The Decay of UK Society

reply to post by dogbone

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What i do at the moment is i get sent from my university to schools with very bad reputation and my job is to persuade teenagers to carry on with their studies because going to college/university is not as hard as they think.I tell them about different courses they can do and make myself sound like i have also been through all the troubles etc.. when i was a teen.

It sorta works because they start to understand education ain't as tough as what they thought and there are many other ways to go about it.

Here are our options...

Go out and get our heads kicked in after dark by a group of clone-a-like wannabe gangsters.

Or act in self defence and feel the brute force of the law on us and get slammed in a cell by an uncaring, unlistening policeman who's only concern is his own cowardly points in grabbing speeders and drunks, and not tackling any of the real issues of society.

So, we've got kids above the law who may kill you, and we've the got the actual law which is neither use nor ornament...

Great Britain eh?

I stood up for my fellow citizen and would do so again..

I intervened in a fight a week or so ago whilst walking home from town, where a drunken slob was punching and kicking his equally drunken girlfriend to the ground. I went to her aid without really thinking of consequences, and even though he got a blow or two on me, I managed to hit back harder and sent the weasel packing.

I stayed with the woman until the police and ambulance arrived and made sure she didn't lapse into unconciousness, and even though I risked my own safety to help defend someone from being beaten senseless, I got a stern word from the officers that although I acted with good concience, they could technically arrest me for assault

...the only person who said 'thankyou' was a fellow passer-by who stopped and asked if she could help in any way

reply to post by dogbone

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the inner cities of the uk are full of out of control kids but you have to realise 1,they are bored-no sports field,social centres etc. 2. this pent up energy is spent playing aggressive video games while listening to promoted gangsta hip hop- positive music just isn't played.3. they live in a surveillance society and are feared and misunderstood by scared adults. 4 there is no police prescence except in form of cameras. 5. they are pumped full of e numbers and rubbish food causing furthur hyperactivity.6. fathers are either not involved or in jail leaving no positive male role model. 7, uk govt continues to import addictive class a drugs to create underclass, enslave the people and make vast amount of cash

you can't blame the youth!-peter tosh

My point exactly... where were the coppers when the poor woman was getting a beating????

And then they threaten YOU with arrest....

No wonder the police are hated so much by everyone in this country... they're power-tripping cowards in uniforms, who would rather sit in their cars and pull over a motorist for having a dodgy indicator...


Are there any POLICE on this forum who can give an honest reason why we should give them any respect?

In my opinion vigilantism is probably gonna be the only answer in the next few years if this problem doesn't get sorted. God forbid.

I haven't reaall replies but here's what I think,

It is nowhere near as bad as the media makes it out to be. Sure there are violent incidents which sadly have ended in fatalities on many occasions. However, this is just a fact of the present day. There has always been some group of people causing trouble. It will eventually fade away with the generation in the same way hippies (i know hippies were the good guys) and skinheads (not the good guys) did. They will still be around but not to the same level. The chav will die out eventually but in the meantime we just have to get on with our own lives and try to keep out of trouble.

I live in nottingham which is rife with chavs and council estates full of hoodlems, but I have never had a problem (so far, touch wood, crossed kings, god willing etc..)

On a serious note though, until criminals get the punishment they deserve, they will keep on doing what they do. You can literally get away with murder these days

[edit on 19-3-2008 by fiftyfifty]

reply to post by fiftyfifty

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I disagree,

this generation of chavs seem to be the offspring of the messed up gene pool that occured in the disillusioned eighties and unfortunately unless the media potrayal of gangsters and guns tones down, then unfortunately i cannot see much changing in the next few years...

reply to post by mr-lizard

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I suppose that's right but once this generation has grown up (if ever), as long as their kids get a proper education it should become less of a problem. I was born in the eighties and am not a chav, the same as the mojority of other late teens early 20's. My brother was born in 1991 and the same thing. It all comes down to the childhood and the upbringing. You will see that a lot of 'chav's want their kids to do well because they want them to have a better childhood than they did. (Jeremy kyle is good proof of this )

The two most important things for a brighter future are better policing and better education. All we need is the right government... there's the problem.

rolf... Your solution is.. Start eating, lifting weights, and pounching a sandbag.... learn how to fight and learn how to think like a gang member. most gansters are only tougth when they are in the 5-6 men group not when they are alone, because the only thing that makes em strong is there numbers. if they have a weapond then make sure you have a wepond. thats my solution to preventing your butt getting beaten!

I live in the U.S but back in Peru, there is no such thing as a little gang, because first of all, if a father sees his kid stealing or acting like his a gang member. that kid will get his living lights beaten and so he will understand not to do. but if the father fails to. then the town will take care of them, by catching them Tieing their hands and feet and leting the Woman beat the living lights out of them as a lesson. after that they are turned in to the Police station and spend some time in jail. if they don't change after that then they are just a lost cause and need to be eliminated.

[edit on 19-3-2008 by Lotlatino]

reply to post by dogbone

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Apply their own tactics. Surely there are enough grown men in your neighborhoods to deal with a bunch of punks that threaten not only you, but your wives, your children, your siblings, your elderly parents, etc.

I'm sure the police do all they can within the scope of the law, but sometimes it doesn't hurt to give them a hand. A lot of people once the the cops do arrest the scum, refuse to testify out of fear of retaliation. Amazingly, they then have the nerve to complain about the courts setting them free. what do you expect?

You can't lay the responsibility for your own safety and that of your loved ones on someone else. Do you want to spend the rest of your days afraid to go outside your own homes? Do you want your womenfolk and your children frightened every time they must leave the house because something bad might happen to them?

