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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
It may not be Ironman, but the United States infantry of the future will each be better armored and carry more firepower than an up armored Humvee.
With the support of their powered exoskeletons soldiers will be able to be oufitted with armor comparable to a Stryker or Infantry Fighting Vehicle and carry weapons normally only seen mounted on vehicles or tripods, like the XM307-XM312 Objective Crew Served Weapon System that can fire 25mm smart shells (including thermobaric rounds) out to 2000 meters or 12.7mm (aka .50 cal) with a maximum effective range also of 2000 meters, depending on configuration.
Nothing short of an RPG or Anti Tank mine would stop one.
Now take into consideration the development of Active Camo (aka Predator camo) being developed, various tactical combat support drones, and DARPA's SUSTAIN/FALCON (Military Spaceplanes and Spaceborne Paratroops/Space Marines) programs.
You end up with real life Mobile Infantry Starship Troopers or what I prefer to call them Panzermensch.
The US troops of the future will dominate the battlefields without equal.
So if anyone wants to take a shot at the champ, they better get it in while they still have a chance. The window is closing and in less than ten years it will be closed.
After that point I have a feeling any war against the US will look like a scene from Terminator films future portion, the US and its allies being like the Terminators and the resistance being the Resistance.
But will each 'armored' infantry man be able to carry four others or will they be able to run around at 60 miles per hour so as to do away with the need for armored transport? If the armored infantry man can carry more firepower than a Humvee that says's far more about the lack of weapons on a Humvee ( which was never intended to carry much if any weapons) than it does about what such a infantry soldiers might be able to carry.
Sure but such weapons might be perfectly useless against other armored infantry soldiers of other nations or did you forget that these technological evolutions do not happen in a vacuum? And armor comparable with a stryker or average IFV ( does not say much either) given how vulnerable such platforms are to a whole host of anti armor weaponry. What infantry will become at such a time is equally expensive targets that are suddenly as vulnerable to tank main gun shells as other tanks tend to be without the protection required to actually survive the engagement.
And given the real possibility of a serious reduction in agility those RPG's ( which can be carried in relative abundance by modern armed forces) are going to hit far more often than they otherwise would have. As for anti tank mine it's still going to be very cost effective to blow up soldier who costs tens of thousands of dollars to train,tens of thousands of dollars to equip and sustain in combat armored in hundred or two hundred thousand dollar armored suit all hoping that he does not die so the two hundred thousand dollar death benefit comes into play.
Doesn't your chest hurt and what on Earth makes you so sure?
Sure but such weapons might be perfectly useless against other armored infantry soldiers of other nations or did you forget that these technological evolutions do not happen in a vacuum?
Originally posted by centurion1211
Historically this has sometimes (but not always) been true.
But what other nations are working on these systems to this level?
I guess when the russioans or chinese finally get around to stealing the plans you could be right. But by then, who knows what will be coming off the U.S. drawing boards and assembly lines?
India and China dont have these resources and they will seek them out in Africa and Central Asia. These places will be torn apart and devastated. I can only imagine the number of Refugees that will be trying to come to Europe.
In Ten years more SuperCarriers will be added to the Navy, meaning more Battlegroups. We will have large inventories of tactical and strategic drones. We will have real time command and control of all assets on the battlefield, down to an individual rifleman. These forces will be able to deploy and engage anyone, anywhere at anytime. At this point only the UK, France, Germany and maybe a few other NATO countries will have comparable technology and abilities, though on a much smaller scale.
Missile Defense systems will make ballistic and cruise missiles useless. Tactical directed energy weapons will make smaller missiles useless. Railguns will be mounted on naval vessels, replacing cruise missiles and main guns. They will have ranges comparable to cruise missiles and ballistic missiles. They will also be almost impossible to bring down with any Missile defense system. Active Camo, Spaceplane transports and bombers, and the concept of Orbital Assaults will be introduced to warfare.
Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by manson_322
As fast as India is growing you dont think that Shale will be consumed, or even worse China may want to "borrow" it.
Windmills dont put fuel in aircraft, ships or trucks.
Hypersonic? Try the speed of light, because thats exactly how fast the beam will travel that intercepts that missile.
Tanking, hmm. Well the economy is recessing thats for sure, but even recessing we are by far the largest national economy on the earth.
Hypersonic? Try the speed of light, because thats exactly how fast the beam will travel that intercepts that missile.
