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The Reverse-Conspiracy-Theory

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posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 11:30 AM
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Well we are back here again. When the truth and reason are presented its a bit boring compared to alien reptile shape shifters, Secret death cults and the rest of the goobers posting up 'psychosis in motion'. The icke's and whoevers are taking peoples money for DVDs of things that they claim knowledge of but in no way can it be proven. This is their profession. They make their living from it. The masses pay to get it. They indulge in a crock of lies and then repeatr it because some messiah has taken their $39.95 it must be true, and should be heaped on everyone else.

Some of you know that I have even let out chunks of truth and the audience is just not ready. Might be several more generations.


Here is a great truth, accept it or not, I don't really care either way. The elite are as clueless as everyone else. The illuminati in both houses white and dark do not much bother with worldy affairs and function, except when things get stuck and need a push to get going again. Regardless of what govt or who, none are effective in much of anything beside running giant ego machines. There is no great secret power group running anything beside the false concept of money.

And the final truth. There is no one at the wheel, and this behemoth of a mess you all call human civilization is running amok and running itself into the ground. It is destroying itself and there is no NWO or secret power going to fix it at the last minute, and then require your slavery.

Repeat: There is No One at the wheel steering this mess. That is indeed a most terrifying truth. Its all spinning out of control and there is no one that can even take control till after the reset. Yes I said after the reset.

The only plans that truly exist is to recover the remnants of the human race and set a system up to stop what we did in the past. A system of world peace, that can only come about when not much of this society is even left to salvage. Only then will mankind be able to rebuild and leave out all the mistakes of the past that got us here.

Its far scarier knowing its all out of control and nobody can do anything to stop it.




posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 11:55 AM
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I tried to make an argument once that world government is a necessary advancement of society and baby steps towards potentially joining some form of galactic community.

You can view the post here if you are interested.

Great post Skyfloating. Starred and flagged.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:15 PM
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Although your views are beneficial for everyone to see, especially the overly paranoid, I think you are incorrect in your assumptions of an elite class which wants betterment for mankind.

One might look at the current situations and see that our economy is on the brink of collapse, as well as the economies of other countries. This is because (with a little research at moneyfiles.org and maxkeiser.com) it is clear that this economic crisis was ENGINEERED purposefully by world bankers. The results will be a lower standard of living for people, at least in the short run.

Another thing, although the "royals" have lost most of their power as rulers, they have transferred it though political moves and corporations. NATO, the UN, and the bankers hold a majority of power, and have not worked to better society. Makes me



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:18 PM
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I fail to see logic in the idea that a group of people would operate in a clandestine manner for love, progress, enlightenment, and freedom.

Why would a group of this nature want to be in the shadows?

If their message is of love and advancement then their operation should take place in the light.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:36 PM
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reply to post by badmatty
 


History indicates the ones with the knowledge will be persecuted for coming forward.

Its not their responsibility to shape and mold mankind. Nor should they assume it.

A certain degree of prophecy determines actions and timing.

Evil must consume itself. It can not be fought against. Only education can overcome this challenge. Teach differently, generations ahead of time.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:36 PM
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Originally posted by HuntaXX

it seems obvious to me that the majority of the media in the western world is controlled by one group and if they are trying to paint the Illuminati as evil then why are they using mass media to manipulate the masses on so many other topics but not these most important ones? its clear they are so arrogant they dont care if our 1% - 5% or whatever number it is of above average intelligence people know the truth so being too subtle about the way they "leak their secrets" would be a slow and inefficient way to try to taint our minds with lies considering how few of us there really are percentage wise and how easily they brainwash the majority of people. what are your thoughts on this?




I agree that the mass-media is godawful and "part of the problem". That would seem to be "a hole in my theory" if you will.

This is why I cant claim there is no global conspiracy happening at all. I can only say for certain that some of the groups and ideologies its been blamed on are not the guilty ones. WHO THEN is responsible for this mess? That would then be the next question and one of the purposes for spending time at this website.

I´d say that WE are responsible to 50% because of our demand for this kind of media...which oscillates between the mundane britney-spears type junk-food news and the extremely negative.

Some of what is posted here at ATS though is not an alternative to mass-media-indoctrination, its a continuation of the brainwash.

The brainwash is basically setting up different polarities against each other, especially stereotype ones at that.

left wing vs. right wing

religion vs. atheism

and a few thousand others.