Can I presume that people realise Death Wish is a film?

While it might seem a good idea to be a vigilante you are more likely to get killed or be arrested and the bad guy gets away. I've stood up for myself but the balance is against you.

As for getting between a drunk man and woman, I saw that in Hammersmith and the Policeman who did it was stabbed by the woman while he was wrestling her mate to the floor.

What we need is this poxy government to step in, instantly recall National Service for those of 18 or above that are not in work. They will learn respect, a trade if they can bothered and something about life. I'm absolutely sick of this growing trend to follow an MTV US based lifestyle where being a 'gangsta' is good and women are just there for sex and belittlement. We had very little gun crime in the UK before, now we are getting drive by's and guns everywhere.

As groups we can try and keep our neighbour hood free of these scum by showing strength in groups. People must remember that this isn't a game and you don't respawn after getting shot.

It's a sad world we live in and it's getting worse every minute, I can almost see the film Escape from New York becoming real life, one massive area for the scum to live in with no escape...

I agree completely. Cameron for '09.

Mind you, when you are walking down the road and some 'girl' who looks like a prostitute pushing a pram screaming at a 3yr old to "stop F'ing making noise you little c**t" it not hard to see why some of these kids grow up to be scum.

reply to post by VelvetSplash

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What difference will Cameron make, both the parties are the same with the exception that whatever wealth will be shared more with the wealthier via Cameron.

All that needs to happen is a few steps:

1. Routinely rearm police. There is no reason to have police walking around with a glorified beating stick (baton), while the thugs have handguns. The police themselves are against this, because it will cause them to make difficult decisions about when to shoot/ not shoot. For gods sake, they better learn to make those decisions and reclaim these dingy streets back for the law abiding.

2. Zero tolerance police. Thug bashes granny up- thug goes to jail and serves HARD punishment... chain gang/ road building duty labour- this also gets us better public infrastructure! Yay!

3. Reintroduce the death penalty for sadistic and horrific crimes including multiple murder, paedophilia and rape.

4. Re-arm law abiding citizens so they can deal with violence on the front lines. If a punk attacks you with a knife, you pull a gun on him, he runs away scared and its all good. If he pulls a gun on you, shoot to kill. Simple.


Enough with this namby pamby liberal hogwash about people deserving 3rd, 4th and 5th chances... we the public are on our last nerve and we need to demand action now.

I honestly feel that most of the groups are just bored kids hanging round together with nothing to do and no where to go, but that a smaller number of "ring leaders" who can get booze and drugs tend to lead the more gullible into trouble. Heres an example, My Bro and I was walking back from a neighbours house and had to walk through the middle of a gang of chavs with ages ranging from about 14 - 16, as we passed the group I heard the biggest one tell one of the smaller lads to kick the football at us ( I'm in my early 30's and I'm 6'2 and my bro is 20 and almost 6' tall). I managed to turn around and catch it, the older, bigger lad then shouts abuse at me to give him his football. As soon as I turned around the younger ones run, leaving a handful of the ring leaders, I told him if he was man enough to tell his mate to kick the football at people then he'd be man enough to come and take it out of my hand. He decided not to, so I dropped the ball where I was standing and told him in a very descriptive way that if I saw him do it again then there would be trouble.
I remember being that age and hanging in groups and seeing older people look at us with a bit of fear, but even though we weren't angels we seemed to have a bit more respect for the average person than most of these kids today.
I just can't decide what happened in the last 10 years to give these kids the huge chips on there shoulders they seem to have.

I totally agree with bringing back a 2 year national service. I wish my generation (including me) had got it when we came out of school. A lot of my friends were so friggin useless, they couldnt iron their clothes, or cook anything more complex than toast. The biggest difference within the groups of friends I aquainted with, was what they were taught by their parents. ALthough I was brought up in a single parent home, my mother taught me manners. If I got out of line, my 'former boys club heavyweight boxing champ' of an uncle would come around and have a word with me. This was instilled in me before I became a teenager. I was told what was right, and what was wrong, and I was expected to act that way. If I didn't, then there was a punishment as a consequence. I had friends that were total louts, and always there was something lacking in the parental guidance. Usually it was telling them off, not explaining why, and not bothering to punish them. It's a simple Pavlovian equation: do something right, get rewarded. Do something wrong, get punished. But these god-awfull parents just couldn't get it together, or indeed, didn't care to take the time to disciplin their little crotch-fruit. Needless to say, as we got to the end of our teens, these were the little welfare-soaking s**ts that were punching people in pubs, robbing stuff out of cars, and selling drugs for their income. Worst of all, they're still allowed to breed, so the cycle will continue. I also had a headmaster that used to dish out the cane - that was probably the biggest preventative measure in the whole school. As soon as someone reminded you " you'll get caned for doing that!" that was it; we'd behave again. I only ever got the cane once, and I damned well made sure I never got it again. Yeah, I hated the guy, but he wasn't there to be loved. He was there to make sure we didn't cause trouble, and the thought of that swishing strip across my hands was a huge detterent. Simple and effective.

National Service.

Out in the countryside where I live, there were street fights between Emos and Chavs. In a small town! Granted there isn't a police station nearby, but when someone gets their ear sliced off with a crow bar, something should be done.

Instead, the chavs continue to walk up the hill to the train station every friday/saturday night to drink and smoke.

Stu,

I think you must of misheard Tony eleven years ago......

What he was actually saying was Immigration, Immigration, Immigration........

NOT........Education, Education, Education......

What is going on over there with immigration? That's all anyone ever talks/complains about whenever I speak to people? Is it really as bad as they claim? They've also mentioned organised crime coming in from Russia and Jamaica. What's going on?