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Is America the new Nazi Germany?

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posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 02:30 PM
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Semper, the US military is spread paper thin and if you thibk a bunch of bum bandits are going to achieve anything you sadly mistaken. For a start in order to prosecute the Fascist state one of the Govs first actions will be to relieve you of all those guns you have, now I know this will have you cying like a baby but that is what will happen.

You have already stated yourself that the people follow orders so if another columbine etc. crops up you can gurantee that the next step will be the handing over of personal weapons. And yes your right people like you and others may resist such activities but dont worry after they have taken your guns they will have a nice camp holiday lined up for you and your gun totin mates.

Dont tell I'm wrong because history proves you and all others wrong, you think because its the US it wont happen to you well yes it will and it is happening right now. What about WACO, American men women and children, shot, gassed and burnt to death on prime TV and for what because they had different religeous beliefs, 9/11 thousands of US citizens killed by their own and others and stupid Americans think its some guy in a cave thats doing it, talk about being dumb. The US is a sick patient and as such needs radical surgery for its survival. Even a blind man with no sense of smell would know there is something wrong, but not the American people.




posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 02:42 PM
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Originally posted by dgtempe
reply to post by Bluesession
 

No llores por mi, Argentina....

I will tell you why. In spite of our current problems, we are still free and you aint and will never be.
This country has done much good also around the world.
Your people envy us and all that we stand for, if we are and have ALWAYS been so darn nasty, why do your people and the Mexicans head North?



People head north because they lack direction!!!!
And the fact that the spin of freedom and the few drippings off the master's table are more than are getting!

Ooops- did I say that? I only meant to think it. Sorry!

And Congrats Kleverone for your thread making it to the front page on ATS!! It has been earned!



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by kleverone
 



I just dont see how people can say we are becoming Nazi Germany.

The Third Reich came into power during the Depression and after Germany lost World War 1. They didnt have time for Decadence and the Corruption we have here. They were broke and desperate. Which allowed parties like the National Socialists to come to power. They scapegoated Communists and Jews for their state of affairs. First the Reichstag and then Chancellorship was taken by the National Socialists in a democratic election. After the Reichstag incident Hitler was given sweeping powers and made into a Dictator. The German military had to be rebuilt, outlying German areas were annexed, and the last was to take back German land lost in WW1, which was now in Poland.

This has not happened. There is no freaking comparision. For someone to be blind to the parallels between the Roman and British Empires is borderline moronic.

The United States has dominated the planet since the end of World War 2. Germany has never been in that position.

Only one other Empire has been in that position. The British Empire.

They maintained that empire with a massive Navy that dominated the world's Oceans. Just like them we have the Largest Navy on the face of the earth.

Like the British we find ourselves fighting for resources, but telling people we are spreading Civilization or Democracy for us.

Our military is the most advanced and powerful fighting force on the earth. Germany did not start strong militarily and barely had a navy during and before WW2.

The British King did not have absolute power either. The Parliament like Congress has a measure of power itself. The President is not absolute in authority.

We also have many parallels with the Romans. Like them we have an advanced(their army was advanced in its time) and nearly unstoppable Army. We have bases like their Forts all over the place. We have bases all over the planet.

Like the Romans we are massive consumers. We are massively corrupt and decadent just like them.

Our government mirrors theirs so much it is scary.

The Romans had three forces in their Government.

The Emperor, the good ones kind of being like our Presidents.
The Senate, much like our own.
The Mob, the masses, the people.

The officials appeal to masses. Bread and Circuses, building projects, Entertainment. Then the masses support that official. The Mob if they dont get their way protest and riot. Look at us, we march, we protest, everyone wants a piece of the pie or the whole pie. "Were not equal" Everyone with an idea or difference goes out and marches and protests. We march for the animals, the trees, the land, ethnic groups, sex, speech, guns, etc. What do we not march and protest for?

Socially we are like them, they are like us. We are obsessed with Entertainment. We are extremely Decadent and Corrupt. We preach Morality yet have none. We claim to be spreading civilization when were not. We speak about the virtues of Republic and Democracy while withering away our own.

