what you should know about the 14th Dalai Lama

Originally posted by sy.gunson
You told me ?

Yes I did. Some people are to stubborn to listen to advice

Besides I don't have the postage nor an address to mail you the documents, nor the inclination.

Are you claiming you have the documents?

everyone know who is the boss of Dalai.

No actually... do tell

And this is a great distraction from the human rights abuse and illegal occupation of Tibet.

You have not provided a point by point rebuttal of the facts. You have only jeered at evidence, but can't counter it.

There are even candid admissions that you Chinese guys have no knowledge of documents or evidence. If you're so well informed share it. You haven't because all you have to share is Chinese Governmnent propaganda.

Gosh you must have great jobs being paid to pump out B/S. What do you do when you run out of anything useful to say. Create distractions.

Anti-chinese and pro human rights activists websites? This sounds like Bush speak to me. The Chinese are just as bad off as we are.
Stop vilifying the rest of the world, especially since you hate when we do it.

I know im not a moderator here but can we please stop snipping each other and post evidence instead of attacks?

Yes I did. Some people are to stubborn to listen to advice

and I'd take advice from someone who a few moments ago who said he had no knowledge of something widely publicised and written in in books like that of Michel Piessel about the Tibetans of Mustang ?

Well if you've come here just to spit all your ignorance over us then you're actually nobody serious enough to debate with. You're just a time waster.

I'll debate in future with serious people.

Originally posted by sy.gunson
There are even candid admissions that you Chinese guys have no knowledge of documents or evidence. If you're so well informed share it. You haven't because all you have to share is Chinese Governmnent propaganda.

And I live in China because?. I have not ONCE linked to a Chinese Government website, while you have linked to Tibet.com and other bias websites. Now who is the one spreading propaganda?


If you have any documents you would like to share, share it. If you dont then dont make such a big fuss about it

reply to post by chinawhite


Well if I could find any chinese documentation on the matter of Falun Gong I would provide that. The world knows what happened, frankly I'm not all that concerned with the fact that you do not.

reply to post by sy.gunson


you only repeat yourself again and again.
Ok, China's document is propoganda while yours is the truth. right? you are the incarnate of TRUTH. LOL....

dont lose your civility, otherwise you have already lost the debate.
be a decent man no mater you are right or not.

Originally posted by sy.gunson
something widely publicised and written in in books like that of Michel Piessel about the Tibetans of Mustang ?

I was asking about the "Secret Chinese documents" NOT Michel Piessel.

Accuse someone when you have a proper idea of what they are refering to

reply to post by Witness2008


hi ,clever witeness.

now, the topic is Tibet. dont derail this to conceal your lose.




[edit on 22-3-2008 by wwssii]

I think it is weird that everyone is taking such offense to this. There is plenty of research out there about the Dalai Lamas connections.. It is a well known fact that the US backs Tibet in its anti-chinese campaign/CIA. And the fact is there are plenty of articles out there that would suggest that Buddhism has had plenty of not so peaceful moments, including its involvement in Viet Nam

Important things to remember

1. Tibet is small, of course it needs help and to take action against its Chinese agressor.

2. People that back China, are again of course going to come out with knowledge of these things and the Dalai Lamas relationship with other people

3. Just because someone is a Buddhist does not mean they cannot or will not be militant, there are plenty of examples (you can find them on WWW)
there are even militant buddhist groups in the US

4.To all you who just do not want to believe this, grow up! There is good and bad in everyone and on everyside, sometimes you just have to pick a side. Drastic times call for drastic measure and everyone is capable. If not you just get ran over. Some things are worth fighting for...and I am sure it is being done in Tibet

5. I am not making any direct accusations on weather or not the Dalai is a terrorist, or who his best friends are. I am not even saying he is militant...but the man does have his beliefs, which he is going to stand for and he is running Tibet, so as a leader he still has to have options on the table. You can view it however you want.

[edit on 22-3-2008 by birchtree]

Oh Birch tree another Chinese member who just joined us since the protests in Tibet

A little obvious don't you think ?


Well actually keep arguing because as you do so you confirm the western view of China's invasion of Tibet. Westerners reading this are getting great insight to how much like Nazi Germany, China's occupation of Tibet really is.

None of you from China offer any evidence of your own, but you always demand that the evidence provided against China is insufficient.

At the same time most of you admit never reading the evidence. Typical.

reply to post by sy.gunson


you stick to your opinion just because you firmly believe what you read and heard.
i think your evidence is lie.
you reckon our evidence is propaganda.

that is the key crux.

i introduce you read about this book. , written by Stavrianos, L.S....an world-wide famous american historian can give you every picture of his that prove that tibet always is a part of China.

dont tell me this professor is also a gov agent.

[edit on 22-3-2008 by wwssii]

[edit on 22-3-2008 by wwssii]

by wwssii

i introduce you read about this book. < global history---from prehistory to the 21st century>>, written by Stavrianos, L.S....an world-wide famous american historian can give you every picture of his that prove that tibet always is a part of China.

