What would you sacrifice for disclosure?

Hypothetically assuming that you wanted the truth to come out, what would you give up or sacrifice if you knew in doing so, the world could have disclosure?

Is it really up to the government to disclose the facts? Do they speak for us as citizens or do we?

I think in a way it's kind of despicable that people are just so eager for disclosure. Sitting around waiting on the government to spoon-feed them the truth, especially when all the evidence that we've been visited is right there in front of us. Enough focus on disclosure. Let's find the truth ourselves.

reply to post by chromatico


Thats a very profound statement, chromatico. I happen to share that sentiment. Perhaps the endless cries for "govt. disclosure" are merely a reflection of how dependent many of us are on our govt.'s to "take care" of us. If more of us empowered ourselves, we may have more freedoms than currently realized.

Isn't this, in a roundabout way, asking what I would pay in order to be told the truth?

There should not be a cost for it, we already pay for the government.

I suppose you could also be implying that it could cause problems in the world that would have a negative effect on our lives. Unless it caused a take over of Earth by Ets, seems like we could all work it out. There should be some very positive benefits via technology.

Enact a law the punishes all who do not give full disclosure with death.

Mode Note: One line posts are discouraged.

Read here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 17-3-2008 by NGC2736]

Originally posted by VisionQuest
reply to post by chromatico

 

Thats a very profound statement, chromatico. I happen to share that sentiment. Perhaps the endless cries for "govt. disclosure" are merely a reflection of how dependent many of us are on our govt.'s to "take care" of us. If more of us empowered ourselves, we may have more freedoms than currently realized.

The issue is, though there are many individuals who have "done their own research," or had close encounters, their stories are treated as what they are: anecdotal. With an official disclosure, no one can say, "Who are you and why should we believe you?"

So it IS important to have the official word.

reply to post by Amaterasu


We still have the scientific method. We still have Occam's Razor. And both of these are more reliable than any government official I've ever known.

What I find myself wondering is, if the government came on TV and spilled everything they know about ET,
maybe even backed it up with video and whatnot......

Would you believe them?

It's pretty common knowledge that they lie all the time about everything.
What would make this subject any different?

I would have a problem believing them, personally.

So basically, I guess, I wouldn't give 2 cents for any kind of governmental disclosure..

People often paint a rosy picture of Disclosure as though it would solve all of our problems over night. Lets set up a list of what people think disclosure will bring:

1 Free Energy

2 Economic equality

3 Staving off Global Warming

4 Humans will become Star Trek like explorers

5 Mass hysteria

Let's go backward on the list. Mas hysteria is certainly a possibility. But how many people would choose to go completely nuts when they have a job to go to and a family to feed with said job? Life can't just come to a halt due to some new tid bit of knowledge that would certainly change the world, but it won't change human hardships over night.

Humans will not be, even after disclosure, a Star Trek like race of beings. At least not within the decade of disclosure. These things take generations of new physics and systems training and education. This is not going to be a one day affair, the infrastructure is not already there. It's preliminary at best..So get your head out of the clouds.

We have a massive oil industry, and it isn't just for gas and heating. We use it for pharmaceuticals, plastics, insulators, and a host of other things our society today cannot do without. Any alien technology we do get a hold of to promote free energy won't just kill greenhouse gases permanently, and certainly not over night. Free energy doesn't translate into "No pollution". Right now there is an ocean of plastic debris in the Pacific that is larger than the USA. Free energy won't cure that ill...Oops back to the drawing board.

Economic equality won't exist so long as there are greedy people. Even if all the changes took place over night the fact remains that we are still human..Sorry to break it to you Disclosure Romantics out there, but the face of disclosure isn't as pretty as you'd like it to be. And it won't be.

Enough with the rosy view already! What is the face of Disclosure anyway? Is it just another form of control, it can be, very easily, especially when you have a small group of people controlling the flow of information about it. Do you even know what disclosure would look like? Do you think it is even up to the government? If it is you have to wonder about the agenda, and the reasoning behind disclosure. Why would the government suddenly disclose the existence of alien life forms visiting us? Unless it isn't their choice, what if they are going to show up with an armada of warships?

We can't assume every space fairing race is going to be benevolent. We can't assume the government has our best interests in mind when it come to disclosure. Just keep in mind that the same people who let 9/11 happen will be the same people who disclose this stuff...So don't count on getting the full story, and don't count on it being rosy.

Originally posted by projectvxn
Just keep in mind that the same people who let 9/11 happen will be the same people who disclose this stuff.

Are you sure of this? What leads you to believe that? Is it not possible that disclosure could happen on an individual basis? Where is the evidence that the ET's are conspiring with the 9/11 evildoers?

I think you make a good point about the world continuing on despite disclosure. Hysteria is possible, but its hard for me to imagine as well.

Originally posted by VisionQuest

Originally posted by projectvxn
Just keep in mind that the same people who let 9/11 happen will be the same people who disclose this stuff.