People, we are not Germany. Anyone can pick up a history book and objectively see that. We are a massive global Empire full of corruption, immorality, and decadence. We have a massive and advanced military. We dominate the Oceans. Soon we will dominate Space like the Brits dominated the Seas in the 1800s.

Ladies and Gents, like it or not, we are the Greatest Empire in the History of our Species. We are Britain and Rome of the 21st Century, fighting our resource wars like those empires before. Playing the Great Game with the East, whether it be Parthia or Russia. Ever since WW2, we have lived beneath the Pax Americana.

Right now things are changing in America. We are becoming more and more like Imperial Rome rather than Republican Rome. Eventually we will have our Caesar.

The real question is what will our legacy be and how will it end. Will end like Rome, with the Empire divided? Like Britain broken and weakened after Two World Wars? Time will only tell.

I can assure you this, we are not Nazi Germany. Thats Blind Ignorance. Bush is no where like Hitler or Stalin. For one we wouldn't even be having an election right now if he was. The entire Democratic Party would be in jail or dead. Ron Paul would of been jailed or dead. We would not be having this debate if Bush was like them. We would be dead or in prison. ATS would be shut down.

So open your eyes, go read some history books, and wake up. There are huge diferences between us and the Third Reich. There are major parallels between us, the British and Roman Empires. Britain was in Iraq and Afghanistan before. We seem to following right in their footsteps and mistakes. Read some books and you'll find out how.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 03:25 PM
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I am an American and don't you dare call "America" Nazi Germany.

People keep attributing the current states of affairs to the entire American people, what makes you think we want to be in Iraq or listen to Bush or be in an economic instability. If you call anyone Nazi's point them out directly, Bush and his entire administration.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 03:35 PM
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Originally posted by SteveR
The closest America came to Nazi Germany was in 2001.

One has to keep in mind, always: The Germans wanted Hitler. He was the one who inspired with his leadership and nationalism in a time when it was desperately lacking.


I believe we came the closest in during the FDR administration. The echoes are far more similar than the ignorant scare tactics of "Bush is a Nazi!" Before the war, newspapers in Italy at the time even praised FDR for following the tenants of fascism; Mussolini had to order editors to stop the praise, because it was being used as fodder by FDR's enemies here at home.


In the North American Review in 1934, the progressive writer Roger Shaw described the New Deal as “Fascist means to gain liberal ends.” He wasn’t hallucinating. FDR’s adviser Rexford Tugwell wrote in his diary that Mussolini had done “many of the things which seem to me necessary.” Lorena Hickok, a close confidante of Eleanor Roosevelt who lived in the White House for a spell, wrote approvingly of a local official who had said, “If [President] Roosevelt were actually a dictator, we might get somewhere.” She added that if she were younger, she’d like to lead “the Fascist Movement in the United States.” At the National Recovery Administration (NRA), the cartel-creating agency at the heart of the early New Deal, one report declared forthrightly, “The Fascist Principles are very similar to those we have been evolving here in America.”


Hitler, Mussolini, Roosevelt: What FDR Had In Common with the Other Charismatic Collectivists of the 30s



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 03:48 PM
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Originally posted by Tinhatman
I don't know about th eNWO but it does not take much to see that the "two party" system in the US is a sham to convince the common Prols that we are not being ruled by a small priveledged class of Bankers and descendants from European Royalty.


Just consider that the people of the US doesn't elect a president per se, but only electors who then elect the president. They generally vote the same as the citizens, but are not always required to do so.

In theory, a president candidate could get 60% of the votes of the citizens, yet the electors could then go on and elect a different candidate for president. Is that democracy?



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
I just dont see how people can say we are becoming Nazi Germany.

The Third Reich came into power during the Depression and after Germany lost World War 1.


In case you haven't noticed, the US is currently heading for recession which might end up as a depression. True, there are many other variables to to the equation, but some of the basic elements are there.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by moniker
 



Thats true we could face a major economic crisis in the near future, but I dont see it leading to a Nazi style government. There will be fascists and communists hoping to take advantage of the situation, but we are simply too diverse and too big for either to dominate the whole Union through a democractic process.

It would require a Civil War like the Russian Civil War of 1917-1923 that would probably Balkanize the country to force either extreme on the union.

