Free Tibet? Hell, free America!

reply to post by emeessa


I wouldn't have said "odd" but I know what you mean - many people in the UK mistake being quiet with being aloof or arrogant, and I never found that to be the case.

I worked with a couple of norwegian guys and a swedish guy and they were very different, but in a way that was hard to define.

I sometimes wish my own government would act the same way as yours does, and just concentrate on its own citizens, instead of getting mixed up in other peoples problems.

My belief is that a government should sort out their own country above everything else - look after their own citizens first and foremost.

As a side note, you may notice that there are butons called "friend" and "foe"

If you don't mind, I'll add you to my friends list

reply to post by Witness2008


I have no problem with saying where I'm from I'm a swede, you know.. the country of commies and clipclopshoes.

At some time in our lives we all end up victims for crime, as have I. But.. a gun is a thing for murder, and whatever crime we end up being victims for.. Not carrying a gun can be what saves us too. Uhm.. I don't know the name for it, selfdefense? Taking courses in selfdefense is a better idea, they'll teach you both how to think about the crime and how to make sure you'll walk away. The more guns a country have, the bigger is the risk of ending up on the wrong side of it.. And.. honestly.. I'd take a knifestabbing over being shot any day.

reply to post by emeessa


Sorry I missed reading where you referred to yourself as swedish. I always question that if I had indeed had a gun would I have used it? It turned out that calm and and itellect kept me from any more danger.

Most of the violence in this country is gang related and done with guns. On occassion that anger and desperation seeps into our lives and you begin to question the remedies and what you can stand to sacrifice while we repair our society. A lot of people with a lot of guns...Who gives them up first? And then there will be the black market, we have that now and most regular people won't go shopping for them there. Where do you start? That is the context of the argument over here. We have been going in the wrong direction on the gun issue, people carry them into churches now, sad and pathetic I know. I am sure when the world looks in our direction we must leave a lot of people scratching their heads.

reply to post by budski


A countrys leaders are there for their people.. but sometimes it seems as if the leaders think that the people are only there for Them.

Hehe, I'd say we're a bit odd. Even from our own point of view, and kind of hard to understand - even for the other scandinavians.. but thats mutual I think some of the differances between the scandinavian countries can be traced back to when we where at war with eachother. Hippies is what we are now, but we've had our fair chare of wars too.

Hehe, yeah, I've noticed the friend/foe buttons.. And if you don't mind I'll add you as a friend to.

I had a friend from London when I were younger.. and the biggest cultural clash between us was the different way of thinking about money - and how we acted when irritated and/or angry. I felt that she was barbaric, brutal and noicy while she thought I was a silly wooz who stubbornly refused to shout back


At times I think that a lot of the wars and clashes in the world never would have happened if countries just could stop trying to be the "big brother".. Just look at Isreal vs Palestina. What right did "we" have to give Palestinian country to Isrealits (?) with the argument that Germany had a debt to the jews? It's one of the biggest issues in Europe still.. and If "we" just would have kept our noses out of what was not Our problem but germanys.. there wouldn't be the Israel vs Palestin situation. Pay a debt to one "race" on the cost of anothers life? Euw..

reply to post by Witness2008


From up here where I'm sitting.. yes.. some parts of the american culture is hard to understand.. But putting it in the light of history..

I'm sorry if I end up sounding a bit rude and elitistic.. it's hard for me to put in the right "tune" when writing in english so I might end up sounding a lot worser than I intend to.. but here we go..

The people who emigrated from Europe to US to start with faced all kinds of threaths that didn't exist over here. The country was wild, the where the threath from the native american tribes, and the issue of people in dispeare, frustration and whom were desperate. It was more or less lawless from time to time and the only one who could protect the family was the part of it that had a weapon of some sort.

First, the wars agains nature and the struggle to survive in a new wild place, second, the fighting down the native americans, third, fighting poverty and thiefs, fourth, the civilwar.. and going on to the Vietnam, first and second worldwar and so on..

US have a very short history.. and a lot of it involves fighting, either just to survive, eachother and when the reasons to fight for survival inside the US the country went on to "Saving the world" instead. It's not yet in your historical culture to Talk things over, to take that deep breath that'll be needed for the Americans to start trusting the Americans.