Are you sure of this? What leads you to believe that? Is it not possible that disclosure could happen on an individual basis? Where is the evidence that the ET's are conspiring with the 9/11 evildoers?

I think you make a good point about the world continuing on despite disclosure. Hysteria is possible, but its hard for me to imagine as well.

Obviously I'm speaking in context to government disclosure. As in Government Initiated. I have nothing against individual revelation...Actually that would probably be the best way.

But if it is up to the government, then we must examine their motives closely because, as I said, the same people who are lying to us about what really happened on that day, will probably be controlling the flow of information in regards to disclosure at a government level.

What would you sacrifice for disclosure?

Definitely the government.

Because nobody needs a government which lies and keeps information the people want to know.



Peace

Originally posted by chromatico
reply to post by Amaterasu

 

We still have the scientific method. We still have Occam's Razor. And both of these are more reliable than any government official I've ever known.

Well, Occam's Razor says that 9/11 was an inside job, but try using that point with a rabid Denyalist. So even if we have it, it's too easy to brush off.

The scientific method is great when you have stuff to work with, both in terms of evidence and in terms of equipment. And a great number of things out there are hoaxed, either as a prank, or, quite likely as disinfo, so your evidence has to withstand a purity test. If you're looking at an alien body, your purity test will come back pretty high. If you're looking at a video, it may come back high or it may come back low or... You may not know which it is.

And very often, you might not have the needed equipment (Hey, Joe. What's this gooey stuff? I dunno, Greg, let's run it through our pocket spectrometer...). So this choice, though it might happen that it is useful, most often it is not.

Thing is, with Occam's Razor, we can conclude that there's something going on we are not told about. And if this is a country that is run by the people and not an Elite, we have the right to that knowledge. (I'm a proponent of 100% transparency in government. The heart of the country would rule, and not the greed of hidden individuals.)

So we know it's there, we know we are being had by an Elite, and it is our right to have that information, and we are to console ourselves with lesser placations.

Well, it's not me. I for one stand and call for disclosure.

Originally posted by subject x
What I find myself wondering is, if the government came on TV and spilled everything they know about ET,
maybe even backed it up with video and whatnot......

Would you believe them?

It's pretty common knowledge that they lie all the time about everything.
What would make this subject any different?

I would have a problem believing them, personally.

So basically, I guess, I wouldn't give 2 cents for any kind of governmental disclosure..

Well, if all they did was throw a few tidbits out, no. If they walked out with their arm around an alien, and let the alien have the mic awhile, yeah, I'd be better inclined.

But you're right. It would be difficult to believe unless the press was flooded with people, now free to talk, talking. I guess that would be what I would be looking for.

Disclosure is a balloon that you will always chase. If some information is released, you'll always want more. If it doesn't say what you want to hear, you'll want The Truth. Even if they tell you The Truth about one thing, you'll never believe they're telling you The Truth about everything.

[edit on 17-3-2008 by Nohup]

My left testicle.

Ha. No. Seriously people, there are not any aliens here. It is all government propaganda. You need to get a hold of yourselves. These people are prepared to begin wiping us out.

Originally posted by projectvxn
Free energy doesn't translate into "No pollution". Right now there is an ocean of plastic debris in the Pacific that is larger than the USA. Free energy won't cure that ill...Oops back to the drawing board.

Ok. Drawing board: We transmuted lead into gold in the 1970's (and there's likely been some modicume of progress in that effort since then) and itwasn't all THAT hard to do, but we only made a very little bit of gold because, when the energy it took to create that gold, it worked out to be millions an ounce. If we can do that, and have free energy, what's to stop us from transmuting any atom to any other? Any molecule to any other?

Meanwhile, we can retrofit our cars with Joe Cells, or whatever, and not pollute with our cars... And believe me, MANY businesses would remove energy from their bottom line,. The transition would be much swifter than you're suggesting, I suggest.

Economic equality won't exist so long as there are greedy people.

Ok. Here is where I post a letter I wrote to a friend. It involves the video seen here 9 www.youtube.com... )and is in response to his hedging:

Oh, now Harv,

Why did they do this vid, do you suppose, in Britan, about American stuff? To pull one over on the Brits? To send it over here and have a belly laugh? To spread disinfo, and if so, why?

I'm just sayin'. It is pretty slick, if extremely dull production-wise (how very British), and the guy seemed righteously indignant over the issue of free energy.

Why do you suppose he was so passionate about that?

He brushed off the UFO and anti-grav stuff, really, but I got the impression that a lot of his passion over the free energy thing was edited out.

The reason he was so passionate about free energy is because IF it is there, everyone's standard of living would be elevated to that of The Elite. With the current state of tech where it is, on the verge of supplying our every whim (game AI just took another large step forward, BTW), free energy would be all it would take to create heaven on earth in the form of having everything we want in a material sense.