The Machiavellian act of setting up two stereotypes while being the "third power" is reminiscent of classical illuminati-conspiracy-theory. But who is it thats doing the set-up? I dont know.

I just know who it is not.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by Illahee

Here is a great truth, accept it or not, I don't really care either way. The elite are as clueless as everyone else. The illuminati in both houses white and dark do not much bother with worldy affairs and function, except when things get stuck and need a push to get going again. Regardless of what govt or who, none are effective in much of anything beside running giant ego machines. There is no great secret power group running anything beside the false concept of money.


Which is why the ills of the world might be due more to stupidity than controlled conspiracy.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:45 PM
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reply to post by metaldemon2000
 


I absolutely agree that we will not be having extraterrestrial contact much less "disclosure" before we dont present ourselves as a world unity under one governing body.

This is why I actively promote a one-world-government. In order to join the galactic federation.

Why do some people go crazy when they hear NWO and one-world? Because it is mistaken with ideas of totalitarian rule, dystopian science-fiction, communism and dictatorship.

But thats not what I and others think when we say "one world government". We´re not thinking orwellian and dystopian, we´re thinking more "Federation of Nations" like in star trek. We´re thinking more "management of nations" under one roof, in a loose fashion, without giving up individuality of each nation.

That type of new order of the ages will stop all war and hook us up with the rest of the galaxy imo.

But this cannot be in the interest of those who strive to hoard power by keeping the populace ignorant.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:47 PM
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reply to post by Skyfloating
 



I rather let the thread go the path it has taken, I now see that this thread you have posted, perhaps due to something that has been bothering you for a while. Because I am not familiar with the problem at hand here on the particular subject I think, I will leave it to the already on going discussion that seems to be what you want to bring to light.

Perhaps on another occasion.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:48 PM
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Originally posted by badmatty
I fail to see logic in the idea that a group of people would operate in a clandestine manner for love, progress, enlightenment, and freedom.

Why would a group of this nature want to be in the shadows?

If their message is of love and advancement then their operation should take place in the light.


Why they would want to be in the shadows becomes quickly apparent to me when I get death threats or am slandered as "devil worshipper" for promoting similar ideas of enlightenment and betterment.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:49 PM
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It has always been a contention of mine that we're on the right track as far as investigating certain theories and back-tracking the execution of them to their origin to see where policy emanates from. But the one thing we'll most likely never be able to gauge is the true intentions of these people. We can assume that at the very top we have the wealthiest of the wealthy, families who have garnered enough power and money over the years to be in great control of the world around them. The trick is, they can't do it themselves and need help from those who share similar values and beliefs, not to mention are loyal to the families and are willing to follow their little game plan.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:53 PM
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Originally posted by jmilla
One might look at the current situations and see that our economy is on the brink of collapse, as well as the economies of other countries. This is because (with a little research at moneyfiles.org and maxkeiser.com) it is clear that this economic crisis was ENGINEERED purposefully by world bankers. The results will be a lower standard of living for people, at least in the short run.


Whatever the cause, the solution is not necessarily in reading conspiracy-books but in gaining financial education.

EDIT to add: Why is it that conspiracy-theory always points out the ills but never the solution?

[edit on 14-4-2008 by Skyfloating]



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 12:57 PM
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I like your ideas and theories OP and it touches on something I've been thinking about after reading a lot of socialist and nihilist philosophies. Perhaps the "Illuminati" or whatever they wish to call themselves are in fact acting in the best interest of the human species as a whole but I don't believe they're acting in the good of the individiual.

Take, for instance, the reduction of world population to about 10% of the current population. When I truly thought about it, pondered it free of outside thought, I realized it might be an ideal, a vertibale utopia for both man and nature. Resources would be easier to come by and more effort and resources could be directed to scientific advancement. Health would improve, health care would be universal, economics would never fail, the list truly goes on. However, there is the small issue of getting that 90% population reduction to happen.

I think this is the fundamental issue between our perception of good and evil. There is a praradox of sorts that exists due to the inherant intangability of the term "evil". It would seem logically conclusive that one may practice "evil" as a means to attain "good". For instance, if someone decided to commit armed robbery on multiple occasions he would be deemed a criminal yet if he took his loot and spread it among the improverished single mothers of his neighborhood he would be branded as doing "good".

