Chinese Security Forces Swarm Tibet

reply to post by WraothAscendant


I think with the right leadership in this country much of what has been lost to cheap foriegn labor will come back to us. We are still the largest economy on earth. I am a candle maker and sell direct online. You would be surprised at the sales we have because of quality and the fact they are made right here at home. I think consumers grow weary of the cheap crap and are coming home on their own. Now throw Tibet in the mix.

Originally posted by northwolf
Geocraphy doesn't seem to be a big subject in Chinese education system...

Please dont group people into groups. You wouldn't want to be accused of crimes someone else did

I'm going to ask you people a question.

If they were Muslims in Iraq, how would you people react.

As i've said before:

If one feels opressed and feels that his country is illegally invaded and attacks the invaders (military and security forces) they are freedom fighters. If one attacks civilians, he is a terrorist. Very simple.

Who are the Tibetians attacking?
Some unofficial sources claim that majority of deaths in Lhasa have been ethnic chinese caught in the middle of these riots and beaten/burnt to death. If so those responsible should be tried and punished.

If the dead are from Red Army, then i tip my hats to tibetians and wish them happy hunting.


Ps. I try to apply same rules for everyone. For example I liked Chezens until they started targetting hospitals.

PPs. Chinawhite, i base that geography comment on discussions with about 20 chinese exchange students living in the building next to my home. Small sample, i know.


[edit on 17-3-2008 by northwolf]

These threads are turning downwards and is becoming plainly sad.

You really have no clue what is going on in this world. Even at the footsteps of becoming the manufacturing juggernaut of the 21st century, more than 90% of the Chinese population is still living poorly with a national income per capita sometimes the poorest guy in a developed country earning more thajn 20 times their income.

This is still the legacies of an extremely weak and sad end of the Qing Dynasty fueling and allowing the European colonists to profit off the once proud nation, and being invaded by Japan, civil unrest all over the country and breaking of different regions into "feudal kingdoms of its own" with a civil war as a result.

A civil war between two parties who everyone can have their own judgement on it, nonetheless, most important is that after this civil war between these two major fractions it was nothing more than inevitable to UNITE the rest of China again, even if this has to be done with force.

Throughout the Chinese history the Chinese people could only prosper when there is stability in the country. Instability only meant MILLIONS of deaths, so whatever the costs, the stability need to be maintained. After all China is still only a developing country, which the over majorly of our Chinese population still need to get developed, need to live well, and at least can count on that the basics can be provided to them at an affordable price. No kidding, I had been in the pheriperals, had been in small towns and villages, you can not imagine what is basic to the Western world is actually a luxurious good. As simple as getting water from the pipe! Some cities and regions in the coast provinces are well developed by now, that's why it is the turn to move north and inwards.

To keep the pace of development and allowing the Chinese people to live at least normally like what the Western developed world count as poor if you were in the States or you were an Aussie, the last our country need is instability. We don't believe in a big-bang change of the economy, the gradual economic opening and gradual reforming policy started off by Deng Xiaoping proofed to be working for the past 30 years. But China still need another 30 to even 50 years to have the whole of China fully developed. Therefore no instability is allowed, and riots need to be taken down swiftly and decisevly.

A one China policy need to be enforced, and the unity should be maintained, certain provinces with a major non-Han Chinese people can be allowed to have a high degree of autonomy, other former European colonies can live under One country two systems administration, which both are proven succesfull, but don't ask for mercy if you try to break this unity and stability, because this is against the grand benefits for the total Chinese population of over 1.3 billion humans! Can you imagine that? That is like 260 times of the population of Finland!

China is definitely not perfect right now, we have our own problems, and even in China we face the threats of terrorists who tries to destabilize the peaceful society and to worsen the problems we already face. But these are all our INTERNAL problems which we will tackle with our own chosen ways. If you do wanna help in a CONSTRUCTIVE and MEANINGFUL way with your resources (time/ideas/money whatever), be my guest, but at least you should have come to the place where the problems are supposed to be and be CONSTRUCTIVE with the grand benefits of the whole of Chinese population in mind. If not, go back to your own country and FACE your own problems first, which you already have wasted time on Facing by merely thinking about Tibet!

