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Does Christianity make people not believe in ET'S?

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posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 01:11 PM
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Zorgon,I am awaiting your info on this post about Islam and UFOS,in the meantime I would like some of the angelic UFO believers to tell me what they think this might be...............UFO




posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 01:51 PM
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reply to post by jkrog08


Well you will have to wait some more... research takes time you know...

As to the image you linked to...



All I see is two parachutists, one hasn't opened his chute yet... but that image is very low res... perhaps you mean something else in the photo?

I am going with hoax on this one...



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:02 PM
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I can't read all the posts in this thread, but let me point something out.

When I was roaming around different Creationist sites, whether young earth or old earth Creationists, I was shocked to find that almost every one of them tried to debunk UFOs. I tried to think why, and then several potential reasons came to me, at least as to why young earth/universe creationists wouldn't believe in UFOs or aliens. Here they are:

1) They take the biblical creation story literally. That means the entire universe, all galaxies and stars, were created based on 24 hour earth days because the whole universe is here just for earth and man. It would look pretty ridiculous to have an earth centric creation story where everything is timed by earth days, yet have lots of other planets with aliens on them.

2) They believe the universe is 6000 years old. Not enough time for beings on another planet to become so much more technologically advanced then us to be visiting us in UFOs. That threatens their 6000 year old universe theory.

3) Everything was created in 6 days, God rested on the 7. The bible doesn't list alien or animal life on other planets in its creation story, nor allocate any time when God would have created that life.

So I would say that Christian fundamentalists would be against UFO belief, which so far seems to be what I find everywhere. But Christians in general have no problems with UFOs. In fact, I sometimes watch the Jack Van Impe show, which is a religious based show that mostly talks about prophecy. They actually came out with a video about aliens and what their agenda may be, and how they're probably demonic in nature.

You can even see an ad for their ET video here:
www.youtube.com...



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:03 PM
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The Quran and Extraterrestrial Life
by Mirza Tahir Ahmad
from Al Islam
official website of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community

www.alislam.org...





Allah is He Who created seven heavens, and of the earth the like thereof...1




And among His Signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth, and of whatever living creatures (da'bbah) He has spread forth in both...2



...And He has the power to gather them together (jam-'i-him) when He will so please.3



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 02:14 PM
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EXTRA – TERRESTRIAL LIFE: RELIGIOUS & SCIENTIFIC FINDINGS
by Muhammad Naseem Khan
www.hssrd.org...


We now turn to the second part of our discussion, i.e., religious sources of knowledge. First we turn to the Holy Quran in which some verses are very clear on the subject under discussion. In Sura 42 verse 29 Allah Almighty says:


Among His signs, is the creation of heavens and earth

And living creatures

He has dispersed therein,

And He is able to gather them together

When He wills.

The commentators of the Holy Quran both in antiquity& in the modern times, while commenting on the above verse, have indicated towards the existence of intelligent beings like humans in heavens. Hazrat Ibn-i-Abbas, a disciple and companion of the Holy Prophet (peace be upon him), was reluctant to explain this verse for common people.

When someone asked him to explain this verse he said if he explained that verse he would not believe in it. However, his explanation of the verse has been narrated through different sources in the following words:

Every earth has a prophet like Muhammad, Adam like our Adam, a Noah like our Noah, and Abraham like our Abraham, and Jesus like our Jesus (peace be upon them).(11)

The author of the commentary KHAZIN (VOL: 6, p.104) says:

”it is possible that different creatures created by Allah in the heavens might be moving about like human beings.”(12)

According to commentary SADI-ALAL-JALALAIN there is nothing to stop from adopting the literal interpretation of the above verse, i.e., Allah has created living beings in the heavens which move about in the heavens as humans do on the earth( vol:4,p:34). (13)

The commentator of RUH ALMAHANI commented on the verse thus:

The authentic tradions of the prophet prove the existence of living creatures in the heavens-------------also it is not far fetched to believe that there exist living creatures and beasts in the heavens which have such shapes and conditions which are not in our knowledge(page:526). (14)

Maulana Maududi comments on the verse in the following words:

It is a clear indication that life not only exists on the earth but also on other planets. (15)

Bashiruddin Mehmood, a Pakistani scientist, explains the above verse thus:

It is obvious from the verse that living creatures, as on earth, must be widely scattered among the heavenly worlds also. It also means that cosmos has innumerous living worlds with all types of animals beasts and human beings dispersed therein.(16)


Seems there is quite a bit of material on Islamic views on ET Life... much more than I expected to find easily...