I think the main flaw in your argument would be the fact that "good" and "evil" are entirely subjective and not accountable to any exterior objective deffinition. In other words, "evil" is just what you as a person deem to be evil based upon your own beliefs of what is "good". It is your beliefs and your position in the world that makes you deem one thing good and one thing evil.

When we are talking about concepts such as "The Illuminati" and "NWO" we have to keep in mind the subjective relativity of "good" and "evil". Perhaps those that are illuminated do not believe they are doing wrong and are in fact working for the ultimate survival of humanity as a species in a multi-planet or galactic wide future. However, to acheive this ultimate utopia certain sacrifices must be made, people have to die, buildings must be destroyed and old concepts of thought and philosophy must be abandonned. Much like when a child recieves a shot from the doctor, we must do harm to the child in order to protect his or her future even if the child itself is incapable of understanding our need to cause him pain.

I think this is where the perception of the "Illuminati" as "evil" comes from. It is the fact that as children we can't see the bigger picture, we can't understand why there must be pain and suffering even if we want that same utopia they're offering. Take for instance the rebellous southern states during the American Civil War, they viewed the northern act of withdrawing slavery from their economy as evil and wrong yet the northern states felt the same in reverse in regards to southern slavery. Take also the Nazis, who believed they were doing good and felt it was their duty to eliminate all genetically inferior peoples yet we don't have to look far to find an account of how evil the Nazis were.

This fact works in the microcosm as well. Any outside force that we are powerless to stop and that we deem to be acting against our best interest is deemed "evil" in differing degrees. The drug dealers on the street are "evil" but not as "evil" as the rapist who in turn is not as "evil" as the serial killer. In fact, I would venture to guess that it is easier to find a commonality of opinion when labeling things "evil" than if we were labeling things "good". There are many regional differences within America alone let alone the regional, religious, political, and philosophical differences throughout the world. When these differences are all taken into account it seems quite obvious that there is no way we can concretely determin what is in fact "evil" and what is in fact "good".

I perosnally believe the understanding of the inherent non-existance of such terms and ideas as "good" and "evil" is one major part of what we would deem "Illumination". It is the understanding of the whole true picture, not the microcosmic but the macrocosmic, it is the considering of every aspect even in decisions that seem to effect only a small part. I believe they know that most people are unwilling and incapable of abandonning all the belief structures and political theories they've worked so hard to use as a foundation of their own perception of the self. Most people are unwilling to abandon the concept of self and take up the concept of true communitiy and commonaltiy of purpose. Most people are incapable of living in true equality with anyone, even those that share the same ideaologies. This is why secrecy is necessitated, because most people will deem as "evil" that which they do not understand and most people are completely incapable of truly understanding the actions and goals of the "Illuminati"

Based upon what I've said so far I would be willing to go so far as to label the majority of human actions and opinions as "evil" since they contribute almost nothing to the betterment of the world as a whole, lead to no greater understanding of the world or people around us and serve only to further isolate all of us from both eachother and our true purpose here in existance. Humans will always seek to label, to seperate, to segregate, to organize, and categorize everything they see and experience which will always lead to further inability to live a connected, complete, whole existance with the planet and the people around us and will almost certainly sentence us to obliteration in the face of such problems as the inevitable neccesity to leave this planet and become citizens of a connected universe. I beleive the first step to illumination is the rejection of concepts such as "good" and "evil", religion, politics, moraltiy, societal norms and groupthink. The path to true illumination is walked alone in darkness until one can truly find one's own path to illumination where you will realize your true purpose for existence and you will see the actions of the world with new vision and understand them more fully than you could have hoped for before. Only in darkness can one find true illumination.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 01:05 PM
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Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by Illahee

Here is a great truth, accept it or not, I don't really care either way. The elite are as clueless as everyone else. The illuminati in both houses white and dark do not much bother with worldy affairs and function, except when things get stuck and need a push to get going again. Regardless of what govt or who, none are effective in much of anything beside running giant ego machines. There is no great secret power group running anything beside the false concept of money.


Which is why the ills of the world might be due more to stupidity than controlled conspiracy.



What was the first issue in the Bible? Don't eat the fruit. it wasn't the friut. it was the hiding and lying, the same would destroy an relationship today. People missed the whole point there.