One last point: To anyone claiming that Tibet is NOT a part of China is plain out claiming something that even the Dalai Lama is not claiming. So EVEN to the Dalai Lama this is a CHINESE INTERNAL problem, either you like it or not.

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by WraothAscendant

 

I think with the right leadership in this country much of what has been lost to cheap foriegn labor will come back to us. We are still the largest economy on earth. I am a candle maker and sell direct online. You would be surprised at the sales we have because of quality and the fact they are made right here at home. I think consumers grow weary of the cheap crap and are coming home on their own. Now throw Tibet in the mix.

So you do have a motives to hate China and would benefit in a boycot of Chinese products Now it makes more sense to me why someone in USA would care so much about China instead of caring what is happening at home, or what his country is causing to other nations

Originally posted by northwolf
As i've said before:

If one feels opressed and feels that his country is illegally invaded and attacks the invaders (military and security forces) they are freedom fighters. If one attacks civilians, he is a terrorist. Very simple.

Totally AGREE!!!
I just want to get something clarified, when is he a Rioter?

Who are the Tibetians attacking?
Some unofficial sources claim that majority of deaths in Lhasa have been ethnic chinese caught in the middle of these riots and beaten/burnt to death. If so those responsible should be tried and punished.

If the dead are from Red Army, then i tip my hats to tibetians and wish them happy hunting.

Ps. I try to apply same rules for everyone. For example I liked Chezens until they started targetting hospitals.

These are riots caused and organized by Terrorists who even burned innocent civilians to death, or conducted violence and vandalism against civilian's properties.
But I highly doubt that closed-minded people will look at these facts. Even if these facts are confirmed by eye-witnesses than these people will still say otherwise *sigh*

PPs. Chinawhite, i base that geography comment on discussions with about 20 chinese exchange students living in the building next to my home. Small sample, i know.


[edit on 17-3-2008 by northwolf]

funny, I noticed the same among the mainland Chinese here, but unfortunately I also observed this lack of geography knowledge among my travels in Europe, Russia, Middle East, Africa and America. Hmmm, I remember there was a video link to a TV show, wherein a worldmap without or wrong names was taken out to ask Texans where certain countries are located, it was hilarious.

Rioters are those without balls to actually pick up arms to fight for what they feel right.

Final note on the geography issue, all americans i've met outside of big tourists places have been very knowledgeable. But some of those in big european cities have been sad

well, I would also add some rioters are mingling in trying to monetary profit from the riots

[edit on 17/3/08 by IchiNiSan]

reply to post by IchiNiSan


That is true and there are allways people who like to riot and cause mayhem. It is very visible in the anti globalisation riots. "Anarchist" rich kids bashing cops to get some meaning to their lives...

reply to post by northwolf


sadly true

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by IchiNiSan

 

Can you access the link I posted just above this and give me your opinion?

Yes, and I will even copy/paste for example CNN's headline article about Tibet to proof I can.

edition.cnn.com...

I will only quote the last four paragraphs so you know I read the whole article, you can ask a Mod to check if I am really accesing ATS from China or not. (After all, it seems like somebody likes to send out warnings to Chinese posters in this forum anyhow, so why not also for my part check out where I live

Police used tear gas against demonstrators who took to the streets of Kama Kusang, east of Lhasa, on Sunday, they said.

The exile spokesman also said there were major protests at the Labrang Tashikyil Monastery and at least four people were taken into custody by Chinese soldiers.

Xinhua, China's official news agency, quoted police in Tibet giving protesters a deadline of midnight Monday "to stop their criminal activities and offering leniency to those who surrender themselves."
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"Those who surrender and provide information on other lawbreakers will be exempt from punishment," Xinhua reported the police notice said.

Tibet is one of two provinces in China, along with Xinjiang, where the Chinese government places restrictions on reporters' access. Government permission is required for foreign media to enter Tibet and Xinjiang, and CNN has not received permission to go in. E-mail to a friend E-mail to a friend

Originally posted by wwssii
reply to post by Witness2008

 

my last reply would be that Tibet is China's internal issues and have nothing to do with you guys. you'd better shut up. otherwise it would be only in totally vain even if you shout to the extent of hurting your throat.