Another verse of the Holy Quran which refers to the existence of life supporting heavenly bodies is verse 15 of SURA 65.The verse is:



Allah it is, who has created seven heavens,

And of the earth like thereof----

The commandment comes down

Among them gradually,

So that you may know that

Allah is able to do all things,

He surrounds all things in knowledge (65:15)

Maulana Maududi interprets the above verse in the following words: WAMINALARDH MISLUHUN (i.e. AND OF THE EARTH LIKE THEREOF) means that as this earth is the abode of living creatures there do exist other earths like bodies which are the abode of living beings. Hazrat Ibn-i-Abbas among old commentators of Holy Quran is the only one who stated this fact in that era when no one was ready to accept the fact that there could be any other abode than the earth where intelligent beings do exist. (17)

The interpretation of the verse as given by Bashiruddin Mehmood is:

In the verse the statement COMMANDMENT COMES DOWN AMONG THEM GRADUALLY is also of great significance; this means that development of each one of these earth systems is a slow evolutionary process. Turbulence is basically a feature of the hot and active systems such as nebulae etc. But once a heavenly body is destined to become a life supporting place, the process of change is slowed down there. An example of this slow change is our own earth. According to the current scientific thought, it is about 4 to 5 billion years old and has evolved to its present state. First signs of life appeared on it after several billion years of its existence. Even after that it took hundred of millions of years to have mature life on it.-----------------The concept that other earths are like our earth, implies that their development in space may be guided by the same set of rules, and life pattern in them should be exactly ours. This must be so because, God Who is the Maker of scientific laws is the same everywhere. (18)



And then there are the Jinns (or Genies to Americans) I never new they were considered an ET race...




According to the Holy Quran jinns were created from the fire. The Holy Quran says:

And the jinn race, we had before (the creation of man) from the fire of scorching wind (15:26).

And:

And he created jinns from fire free of smoke (55:15)

Before the advent of man the earth was the abode of jinns. We know that the earth took a lot of time to become habitable for man. Before man Allah almighty created such intelligent beings on the earth which can reside in a hot environment. Therefore, jinns matter of creation was fire suited to the conditions of the then earth. Allama Shahabuddin Nadvi, an authority on science & Islam, explains the above mentioned verses thus:

It is possible that in the creation of jinns there might be an excess of combustible element or elements like Hydrogen, carbon, Phosphorus, Sulphur, etc. (19)

The above discussion leads us to the conclusion that the intelligent beings dwelling elsewhere in the universe could be created of elements different from the human beings which suit their environment. Both Science and Islamic sources of knowledge hint to the existence of extraterrestrial biological entities


This will take some time to process all the data but you have a start...

Now Go Ye forth and Study



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:15 PM
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Originally posted by Elhardt
I can't read all the posts in this thread, but let me point something out.

When I was roaming around different Creationist sites, whether young earth or old earth Creationists, I was shocked to find that almost every one of them tried to debunk UFOs. I tried to think why, and then several potential reasons came to me, at least as to why young earth/universe creationists wouldn't believe in UFOs or aliens. Here they are:

1) They take the biblical creation story literally. That means the entire universe, all galaxies and stars, were created based on 24 hour earth days because the whole universe is here just for earth and man. It would look pretty ridiculous to have an earth centric creation story where everything is timed by earth days, yet have lots of other planets with aliens on them.

2) They believe the universe is 6000 years old. Not enough time for beings on another planet to become so much more technologically advanced then us to be visiting us in UFOs. That threatens their 6000 year old universe theory.

3) Everything was created in 6 days, God rested on the 7. The bible doesn't list alien or animal life on other planets in its creation story, nor allocate any time when God would have created that life.

So I would say that Christian fundamentalists would be against UFO belief, which so far seems to be what I find everywhere. But Christians in general have no problems with UFOs. In fact, I sometimes watch the Jack Van Impe show, which is a religious based show that mostly talks about prophecy. They actually came out with a video about aliens and what their agenda may be, and how they're probably demonic in nature.

You can even see an ad for their ET video here:
www.youtube.com...
Hey that was a great rply and what Ive been looking for as far as replys go,thanks for your post!

Zorgon,wow,thanks for all that info it really helps!I didnt realize all those religions thought like that,that pretty much proves IMO that ALL the religious books talk about other creatures in the universe!


As far as that pic it is being heavly disscussed right now on another forum,I dont think its a hoax,they said the object appeared and dissapeared staying in the same spot,not making any noise,look at some of the close ups.


Heres the link to the forum about the object:www.abovetopsecret.com...'



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:19 PM
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Ironically, Christianity can make you believe in ET´s.

A woman gets pregnant by a celestial divine force in the form of a light, with no corporeal contact at all.

And then she gives birth a hiper benign human with super powers.



Sorry for my english.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 04:34 PM
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Good point Orion,but Christains will just say that "light" is God,not some Grey or Pleadian on a spaceship.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 05:02 PM
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Well when Scotty beamed you down to Earth you too arrive in a beam of 'light'

But anything that lives in the "Heaven's" and not on the Earth... no matter how you spin it... they are all true ET's

Now as to other Religions and ET's

Don't forget the Sanskrit writings of India et all...