US is a Very young country and you're still not "fully grown".. yet not stabile and calm within. It Will become that way, but I dont think we'll live to see it.

Originally posted by emeessa

US have a very short history.. and a lot of it involves fighting, either just to survive, eachother and when the reasons to fight for survival inside the US the country went on to "Saving the world" instead. It's not yet in your historical culture to Talk things over, to take that deep breath that'll be needed for the Americans to start trusting the Americans.

US is a Very young country and you're still not "fully grown".. yet not stabile and calm within. It Will become that way, but I dont think we'll live to see it.

This is something that I've often thought about, and amongst european cultures there is a perception that america is still struggling to find its unique cultural identity, or its "personality"

Of course it could equally be said that because america is such a large and diverse country, it doesn't have a single culture.
Rather it is a stewpot of many cultures which are constantly clashing - sometimes to the detriment of the country as a whole.

In many ways it can be said it is a young country which has grown strong out of proportion to its maturity - but I'm not sure that this is the case.

The country was founded by europeans, and then further populated by many other nationalities, and I think that it is the melding of all these disparate cultures into a singularity which has led to some "teething problems"

I have the highest regard and respect for american people - but sometimes I despair of them forputting up with someone like bush.

No offense to any americans - it's just my tuppence worth

reply to post by budski


Aye, You do have a very good point there..

Looking at my lil conutry thats purdy darn small there are differences in culture depending on wether you're up north or down south.. and We've been the same people (more or less..) for a very long as.. as in US case I think they are still in the "blending" fase of the cooking.
People talk about immigrant's children going out of controle due to loosing their roots.. If that is an excuse/explanation for individuals to act crazy.. From both where I'm sitting and where You're sitting US is a country with alot of rootless people.. can that theory have anything to do with it? o0

Sooner or later, all the different cultures in US well smooth out and become more or less one culture.

But.. what I Now started wondering about is.. IF it's based a lot on the cultural clashes.. shouldn't Canada be in just the same state of.. eh.. mind?

Talking about Canada I know more about the countryside in Sask. than I know about all of Canada.. But it is after all a country that has evolved during the same timespan as US, and with the same "starting ground".

..esch.. im brainstorming.

reply to post by emeessa


Right on. I totally agree. We are a mixed bag of good and bad..on occassion it gets shook up and then it all looks chaotic. The greed over here is a bad, bad thing that has created most of our problems right now. This war in Iraq is driven by greed for money and power. There are the gun totten, flag waving patriots that think we are still fighting back the Indians and wild things and want everything to be solved with bibles and firearms and the greedy take advantage of them. We wage war on drugs on poverty on terroisim and as of late each other. I don't think any of those wars will be won anytime soon. Wars need to become a thing of the past for us and I hope to see that in my life time. I am optimistic.

We do have our good points however. Our constitution in my opinion is the perfect document to lead us, if only we could get back to that.

reply to post by emeessa


A canadian told me the difference was because they kept hold of their british roots and culture (cue raggae)

That didn't really work for the aussie's, but it did for new zealand.

And by british I mean all the country's in the british isles, plus we'd better mention the irish as well.

The irish are everywhere.
I bet you can find an irish bar in most tourist countries.

That's an example of a country and culture which has maintained itself for many, many years, in the face of some people who wanted to destroy that culture.

reply to post by budski


My closest friend in Canada thinks and acts a lot like the europeanroots in his family, but is laughing his head of towards the canadians higher up north that still cling on to the French.

Oh, we have an irish pub here in my hometown.. owned by an arab. It's kinda fun But yes, some people evolve With their culture, keeping the roots close no matter where they end up. It's a bit the same with us swedes, some old traditions we just wont stop with - no matter what. But as it goes for New Sweden (located somewhere in the US) they still hang on to the old swedish traditions, even tho I think they've lost some of the knowledge about Why we celebrate certain things.