Money will lose its purpose, being, in the final analysis, a representation of an exchange of energy. As it stands now, energy is a finite commodity because there is only so much energy we can economically draw forth. Since none of us would be dependent on the energy of others, we would not need money. And with the removal of money is the removal of the false god, for if it is not there to worship, Evil has no root.

We turned lead to gold in the 1970's. Just a very small amount. And the reason it was so small an amount was that, though it wasn't THAT hard to do, the cost of the energy to do it made an ounce of it cost a million or more per ounce. If we have the tech to do this, and all the energy we wanted, I would think we could transmute anything we wanted from anything we didn't...say, waste materials. Or any other surplus.

Anyway, the point is, that I knew the reason he did what he did was because he saw what I saw. That IF free energy exists, it does not belong to an Elite. It belongs to all of us.

What I don't understand is why, if free energy would mean THIS much to every bleeding one of us, so few of us are willing to give it the benefit of the doubt.

At least do some experiments. I have done some with Mathew, based on stuff out on the web that Wilhelm Reich did. I tell you what, I could very easily distinguish the "cold" sensation of the flow of the energy it was moving. It was detectable. So I'm willing to open my mind to the possibility that there is something being hidden from us.

I am lead to believe that there are portions of the equations used in thermodynamics which are not taught - they were thrown out early on. Is this so? I am also lead to believe there are things which, by rote, we dampen to get a specific result, that might be of interest in themselves undampened.

I'm no engineer. I'm no scientist. But I have felt the Energy (free energy) all my life and could feel that flare of Energy flowing out of the contraption Mathew and I built.

So if there's a way to tap it and I can build it myself, I'm gonna at least try. Give it the benefit of the doubt. Because if I DO succeed, I don't care if others are forced to live in luxury (and of course, no one would be forced to do anything but not harm others - if they wanted to go rustic on the planet's surface somewhere, more power to 'em)... I don't care that I would be supporting the freeing of humanity. I do it because *I* want to live in whatever way I want.

I want to go camping now and again, and how nice that I will always have an energy source - if I find I need one. I can go dancing. I can go to amusement parks, kept up to snuff by people who love to look after amusement parks...

I want to entertain my friends. I want to go see the world. I want to share it all with my daughter as she grows up.

And I figure the rest of the world could adjust. People of similar views would aggregate, awesome things would be built, and on it would go.

Thing is. If I'm the only one trying, if I were to succeed, like Wilhelm Reich, like Nikola Tesla, like Royal Rife, I would likely have my work destroyed, and the whole mess would end unprettily. But if we all gave it a shot, and many get it right... Well, I would think that it wouldn't matter whether there is or there isn't someone out there withholding the evidence.

That's my view. Input will gladly taken into consideration.

[end letter]

So. Rosy. Let's talk rosy.

[EDITED because I messed up the quotes and forgot the link...

[edit on 3/17/2008 by Amaterasu]

Originally posted by chromatico
I think in a way it's kind of despicable that people are just so eager for disclosure. Sitting around waiting on the government to spoon-feed them the truth, especially when all the evidence that we've been visited is right there in front of us. Enough focus on disclosure. Let's find the truth ourselves.

This can be true, but what about the people who do not have the capability to go searching for hours on the internet debunking hoaxes, or having information enough to make their own determination of what the truth actually is?

It just seems like the "disclosure" idea is one that has been around for years on the internet, but for those who never even darken the doors of the internet scape, its the new hype.

And like user Nohup said, even if they do come forth with some information they were withholding for whatever reasons, since there is the concept of disinformation out there at all, no CT's are going to ever believe the full truth is being disclosed.
Unless the disclosure is so dramatic that it makes everyone sit back in awe. But even then still there will be those that think that "awe" was a disinformation tactic.

Why would I want to sacrifice something? It doesn't matter either way. The government is in it for itself and will be in it for themselves if there was a disclosure or not. The government is going to show us what they want to show us so they can benefit from it. If ever free energy comes along there will be something else to replace that money lose. Or there will be something in it for our government and will be the ponds on the chess board while they figure out checkmate. I wouldn't sacrifice anything. I would be figuring out how to live my life the best way I could with that circumstance. I'm afraid people are to caught up in entertainment, sports, movie stars, work & high gas prices to worry about what to do to stop it.

Originally posted by Wilsonfrisk
My left testicle.

Ha. No. Seriously people, there are not any aliens here. It is all government propaganda. You need to get a hold of yourselves. These people are prepared to begin wiping us out.

I surely agree with you that they're preparing to wipe us out. I do not, however, believe there are no aliens and it's all hype. There is enough credible evidence in my book to conclude that aliens are there. At least, I give it a 95% chance.

And I think it is tied in with the fact that they're preparing to wipe us out.

But I respect that you have your own view and would consider any argument you put forth towards support of your statements.