Those read more like Star Wars Trilogy than anything else, complete with Nuclear war (and an ancient city discovered recently that is still radioactive today bears up that story) and flying ships "Vimana"

I think for thousands of years the organized religions have rewritten, altered, erased, kept hidden, mistranslated or simply lied about the truth for the single purpose to maintain control.

I doubt any one of them ever cared for the truth or the welfare of their followers... it was all about power, control and wealth back then

fortunately that has all changed for the better now..






[edit on 23-3-2008 by zorgon]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by Elhardt
3) Everything was created in 6 days, God rested on the 7.


I had a discussion once with an Italian catholic friend I brought up the 6 days and rest thingy...

But what I said was;

We all know that a 'day' in the life of God is not one of our days... and since Creation what has God really done lately? Not much that we are aware of...

So WHAT IF THIS IS STILL THE SEVENTH DAY?

God is still resting .... and when he goes back to work on Monday and sees how messed up we are, he is going to be 'annoyed'

Now my friend, being a devote Catholic had occasion when we sat in a coffee shop in Little Italy to repeat this theory to his Monsigneur...

I swear, that minister turned white as a ghost and he asked in a quiet voice.... "My son, where did you get such a notion?" All my friend could do was point at me


I would love to see that Monsigneur again and ask him his thoughts since that day





The bible doesn't list alien or animal life on other planets in its creation story, nor allocate any time when God would have created that life.


He doesn't mention Dinosaurs either... so I guess we made those up

But what about the Heavenly Hordes? Seeing as they are not from Earth, are they not ET's?




[edit on 23-3-2008 by zorgon]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 05:45 PM
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Hey interesting post Zorgon,I would however like to know more about this "radioactive" city and this "star wars " read.Are you possibly refering to the Epic of Gilgamesh?



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 05:56 PM
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Originally posted by Bigwhammy
reply to post by funky monk
 


Well I am getting this knowledge from the Book of Enoch. Demons are the spirits of the dead nephilim killed in the flood. The nephilim were genetic hybrids between Angels and humans, there bodies are not resurrectable, which is why they seek to posses people. Note that you never once see Demon with its own body in scripture. Fallen Angels are much more powerful and dangerous. The Bible describes Angels as having the ability to appear as solid bodies or spirits.

Believe it or not there are Christian UFO conventions!!!!
www.ancientofdays.net...

[edit on 3/18/2008 by Bigwhammy]


The term Fallen Angel and Demon are one in the same.

The Noahian Order of fallen angels are those who died in the flood. There are MANY orders of fallen angels who are confederates of Satan.

Some demons do seek to possess people, but not all. All try to lead people away from the truth of the Scriptures. It is the part they play in the Spiritual War that has been raging for 6,000 years. Part of the role they play is leading people to believe in alien life forms on other planets.

The Nephilim were all destroyed in the flood and are not included under the Ransom Sacrifice because they were hybrids and not part of God's plan.

Both Holy and Fallen angels have and do have the ability to materialize in the form of physical bodies.

Fallen angels (Demons) are no more powerful than Holy angels. The Spiritual War is fought on an even playing ground overseen by God.



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 06:24 PM
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ReginaAdonnaAaron-
Part of the role they play is leading people to believe in alien life forms on other planets.


I have heard that before and disagree,what proof do you have and what relavence would that have for demons?I believe demons and angels are there own seprate entities-seperate from EBEs.

[edit on 22-3-2008 by jkrog08]

[edit on 22-3-2008 by jkrog08]



posted on Mar, 22 2008 @ 08:47 PM
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Nice posts Zorgon!


Anyways, i made the same conclusion about the religious books a couple of years ago.

I think what they tried to explain, was something they could not comprehend.
And then tried anyway, and put it up like something that was more comprehensive in their minds.
Fallen angels, Nephilim, it is just not something that a non technological species would understand, vehicles flying in the sky, wars with weapons unimagined.

There are all sorts of mysteries in the 'holy' books, but probably could be explained in a more technological view if it happened today, instead of several thousands of years ago.




posted on Mar, 23 2008 @ 01:30 AM
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Originally posted by jkrog08
Hey interesting post Zorgon,I would however like to know more about this "radioactive" city and this "star wars " read.Are you possibly refering to the Epic of Gilgamesh?


No Gilgamesh is Sumerian... I was referring to the works from India

As to the city I am still working on that but you can always google



posted on Mar, 23 2008 @ 01:33 AM
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Originally posted by Balez
There are all sorts of mysteries in the 'holy' books, but probably could be explained in a more technological view if it happened today, instead of several thousands of years ago.


Yup remember the Ark? An army who carried this would be invincible? Hollywood took that wrath of god to be a beam weapon in Indian Jones



posted on Mar, 23 2008 @ 05:39 AM
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Its said diffrent things test diffrent people's faiths, we are all at diffrent depths of trust in God, and his Son.

