a pawn to a evil King.

America, and China, are basically Satan.

America and the idea of reality as we know it will, WILL, WILLLLL be demolished by galactic warfare.

I can promise you the sattelites in the skies to belong to humans anymore.

=)



What?

Could you explain please?



posted on Apr, 24 2008 @ 01:19 PM
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Im sick of trying to make a obvious point to you all,I will never change your minds-you will just have to see for yourself( hope you don't)


I will waste no more of my valuable time getting information to counter anything,it is just ridiculous (but honorable)that you all refuse to admit the obvious.Even with our air-force aged........our fighters(you realize we make more right?)are still the top's in the world.


I guess the US has the rest of the country where we want hem.......to think of us as vulnerable and weak..................let them try some sh*t and we will OBLITERATE THEM(that was a figure of speech,not referring to nukes)


Sure other countries are developing new tech............but nothing like our secret stuff that no one knows about.........trust me,you don't want us to roll those out.


Just a thought-Anyone remember the soldiers stories from the first Iraq war about "saucers"hovering over the battlefield shooting beam's of "light"at the Iraq army?And when they went to see what was left of the target that was shot............there was nothing but a scorch mark.

We have had alot of this "theoretical"tech like particle beams,laser,masor,fasor...................scram jet and other advanced stuff since the 60's.................do you really think we have made no progress,or as little as we would have you believe?We have the smartest scientist in the world,I think not.

[edit on 4/24/2008 by jkrog08]




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