When you kill my brothers and sisters, force them into exile and force them to give up there traditions it becomes my issue, so don't tell me or anyone else to 'shut up'.

Man, calling for China to free Tibet is like calling for the US to free Hawaii.

Yeah! Hawaiian independence! Free my Polynesian brethren!

Hawaiian sovereignty movement
Hawaiian Independence Blog


/unrealistic

An update on Tibet:

Chinese troops parade handcuffed Tibetan prisoners in trucks

That sure sounds like a loving Chinese government, eh?

The Chinese Army drove through the streets of Lhasa today parading dozens of Tibetan prisoners in handcuffs, their heads bowed, as troops stepped up their hunt for the rioters in house-to-house searches.

As the midnight deadline approached for rioters to surrender, four trucks in convoy made a slow progress along main roads, with about 40 people, mostly young Tibetan men and women, standing with their wrists handcuffed behind their backs, witnesses said.

A soldier stood behind each prisoner, hands on the back of their necks to ensure their heads were bowed.

For each prisoner, one soldier made sure they were submissive. Sounds like the Communist Police State to me.









Beijing students in silent protest for Tibet

Even some Chinese think the Tibetans should be free!

US urges China dialogue with Dalai Lama

Video of protets

Originally posted by chinawhite
If they were Muslims in Iraq, how would you people react.

What is your point? The majority of residents in Iraq are Muslims.

I personally believe the Iraq war to be bull#, along with a large majority of US citizens. However, our government, like the Chinese Communist Party, does not listen to its citizens.

We both live in quasi-dictatorships.

After all, it seems like somebody likes to send out warnings to Chinese posters in this forum anyhow,

I will take this back,

if anyone felt I implied this board was discriminating Chinese posters, yes I did, and I'm sorry I did, my apologies to ATS, because obviously the Mods will admit their own mistakes for giving out wrong/incorrect warnings and apologize & correct it (it only seems they can not remove the red warning signs).

[edit on 17/3/08 by IchiNiSan]

reply to post by Beachcoma


If Hawaii and her native people were being subjected to the horrors that Tibetans are I would support independance, and I am sure most of the world would. We Americans have our dark past, I just hope we learned enough lessons from those mistakes to make a differnce for Tibet.

reply to post by biggie smalls


I have been online all morning reading of the various world reports on human rights violation committed by China and I fear greatly for those Tibetans that are rounded up. I find it maddening that the world lets these things happen, and I am even speaking to the invasion this country us undertaken in the middle east. It is time for us all to become world citizens looking out for one another. God knows and so do I that all of the worlds corrupt leaders won't bother.

www.bloomberg.com...

reply to post by biggie smalls

Loudspeakers on the trucks broadcast calls to anyone who had taken part in the violent riots on Friday — in which Han Chinese and Hui Muslims were stabbed and beaten and shops and business set on fire — to turn themselves in. Those who gave themselves up might be treated with leniency, the rest would face severe punishment, the broadcasts said.

I don't see you quoting the part of

"violent riots"
or the part in which (a fact) that Han Chinese and Hui Muslims were STABBED and BEATEN

I don't see why the law-breakers and murderers should not be brought to justice?

The governor said: “No country would allow those offenders or criminals to escape the arm of justice and China is no exception.”

This quote of the governor (a puppet or not) summarizes most of the feelings most of the other 99.99+++ % of the Chinese population.

Even some Chinese think the Tibetans should be free!

Maybe you should read more carefully what your article says, they only demanded more religious freedom and the return of the Dalai Lama and not that Tibet should be set free. In each country there will be always to some extend some who supports certain ideas, that is no difference in China. You don't see that these 100 students are being "killed" or "imprisoned" like what you will think by protesting. haha, of course you won't see them start a career in the Chinese government

[edit on 17/3/08 by IchiNiSan]

[edit on 17/3/08 by IchiNiSan]