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Police in Rising Arms Race With Crooks

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posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 03:10 AM
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reply to post by ANOK
 




Yep education is the only way to go I think


Get the people into school instead of on the streets where crime is the only way to make a living.




posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 03:16 AM
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Originally posted by ANOK
Cops don't care about peoples safety, or stopping crime, they just want to been seen to be fighting the 'war' on crime. Their livelihood is dependent on crime, so it's not in their best interest to suppress it. It's all just another business at the expense of citizens. So the cycle continues...


Wow, some excellent points there Anok! Logic is sound to me.

But it saddens me. How can we deal with crime, with the crooks (violent-offenders), with a means that doesn't create a system who's livelihood is dependent on the crooks? (I understood you were alluding to the fact that just having the police department actually increases the crime, because of that dependecy, to which I agree, but obviously some crime will exist regardless)



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 03:23 AM
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I do remember when the IRA was bombing and shooting everyone that was against them. Correct me if I am wrong, but they were doing this while England had all ready banned guns.

Banning weapons for the so called good of the people has been done a thousand times over by despotic and paranoid governments.

First it was the sword that was banned in England during the middle ages. Did this stop crime? Not in the least.

China has a similar history of banning certain weapons only to have the people resort to different ones. Kung Fu has over 100 different weapons, most of them designed because a government tried to ban the most dangerous ones.

Let me give you a glimpse of the future. A standard microwave can be turned into a bomb without any major explosive chemicals. The microwave emitter itself can kill silently and without warning if so implemented. Sound waves if formulated correctly can cause massive damage. Electricity in almost any from can kill someone very quickly.

My friends if you think banning guns makes people any safer than you do not know history, nor just how much technology is out there that can kill you more silently, just as quickly, and more available than a gun.

A slingshot with a poisoned rock can kill you. If you pass more laws against guns then all you will see is just how more creative criminals can get. Just look at the arsenal collection of any jailhouse and you will understand that taking away weapons does not deter crime, nor does it make people any safer than they are today.

The crime rate in prison has escalated or stayed above the level of the standard population no matter what weapons are taken away from them. This is because criminals always find a way and only the foolish think that taking away weapons changes the equation.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 03:26 AM
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Originally posted by ANOK

Guns don't reduce crime they just escalate the results of it. Ever hear of a drive by stabbing? Guns make it to easy to kill.


I completely agree with you, and nice analogy.

But, what happens when the police and the Government, who are armed to their teeth, turn on us? I know, its a stretch
I am talking about escalating it even further. What if they really turn on us, the People. In everyday living, perhaps it is more of a hindrance to our safety, by increasing fatal crimes, and what not. But what if the Government and its Police turn on the people with guns. Are we going to wish we had guns instead of daggers?

I understand and agree with your points, but with the prevelance of corruption and abuse of power, do we really want the People so defenseless? I know it's what they want...

[edit on 033131p://24u09 by Lucid Lunacy]



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 04:08 AM
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As has already been stated twice that I know of, killing will go on regardless if there are guns available or not. As the old adage goes: "Guns don't kill people, people kill people."

It still rings true today.

TheBorg



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 07:30 PM
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reply to post by TheBorg
 


thank you thats all im saying if people are still goona kill people why take away peoples abbility to defend and protect them selves and there loved ones.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 07:43 PM
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Originally posted by krill
thank you thats all im saying if people are still goona kill people why take away peoples abbility to defend and protect them selves and there loved ones.


Because feeling you need a gun to protect yourself is a little paranoid?

It's actually reactionary thinking based in emotional gut reactions. Man has gun, man gets bigger gun. Don't you see the pattern it creates?

Personally as a ex-pat Brit living in the US I see gun ownership here as more of a need for males to be overly masculine from insecurity due to the systems conditioning of its children to overly express their masculinity. Along with overt competitiveness and blind obedience to coercive authority...


I call it the John Wayne syndrome...



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 07:43 PM
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Originally posted by Fett Pinkus
We dont have drive by shootings, its seldom that some kid shoots at a school.

Then why are there so many of them in the US?

Food for Thought

2004 saw 81 people die everyday from firearms


Says it all really...


Because America is 1. A lot larger then Europe.

2. Has a less centralized/departmentalized control over citizens in smaller populations like European countries.

3. France has the largest population in Europe with over 40 million people, it is also the largest by land..

America however is twice as large as the continent and has 300+ million people..

4. Under one nationality no other nation in the world has as many cultures, the next closest would be China.

5. No other nation in the world is more heavily medicated then America.. imo, drugs account for more deaths then guns, as many gunmen are drugged up on anti-depressants..

6. All murders are committed by criminals of some nature, else they would not be committing murder.. someone committing murder will do so whether or not they have a gun.. a gun is the easiest method, not the only method.

There are many reasons why America is portraited as being this wild west scene.. in reality I do not see American violence as being any worse then other countries..

Those that say take guns away and you fix the problem.. I say I consider YOU the problem..