I belive the key to surviving, and living side by side, is to understand and respect the traditions and the way of life in the country you end up in.. and/or the culture of ones neighbours.

reply to post by budski


Our history is made up of fighting for the best of what was there, and during our floods of immigration there was much fighting. Many immigrants ended up in the slums fighting each other for scraps. My ancestors were French trappers (the earliest on these shores) Scotts and Germans along with a splash of Native American. They were all hard working trying to get ahead and see to that american dream. Coveting anothers wealth is what made us what we are, fighting tooth and nail to get ahead. We do not like being second best at anything, this is why the immigration flood still continues. I do not think it is the freedom that most are looking for I think it is the wealth they want. Greed is what it's all about over here. Our immigration problem is big right now, we fight each other over what the solution should be and it turns out that the cheap labor that is needed for executives in corporations to line there pockets more is what drives the problem. Greed is not only an American vice we just don't care that it can be seen.

reply to post by Witness2008


Of course there are som good points over there US have done some good in the world, and a lot of it's in habitants are remarcable wonderfull human beeings.

Unfortunatly.. it's selldom the good things that "we" remember and notice. But that speaks more about "our" ignorance and stupidity

Originally posted by emeessa

Oh, we have an irish pub here in my hometown.. owned by an arab. It's kinda fun

FUNNY

I belive the key to surviving, and living side by side, is to understand and respect the traditions and the way of life in the country you end up in.. and/or the culture of ones neighbours.

I believe in live and let live, because it's easier than confrontation

On the other hand, I will always retain my cultural identity, even if it is a bit mixed up
People from europe are much more likely to say "because that's my culture, that's who I am"

IMO people from the US are more likely to take offense if you question a cultural identity.

This may be a case of misunderstanding.
Europeans have been fighting for so long we got bored of it, and decided talking and getting rich was a better option.

America's leaders still think that fighting is the best way to get really rich and powerfull.

But we can't blame the american people for that.

Errmmmm - except for electing them

It's still like being at school:

The europeans are the brainy kids who just want to get on with it and not do anything too violent.

The americans are the sportsmen and testosterone junkies who always want some action.

The rest of the playground looks on with a little trepidation.



And the UK is the kid in the middle who doesn't know which group he belongs to

[edit on 18/4/2008 by budski]

reply to post by budski


You can only blame half of the Americans for voting bush into office and that other half is a greater number then the whole British population of 60 million.

reply to post by budski




Right on!! oh, i can't stop laughing.. but Yeah.. I think you're right.

I think some of the UK's problems with "where do we belong" comes from it not that long ago, having problems with IRA? There's still a form of freedom fight going on there.. and even tho the country - and it's people - are old enough to join us retired old dinosaurs in the "Esch, let's talk it through over a cup of coffee"club some of the fighting over there is still in fresh memory.. eh.. I Might be Waaaay of track, I haven't studied the UK/Scotish/Irish history in a long time.. I think I was about 13 last time I read anything about that.. (that'd be 10 years ago..)

The problem with being "the best kid in class" and allways trying to smooth things down is that the testosteron kid sometimes take advantage of that.. sooner or later we Might wake up one day and wonder Why the heck US hit us in the head with a book..

Live and let live is a very good way of looking at life.. and suddenly i felt an urge to go to UK for a cup of coffee this thread is interesting as h*ll and I hafta say that the writers in it seems to be people with one good brain, and heart, and spine.

reply to post by Witness2008


I read a book by James A Michener, called Chesapeake, which detailed the earliest settlers and the things they went through, right up until the modern day.

And Centennial.

And many others - the books may not be the most accurate in the world (they're not textbooks after all) but they are truly rivetting and give you a sense of the hardships and difficulties faced.

So I understand the cultural identity in that regard - I don't understand how regional identities came about, and how the country came to be so split.

Instead of coming together, it seems the different states/regions have drifted further apart.

reply to post by emeessa


Hey Emeessa, I know this is offtopic, but is your last name Tokos? I knew an Emeessa Tokos from Hungary.
Just wondering if you might be her.

-Jimmy

reply to post by Witness2008


60 millions in UK? How many in US?


..i fell silly.. you guys have any idea how small my country is compared to yours?

reply to post by jimmyjackblack


Nopers, I'm a Swede and Emeessa is just a combination of letters i started using some years ago Sorry i'm not her.

reply to post by emeessa


You know, if it ever happens, that books gonna hurt.

But I also think we learned to duck a long time ago - if we have to.

The whole northern ireland thing was eventually sorted out by tony blairs government.
He let all the terrorists out of prison.

Then went off to fight the war on terror.

It doesn't seem to make sense.

But apparently it does - because they were OUR terrorists.

So we let them go, and made peace so that we could fight more terrorists.

That's the problem with being the kid in the middle.