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Could we really run out of Food?

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posted on Mar, 13 2008 @ 11:59 PM
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Originally posted by MBF
This is what was done at one time, but not now. Not for maybe the last 10 years.

Now we get what is called a deficiency payment. The government basically says we know you are going to lose money planting this crop so here is some money to help you make it through the year. There is a limit on the amount of money that a farmer gets. Just ask any farmer if he could survive without these payments.


what in particular was done and what has changed? the first half is simple economics, and the last part was just my understanding of how it came into being.

if the farmer could not survive without the deficiency payments, then he certainly could not survive by overproducing. all that would happen would be prices plummeting and then all of a sudden farmers are making less money than before. but of course this is just my opinion and I'm no expert.

but any way you slice it, it's not a conspiracy as NewWorldOver was suggesting.




posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 12:50 AM
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WE in first world countries will never run out of food. But third world countries may suffer when our need to sustain our current lifestyle increases.


MBF

posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 01:15 AM
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Originally posted by FinalSonicX



what in particular was done and what has changed? the first half is simple economics, and the last part was just my understanding of how it came into being.


At one time we were paid so much to not plant a certain percentage of our land. The govt decided to stop doing this and let the markets work themselves out. NAFTA and GATT was going to help this country have stable prices. OK............(if they say so). It didn't nowhere near work and prices fell to rock bottom. Remember, we are the ONLY industry that takes what we are given for our products. The big corporations were just taking what we were growing for almost nothing. Way below production costs.




if the farmer could not survive without the deficiency payments, then he certainly could not survive by overproducing. all that would happen would be prices plummeting and then all of a sudden farmers are making less money than before. but of course this is just my opinion and I'm no expert.

but any way you slice it, it's not a conspiracy as NewWorldOver was suggesting.


Now, farmers around where I live farm by the deficiency payments. Cotton pays the most. Now these numbers I am going to give you are off the top of my head. Maybe 10 years ago this country produced about 20 million bales of cotton per year and used about 15 million bales per year for the textile industry. Today we produce about 25 million bales per year and use only about 5 million bales per year. The rest has to be exported. You pretty much have a grasp of what's going on.

[edit on 14-3-2008 by MBF]

[edit on 14-3-2008 by MBF]



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 01:22 AM
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Seems like we are headed for problems with our food supplies, I have read about the bee disappearing, corn is being used for fuel, wheat supplies are down due to drought and flood, storms demolishing what crops we do have, I definately see a shortage coming, to what extent I don't know, but expense of food is already being affected. Scary. We tilled up our spot today for our anual garden, making it larger this year, but we are in an area that is still in an extreme drought, we may not even be able to water it when we need to.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 01:38 AM
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Grain prices have been very good lately... but its about time. I am actually get tired of saying this, but I will say it again.

Food prices need to rise. Food has been cheap for far too long. It is time that people see the value in food.

The cost of production has always been going up, but what do people want? Cheap food. You can only push the farmer so much.

The margins are made after the grain leaves the farm. A box of cereal really only has a few cents worth of grain in it. This is where the money is really made.

Farmers are making decent money this year, but its about time. Will it last? I don't know. I made record money this year. Very, very good. I would like to pick up another 100 acres of land.

I would not put so much emphasis on biofuels being the reason behind the commodity run up. If you look at gold or oil lately, you will see that investors flock to what is making them money.

If the market sucks elsewhere, they will make money where there is money to be made. That is commodities, hard and soft.

They will correct, and when they correct it will be fast.

There are things like limit prices, most people do not know this. The amount that say, wheat can go up or down in one day is limited in some instances.

This article talks about them a little at the end.

So will we have a shortage one day? Oh yeah. I am 100 percent sure we will have a terrible shortage one day. Growing populations, shrinking farm land, changing weather....

I will give ATS members a good deal of raw product when the apocalypse comes.




posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 01:50 AM
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think about this....

On an average, how many eggs do you think you eat at a restaurant during breakfast? How many eggs would you say 1 restaurant uses in 1 day? How many eggs will that single restaurant use in 1 week, 1 month? Now, use that and then add all the restaurants in just 1 town for 1 day, 1 week, 1 month. Now, use that for all the restaurants in a large metro area....you get the picture.

What about flour, meat..etc.

Way back in 1984(?) my friend came out of a World Eco class in college one day and looked like he saw a ghost of sorts..I said..

ME: "Whoa! what's up?! you looked you just had a bad discussion or saw a ghost.. "

Friend: *looks at me very solomely and says, " kinda, we just did a simple formula which took the population % of growth as it is today and applied that to the land mass and how much grain, beef, is current being grown......the class came up with..........we begin to run out of food in 20 years...."

the only alternatives would be, mass death, or gentically modified foods or both........................