I could see the United States becoming a Theocracy like Iran, before becoming Communist or Fascist. Many Americans have a fanatical attachment to faith, desperate times would only encourage that. So what we could end up seeing is Religious Revolution, turning the nation into a Christian Theocracy. I still think even that would lead to Balkanization.

More than likely if anything happens in a worst case scenario, it will be civil unrest, martial law, privately secured and fortified Enclaves for the wealthy, publicly secured and fortified communities in rural Enclaves. The urban areas could have massive drug and gang problems, riots, throw in some bird flu, food riots, and in about ten years or less the mess burns itself out and order is restored to urban areas. The biggest threat at that time will be again Balkanization, primarily the US Southwest. We might see rebellions and revolts put down here and there, likely from those rural Enclaves. Waco type incidents in various parts of the country and domestic terrorism like in Oklahoma City. Outside influences could prolong, worsen or even shorten the mess. We could find ourselves fighting Latin American nations or even inviting NATO troops, and UN humanitarian workers into the country. Maybe even all of the above.

Again that is a worst case scenario. I dont think it will likely be that bad. It will still be safer than current Iraq or Afghanistan is to its citizens.

Either way, I dont forsee us turning into Nazi Germany. I could see Nazi/Fascist Enclaves developing in rural areas and even Communist/Marxist Enclaves in the Southwest, but not the whole country. Federal forces would end up crushing these extremist enclaves.

So either we:

1. Break up, have a Civil War.
2. Face a National Crisis of Civil Unrest and potential Low Intensity Warfare
3. Develop a Christian Theocracy
4. Somekind of Mix of all three.

Thats my take on it but no Nazis or Communists, at least for the near future. Twenty or Thirty years from now anything is possible.


[edit on 30/3/08 by MikeboydUS]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 04:39 PM
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Mike,Take off those rose tinted specs, the US the greatest empire ever dont make me laugh, Most Americans dont even know whats going on in the words, have never traveled outside the US and could not say where countries were on the planet to save their lives. Your not a comedian in real life are you cos you can certainly tell them. Empire my arse, what you think attacking and invading a few countries makes an empire.

Yes Hitler and his gang fed on the festering nation that was Germany after ww1, OMG so is the US, a festering nation, up to its armpits in debt, a worthless currency, a corrupt Goverment, falling education, health care, and social standards yes thats sounds about right for a fascist take over.

The fact that you try to compare the US with the Roman and British Empires indicates you know nothing of those countries and nothing of your own. You might be right if your talking about an empire of McDonalds etc, but thats about it. The US is a Nazi State in all but name and just because your not locked in some camp yet or wearing the uniform does not mean its not happening. And again if you realised that the people who set up the US are still running it and I MEAN THE EUROPEANS you would realise that they are playing you for the fools you are.

Again if you had any grasp on European history you would understand what is happening in the US but then again as they say sometimes you are to close to the wood to see the trees.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by kleverone
 


The philosophies that were prevalent in the Weimar Republik (right before Nazi Germany) were the same ones prevalent among liberals in America today.

Social Darwinism justified killing less than perfect babies, we justify killing aborting inconvenient children and call it "a mother's right to choose."

The Nazi's sent Jews to Concentration Camps, while we tell the Jews in Israel that they shouldn't respond when Hamas fires rockets at them on a daily basis.

The more the world changes, the more it stays the same.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:16 PM
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Long story short, it is being set up that way for a long long time. The necessary Acts have been put into place very cleverly to allow the president to declare martial law when he deems necessary due to a "national disaster".....as planned. They are pissing off Chavez in order to force them to link with Russia and in my opinion allow troops to start their march north to Mexico.....after they crash our dollar making way for the Amero. It is a set up......we bomb Iran first or we get hit first and then bomb Iran.......and then syria. Blame the attack here in the US on Al Qaeda with Links to Iran the the War is on....as planned many many generations ago.......fact of historical research.....



reply to post by kleverone
 



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:19 PM
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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by moniker
 





1. Break up, have a Civil War.
2. Face a National Crisis of Civil Unrest and potential Low Intensity Warfare
3. Develop a Christian Theocracy
4. Somekind of Mix of all three.

