It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Expert: "We're brainwashing our children" about global warming

page: 6
11
<< 3  4  5    7  8 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 11 2008 @ 07:33 PM
link   
reply to post by Maxmars
 


Well now that's unfair - you can't take a single sentence, out of context, and use it to prove a point!

OK, you can,

but...




posted on Apr, 11 2008 @ 08:39 PM
link   

Originally posted by Maxmars
I often get 'ruffled' regarding matters involving those who use media, marketing, and propaganda-style techniques to further their agenda. But it is an academic objection. And where children are involved I am very sensitive (perhaps overly so.)

I think that it is important to remember, and perhaps you can only realise this once you have had children of your own, is that we are only custodians. I have a five year old son and it is only since I had him that I have become fully aware of the 'bigger issues'. The education system in the UK is fast becoming a joke, but to be quite honest I only rely on the school system to ensure that he is properly socialised within his own age group. It is my job to inform and educate him, more importantly though, I feel an overwhelming need to equip him with the skills to survive what I feel is going to be a very hard life in the future.

Propaganda surrounds us and conflicts us. While there are scientists who are quite obviously being paid to say Global Warming is the only reality, there are just as many being paid to say it doesn't exist at all. We as consumers of the available information have to sift out what is relevant and make our decisions based up on that. The governments, to greater and lesser extents are corrupt, and this corruption permeates every aspect of our lives. It has become acceptable, commonplace and barely worth a passing comment.


Originally posted by Maxmars
I worry that no one will adequately oversee the 'global projects' because we have a 'heroic' team of 'do-gooders' 'on-the-job.' The simpy is too much at stake to risk 'entrusting' those who already - before the 11th hour - have begun 'sanitizing' the contradictory evidence to suit their 'inconvenient truth' rather than embrace every new scientific observation as an opportunity to better define the problem.

Now I don't know how much of what follows is conspiracy theory and how much is fact; but I have seen the 'chem trails' in the sky and I am worried - not about the possibility that people are trying to do 'bad' things, but that they might be thinking their doing a 'good' thing - based on a partial set of scientific data.


This to me is of enormous concern and I think that you sum it up very well. I also feel that the corporations and elites feel that they can buy their way out of the problem (just as they feel they can buy their way to religious redemption). They think that it is okay to tear up trees in the rainforest, just as long as they plant more somewhere else. Or that they don't have to reduce emissions to meet the targets, they can just buy the quota from another country that isn't using theirs. The effort needs to be concerted and while I do not think all the onus should be on the individual, i do believe that we have to set the standard, because they will suck out every last drop and then retire to their bunkers to wait out the storm.

We face a myriad of problems in the coming decades, our environment is part of the problem but our societal and economic structures are also failing. There is a great deal of work to be done if we are to survive as a species and I do not understand why our governments are not doing more to direct the change that is required. This is why I do think that there is an agenda because I simply cannot understand, unless they do want famine and disease to cause massive depopulation why they would not work harder to implement change.


Originally posted by Maxmars
I still recycle, I still switched to high efficiency personal vehicles, I consume less energy and I grow as much of my own food as my terrible gardening skills can muster. But I cannot bring myself to trust to Gore cartel and the notion that this is a 'my scientist says' vs. 'your scientist says' debate.


I can perfectly understand how you feel and I applaud the fact that you are not allowing distrust to turn into complacency like so many others obviously are. We live in world where everything is about personality or money, or a combination of both. I find the best thing is to trust your own judgement and ignore the bickering. Whether the climatic changes are caused by global warming or something else, does not detract from the level of toxicity that we are inflicting on this planet, nor does it detract from the fact that these changes are making intensive farming increasingly unsustainable. These are two of the biggest and most immediate problems that we are facing (IMO). And I agree with you, neither problem is going to be solved by chem trails or any other quick fix solution.

It seems obvious to me that we all need to work together on this, and yet, I find myself increasingly wondering why they keep trying to push us apart.



posted on Apr, 11 2008 @ 11:23 PM
link   

Originally posted by budski
reply to post by Maxmars
 


Well now that's unfair - you can't take a single sentence, out of context, and use it to prove a point!

OK, you can,

but...



Yeah, I do get carried away - I'll try to behave



posted on Apr, 11 2008 @ 11:38 PM
link   

Originally posted by KilgoreTrout

It seems obvious to me that we all need to work together on this, and yet, I find myself increasingly wondering why they keep trying to push us apart.