I'd suggest researching Planned Population control on youTube or Google it..besides China's 1 child per family method.....



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 01:56 AM
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It would be much easier to just do genetically modified crops then mass genocide. Genocides not as profitable.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 02:00 AM
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unless you sell the body parts to the hospitals.. kinda like China is doing.. I think.. but.. as always .. no proof...





Originally posted by Holygamer
It would be much easier to just do genetically modified crops then mass genocide. Genocides not as profitable.




posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 02:03 AM
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reply to post by Komodo
 


we talked about this alot in a few of my world issue classes. First world countries will never starve. US exports more crops and foodstuff a day then most countries do a year. That surplus, if we ever needed, could just be used to feed us.

Once again, like all of history, the only people that will suffer is the poor brown men and women of this earth.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 02:27 AM
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The average piece of produce travels 1500 miles before it hits your table. The rising cost of fuel alone will make food more expensive to procure. Most Americans haven't the foggiest idea what goes into keeping half the population obese. But they know Jessica Simpson's little sister's name, which is eluding me now.

It is possible to keep your food costs down and even to provide yourself with more nutritious food. But it isn't going to happen easily, there's hard work and planning involved. I've become addicted to the way really good food makes my body feel....healthy!

I've prioritized accordingly.

It's hard to imagine a lack of food when a majority of children are obese and the number of morbidly obese (> 30 BMI) is growing everyday. I'm aware that malnutrition applies to overweight as well, and some of these people are simply stuck in a never ending cycle of bad nutrition, as evidenced by people buying loads of chips and soda with their food stamp card. I've witnessed it myself standing in line at the grocer's.

And nutrition is directly linked to cognitive ability. So if one feeds their children crap, one shouldn't expect them to be able to do any better in the smarts department. The sad fact is, in 15 years, the same kids will probably be in the same line with their own food stamp card while THEIR toddler guzzles a Coke.

Edit to add: I sound like a Republican

My point about the food stamp card is that without education (specific nutritional education) AND proper nutrition, the poor are not only poorer, they're dumber.

[edit on 3/14/08 by themillersdaughter]



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 02:47 AM
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reply to post by DimensionalDetective
 


Well done, DimensionalDetective! Star!

Food running out is a frightening subject. During the L.A. riots, the
food stores were looted first, i believe...

I have a little experience with my own food-depravation study. First, as
a wrestler in high school, cutting weight. For a week, only, with water,
and "dexies"...(terrible, i know)!

Then, through the eighties, well, i won't go there; (title to one of Eric
Clapton's songs applies here)...(even worse)!

Then, in the early 90's, after a series of friends dying, decided to see how
long i could go- once for two weeks, and again for almost three! (with
plenty of water, though) At about 10 days, there's a little dizziness, and
lots of stomach growling. Close to three weeks, there's weakness and
some dazy hallucinating, and over-tiredness!

One MUST eat; just not as much as we think!



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 03:21 AM
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reply to post by NewWorldOver
 


It’s done to keep the “independent” farmer in the market. The family farm is a long gone item and the sooner these people understand that the better.

Now if you want a family farm to feed yourself and your family, go for it. But if you want to make a living from it you better learn to coop or some other form of mass production. The issue is that you have to keep food prices high OR produce large amounts in order to make a profit.

As long as we keep this “family farm” idea alive the issue will not go away.

Family farms and Factory workers are a hold over from the past.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 03:36 AM
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Take a look at this website.

dieoff.com...

dieoff.com...



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 03:44 AM
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And thanks to the GMOs contaminating everyone plantations, it won't be long before we see super plagues hitting humans, animals and plants. They didn't do the apocalypse seed vault for nothing.

Thanks to Monsanto... serioulsly we should be thousands marching on Monsanto burning it down to the ground and bringing their CEOs to justice.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 03:51 AM
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Texas has 268,820 Sq miles of land or about 7,494,271,487,896 Sq Feet
There is a total of 57,510,000 Sq miles of land on earth.
There are 640 Acres in a sq mile.
The Population of the world is: about 6 Billion.
A person needs from .25 to .5 acres to support them for a year.


Subtract the area of Texas gives us: 57,241,180 Sq miles. Lets say only 25% is useable. So that is 14,310,295 Sq miles. That gives us: 9,158,588,800 Acres.

If you put the whole world’s population into the state of Texas each person would have about 1250 Sq feet. That would mean that the closest each person would be to another would be about 35 feet. Each would also have 1.5 acres of land to support them outside the living area, about 3-6 times what is needed.