Windmills dont put fuel in aircraft, ships or trucks.
Tanking, hmm. Well the economy is recessing thats for sure, but even recessing we are by far the largest national economy on the earth.
Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by manson_322
As fast as India is growing you dont think that Shale will be consumed, or even worse China may want to "borrow" it.
Windmills dont put fuel in aircraft, ships or trucks.
Hypersonic? Try the speed of light, because thats exactly how fast the beam will travel that intercepts that missile.
Tanking, hmm. Well the economy is recessing thats for sure, but even recessing we are by far the largest national economy on the earth.
Hypersonic? Try the speed of light, because thats exactly how fast the beam will travel that intercepts that missile.
Windmills dont put fuel in aircraft, ships or trucks.
Tanking, hmm. Well the economy is recessing thats for sure, but even recessing we are by far the largest national economy on the earth.
As fast as India is growing you dont think that Shale will be consumed, or even worse China may want to "borrow" it.
Consider this we developed the Stealth fighter in the Mid Seventies and the stealth bomber in the mid 1980s, where is their's at? Its been Over 30 years where's their Stealth Fighter? Its been over 20, where's their stealth bomber? Where is their equivalent to an M-1 Abrams main battle tank?(which was also developed in the 1970s)
Where is their equivalent to an M-1 Abrams main battle tank?(which was also developed in the 1970s)
Originally posted by MikeboydUS
I dont think they'll be carrying anyone except casulaties away from the battlefield.
I don't think they'll be running at 60 mph either. I couldn't even drive my Humvee in Afghanistan at that speed, try around 25 mph.
In Iraq people only drive like that on the highways thinking they might be able to outrun an IED or sniper fire. So there is no need to go 60 mph.
Your right about the Humvee, it was only intended to be a support vehicle. They are already being replaced on the battlefield, by various new Mine Resistant vehicles. The weapon systems they can carry are equal to Russian vehicles like the BRDM and BTR series. So they arn't that poorly armed.
Show me one other country other than Japan that is working on Powered Exoskeleton technology. This kind of technology will take the Russians and Chinese 20 years to catch up to.
Consider this we developed the Stealth fighter in the Mid Seventies and the stealth bomber in the mid 1980s, where is their's at? Its been Over 30 years where's their Stealth Fighter?
Its been over 20, where's their stealth bomber? Where is their equivalent to an M-1 Abrams main battle tank?(which was also developed in the 1970s)
Where is their Battlefield Command and Control Sysytems (FBCB2) with touch screens, integrated GPS, and satellite communications that can be found in a regular US army Humvee?
We developed it in the 1990s. Where is their SuperCarriers? We built our first one, the Enterprise, in the 1960s, the freaking 1960s, and no one else has one yet.
I expect our allies to have them within Ten years of us fielding them, everyone else it could be from 20 years to never.
Those .50 cals and 25mm weapons can take out light armor. The 25mm could technically take out old Russian tanks like the T-55/T-62. Those tank series make up the vast majority of tanks seen across the Third World and most Chinese tanks are based on the T-62.
Infantry are more vulnerable in the Present to Sniper Fire, Small Arms, IEDs, Grenades, and Tank fire.
The Powered armor reduces that vulnerabilty. It is what is known as a Combat Multiplier, these machines are not intended to operate alone or replace tanks. They will operate in Joint Combined Arms task forces, that will include Close Air Support from gunships and drone combat aircraft, main battle tanks, various combat support drones that range from scouts, medevac, supply, etc. They are only one part of system that covers a full spectrum.
Again you have to take all information into account, like comparing the costs of the suits to costs of vehicles. Instead of one easy to hit M2 Bradley, one is faced with numerous small targets.
Believe me, smaller fast moving targets even in an Abrams is harder to hit than a vehicle. These targest are usually engaged with the coaxial machine gun, spraying them and hoping rounds hit. Coaxial machine guns will be useless against powered armor.
Unless we go to war with a Japan (If they build an offensive military) or Europe I don't see anyone being able to put up a real fight outside their home countries. Were not going to invade Russia or China, but facing them on the battlefield outside of their country, they will be at a major disadvantage. We on the other hand, we can fight anywhere at anytime.
What makes me sure the window will close? I take into account a number of factors. Our Logistics, Communications, and Reconnaisance abilities are no where near being equalled by anyone.
We have more modern combat tanks than Russia or China.
