How Jackinthebox got jacked-up by the police

I know you may have been told that your 'window of opportunity' had expired but remember - the law still (so far) has ways of dealing with that kind of 'brush off.'

There may be a window within the police department, but if you pursue a different venue, or amend your complaint to call for 'showing cause' a good lawyer can resurrect this case (if you really wanted to). Someone brutalizing you - cop or otherwise - constitutes a breach of public safety laws as well as trespassing (again they had to have cause to approach you in the guise of peace officers).

Also, this can be taken to the DA as an assault charge - or to the local human rights commission as a civil rights abuse case. I don't know what lawyers you've been consulting, but if i ever meet them on the street I'm going to jap-slap them.

Still - and this is valid - the jurisdiction you happen to fall under may prove - uncooperative - depending on judge and his relationship with local law enforcement. There is absolutely no way the legal system can prevent you from bringing this case - but the law is deliberately ambiguous in certain areas - both for your protection and theirs.

I'm not trying to cast doubt on your story, but are you certain they didn't 'have cause' to approach you on private property. And you in no way gave them reason to believe that you were challenging their 'authoritah'? Were there any reliable witnesses willing to state on the record the nature of the encounter? You weren't a suspect were you?



[edit on 28-3-2008 by Maxmars]

reply to post by Maxmars

...but are you certain they didn't 'have cause' to approach you on private property.

They called me out to ask questions regarding the complaint they had received. I foolishly agreed to speak with them. They did not enter my home until after the arrest. They need little "cause" to set foot on a property, especially a rental property. And even entering a home these days requires little cause.

And you in no way gave them reason to believe that you were challenging their 'authoritah'?

I expressed an objection to their tactics, but not their authority. In fact, my statement included direct acknowledgement of their authority.

Were there any reliable witnesses willing to state on the record the nature of the encounter?

Yes. Impartial witnesses at that.

You weren't a suspect were you?

A "person of interest" I would say. After all, I was awake and my front door was open. They could have questioned one neighbor who's daughter was molested by the victim of the broken window, who was also awake, but it never got that far.

Also, this can be taken to the DA as an assault charge - or to the local human rights commission as a civil rights abuse case. I don't know what lawyers you've been consulting, but if i ever meet them on the street I'm going to jap-slap them.

This is how they get down around these towns 'round hyah.

Prosecutions by private attorneys pose dilemma

Jack, times are different today and you should know that.

If someone cuts you off your first reaction is to flip them off.
In these times you really need to think before reacting.

You need to stop and ask yourself if it's really worth getting in a scuffle over because nowadays you have to accept the possiblilty that if you decide to escalate, you need to to ask yourself if you are also willing to die.

This is no different because cops are only people, some are good, some are bad, some are fair minded and some get easily defensive,...

Seems common sense has become an oxymoron.

[edit on 28-3-2008 by Alxandro]

reply to post by Alxandro


I don't see anything wrong in what you have said. But how does that pertain to me?

I don't understand this...

Jack, times are different today and you should know that.

reply to post by jackinthebox


The "think before you act" part, or in your case "think before you open your mouth".

If I were in your situation, packed, loaded and drunk I would not smart mouth a cop for the very reasons I've explained.

reply to post by Alxandro


I suggest you go back and re-read the thread to better understand the situation. If you are comfortable with having your civil rights violated without raising any objection, that's your own perogative. I for one am not willing to tolerate civil servants who act in such a despicable manner. It doesn't make any difference if they are "just people like everyone else." Police are supposed to hold themselves to a higher standard, not to act like thugs. If they cannot, then anarchy would be preferable.



[edit on 3/28/0808 by jackinthebox]

And I suggest you re-read my previous post because as usual your in tunnel vision mode and can't see the full picture of my analogy. They may be cops but they are human first and you don't want to give them a reason to flex their muscles because they will, and in your case they did.

You have to remember that it's nothing more than a contest of one trying to out do the other, a contest of "one-up-man-ship", and when it gets to that point, they are not going to lose.

Your mistake was giving those cops an excuse to abuse their power.

Originally posted by jackinthebox
I came out and stood on my front porch to speak with two officers from the local department.

Originally posted by jackinthebox
I was already out. My front door was open and I had two friends over. We were hanging out on the porch and in the living room.

Well which one of these statements is true? They both can't be true.

I always wonder how it is I have gone 40 years without having the police bother me for no apparent reason. Luck? I think not. I stay away from trouble? Maybe that could be it.

[edit on 28-3-2008 by craig732]

reply to post by craig732

Well which one of these statements is true? They both can't be true.

Perhaps you should re-read what I said...

We were hanging out on the porch and in the living room.

On a nice night the front porch became a sort of extension of the living room, and I preferred that everyone smoke outside.

Originally posted by craig732
I always wonder how it is I have gone 40 years without having the police bother me for no apparent reason. Luck? I think not. I stay away from trouble? Maybe that could be it.

Go ahead and keep on believing that. Let's not forget that I was at home when all of this happened.

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for the sick, the so-called incurables,
I did not speak out;
because I was not mentally ill.

When they came for the Catholics,
I did not speak out;
because I was a Protestant.

When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.

- attributed to Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984) about the inactivity of German intellectuals following the Nazi rise to power and the purging of their chosen targets, group after group.

[edit on 3/29/0808 by jackinthebox]

reply to post by Alxandro

Your mistake was giving those cops an excuse to abuse their power.