Thats my take on it but no Nazis or Communists, at least for the near future. Twenty or Thirty years from now anything is possible.


[edit on 30/3/08 by MikeboydUS]


1. Will not happen (Prozac nation)
2. This is exactly what IS happening right now. Tasing 11-year olds... come on
3. Christianity has lost its usefulness/effectiveness for control. They are cooking up something new for the remaining few. Think about it...Crazy chrisitan bush and huckabee? They are polling public appeal. Christianity is done.
4. Nope- people are too awake for this and questioning too much 9/11 proved this to them- so they are not going to bother with much aesthetics. As good as they are with packaging/marketing- its not working either. IMO- its just a matter of timing.

Nazi's and Communists are terms being tossed out to describe what's happening. So we can call it Amerazzi or Amerinism but that would only make it more difficult to point out what this New World Order is.

Truth be told- if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck- it is a duck!

Then again there are some publicists/spinnsters who can make it very difficult to spot this duck- despite everything you know about ducks!

On a personal note- I love discussions like this because THEY do read them and it shows THEM how truly untalented they really are!!!! And I love this as it is my version of not going quietly into that good night- which I will not.


[edit on 30-3-2008 by dk3000]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:27 PM
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[I get such a kick from the historically unread. You use labels that you neither understand nor have any experience with.

I would suggest that you actually read about Nazi Germany in some detail. We are not rounding up Jews, homosexuals, gypsies, catholics, seventh day adventists, etc. and exterminating them. We are not exterminating the physically and mentally disabled, as Nazi Germany did.

You can fling labels around, but you really have no concept of what those labels actually mean.
Oh well, so much for the historically ignorant.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:31 PM
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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by kleverone
 

So open your eyes, go read some history books, and wake up. There are huge diferences between us and the Third Reich. There are major parallels between us, the British and Roman Empires. Britain was in Iraq and Afghanistan before. We seem to following right in their footsteps and mistakes. Read some books and you'll find out how.


I have a better idea.....how about you read my original post and begin to comprehend the fact that I never implied that the US is a mirror image of Nazi Germany. I was pointing out the similarities. How come you can speak in terms of parallels between the US and Rome but have to make direct comparisons when comparing to Germany? Do you just wish to argue? I would also suggest losing the condescending manner in wich you suggest I further my education when it comes to history, it only detracts from the points you try to make. If you disagree with me fine, but please do it in a respectable manner as is required by ATS.

Besides this thread currently has about 22 flags and about 20 stars, so as much as you like to think I need to re-educate myself on the facts there are at least 22 other people on here who think you need to go take your own advice.

I'm going with my people on this one.....

Thanks for stopping by my thread though



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:36 PM
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Originally posted by OldMedic
I would suggest that you actually read about Nazi Germany in some detail. We are not rounding up Jews, homosexuals, gypsies, catholics, seventh day adventists, etc. and exterminating them. We are not exterminating the physically and mentally disabled, as Nazi Germany did.




Once again, I wish people would actually read the post.

Do you think they would be stupid enough to make those same mistakes?
Did I not mention changes in the OP.

Please read it, and by it and don't mean the title, I mean the actual post.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:45 PM
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reply to post by magicmushroom
 



So tell me who was the greatest empire in human history? Industry, Economy, Military, etc. There is no one who compared to the United States, especially at the pinnacle after World War 2.

You do realize Most Roman and British Citizens at the peak of their empires were very ignorant about their world.

Worthless currency? Its not worthless yet. Rubles, Yuan, Lira, Pesos those are some worthless currencies.

Failing education, healthcare, corruption, and society have all happened before. In many instances its a catalyst for revolution, often Communist.
Whats good for Fascism is just as good of a Catalyst for Communism. Even better yet its also a good Catalyst for Fundamentalism. Which is what you would more likely see in America than Fascism or Communism.

It sounds to me you are one who knows nothing about nations and their histories. If you can't see the parallels to the British Empire and especially Rome you have to be blind.

