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The Chemtrail Myth

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posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:35 PM
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Originally posted by danman23
reply to post by weedwhacker
 


Haha.. WW... first off he wasnt talking to you. Second off.. Take a look at the pics I posted. I know you already said you cant see the black trail in the first ones I took. (Understandable.. its blurry) But take a look at the second set my friend took.. and read my post. Its undeniably a black trail in the sky. There is no way its a shadow.. its common sense. For a shadow to be there it needs something to be cast on. That black trail is in the middle of the blue sky.
You are missing the whole point anyways.. you admit there are massive amounts of contrails in the air right? Well the government knows it is a horrible for our environment and know how to stop it.. (tell the planes to fly at different altitudes) but they do NOTHING... Chill out... and OPEN YOUR EYES

Peace


If you did some research into black contrails you would see that one of the definitions is when a contrail shadow is cast onto a lower thin layered cloud (check out cirrostratus definition too)

This link has the three types of shadows


contrailscience.com...




posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:40 PM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


I know the air gets 'thin' and whatnot(people climbing everest needing air tanks.) I also don't own a jetpack. But, say for some reason I could breath up there would the moisture in my breath crystallize and persist but in a smaller scale?

EDIT: I think those black contrails are likely shadows, I've seen one stretch across followed by the plane and contrail casting the shadow.
If shadows can't cast on the blue sky or wouldn't the sky not be blue?(I've heard conspiracy's that the sky isn't really blue but its too far fetched
)

[edit on 4/17/2008 by Bumr055]



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:42 PM
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reply to post by danman23
 


danman, WHO wasn't talking to me?? You mean, now you're the thread police, I can't comment on someone elses's post and bring in my knowledge?

Secondly....in that photo with the 'black' ... hey it's a shadow, because otherwise it would be much better defined, no?...

It is evident that the Sun is low in the sky, and there are faint, thin existing clouds...it is easy to be fooled by the angles, especially in a photo, since we don't have the luzury of scanning the entire with our eyes and getting perspective.

This really speaks to the crux of this 'theory'...untrained 'eyewitnesses' and out-of-context photos....and a need to go get training in the aspects of meteorology and aviation.

You have experienced people here, on these threads, mostly meteorogists, who are trained observers, and knowledgable in their field, and we have amateurs with an opinion.

pfft!

[spell]


[edit on 4/17/0808 by weedwhacker]



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:45 PM
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Originally posted by Bumr055
reply to post by weedwhacker
 


I know the air gets 'thin' and whatnot(people climbing everest needing air tanks.) I also don't own a jetpack. But, say for some reason I could breath up there would the moisture in my breath crystallize and persist but in a smaller scale?


Well, pretty much what you see here on the ground, in cold air, eh?

But, unless your breath exhausts at 400 or 500 degrees Celcius, I doubt you'd affect enough of the water vapor to create anything that persisted for very long...

WW



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:48 PM
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Originally posted by Bumr055
reply to post by weedwhacker
 


I know the air gets 'thin' and whatnot(people climbing everest needing air tanks.) I also don't own a jetpack. But, say for some reason I could breath up there would the moisture in my breath crystallize and persist but in a smaller scale?


I think I can answer this from a non-professional view.

Here in Alaska it gets NEGATIVE 30 during the winter. If you go outside and breath. Your breath is literally frozen there in the air in front of you. Its fun watching kids do it. LOL If you take a cup of water and throw it in the air. It turns to crystals and sits there. Its crazy.

So, im assuming that is what would happen if you were floating around up at the levels jets/planes are.



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:51 PM
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reply to post by greeneyedleo
 


Thats exactly what happens....so if any of yo chemtrailers live in an extremely cold climate, like -30 and lower, boil a jug of water then throw it out into the cold....its an easy experiment to do

If the air is humid enough it will stick...if it isnt it will momentarily freeze in mid air, then fall to the ground

[edit on 17/4/2008 by OzWeatherman]



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:52 PM
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I'm really shocked that people who live in a cold environment aren't familiar with the pre-contrails that proceed from the exhaust of their cars in the winter.
When engines burn a pound of fuel, it produces slightly more than a pound of water vapor. When you add that water to the atmosphere and the ambient humidity reaches saturation (100%) the result is fog. When you add that water and the ambient humidity is (100%) and the temperature is VERY low it freezes attaching to particles (like exhaust particles). Just like a cloud.
Also vortices or even wing surfaces and the jet engine intakes or prop blades will produce "fog" or contrail when the low pressure drops the temperature and forces water out of the air. Basically the area of low pressure produced also lowers the temperature past the dew point (which is why that happens most frequently in humid air). The name for that is the "Prandtl-Glauert singularity."
And observing contrail shadows are not real common, but not exactly rare either.
That's the best explanation I can give you, as I'm not a meteorologist



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:52 PM
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reply to post by OzWeatherman
 


I did do research.. I wouldnt be here telling you guys there are black trails if I didnt do my research. I've gone threw most of that website.. and understand it. can you explain why (in the one my friend took) the other trails don't have a "shadow"? And how it can be a shadow if there is obviously no thin layer of clouds there.. it was a perfectly sunny day. (minus the trails)



posted on Apr, 17 2008 @ 11:55 PM
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reply to post by greeneyedleo
 


I think I have seen a video of what your talking about(not the breath thing the warm water) I gota look for some videos of Alaska! (Not cold enough here, even though we live in iglues
)

EDIT: so all this time all someone had to do was grab there camera(live in Alaska) and record them breathing to debunk this
?