Oh, well that makes it okay then. :shk:

I suppose we should all use that excuse. The next time someone cuts you off in traffic, go ahead and put a bullet in them if they don't kiss your behind. You're only human after all.

Jack,

I realize there are a few aspects of the case you're not at liberty to discuss here, and that's cool. It'd be really bad to have your case prejudiced over a disclosure issue.

Cops are people just like you and me though, and they have their personal prejudices, fears, and dislikes as well. You said you're a large guy, and I'd guess that's where all your troubles began. Big people are typically looked upon with fear and distrust and by smaller individuals, including armed police officers. I have a similar reaction myself around people who are larger than me, it's a natural male response I guess.

At some subconscious level your size probably provoked a fear reflex in them, hence the use of excessive force. It may also be a case of someone having a chip on their shoulder, and a Napolean Complex about their own size.

I'm a big guy myself, and I'm always treated like I'm on the Most Wanted list even for traffic citations. They get a look at me, and their first reaction is to put their hand on their gun. I'm very careful about keeping my hands in plain view so as not to provoke them. I keep my voice level and calm, and try not to give them cause to fear me.

Honestly, the female cops are less intimidated by me than the males. I got pulled over recently by a female cop for my headlights not being on after dusk. She never once reached for her gun, was not afraid of me standing by her even though I was a good foot taller and a 100lbs heavier, and she treated me with like a regular person. I really appreciated that. I called the station the next day and sang her praises.

I hope you get some vindication on your complaint. Regardless of what you may or may not have said or done, the amount of force seems excessive. Two police officers should be able to restrain one person without having to resort to the use of a taser. If they can't, they need to find another type of work. Good Luck on your case.



[edit on 3/29/08 by LLoyd45]

reply to post by LLoyd45


I agree. And I do think that I may be the victim of "size-prejudice." This is something that I deal with wherever I go, not just with police. I deliberatley try to put people at ease by speaking softly, smiling, etc., and generally going out of my way to appear non-threatening. Perhaps the two officers feared that my attempts to do so that night were a ruse.

Originally posted by jackinthebox
reply to post by LLoyd45

 

I agree. And I do think that I may be the victim of "size-prejudice." This is something that I deal with wherever I go, not just with police. I deliberatley try to put people at ease by speaking softly, smiling, etc., and generally going out of my way to appear non-threatening. Perhaps the two officers feared that my attempts to do so that night were a ruse.

It's very possible. I'm sometimes annoyed by the fact that I have to go out of my way to place others at ease when I'm really no threat at all. Discrimination in our society comes in an assortment of flavors ranging from skin color to physical size.

reply to post by jackinthebox


Kissing their behinds was never a suggestion.
You obviously don't know the meaning of "Silence is Golden".

Why are you such a hot head?

Something tells me you would be prone to snapping as well if you were still a cop. You were probably let go because you spent too much time on ATS.

Wow goosdog that is an awesome survival story. You are blessed. Yes, their really are many good and caring cops on the beat. God bless you!

You know jack, it appears that you might be in the right and I hope you come out of this, on top.

However, I have to agree with some of the comments here. Had you not run your mouth you would be less likely to be dealing with this crap. I know you don't want/need to hear that, but I'm saying it for others reading along too.

Now, that doesn't give these MF's an excuse to break the law themselves by kicking your butt, but that's status quo when you mouth off to these types and more often than not they have better support & know the court system better than their opponents, so they continue the abuse as long as they see they can get away with it.

I believe you could of outsmarted them using you wit, and cooled them off with finesse, but instead you choose to stand your ground which led them to escalate the situation and they had the upper hand.

The biggest problem I see with your story is that you had a gun, which makes it appear like you may have been packing the gun because you were expecting possible retaliation from the person who's window was broke whom you've had an ongoing feud with.

That's what it looks like to me with the information provided so far and that's probably why the cops reacted the way they did - if that's they case than I see why you have no case against them. No matter what they did, that fact & the drunkenness will destroy your credibility.

If you don't file a claim & or a lawsuit nothing will change, so I suggest you think about it before the statute of limitations expire. It's three years where I live, I find it hard to believe that it's only three months for you. IF you don't play offense & defense your chances of a win diminishes.


I too had a similar but different problem with the same folks, but I can't tell the story because it's ongoing too.



[edit on 30-3-2008 by verylowfrequency]

Originally posted by Alxandro
Something tells me you would be prone to snapping as well if you were still a cop.

Jack was never a cop.

He was a security guard.

I wonder if some police officers take offense to Jack's claim of "Having worn a shield for several years".

I am not saying he is intentionally misleading people, but he is implying he was a police officer or peace officer by saying this, as is indicated by the numerous replies here that indicate people believe he was a police officer.

[edit on 30-3-2008 by craig732]

Originally posted by jackinthebox
I have been beat up worse before.

Originally posted by jackinthebox
a man who had once intended to murder me.

I still don't understand how some people have a bunch of trouble like this find them while others seem to go through life without this type of trouble.

Any insight into this Jack?

reply to post by craig732

I wonder if some police officers take offense to Jack's claim of "Having worn a shield for several years".

I take offense to the stigma attached to security guards. I remind you that I was contracted to the state at my last post. My duties and experiences on the job have gone far beyond checking locked doors.

It is also important to point out that such duties are carried out without the civil protections that police officers enjoy, and are often carried out unarmed as well.