The Europeans? Which ones? So is the new Vast conspiracy the Polish and Czechs are in league with Italians and Dutch to control America? What a crock. The only Europeans with any influence are some individuals who can influence are financial system, and thats not very many. Again they have no control over Society or really anything else, just some influence in the markets and finance. Another European the Pope has a certain amount influence on some Catholics and well thats it for Europeans. They dont control the United States. The Corporations here have alot influence, American Corporations. The Mob or Masses that protest about every thing under the sun from minorities, the environment, sexual orientaion, feminists, speech, guns, religion, liberal and conservative, and the officials they get elected have a huge amount of influence. These two wield the real power over this nation. On one side you have the American Elite or Patricians on the other you have the restless mob, Plebians.

There are so many similarities to Rome its not even funny.

Love for Violent Entertainment. Check
Emotional Plebian Mobs. Check
Elitist Patricians. Check
Powerful Legislature. Check
Powerful Executive. Check
Immoral and Decadent. Check
Corrupt and Ambitious. Check
Powerful Military with Bases around the World. Check
Fighting resource wars with insurgent natives. Check
Facing off with Eastern Powers. Check
Massive Illegal Immigration Problem. Check
Culturally and ethnically diverse. Check
Capitol full of Roman style art and architecture. Check
Modern Bread and Circuses. Check.

I could keep going and going. I could even make comparisons between the Gracchi and the Kennedys. If you dont know who they are then it'll be pointless for me to debate with you.






[edit on 30/3/08 by MikeboydUS]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 05:55 PM
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reply to post by kleverone
 



I did read your original post and did see that this is not your belief, but just an idea.

I apologize if I sounded condescending. I just find it laughable to compare National Socialism in Germany to the Two Party System in the Federal Democratic Republic we call the United States.

So we agree to disagree.

The primary reason I posted to this, is due to those numerous flags and stars. My message was directed at them as well. The fact that so many people seem to be blinded apparently by hate, that they would compare the US to a short lived, rapidly burnt out dictatorship is bizarre.



[edit on 30/3/08 by MikeboydUS]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by kleverone
 
I tend to agree with you kleverone. Every day we become more and more like Nazi controlled Germany. Our Constitution has been circumvented by the enactment of such articles as the Homeland Security act, The Patriot Act, and a plethora of executive orders Bush has written for the expressed purpose of undermining the power of the Congress and divesting us of our constitutionally gauranteed rights.

Few Americans see this happening though, and choose to bury their heads in the sand and pretend that all is well in the good Ol' US of A. They have elected to give up there freedom for the illusion of security that our government has promised them. They see terrorist around every corner as they have been frightened into believing, and are willing to give up their rights for a promise of safety.

Guns will be of some use to those who have them, and are willing to use them. But not everyone will follow their lead. It's fine to beat the drum of patriotism and pound your chest in mock fury against this evil, but are you willing to sacrifice the lives of those you love as well?

I'm personally willing to sacrifice my life, but I don't think I'd be so willing to put the lives of my friends, family, and children in the same jeopardy. If you resist, there is a very good chance those you love may die in the ensuing battle, or may even suffer worse consequences as a result of your actions.

If they put a gun to your child's head and tell you to surrender your arms, will you still refuse to do so? Or will you comply, and hope against hope that they'll be honorable and allow you and your family to go free since you cooperated?

I believe we Americans watch way too much TV. Rambo and John McClean aren't real people, their movie characters. In a clash between ordinary citizens, even armed ones, the odds of living through such a battle are small. Who honestly can stand up to tanks, helicopters, mortars, machineguns and smart bombs with an AR-15 or their trusty old 30-30? It won't be as easy to resist as movies like Red Dawn might lead us to believe.

At best, we'll be lucky if we can scurry off into the woods and hide until it all settles down.

[edit on 3/30/08 by LLoyd45]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 06:05 PM
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Anyone who thinks that America and Nazi Germany are comparable is an idiot and should be locked up because that kind of thinking is dangerous both to himself and others. He is stark raving mad.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 06:14 PM
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
 


I think it is the combined ignorance and lack of education that makes these views so popular. To anyone who is intellectually grounded, it is sensational and bizarre, I agree. I think some of us are living in different realities.


I don't think Kleverone is espousing a particular viewpoint, but open questions.



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