More Than 1,000 in Iraq's Forces Quit Basra Fight

More Than 1,000 in Iraq's Forces Quit Basra Fight

www.nytimes.com

BAGHDAD — More than 1,000 Iraqi soldiers and policemen either refused to fight or simply abandoned their posts during the inconclusive assault against Shiite militias in Basra last week, a senior Iraqi government official said Thursday. Iraqi military officials said the group included dozens of officers, including at least two senior field commanders in the battle.

(visit the link for the full news article)

These insurgents must be heavily supplied if they can resist one thousand soldiers in a single city. Perhaps this is one of the best pointers so far to a proxy war in Iraq. Will this help incite the coalition to attack Iran?

Personally speaking. These men are my heroes. The only way a war will end is if people refuse to fight. Perhaps they see the bigger picture and disagree it is worth fighting for. It is also pertinent to note it is their countrymen they are fighting against.

www.nytimes.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Wow that's what some of us have been saying all along.

Interesting normal people are picking up on this..

We don't need to be there, if these guys stop fighting each other and whatnot, the faster we leave.

But even then they prob will all have to go against the states because Bush and Cheney want their oil. So in the end its war as usual, at the expense of everyone else.

[edit on 4/4/2008 by ThichHeaded]

Originally posted by ThichHeaded
Interesting normal people are picking up on this..

What?

Originally posted by ThichHeaded
But even then they prob will all have to go against the states because Bush and Cheney want their oil.

I wouldn't think so. Cultural divisions in Iraq will persist, and have only multiplied since the installation of the government. It's going to be some years until we see a cohesive anti-american Iraq. Perhaps that is what 100 year McCain is afraid of.

This just in:

Maliki Orders Nationwide Freeze On Raids Targeting Militiamen

Good move. Don't embarass yourself trying to command uncommandable men. See what I said about refusing to fight ending a war?

[edit on 2008/4/4 by SteveR]

"As the Iraqi government stands up..."

What a bad sad terrible joke that is.



[edit on 4-4-2008 by grover]

reply to post by grover


I caught you with those edited smileys grover.

reply to post by SteveR


What can I say? Ya laugh until you cry.

Talk about being between a rock and a hard place and another rock. These Iraqis that refused to fight probably did so because if they did the Shia would retaliate not only on them but their families. I doubt it was anything so noble as refusing to fight to end the violence. They probably joined the force because it is the only job available and need to feed their families, but when put up against Shia militia, they probably figured it was better to be hungry and alive.

I think the only way Iraq is going to remain intact as a nation is if the newly trained police and military stay and fight the militia. If not, the government will have no power, and our troops will remain there indefinitely. So if I were you, I would root for the ones that stayed.

Hal, I'm not so sure that Iraq should be kept intact in its present form. The Iraqi people know that the current government is sanctioned and controlled by the United States. Ultimately, this will be its downfall. You can only slow that process for so long. Paying them to fight each other is reaching its limits too.

[edit on 2008/4/4 by SteveR]

Steve, you may be right that Iraq may end up splitting up, but the only way our troops are going to be allowed to leave the place is if the current government can control the violence. The best chance of that happening is the government that is in place now, even if the population doesn't support it. If they don't like it, they can do what we do and vote them out of office. It is better than letting the Shia Militia take over by force, which is what is going to happen. If it weren't for our troops it would have happened already. Then the population will not have a choice and the Sunnis will fight against the Shia and they will have a civil war. Is this what you prefer?

If Iraqis want our troops to leave, all they have to do is stop fighting. I just want to see our troops come home. After we leave, then it will be up to the Iraqis to determine the future of their country. Unfortunately, I don't see this happening anytime soon.

reply to post by SteveR


The current state of Iraq was 3 separate kingdoms/city states before the British came in (Basra, Mosul, and Baghdad).

Iraq should not exist in its nation form. The people are very different. If they want to stay connected as one nation, fine, but I highly doubt it.

As for the Basra news...This isn't exactly great news. The militias are still armed (Mahdis Army and the Sadrists) although a temporary ceasefire has occurred.

Does that mean Basra is in great shape? I doubt it. We keep hearing calls from the White House how Iran is fueling the fire, but I think its really our mercenaries that are fueling this hatred.

Our soldiers aren't intentionally creating havoc, but I can't say the same about Blackwater, Halliburton, and kroll (by far the worst and we don't even hear about them).

I really hope the Iraqi people can figure this mess out on their own. It doesn't seem the coalition forces are helping that much. If it turns out the country splits up, that'll be fine with me as long as other countries don't decide to invade...which is quite possible.

I just wish we didn't disband the military in the first place, we'd be gone by now...Maybe that was part of Bush/Cheney/Rove's plan? We're there "protecting" the Iraqis when the Iraqis could have been doing that had we not screwed up early on.

Very interesting turn of events.

How will the allied leaders justify staying in Iraq to fight a war when the Iraqis themselves arent interested in fighting it?

Originally posted by 44soulslayer
How will the allied leaders justify staying in Iraq to fight a war when the Iraqis themselves arent interested in fighting it?

I think you hit the nail on the head there, soulslayer.

Good replies all,

Thats because they are weak little girlie men or they want to be on the side of the terrorist and yet still get paid to be in the Iraqi army of worthless pucks. Sadr's forehead will meet the butt of a U.S. service rifle soon, I hope.

Originally posted by Sky watcher
Thats because they are weak little girlie men or they want to be on the side of the terrorist and yet still get paid to be in the Iraqi army of worthless pucks. Sadr's forehead will meet the butt of a U.S. service rifle soon, I hope.

Wow all knowing person. You seem so wise.

How long have you been living in Iraq?

It's not that suprising really. It is VERY hard to brainwash people to kill their own. Sometimes they snap out of it...

They are not quiting the forces per say, they are just joining the other side. This fight is no use and can not be won by the military, therefore they are joining the side that can win. Plus, they are probably afraid for their lives and their families lives.