If every one had a gun, criminals would fear EVERYONE.. no more would people get abducted and murdered, women raped off the streets, houses broken into..

Imagine deciding to break into a house where you KNOW for a fact there are at least one or two guns that you will face..

or imagine deciding to carjack someone knowing within hand reach the guy or woman has a pistol in the center console..

Of course then those who hate guns would then be crying about all the dead scum.. personally, good riddance to them.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 07:47 PM
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Originally posted by ANOK
Personally as a ex-pat Brit living in the US I see gun ownership here as more of a need for males to be overly masculine from insecurity due to the systems conditioning of its children to overly express their masculinity. Along with overt competitiveness and blind obedience to coercive authority...


I call it the John Wayne syndrome...



It always amazes me....people bitch piss and moan about the US and it's laws, its way of doing business yet...people like you flock here to live and work. And those that are already here who bitch piss and moan about the US and its way of doing business never pack up and leave....so what does that tell you? Tells me a lot about the people who never stop complaining about the very country they run to and never run away from!!!



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 07:57 PM
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Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
...I understand and agree with your points, but with the prevelance of corruption and abuse of power, do we really want the People so defenseless? I know it's what they want...


Thanx brother, or sister?

Well what good would owning a gun really do you if that happens?
I think it's a bit of an unrealistic fantasy to think us 'the people' would be able to fight off the massive military and police with handguns.

But realistically the government doesn't need to turn on us with force, they already have us in their control. Look what happened in New Orleans, how many stood and used their guns when the government were taking them away from them? How many of those people who used to say, 'from my cold dead hands' gave over their guns with no more than a whimper when the time came?

Owning a gun 'just in case' creates problems that effect someone badly every day. But as usual the American psyche thinks only of itself and not the bigger picture. As usual it wants to use a band aid instead of finding and fixing the cause. Its the sign of a lazy society lulled into apathy by TV and easy living on wealth borrowed and payed later, or not.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 08:04 PM
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One other thing...I never met a women that was raped, a person that was robbed at knife point, or a person who was home when it got broken into that was happy they didn't have a gun, or didn't wish after the fact they would of gotten one!



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 08:11 PM
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Originally posted by rcwj75
It always amazes me....people bitch piss and moan about the US and it's laws, its way of doing business yet...people like you flock here to live and work. And those that are already here who bitch piss and moan about the US and its way of doing business never pack up and leave....so what does that tell you? Tells me a lot about the people who never stop complaining about the very country they run to and never run away from!!!


LOL more reactionary garbage.

I live here, have payed taxes here, have served in the military here, my farther was a New Yorker. I have as much right to live here and bitch about it as the next person. I'm from Europe just like your ancestors, I just came a bit later. 'Americans' monopoly on this land that's been here since the earth was created is despicable imo. Property is theft...

If people never bitched you my friend would not have many of the 'freedoms' you enjoy now. You are only still relatively free because people before you bitched and moaned, regardless of where they came from. When a country effects the rest of the world then everyone has the right to grievance.

And your assumption that just because someone moves here and stays it proves somehow that is must be the cats cheese? There are many reasons people move to and stay in another country, it's not always because the system there is perfect and better than anywhere else.
I lived in Sicily for two years and to be honest I'd rather live there than here but it's just not practical. I left Britain and stay here for reasons other than you are assuming. It's not good to assume and stereotype, not very far from racism if you really think about it.

[edit on 24/3/2008 by ANOK]



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by rcwj75
One other thing...I never met a women that was raped, a person that was robbed at knife point, or a person who was home when it got broken into that was happy they didn't have a gun, or didn't wish after the fact they would of gotten one!


Well yes you're right but getting more guns doesn't solve that problem, it escalates it. As I have tried to point out in numorous posts here how fixing the problem by increasing the armory doesn't fix the problem.

Do you want to fix the problem or just spend your life looking over your shoulder as you polish your iron? Anti-social behavior will never go away, but escalating it by 'keeping up' with the 'criminals' doesn't help, does it?

Bail out the basement while there's holes in the roof...



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 08:36 PM
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reply to post by ANOK
 



Well what good would owning a gun really do you if that happens?
I think it's a bit of an unrealistic fantasy to think us 'the people' would be able to fight off the massive military and police with handguns.


You know.. your actually 100% right on.. who the hell are we, the mere people, the untrained men with guns .. who the hell do we think we are to stand up to massive militaries against all odds in a desperate attempt to secure what we believe...

Well..

I know of a few Americans who did this once.. no joke, simple men, stood up against a world power and defeated them and gained freedom.

Our founding fathers.

So sure, we are up against some poor odds.. we may not stand a chance if our government really did react against us..

I for one would consider it tradition.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 08:38 PM
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Originally posted by ANOK
It's not good to assume and stereotype, not very far from racism if you really think about it.


Nice try to tie in something thats not there. Racism is a cop out for weak people. Blame it on skin color and it makes those types of people feel better...all that BS...so no NOTHING like racism.