We have the largest modern air force with the largest amount of modern combat aircraft, including numerous strategic bombers.
We have numerous Carrier Battlegroups with SuperCarriers at their core. Thats all right now, current strength.
In Ten years more SuperCarriers will be added to the Navy, meaning more Battlegroups.
We will have large inventories of tactical and strategic drones.
We will have real time command and control of all assets on the battlefield, down to an individual rifleman.
These forces will be able to deploy and engage anyone, anywhere at anytime. At this point only the UK, France, Germany and maybe a few other NATO countries will have comparable technology and abilities, though on a much smaller scale.
In less than Twenty Years, these powered armor exoskeletons will see widespread use on the battlefield.
Missile Defense systems will make ballistic and cruise missiles useless.
Tactical directed energy weapons will make smaller missiles useless.
Railguns will be mounted on naval vessels, replacing cruise missiles and main guns. They will have ranges comparable to cruise missiles and ballistic missiles.
They will also be almost impossible to bring down with any Missile defense system.
Active Camo, Spaceplane transports and bombers, and the concept of Orbital Assaults will be introduced to warfare.
He who controls Space, will control the Earth.
How do we fuel all of this? While China is potentially bogged down fighting insurgencies in Africa and Central Asia for the oil fields,
Russia is continuing to decrease in production and possibly bogged down in fighting in Central Asia and the Caucuses ( They peaked in 2007),
the United States will be making full use of our abundand farmland for Biofuels and refining the massive amounts of Tar Sand and Oil Shale.
We potentially have enough of these resources to meet any demand within our country for quite awhile.
India and China dont have these resources and they will seek them out in Africa and Central Asia.
These places will be torn apart and devastated. I can only imagine the number of Refugees that will be trying to come to Europe.
It is a very dark future, but the United States and Europe together are shining beacons of hope. We will help where we can and when we can.
The only thing that I can think of that could threaten our position is if us and the EU became enemies.
We need to be building a strong bond with Europe, building somethhing like a Trans Atlantic Organization or Community that is more than NATO. Something like the EEC that lead to the EU. Maybe oneday we will have something like that, what I call the TAU or Trans Atlantic Union.
If we are to survive and bring hope to the world in dark times, the US and Europe will have to work together.
That they will do but China will primarily invest in Russian energy and or buy Siberia; it's part and parcel of their strategic alliance.
Things will probably stay the same as the Chinese and Indians wont soon have the political/military or economic power to do what the west has so far done to Africa. In fact current treaties seem positively enlightened as compared to what the west demanded at gun point.
Oh they had a weight class equivalent to the M-1 Abrams long before there was Abrams and for the longest time ( since before the second world) the Soviet Union have been operating superior tanks that generally had more armor and larger calibre guns. If the Soviet Union and others chose , or still do not, make heavy tanks it's because it's not what they want!
Originally posted by solidshot
US army robot suits tested
news.bbc.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)
The US army is developing robotic suits for its soldiers with the aim of giving them 'superhuman' powers. Rajesh Mirchandani watches them in action.
Originally posted by MikeboydUS
You end up with real life Mobile Infantry Starship Troopers or what I prefer to call them Panzermensch.
The US troops of the future will dominate the battlefields without equal.
So if anyone wants to take a shot at the champ, they better get it in while they still have a chance. The window is closing and in less than ten years it will be closed. After that point I have a feeling any war against the US will look like a scene from Terminator films future portion, the US and its allies being like the Terminators and the resistance being the Resistance.
Originally posted by manson_322
funny statement , they wouldn't need to buy Siberia they would just need to invest and purchase in siberian oil fields and bribe russian politicans , who for bribes would be more than willing to cooperate
india/china are not stupid like West ,india/china by investing developing infrastructure like Roads,Hospitals,oil field development etc. (which india is doing in afghanistan and some parts of central Asia for goodwill and China in Africa , they try to win good will of local populace ) unlike USA/West which acts like a bunch of blood crazed maniacs hellbent on world domination...
khrushchev was against making tanks weighing more than 52 tons as it affects mobility , he wants tanks that extremely mobile and would be mobile enough to survive onslaught of NATO/US nukes.
Show me a superhardened city that can survive a direct thermonuclear strike. Even Cheyenne Mountain would not survive a direct hit by a thermonuclear warhead. Were talking about millions of degrees of heat. Like the surface of the sun being brought to earth for an instant. There is no material, no structure on earth that can survive that kind of extreme.
