Elmer_Dinkley
To say that all video footage is meaningless is extreme
to say the least,seems to me you are poo pooing the subject
matter!
I think this one is hoax too,but to dismiss it out of hand
before it has been gone over with a fine tooth comb,and
analyzed properly by the right people ,is criminal imo.
If this has Jaime Maussan involved,then I`m
pretty sure it`s a fake,as he`s in it for the money imho,
until we have the footage from the guy who filmed this
to analyze,then I agree with you kindred,to an extent LOL
So you believe that ALL footage is fake then,and if not
what`s a good example of what you believe to be real?

Hi Elmer, I never said all UFO video footage is fake, but unless it's from a reputable source and is the full footage and not just short clips, then I personally wouldn't waste my time with it. Eye witness accounts lend credence to any sighting, but even then it doesn't mean it's definitely an Alien Spaceship, but atleast it can be proved that it's probably not a hoax.

You make me sound like I'm a UFO debunker, which couldn't be further from the truth. I've always been interested in UFO's from an early age, ever since I went to watch ET at the pictures. From that day I became hooked on anything to do with UFO's and the paranormal. I bought every magazine I could get my hands on, subscribing to UFO magazine, UFO reality, Sightings and Quest magazine. In recent years my interest has waned considerably, mainly because I don't think we are any closer to finding out the truth. 50 years is along time to wait for the truth and I don't think my patience stretches that far.

There's been plenty of good sightings and good video footage, which is why I believe we probably are being visited by ET, even though it's still yet to be proven. The Belgium sightings of flying triangles and NASA UFO footage are probably some of the best cases. I personally don't think we'll ever know the truth and like I've said before, the governments don't seem like there going to come forward with the truth any time soon and I very much doubt that Aliens are going to making contact for atleast another 200-500 years. We are just not civilized enough for contact and relations with another higher Alien civilization.

P.S Thanks for the star skept!cal.

Originally posted by Nohup

Originally posted by hammanderr
We can all speculate all we want, but without the original video analysis even the scant contribution that this video could provide to the ufo community is lacking.

Quite so. Perhaps it might be possible to get a decent analysis from the original video. But the best we could possibly say about it is that if it's a hoax, we don't know how it was done. \That's nowhere near saying it's "real," and a few billion miles away from verifying that it's some kind of craft controlled by time travelers or aliens or leprechauns.

[edit on 21-4-2008 by Nohup]

Nohup, I agree that saying it's a hoax is nowhere near saying it's real.
Jeesh...

I'm so glad you agree with me that there are no physical biological beings out there visiting our planet -- now or in the past or the future, for that matter, in their marvelous flying machines!

Good to see that there are some members here, like me and you, who know that such stuff is nothing but sci-fi fiction!

[edit on 21-4-2008 by Palasheea]

Based on this thread and the many others like it I would go so far as to say that we have to move beyond mere photographic or video evidence in this day and age. In an age where any fool can create convincing looking evidence we are truly getting nowhere with all of our conjecture and "conclusions" as to the realness or or fakeness of any given photo or video.
Unless an object can be shown to be performing some function or have some intention or be identified as definitely extraterrestrial or otherwise extraordinary, what difference will it ultimately make? Those who are already convinced will be more convinced and those who are not will continue to be unconvinced.
I cannot see that this video nor others like it, (i.e. clear yet entirely inconclusive objects which exhibit no observable properties or lights moving against a dark background which are similarly inconclusive) can ultimately lead to anything other than mere speculation.

[edit on 21-4-2008 by hammanderr]

Originally posted by Palasheea
Nohup, I agree that saying it's a hoax is nowhere near saying it's real.
Jeesh...

That's not what I said. I said that not being able to prove something is a hoax is not the same as saying that it's legitimate. Just because you don't know how a magic trick is done, doesn't make it any less of a trick.

Some people here fail to see that distinction. To them, if an image or bit of footage can't be proven a hoax, that means it's "real," and joy reigns as all the evil debunkers must be forced to admit their shameful defeat.

Originally posted by Nohup

Originally posted by Palasheea
Nohup, I agree that saying it's a hoax is nowhere near saying it's real.
Jeesh...