My point is...IF I decided to move to ..lets say canada..why would I complain about anything? I am the one deciding to move to a country that already has set laws and standards...so to knowingly move there and then bitch about the stuff I don't like once I'm there shows I wouldn't have been to smart to make that move. IMO

As for the part about, if it wasn't for people bitching, pissing and moaning I wouldn't have the rights/freedoms I do...I have to disagree to a point...those rights and freedoms I fought for, just like you, were here when we "STOLE" this land from the NA's. All thats happened since then is more and more people flocked here and decided they wanted things THEIR way and slowly over time...look where we are...those rights/freedoms are going away quickly....is it because of the people who want this country to thrive, and believe in the core values of what America stands for...no it's because we let every tom, dick and harry come in and get THEIR way...instead of adopting to THE WAY it was intended. This is the only country I know of where its ok to move too, throw the American flag on the ground and step on it while you hang your "other" countries flag...

I think my major gripe is there is NO respect for this country anymore by a majority who come here. I can understand not liking us because of the government...sure, I'm on board with that...I don't like them either...but cmon...there has to be a place where there is some common understanding!



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 08:59 PM
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reply to post by rcwj75
 


Well you have a right to your reactionary opinion but I'm afraid I don't agree.

I think I already explained why I have the right, as I have served this country and done more for it than a lot of people who were born here have.
I don't need to justify my actions any further to you.

So why not get back to the topic, which isn't me...

I didn't say there was any racism there, I was merely pointing out that stereotyping is the same thing as racism. Racism is being biased against a race because of the actions of a few of that race, instead of taking each person as an individual. Stereotyping and basing your opinion on that is the same thing, whether its race, political belief, or immigrants...

[edit on 24/3/2008 by ANOK]



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 09:00 PM
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thinking you need a gun to defend yourself against a gun weilding crook is paranoid? ever hear the saying dont bring a knife to a gun fight? it makes a solid point say im mugged by some one with a shot gun and i have lets say a legal knife your saying its reasonable to assume i can defend my self against a shotgun in close combat with a knife with a blade no more then 4 inches long? that seems preety dilusional to me yet im the paranoid one. have you ever been held at gun point? have you ever been shot at ? i have ihave also been stabbed , beaten with a bat, hit with a car and tazed and you know what the getting shot at scared me a hell of a lot more then when i was stabbed , bludgeoned, or ran over. go live in the inner city of baltimore for a few years and then tell me that citazins shouldent have access to fire arms or bullet proof clothing.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 09:08 PM
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reply to post by krill
 


Being worried about being mugged sounds like paranoia to me...

You have more chance of being killed by the government than you have of being mugged. Yes there is crime but it's hyped out of all proportion by the media. Us 'Euros' have always laughed at the hysteria of the American media and the peoples paranoid reactions to it. Your media controls your reasoning.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 09:16 PM
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Originally posted by ANOK
I didn't say there was any racism there, I was merely pointing out that stereotyping is the same thing as racism. Racism is being biased against a race because of the actions of a few of that race, instead of taking each person as an individual. Stereotyping and basing your opinion on that is the same thing, whether its race, political belief, or immigrants...


Glad you said this...might want to keep your own words close to heart when you post about the actions of 1 or 2 police officers!

As far as getting back to the OP. Bottom line is this...this country and world are no longer open to rome and do what we want. As stated before, there is barely anymore room. And the attitudes of society have deterearated. Its become a violent world...and guns have had NOTHING to do with it. I agree with you that guns make the act of killing/violence easier...but we all have said...killing and murder/violence have gone on since the creation of man....and will continue until our extinction. So NO not out of reaction or paranoia will I carry my gun. I will carry for the FACT that violence is a way of life...and I for one don'w want to be a victim if I have a way to stop it.

Now I know your saying guns only add to, or escilate the cycle...I disagree...a well placed round on a rapist, murderer, or robber get rid of THAT element..hence making the world safer for someone else who would of become another one of their victims.



posted on Mar, 24 2008 @ 09:22 PM
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acthualy i have been mugged more times than i can count i have also been beaten for no reason had my home broken in to and robbed on a few occasions and once had some one break in to my house while i was sleeping and woke up to one guy pointing a hand gun at me while his buddy took my tv, dvd player and computer the only things i had at the time worth any thing. so no the media dosent control my thinking the crack heads who robbed me every chance they got altered my way of thinking . and as far as being paranoid goes yep im paranoid acthualy im a paranoid skitzoaffective with a disasociative disorder, im nolt allowed to own a firearm and out of respect for my wife who hates guns because some one in her family killed him self with one i dont violate the law and own a gun but i own many other weapons , and go no where with out a means of self defense. as society and living in a bad neghborhood in a rough city has tought me if some one can take advantage of you they will . what i laugh at is the fact that brits cant walk down the street with out being on 10 diffrent videos or sneeze with out the nanny state saying bless you. and yet theres still roving gangs over there terrorizing passerbys in london. yeah giving up your freedom sure did seem to make you safer.



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