"Yamantau Mountain is the largest nuclear-secure project in the world... They have very large train tracks running in and out of it, with enormous rooms carved inside the mountain. It has been built to resist a half dozen direct nuclear hits, one after the other in a direct hole. It's very disquieting that the Russians are doing this when they don't have $200 million to build the service module on the international space station and can't pay housing for their own military people," ---Rep. Bartlett.
www.viewzone.com...
The following is an excerpt from an interview between Chris Ruddy and Col. Stanislav Lunev, a Russian military intelligence officer who defected in 1992. Col. Stanislav Lunev is the highest-ranking military intelligence officer ever to have defected from Russia.
You ask about Yamantau Mountain. Well, this is a huge underground city, which could be used in time when many Russian cities are destroyed, but the military and political elite will survive and live until our planet will try to restore itself.
www.viewzone.com...
Your telling me the T-80, which is an improved version of the T-64 ( a Forty Four year old tank design) is better than an Abrams? There are many many experts who would disagree. There are only a few tanks that can stand toe to toe with an M-1. The British Challenger 2, German Leopard 2(Believed to be the best Main Battle Tank in the world), Israeli Merkava 4, French LeClerc, and Japanese Type 90.
BTVT estimates T-80 max as glacis 350mm vs KE/500mm vs CE; turret 500mm vs KE/600mm vs CE. BTVT estimates T-80B max as glacis 450mm vs KE/560mm vs CE; turret 500mm vs KE/600mm vs CE
Without K-5 protection of front turret is 275-750mm vs KE and 960mm vs CE. BTVT estimates T80U w/K-5 max glacis 800mm vs KE/1100mm vs CE; turret 860mm vs KE/1200mm vs CE.
members.tripod.com...
The effectiveness of Kontakt-5 ERA was confirmed by tests run by the German Bundeswehr and the US Army. The Germans confirmed that in tests, the K-5, mounted on older T-72 tanks, 'shattered' their 120mm DM-53 penetrators, and in the US, Jane's IDR's Pentagon correspondent Leland Ness confirmed that "When fitted to T-72 tanks, the 'heavy' ERA made them immune to the DU penetrators of M829 APFSDS, fired by the 120 mm guns of the US M1 Abrams tanks, which were among the most formidable tank gun projectiles at the time." This is of course, provided that the round strikes the ERA, which only covers 60% of the frontal aspect of the T-72 series tank mounted with it.
en.wikipedia.org...
Directed energy weapons developed in the 80s were terribly inefficient. The THEL program in the early 2000s changed all of that. It is now feasable and efficient to place Directed energy weapon systems like the THEL on aircraft, ships, and vehicles. These things are the next generation's Anti Aircraft and Anti Missile Artillery.
Originally posted by MikeboydUS
Directed energy weapons developed in the 80s were terribly inefficient.
The THEL program in the early 2000s changed all of that.
It is now feasable and efficient to place Directed energy weapon systems like the THEL on aircraft, ships, and vehicles.
These things are the next generation's Anti Aircraft and Anti Missile Artillery.
I can see some Solar Panels on some civillian vehicles but I can't see it for military vehicles like Main Battle Tanks, Infantry Fighting Vehicles, etc. I can see them being uitilized on various drones though.
I dont disagree about the Rome statement, there are lots of parallels especially to the last "days" of the Roman Republic. What I fear may happen is the end of the Republic and rise of Dictators and Imperators.
I also wouldn't be surprised if India and China do fight over resources, I would hope they work together though than against each other.
The Stealth Fighter, aka the F-117 Nighthawk was developed in the 1970s.
The first Prototype known as Have Blue was built prior to 1977. Its first flight was in December 1977 at Groom Lake.
Your telling me the T-80, which is an improved version of the T-64 ( a Forty Four year old tank design) is better than an Abrams?
There are many many experts who would disagree. There are only a few tanks that can stand toe to toe with an M-1.
The British Challenger 2, German Leopard 2(Believed to be the best Main Battle Tank in the world), Israeli Merkava 4, French LeClerc, and Japanese Type 90.
Show me a superhardened city that can survive a direct thermonuclear strike.
Even Cheyenne Mountain would not survive a direct hit by a thermonuclear warhead.
Were talking about millions of degrees of heat. Like the surface of the sun being brought to earth for an instant.
There is no material, no structure on earth that can survive that kind of extreme.