Now we continue to do the very same thing. We refuse to accept responsibility for our actions and we create a bunch of nonsense conspiracys to cover up the fact that we as a specie can't do things properly and can't admit to ourselves when we fouled things up. We run away and lie, and then blame the people in power.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 01:18 PM
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reply to post by Shadowflux
 


Nice post which evokes mixed feelings. Certainly you´ve "seen some light" as far as the importance of personal path and self-responsibility go. Also in that the perception of good and evil is relative. Nevertheless I shy away from moral relativism taken to the extremes of "aw...it doesnt matter anyway, lets just blow everything up".

So maybe its "best practice" not to judge in terms of good and evil but it terms of "consequences". If I do action X there will be consequences and those consequences can be detrimental to life in general and to myself.

But I see where you´re going with your thinking and its an interesting path.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 01:21 PM
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reply to post by Illahee
 


Yeah, thats what this thread is about. people complaining about the world without offering solutions. Look at the number of complaint threads compared to the number of solution-oriented threads for example. That says everything about why the world looks what it looks like.

Criminals actually use "conspiracy theory" to justify their lifestyle. They say "well, the system is so corrupt. By stealing all this money Im fighting the bad system". Its the height of irresponsibility.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 01:23 PM
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I have struck upon this line of logic before in my mental meanderings several times in the past.
Here are some other ones:

-What would be wrong with mankind reverting back to a more agrarian,self sufficient lifestyle.That is what was intended by the grand design anyway,is it not?

-what would be wrong with people driving less,getting excercise in the outdoors by propelling themselves on a bicycle,instead of being fat,lazy,fast food eating cel-phone talking heads killing each other on the roads?.

-what would be wrong with people having enough brains to home school their own children,and not send them to our "bacterial/viral breeding ground" schools?.

-What would be wrong with people doing more work toward their own survival,instead of going to some store for everything,and forgetting how to feed and maintain their own selves?.

-What would be wrong with people relying less on technologies to get by,and not destroying the ecosystems which they really rely on to survive,in the process of making all that silly junk we don't need?.

-What would be wrong with allowing a child to learn to think on his/her own,before polluting his/her mind with religious brainwashing,leaving the child with the choice of what BS religion to choose?.They are all in fact just mind control...
-
NOTHING WOULD BE WRONG WITH ANY OF THESE THINGS
I am so disappointed at what a bunch of worthless,lost,mis-guided idiots my race has become.Lazy,fat,fast food inhaling media whores and junkies,with no real ambition,other than to agrandise themselves,and pretend they are their own little emperors,when in reality they are a bunch of stupid cattle being bred,farmed and raised for slaughter,to feed some corrupt medical system,and have their organs harvested for the profit of the doctors and hospitals,without compensation to the families of those who died.
Why fight what is right?,we would be better off without most of what we take for granted.
If nothing in this life is free,we should use less,not go into debt to get what we WANT,when we already have what we need in excess....
We are reaping our rewards for being complacent and ignorant,I will sit off to the side and watch the carnage.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 01:23 PM
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Originally posted by Skyfloating
So maybe its "best practice" not to judge in terms of good and evil but it terms of "consequences".


Practically my motto. Always be completely willing to accept whatever the consequences of my actions. You'd think that could be used to justify nearly anything....but I find it a pretty good measure of my decisions...."Am I willing to face the consequences?"



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 01:48 PM
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Hitler had a NWO too. A reich that was supposed to last for 1000 years. Look at the fruit it bore. Didn't do much for the german people either. You are in effect asking the same question asked to Christ by Pontius Pilate, "What is truth?"
Anyway the NWO and Illuminati are largely fictional. Someone else very real is pulling the strings. Who? Keep looking.



posted on Apr, 14 2008 @ 02:24 PM
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Just depends on what side you choose. Everyone wants to be right and no one wants to admit they are the bad guy.

In logic it is called "Blind Ignorance" Google the term.

Just think about how far people will go to justify their position of being correct on their beliefs.

Religion, politics, etc....







Originally posted by Skyfloating

Reverse-Conspiracy-Theory (RCT) states that conspiracy-theorists are right in suspecting hidden forces at work, but partially wrong about the intentions and goals of these forces.

RCT believes similar to that which "world-conspiracy-theory" believes, but the other way around.

* "The Illuminati" are "the enlightened ones" - forces of progress, goodwill and enlightenment.

* The opponents of "the illuminati" are the forces of death, bigotry, stupidity, oppression, suppresion.

* The "New World Order" will not be a totalitarian surveillance state but a "New Age" of beauty, freedom, diversity, self-determination, peace and prosperity.






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