Yes well Stavrianos clearly hasn't done much research has he ?
Neither have you wwssii.

Agreement for the Restoration of Peaceful Relations Between China and Tibet (1918)

Article 3. It is agreed that the provisional boundary line between Chinese and Tibetan controlled territory shag be as follows: The districts of Batang (Bean), Yenching (Tsakalo), Itun (Sanpa or Taso), Tejung (a), Litang, (Lihua), Kantze, Nyarong (Chantui or Chanhua), Luho (Changku or Drango)(b), Taofu (Taowu), Hokou (Nyachuka or Yachiang), Tachienlu (Dartsendo or Kangting), Tanpa (Romidrango)(c), Lutingchiao (Jazamaka)(e), Chiulung (Jez¬erong)(d), Hsiangcheng (Tinghsiang)(f), and Taocheng(g), and the country lying to the east of them, shall be under the control of the Chinese; no Tibetan troops or civil or military officials being permitted to reside therein; while the districts of Riwoche (Leiwuchi), Enta(h), Chiamdo (Changtu), Draya (Chaya), Markam-Gartok (Chiangka or Ningching), Gonjo (Kung¬chueh), Sangen (Sangai or Wucheng), Tungpu (i), Tengko (k),**** Seshu (Shihchu), Derge (Teko), and Beyu (Paiyu), and the country lying to the west of them, shall be under the control of the Tibetans; no Chinese troops or civil or military officials being permitted to reside therein. As soon as the Governments of China and Tibet shall have formally accepted this agreement, all the Tibetan troops and civil and military officials at present in Kantze and Nyarong (Chantui) districts shall be withdrawn; the Chinese civil and military authorities engaging not to oppress or in any way maltreat the natives of those parts, including the Lamas of Dargye Gomba and other monasteries, after the withdrawal of the Tibetan troops. The existing boundaries of Yunnan Province and of the Kokonor (i.e., the territory at present under the control of the Sining officials) shall remain for the present unchanged.

Rather than refer me to the book wwssii since you've obviously read it yourself, tell us all so we can debate what you claim it says ?

China has never been part of China.

From time to time it has been invaded by Qing / Manchu Chinese. In 1720 the Qing emperor responded to a request for assistance by the infant 6th Dalia Lama to drive the Dzungars from Lhasa.

The Chinese left in 1723. Then in 1727 the Qing/Manchu troops returned to impose a Chinese embassy and regent on the young Dalai Lama. In 1749 the Chinese ambassodors murdered a Tibetan regent sparking a further Qing/Manchu invasion but the Tibetans beat the Chinese invaders.

They also beat the Manchu invaders in 1911 and drove them out in 1912.

reply to post by chinawhite


The US was there for their own personal gain to stop communism. They propped up a dictator and used billions of dollars and killed millions of Vietnamese stopped them from uniting. The only blood China has is the blood of free Vietnamese fighting for the integrity of their country


So, are we forgetting the attempt by the Peoples Republic of China to invade Vietnam in February of 1979? Or do PRC people forget every event in which they get their asses kicked?

reply to post by sy.gunson


OK, stavrianos are biased and you r right! you should be the most famous historian in the world. are you satisfied?

dont paste the garbage info,i will never see that.

you live in new zealand, why care so much of China. how can you really understand the real history of China... funny!

reply to post by sy.gunson


I don't usually do this but:

"Never argue with an idiot, he'll only bring you down to his level and beat you with experience!"

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."

These PRC slaves aren't worth debating!!!

reply to post by stikkinikki


Who is "we" ?

Northwolfe CND I know what you are saying.

I think there has been enough argument and the point is well made.

Both sides have expressed themselves and have a full appreciation.

wwssii I think I have answered your last comment fully and from the heart at the thread about forces swarming Tibet.

It is a shame however that you think there is only one version of the truth and insist not to read other versions or other evidence that dis agrees with you.

I am not the world's greatest historian. I have tried to tell you some history which I suspect you may not know.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings. My feelings are about protecting the Tibetans and I care about their fate. I don't hate Chinese or China. Hopefully one day you will understand this.

You asked why I care. If I was in Lhasa and saw someone being attacked i would try to protect them whether they were Tibetan or Chinese because we are all human. That's why I care. Good luck wwssii.








[edit on 22-3-2008 by sy.gunson]

reply to post by sy.gunson


hah, and you try to use these examples to showcase what? You only proof that you really don't know anything about the 5000 year long Chinese culture and history. Ok, you might know some names and some years here and there, but from how you are posting we can see that you don't understand any meaning behind it.

By the way, if you guys did so care about China, where were the yells and screams for "world help" when most part of China faced a disastrious winter storm in January/February? Do you even know that there were hundreds of million Chinese people, Han and other minorities, being affected causing mayhem and suffer to the extend that many couldn't even have access to the very basics of food, water, not to mention electricity or other "luxuries" which you guys take for granted as basics.
NOT one single thread in ATS I could find talking about that disaster, and where were the Western media reporting of this disaster in China? Or the "human rights" group organizing concerts to collect money for saving and relieving?