Sound to me that there is no problem with MAKING the food. Now distribution and control are other issues.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 07:54 AM
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Another recent article on the food crisis---Although this one is more price related, due to in-large the outragious cost of fuel to ship food...But it is coming from CBS news, so it shows that this subject is garnering more attention now for an MSM outlet to run a story on it.


Gas not alone--Food Prices Way up too:Experts

And, says Stew Leonard Jr., president and CEO of the Stew Leonard grocery chain, it's those higher fuel prices that are "at the root" of steeper grocery bills.

He told Early Show co-anchor Harry Smith the tuna fisherman his chain uses tells Leonard it used to cost him $250 a day to go out on his boat, to put fuel in his boat, and now it's $1,000 a day. That cost has to be passed on."

Early Show national correspondent Hattie Kauffman points out that, "If it costs truckers more to fill their gas tanks, it'll cost more to ship produce around the country."

Other factors behind food taking a bigger bite out of consumer pocketbooks, Kauffman reports, include the falling dollar boosting prices of imported foods such as pasta, and large amounts of grain going to ethanol production and to other nations, cutting supplies here.

Some bakeries are struggling just to break even, Kauffman notes.

"The price of flour today is about four times the amount of price that it was in August, and it's going up on a weekly basis," says >Moshe Hecht, co-owner of the Schwartz Bakery and Cafe in Los Angeles. "But it's not only flour that it's affecting. It's also affecting eggs, oil, and everything that goes along with it" in producing baked goods.


Full Story:
www.cbsnews.com...


[edit on 14-3-2008 by DimensionalDetective]



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 09:17 AM
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reply to post by DimensionalDetective
 



Excellent point!

We should all be 'locavores' and eat that which is produced near us. The benefits include fresher, more nutritious food, cheaper prices because the cost of feul is not added to the total and local farmers will put revenue back into LOCAL economies. Every dime that goes into WalMart's register, goes to the home office. Even the low wage salaries, which are turned around and put back into the registers when employees do their own grocery shopping.

I admit that I do splurge and buy shrimp from the gulf coast even when I'm in Ohio for the growing season....but always when its on sale. They couldn't rely on me to keep them in shrimp sales.

I believe it will boil down to re-education and reassessment of priorities. Many people have no idea how to preserve food...it's almost a lost art.

I read a great series of books by S.A. Stirling (Hmm I could be wrong about those first two intitals)...he does a lot of alternative history themed books. These were more future-fantasy in nature. The series starts with "Dies the Fire"...and never really makes it clear why electricity and guns don't work anymore. But they don't. Society is forced to re-make itself. A picture of what would happen if those big 18-wheelers didn't show up twice a week in dense urban areas is not pretty. This book led me to look into sustainable living, sad as that is to say...whatever...it worked for me! (And it was really entertaining, too.)



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 04:33 PM
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I read about UG99 a couple of days ago and i have to say it has me worried. When someone like Norman Barluage says it's a denger you have to listen.

I have worried about the wheat crop for a long time. Also worried about the corn crop the biggest concern of mine was that we were wasting money on using corn as biofuel. A field of corn that's used for biofuel can feed hundreds of people!

We also need to start realising that the grain we produce gets used up a great deal in "growing" cattle. The western diet is a bad one, we need to start reducing our meat intake. Before someone jumps on me i don't mean become a vegetarian, i just mean reduced amounts of meat. Meat is essential to the diet i think (and we haev the teeth to prove it) but we don't need the amount we currently consume.

I've been saying for a long time we can't continue to expand the numbers of our species and support it in food. If we aren't careful then the balance will be restored for us via famine and disease.

[edit on 14-3-2008 by ImaginaryReality1984]



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 08:59 PM
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reply to post by themillersdaughter
 


You know so much about eating healthy food and I enjoy reading your posts but i must ask you why you buy oysters from the Gulf.

I live in Florida and I don't want to buy these oysters because the Gulf is so polluted now especially the New Orleans area of the Gulf.

I really like these oysters but have stopped buying them since Katrina .

I like the idea of going to produce markets. I've gone to the one here in Tampa quite a few times and their fruit and vegetables are so fresh and very reasonably priced.
When I can I buy extra and freeze them.



posted on Mar, 14 2008 @ 09:29 PM
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We are not going to run out of food. We are going to be short of food. Were lots of people will have little or none to eat. Mostly because they most likely won't have a enough money to buy food. They need to grow food year round. Probably in muti-layer green houses. But it will have to able to produce and grow food. Even if it 70 degree below zero or lower out side.



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