That's not what I said. I said that not being able to prove something is a hoax is not the same as saying that it's legitimate. Just because you don't know how a magic trick is done, doesn't make it any less of a trick.

Some people here fail to see that distinction. To them, if an image or bit of footage can't be proven a hoax, that means it's "real," and joy reigns as all the evil debunkers must be forced to admit their shameful defeat.

Oh, I see, so you don't think "magic" tricks are hoaxes.

Well, I think they are but that's just my own opinion.

In any case, the day I see a regular debunker here admit defeat is the day hell freezes over.

[edit on 21-4-2008 by Palasheea]

Originally posted by MrPenny

Originally posted by Palasheea
Below are two frame-shots from that section of this clip showing the location of that bird. It's flying in a straight line OVER/ABOVE that object.

Thanks for the frame-shots. The bird zips by pretty quick and the stills helps to freeze it a bit. So, it looks to me like the bird is just as focused as the object. I don't think that object is much larger than the bird.

Well, actually no. The bird is flying BEHIND that object. One is more focused than the other.

Um, just saying that you were right in the first place when you said that the bird was flying behind that object but then I showed you that it was not only flying at a further distance from where we are seeing that object in this vid but that that bird is also zipping by OVER/ABOVE that object too!

So I agree with you that the bird is BEHIND that object but still am perplexed why you still are saying that that object and the bird are on the same plane and that they are both equally focused when they are clearly NOT.

One is behind and the other is in front... this means they are on 2 different planes... not one. This also explains why the object is more focused than that bird so I'm sorry but I'm not quite understanding what you mean here.

But the bottom line is that you were right in the first place that the bird is behind that object so this is an important fact in the overall analysis of this clip.



[edit on 21-4-2008 by Palasheea]

edit for reworking

[edit on 22-4-2008 by Sys_Config]

Well, actually no. The bird is flying BEHIND that object. One is more focused than the other.

Um, just saying that you were right in the first place when you said that the bird was flying behind that object but then I showed you that it was not only flying at a further distance from where we are seeing that object in this vid but that that bird is also zipping by OVER/ABOVE that object too!

So I agree with you that the bird is BEHIND that object but still am perplexed why you still are saying that that object and the bird are on the same plane and that they are both equally focused when they are clearly NOT.

One is behind and the other is in front... this means they are on 2 different planes... not one. This also explains why the object is more focused than that bird so I'm sorry but I'm not quite understanding what you mean here.

But the bottom line is that you were right in the first place that the bird is behind that object so this is an important fact in the overall analysis of this clip.
[edit on 21-4-2008 by Palasheea]

I am posting what bird shots I could get to help and get an idea of whats happening, when the birds come to the defense of our planet, retreat actually, or perhaps are disinterested as it might not make a good nest but they do appear to be on different planes, the object is clearly the most focused, and of course on magnification, it seemed to dissolve first, indicating, I guess, it must be behind. And boy was that bird hard to snap!







Thanx for helping us all understand a little better.

I had a roof section posted here earlier and found its not anomalous, so wound up answering my own question.






[edit on 23-4-2008 by Sys_Config]

I agree the this is pretty cool, but all of the footage would be better. Something about seeing them fly away at incredible speeds facinates me. Before I believe this is real, I'd need to hear from the experts and see the whole vid. Until then it is just another cool vid.

I just noticed that picture number 1 and 5 with the birds, show reflectivity, i don't mean the blur of wings either , totally absent in the craft, yet both ar exposed to same light source. why is that?. Its been my experience the sun shines on the wicked as well the just?
I agree, we want the whole video, and as mentioned before, I take Jaime with a grain of salt. He keeps being bought up as he were the max planck institute and clearinghouse of ufology. Thats one name that does not inspire confidence, and probably hurts luckys case.

[edit on 23-4-2008 by Sys_Config]

[edit on 23-4-2008 by Sys_Config]

Originally posted by MrPenny
Congrats Nohup....you have been "obtused".....my new verb.

I know, man! I don't know how many ways I can rephrase my statements. When I read them over, they seem to make sense. They seem to be grammatically correct. So I can only assume the communication is failing on the other end. Oh, well.

Internos, you must tell me where you got that ats bowling ball, it looks better and more real than the video for sure!