EDIT: I just watched like 4-5 videos of that experiment and none seemed to persist long at all.(Didn't see persistent breath in Alaska either.)

Someone help find one, this could easily prove that persistent contrails don't contain anything but water. Surprised know one has posted a video yet and went 'see, I doubt that, that guy is a chemplane'

[edit on 4/17/2008 by Bumr055]


[edit on 4/18/2008 by Bumr055]

[edit on 4/18/2008 by Bumr055]



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 12:00 AM
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Hey WW

No.. Im just a 22 year old United States citizen... You said "So, please try not to tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about...I suggest you go learn to fly, and see for yourself..."
He never told you you dont know what your talking about... All you guys need to change your fricking attitude and stop fighting.. Reread my posts.. Let's work together here... sheit

A guy can't just tell people whats goin on around him??

Peace



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 12:11 AM
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I've seen those dark lines also. Don't know what to make of them. Can't be shadows, shadows on what? There are no clouds. I've seen these lines in front of a westbound jet .ing into a setting sun, pretty good trick with shadows.



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 12:24 AM
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reply to post by WEOPPOSEDECEPTION
 


There can be a thin mist of cloud that acts like enough of a curtain to cast a shadow on, and yet be invisible to the naked eye. A lot of theme parks use a similar setup where they project a video on a thin curtain of water mist.



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 12:43 AM
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reply to post by defcon5
 


Right.. but the sun was to the back of him.



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 01:07 AM
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***Yawn***

Don't feed the trolls!!!

How many threads are you going to make with the exact same content?

What a waste of ats space.



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 01:29 AM
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So, know one can show me a video of persistent condensation. I wasn't expecting it to be possible at ground level but it was claimed so I gota see it.

Common, someone would get to make a whole new thread called 'PROOF chemtrails are a hoax' and you would get a bunch of stars and stuff.


You have all been 'wasting your breath' and when it comes time to breath everyone holds it, what gives?
I'm not expecting to see someone breath out a big contrail and it linger there for an hour! A few seconds lingering would seem like a feet to me(I've never seen it with my breath).



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 02:16 AM
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Originally posted by Bumr055
So, know one can show me a video of persistent condensation. I wasn't expecting it to be possible at ground level but it was claimed so I gota see it.

Common, someone would get to make a whole new thread called 'PROOF chemtrails are a hoax' and you would get a bunch of stars and stuff.


You have all been 'wasting your breath' and when it comes time to breath everyone holds it, what gives?
I'm not expecting to see someone breath out a big contrail and it linger there for an hour! A few seconds lingering would seem like a feet to me(I've never seen it with my breath).


It wont happen with your breath, you dont have enough heat in it for a start. Plus there's the latent heat stuff and the addition of exhaust particulates. So, you are right, its probably not possible at sea level. The pressure differences from here compared to up there are huge.



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 02:22 AM
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reply to post by Bumr055
 


Oh Lord. I was trying to draw a comparison and said I was assuming they were similar.

And to me, it does sit there and is frozen in the air. Throw water from a cup in the summer - compared to throwing water out in -45 degrees. Big difference.

Have you ever driven through ice fog...or even seen it? Maybe that is a better comparison to what is up there?

Oz, what do you think?


[edit on 18-4-2008 by greeneyedleo]



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 02:24 AM
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Originally posted by danman23
Hey WW

No.. Im just a 22 year old United States citizen... You said "So, please try not to tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about...I suggest you go learn to fly, and see for yourself..."
He never told you you dont know what your talking about... All you guys need to change your fricking attitude and stop fighting.. Reread my posts.. Let's work together here... sheit

A guy can't just tell people whats goin on around him??

Peace


Ok mate....just calm down. I know it gets stressful


Weedwhacker is/was a pilot so he does know what he is talking about. I am a meteorologist so I know stuff about weather stuff. It is possible to have a transparent cloud layer, cirrostratus is a good example. I dont know if you have heard of a sundog or halo, but they can also be seen when an almost transparent layer of cirrus or cirrostratus is present. This is just my reason (from a proffesional perspective) for what I saw in your pictures. I am not accusing you of being ignorant....but open your mind to the possibility that what you saw is a naturally occuring thing as some evidence provides

And about contrails being bad for the environment......I agree, however I think the contribution is to global dimming, meaning that the cloud tops are reflecting incoming heat from the sun, which isnt a good thing at all

Please people, lets keep it civil



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 02:31 AM
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OZ! Your ignoring my question! LOL

Would ice fog - which occurs here in the winter, often....would that be a close similarity to the contrails? Or am I totally off in left field? lol



posted on Apr, 18 2008 @ 02:37 AM
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reply to post by greeneyedleo
 


Sorry your majesty


Yes it is along the same lines, when combustible fuels are burnt the water nuclei in the exhaust freeze in mid air. The only difference is its on a smaller scale than contrails development and the barometric pressure at contrail height is far less.




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