If aliens confuse your faith, then turn away from them and keep your eyes on THE Creator! Your soul is worth more than all the world! Just because they have better technology doesn't make them superior to us. Don't let aliens turn the eyes of your heart from Him, in exchange for the promise of shiney trinkets of this material plain.

I have no conflicts between my faith and the reality of aliens, the universe is so vast and infinite in numbers of universes, it would make no sence even to our feable minds to leave it all empty.

Are we not in the middle of a battle of faith between good and evil, just as the bible states? Are its battlegrounds not at higher levels/domentions of exsistance, or in the spirit, just as the bible states? Remeber in Hebrew what has been translated as "heavens" is really just "skies", this is one of many plains on wich these battles rage.

Jesus' own words say it best for us:

"I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd. The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father."

Gentiles, aliens, angels- simantics. He is the good shepherd of them all. No matter what pen they are in. Spiritualy is where the real battle is at, if its based on technology or brute strength we are lost already, but the most repeated commandment is "FEAR NOT". Fear is the strongest tool of the enemy, steal your heart against it, counter it with your faith that God, and his Son love you, how could he forsake that wich he made in His OWN image, unless you reject him?

Improve your spirit, and don't lean on your Earthly knowledge, it will fail you. Your physical body is going to die one day, it belongs to time, and to this universe, and we must "give unto ceaser" one day, you might want an escape plan for that day, and no matter how shiney or fast they are, UFOs can't carry away your soul to heaven for you. Too bad the "kings" of earth didn't think of this when they sold thier souls, and even tried to sell ours.

I have read/heard twice now that calling for Jesus' help during an abduction by the greys will stop it cold, what does that tell you? Abuctors come into the sheep pen over the side, the owner comes in threw the front door.

There are also accounts of freindly volintary encounters who's presence fills them with peace and love, the sheep know the voice of thier shepherd (and his servents I should imagine) and it comforts them. Let the eyes of your heart guide you always.

All I can say is, you'll know when the time comes, if you keep your eyes wide open, and ask your self "Does this being fill me with love or fright?". Now that doesn't mean they'll be happy and smileing either, a good Drill Sgt. might make you sweat and might get angry with you, or even make you tremble, but if you look deeper you see they do it out of love.


"Think you this crude matter you are? NO! Luminus beings of light are we!" Yoda.



posted on Mar, 23 2008 @ 07:33 AM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


Yeah, they did!

Perhaps George Lucas knows more than what we know


But anyways it is very interesting what we could put together if we used todays terms to explain events like this instead.

Star for your posts



posted on Mar, 23 2008 @ 01:36 PM
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Originally posted by ReginaAdonnaAaron
Some demons do seek to possess people, but not all. All try to lead people away from the truth of the Scriptures. It is the part they play in the Spiritual War that has been raging for 6,000 years. Part of the role they play is leading people to believe in alien life forms on other planets.


I should also probably add the PURPOSE of this deception - which is to make people believe that if aliens exist and visit this planet, then the Word (Scriptures) must be invalid and Science must be the answer to Mankind's continued existence.



posted on Mar, 23 2008 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by ReginaAdonnaAaron

The term Fallen Angel and Demon are one in the same.


I disagree. Demons never have bodies. Angels do.



The Noahian Order of fallen angels are those who died in the flood. There are MANY orders of fallen angels who are confederates of Satan.


Angels do not die. They are immortal beings. They are flesh and bone. Not flesh and blood like us. Check the Bible.

They watchers before the flood were imprisoned

Jude 1:
6And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.



Some demons do seek to possess people, but not all. All try to lead people away from the truth of the Scriptures. It is the part they play in the Spiritual War that has been raging for 6,000 years. Part of the role they play is leading people to believe in alien life forms on other planets.




Absolutely true. I agree ...



The Nephilim were all destroyed in the flood and are not included under the Ransom Sacrifice because they were hybrids and not part of God's plan.



You are clearly mistaken. Check the scriptures...

Part of Genesis 6:4 note "and also afterward"
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—

Then way way after the flood when the Jews sent spies into the promised land for the very first time.

Numbers 13:33
We saw the Nephilim there (the descendants of Anak come from the Nephilim). We seemed like grasshoppers in our own eyes, and we looked the same to them."



Both Holy and Fallen angels have and do have the ability to materialize in the form of physical bodies.

Fallen angels (Demons) are no more powerful than Holy angels. The Spiritual War is fought on an even playing ground overseen by God.


I agree except Fallen Angels are not demons. Demons are basically nephilim ghosts.

I am afraid a lot of you opinion does not match with scripture. It doesn't tell us a lot about these things but I try to use scripture.

[edit on 3/23/2008 by Bigwhammy]



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