Without question. And I too find myself returning to the very same question. What exactly does this conflict produce that it beneficial. I would expect at least some to hold that it is entirely inconsequential, or at best, unintended and irrelevant to a particular purpose. But the tenor and nature of the debate (meaning public - not herein) seems strangely - choreographed, perhaps that's not the appropriate metaphor, but there seems a 'scripted' element which keeps both perspectives in a continuous tug-of-war; neither seeming to gain enough substance to shift the scales meaningfully towards a self-evident status.

Seems to me that an issue of this importance would not even be debatable, so one way or the other something seems to be preventing the smoke from clearing, or preventing a final shift from happening. It sounds like a paranoid conspiracy, and I admit it, but just because it may not be 'a paranoid conspiracy', doesn't invalidate the fact that it looks as if it were.

Confused? You bet I am. But as usual, and keeping me from the mainstream debate, it's not about the debate per se, it's about the nature of the debate.

[edit on 11-4-2008 by Maxmars]

[edit on 11-4-2008 by Maxmars]



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 01:44 AM
link   
reply to post by budski
 


O.K. you asked why? simply because there are more in the favor that support GW than are against it... I bet they are all liberals though so I wouldn't worry to much about it. See thats the thing with science, it gets peer reviewed. So from what I see, GW= true>GW=false it is simply a case of too many liberals.... right? I don't think you really get the gist of my post nor do you want to. Feel free to pick the parts that fit your agenda.

And BTW, Yea, oil companies donate a lot of money to schools. You never know when you need to get an oil rig out of the way of a hurricane, that is unless you pay them to tell you when. This is NOT a one sided brainwashing. I mean after all can you prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that it's a hoax??? I can't prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that it's not. And if you think you can I'm sorry.. Do I need to touch again on how oil and coal companies get by with the minimum all ready?



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 09:27 AM
link   
reply to post by shizzle5150
 


Proof please - show me the numbers.

Your assertion that more support GW than are against it is baseless - there is in fact evidence to show that more are against than are for, it's even been shown in this thread.

I also object to this labelling of people as "liberals" or "neocons" or anything else for that matter - it's nonsense and adds nothing but conflict to a thread, as do accusations of "agenda's"

Is your view so simplistic that everyone MUST have an agenda if they voice an opinion?



[edit on 12/4/2008 by budski]



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 01:32 PM
link   

Originally posted by budski
reply to post by shizzle5150
 

Proof please - show me the numbers.
Your assertion that more support GW than are against it is baseless - there is in fact evidence to show that more are against than are for, it's even been shown in this thread.
I also object to this labelling of people as "liberals" or "neocons" or anything else for that matter - it's nonsense and adds nothing but conflict to a thread, as do accusations of "agenda's"
Is your view so simplistic that everyone MUST have an agenda if they voice an opinion?
[edit on 12/4/2008 by budski]


Yes, me too. I really need to see where my research went wrong. By all counts the 'nay' sayers by far outnumber the "Gore core'. Of course, we haven't even begun to scratch the surface of this futile aspect of the argument. Why? because then begins the "Who's data is the un-worthiest?" portion of our programming...,

Alas, Propaganda is so powerful, not unlike an opiate delivered straight to the cerebral cortex in the most pleasantly desirable way man can contrive. This is becoming more and more a matter of faith than of thought.



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 03:30 PM
link   
reply to post by Maxmars
 


It always amazes me how the naysayers go quiet when asked for information to back up their arguments...

Funny really...



On topic - there is no evidence from either side to conclusively prove their argument - this is why I object to GW being taught as FACT.

Environmental education yes - it's a good thing
Propaganda, no, it's dangerous.



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 04:11 PM
link   
reply to post by Johnmike
 

I've actually learned a lot from this thread! Even from our debate John!
I've learned that people who live in countries were the government use GW as an excuse to get a hold of more money, are negative to the whole GW concept! While people who live in countries were the government don't exploit the GW situation, are positive to the GW concept!
I guess my answer to the thread topic is that some governments use the GW "threat" in a very negative way! It might even be close to brainwashing in many cases, but not even close to every case!

If Global Warming is real or not, and if it's man made or not, is something that none of us can be a 100% surtain about! It all depends on what information we choose to believe in!


1



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 04:27 PM
link   
reply to post by Stanley Mimix
 


That's the name of the game


Learn from each other - preferably without arguing.

Although I've hardly been in angel in that respect sometimes



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 06:26 PM
link   
Hooray! Good will all around! It must be a sign of the end times!

I have always maintained that GW is an 'event'. Our part in it is certainly measurable - but just because it is, doesn't make it the hinge to control it. Since we can't even get the 'authorities' to agree, we should DEMAND a consensus - and if there can be no consensus - we should DEMAND an accounting of WHY there can be no consensus - BEFORE we all start down a particular one-way path or start writing blank checks to anyone.

[edit on 12-4-2008 by Maxmars]



posted on Apr, 12 2008 @ 09:13 PM
link   

Originally posted by The Oak
Global Warming (this time around) is profoundly influenced by the hand of man. 30 years of research supports this. The idea that man has not played a part in global warming is a fundamental idea propagated by the right wingers to futher advance their economic agendas. To place economic well being above the health of our planet is unforgivable as far as I am concerned.

You call this brainwashing, but I like the term education myself. Suppose for argument sake that the vast majority of the environmental scientific community are wrong and man plays no part in GW. Then all that work we have done to counter-act GW was for nothing, all we got out of it was cleaner air, cleaner water, improved respitory health, and less waste, and who needs any of that.


GW is real, it's here, and it's our public enemy numero uno.



A whole 30 years of research eh? wow thats alot. more like a blink of an eye in the earths lifespan. And how many ice ages has the earth had during its life span? climate change happens all the time.

and for everyone saying that if gw isnt man made, what does it hurt to live by the things it teaches ( use less electricity, recycle, etc). well it doesnt hurt anything. its actually a good thing, the problem is the way its presented. im all for teaching my kids (when i have one lol) about recycling, turning off light switches, etc but i dont want them told that its causing global warming when we dont know if thats true.

Also, i saw an article thats shows several of the planets in our solar system are experiencing climate change as well. strange how those planets dont have people on them but they are experiencing global warming too.

all im saying is this happens all the time. i think the earth goes through these cycles like every 10000 years or something (cant remember exactly). things that are just theories dont need to be presented as fact, and since humans have only lived on this planet for a limited amount of time, it will take a lot longer then 30 yrs to prove that global warming is caused by us.



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 12:35 PM
link   
reply to post by Agit8dChop
 


Are you really so short-sighted? First of all, ANY brain-washing is BAD!

More importantly, FOLLOW THE MONEY! This is all a ploy to get more money to the UN so they can give it where they deem fit and thereby employ global socialism.



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 01:32 PM
link   
Our local schools played that movie, and there where so many complaints, they had to stop showing it. Not everyone is going to fall for Gore's "alarmist" tactics until the real science proves its actually not just a natural cycle. It's so political now, I fear the real science will not get out. Personally my views are that we are in the 150,000 or so years cycle and it just peaked with the warming and now we may be actually be cooling down again.



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 03:48 PM
link   

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
... isnt it a good thing?

'' now jimmy, turn off the lights, global warming ''

'' now jimmy, close the fridge door, global warming ''

'' Dont get a V6-8 Car jimmy, get a 4 cylnder, ride your bike ''

Arent these good things to be brain washing
?


"now Jimmy, pay higher taxes, global warming"

"now Jimmy, take your shots and drink your fluoride, disease and cavities"

"now Jimmy, turn in your guns, crime"

"now Jimmy, do whatever we say or the government will get you"

The answer is no.



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 03:54 PM
link   

Originally posted by mthalman
Our local schools played that movie, and there where so many complaints, they had to stop showing it. Not everyone is going to fall for Gore's "alarmist" tactics until the real science proves its actually not just a natural cycle. It's so political now, I fear the real science will not get out. Personally my views are that we are in the 150,000 or so years cycle and it just peaked with the warming and now we may be actually be cooling down again.


I am actually torn between congratulating you and feeling sorry for what happened.

1) I want to congratulate you for being in a location that respects the truth enough to realize the message cant be delivered as an aspect of 'education' because it creates defacto fact-hood (forgive the accidental alliteration). It is simply not proper to propagate 'opinion' science as if it were blessed by the school.

2) I'm so sorry that said protection had to take the form of censorship. For that is what it was.... unless...

Maybe the Gorester can have the DVD's given away to everyone free of charge - certainly THAT fit's into their mega world-saving budget. Then I would encourage EVERYONE to see it, because along with all that poorly expounded scientific data, there are a lot of good ideas and some important stuff to at least consider.

Personally, I don't want them silenced, I want them to say what they have to say as a scientific message - instead of popularist infotainment. (We get enough of that from Oprah, JCLDS and Scientology pieces.)



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 07:22 PM
link   
As far as I'm concerned this thread is about.....


America brainwashing on this thread that GW is nonsense.

I'd HATE to be American, I'm really sorry to say that. But this opinion has to be expressed, due to the ignorance of generally the americans on this thread denying the issues on cliamte change.

To them It's all about money, money, oil, war, power and the likes. Complete ignorance. The main issue here to them is carbon tax. Why am I not surprised. If carbon tax money was put back into the environment, I don't see what's wrong with that. Americans don't give a damn on cliamate change, They love their gas guzzellers to much I'm afraid.

Oh but still....... waffle waffle....

It's mid April and I've witnessed Hailstones twice today. We dont get this in April Where I'm from. Tempetures are fluctuating too alarmling of late.

Last April on the same time. I got badly burn't (how I remember) as we had the highest record temp in Ireland since records began. 20'Celusius (couldn't be bothered to do farenheit)


Global warming is a real issue here. I'm sick to the death of Americans not using their friggen senses. Turn off FOX news please. Go outside and open your eyes.


P.S sorry to any Americans here, I don't have the photo of my sun burn so I guess I'm making this up, so your right GW is nonsense so



Is George Bush on this forum too sprouting nonsense that GW is not real.



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 07:41 PM
link   
reply to post by mind is the universe
 


No offense, but, have you been actually reading these posts? If so I fail to see how you missed the point of contention. At what point do you see carbon tax 'helping'? Has the weather never changed before where you live? Are there some Americans living near you setting fire to mini-coops and hybrid vehicles over there? Where did your perception come from; Americans driving 8 cylinder behemoths down the road shaking an angry fist at every tree, breaking out the ol' chainsaw and cutting them all down? Where does that idea even come from?

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you sweeping generalizations.



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 08:15 PM
link   
Carbon tax here where I am from is been used, as our Government promised they will put the money into the environment. Whether they will or not is debatable. Right now they are starting to invest in renewable energies so that's something.

Just a small example of Tax that our government introduced a few years ago.
i.e. Tax on Plastic bags has even made major changes to littering and wasting of plastic etc. People don't waste as much now. Small positive changes make a big impact. When it was introduced people went barking mad saying it won't work, or people wont pay for a plastic bag etc. But hey it was a success for both the government, people and the environment.

I see your point on the fact that Carbon tax only, will be only of minimal benifet to GW on a world scale. I did also read the scam behind the media etc buying people into carbon tax.
But In America money is god, so your right, carbon tax ain't gonna change a thing anyway.

My issue is -
America's attitudes on GW and their ignorance on world issues such as this topic.
Secondly,
I think American kids should be told about GW especially in America, afterall it's better than watching the american sitcoms and been
brainwashed by the simpsons.

My second issue is -
Americans don't seem to "GET" the fact that, America is and will lose money if the mass of this country just sit on their butts do nothing, watching fox news, reading this thread and waiting till blue in the face that Global warming is a serious reality. It will cost you and us if you keep denying this reality, And a hell of a lot of money in the future too when the damage is done. It will sure cost more than the carbon tax ye are all whinging about at present in this very thread.

I apologise for not reading every post. But I do get very impaitent when I hear the same nonsense I only seem to hear from Americans. It's usually power, oil. brainwashing, UFOs, WAR, money and what else... I have even deliberatly skipped the last few pages, as I just want to scream at every American on this thread right now to be honest.


No there is no Americans where I live. Why do you ask?


Can you tell me what America are going to do about their emissions and on global warming??
.

Oh just to add as I've have been reading other stuff too
I don't pay much attention to AL gore. I already know about Global warming, I don't think hes changing anything anyhoo.

His motives on spreading awareness on global warming is hilarious!

The world already knows, for christ sakes. Yes I'm already aware of his motives and agendas. I don't like him at all to be honest. To finish it, I don't read any of his garbage either.

Tbf. America is brainwashed anyway. I'm not going to be brainwashed by right wing oil sucking, greed ridden monsters.










[edit on 13-4-2008 by mind is the universe]



posted on Apr, 13 2008 @ 09:03 PM
link   
So let's get them rigs drillin', smoke stacks burnin', and let's start hunting and fishing every critter off the planet.

There won't be any consequences, all those scientists are just trying to give themselves something to do when they see the global temperature average rising steadily over the past 50 years in concordance to man's technological development.





70% of the earth is covered with water already, let's not melt the icecaps while calling it media propaganda ... I like going to the beach every now and again.



new topics

top topics



 
11
<< 3  4  5    7  8 >>

log in

join