My daughter forced to be "pro-lifer", page 4

reply to post by Raist

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I hoped this would not turn into a never-ending debate on abortion. My query was should people other than parents be allowed to influence your child on certain moral issues and be funded by the taxpayers.

reply to post by bossman

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Now I'm a baby myself in the long terms of things (21) but I will raise my kids like this. Its not safe to have sex unprotected, or with alot of people. Theres disease and pregnancy, and a whole bunch of issues. So aim for a committed relationship, and make sure to use all the protection you got.

That, or if I'm in politics one day, I'll chemically sterilize people that fail an IQ test. Since the people on Maury seem to be of the IQ equivilency of a dried up cucumber, I figure this is the best solution.

reply to post by Holygamer

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just trying to use a little satire to describe what alot of Catholics think. Off to confession now... I'll be sin free after my 10 Hail Mary's

reply to post by Holygamer

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Hey, not a bad idea. But then you have to pick a IQ test to give, not to mention all those cry babyies saying, "what about my rights?" Blah, blah, blah.

reply to post by bossman

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whatever IQ test I score high on, we'll use that.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox

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Actually smokers and alcoholics more than likely should be denied transplants their behavior brought about the need. Where there is likely a chance that someone could need the same transplant and have never done either.

There are other reasons for being a type 2 diabetic, being addicted to sugar is not the only reason. Again denying them medical help is not the same, denying a pregnant person medical help would be the same. If someone attempts suicide and they fail it might be better to let them die after all that was what they wished to begin with right?

The treating a soldier bit was off base in the way that they are under orders and doing a job. War is at times needed (not always though) to deny this would change a great deal of history and likely take you and I as well as ATS out of the picture it said wars had not been fought. The gangbanger that takes lives of innocents and later falls victim him/her self should more than likely be left to lay there and die a slow death as well.

The sky divers thing is another way of saying people do stupid things much of the time. If we reward them by taking away all or most of the punishment life dealt to them for their actions they learn nothing. Sort of like the Darwin award if not for those feeling a need to protect us from our responsibilities there would be many more of these awards handed out so to speak.

For instance if I chose to not wear a seat belt and get into an accident the insurance company should not have to pay for my medical costs if I survive or funeral costs if I die. After all it would be my choice to take the risk so I should have to deal with it.

As for you issue with my objective attention I don’t know what to tell you. You were wrong about what I might or might not support so I suggest you might be wrong there as well. As I said I have no compassion for people who bring problems on themselves. If you don’t see that or agree with that sorry but that is who I am. I am not saying I am full pro-lifer I just don’t think it should be used as a birth control or easy way out. I also said that I should not be able to remove that right from someone who chooses it. A pro-life person wants to take away your choice.

But any way to get this thread back on subject I still say the OP should ask his daughter her thoughts and opinion on the subject.

Raist

reply to post by wrathchild

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You must not have read my first post or you would have seen I was not the one derailing your thread initially. Please go back and reread my post to you. I was wondering how basically you could complain about one place pushing their belief on your daughter when you are doing the same thing.

Ask her opinion on the subject and see what she thinks about it. By the eighth grade she should have some idea on the subject or would you rather her parrot everything she is told?

Again my first post was not a rant about pro life or choice everyone should do whatever they choose on the subject. My first post was questioning if you had thought to think of what your daughter thought about the subject.

Funny how everyone picks up only on the last few lines of my post but completely disregards the rest of it, so much for denying ignorance.

Raist

reply to post by Raist

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I have asked my daughter. She was the one that was originally uncomfortable with the project and asked my wife and I for advice. If she was happy with the project's subject matter, she would have just completed it, and we would have no problem with it. She was not sure whether she was "pro-lfe" and still had a lot of questions on the matter and that's why we intervened

reply to post by wrathchild

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I agree with you, forcing a belief system on a child is wrong. On the other hand, the school is stuck between a rock and a hard place. Alot of pressure to take a stand by parents to lazy to be parents, and pressure from responsible parents telling them to butt out. Again, too many stupid people.

reply to post by bossman

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I think schools should be able to push the envelope. If we want a society of free thinkers, we need to push the students to think beyond something thats comfortable for them, infact we need to almost insult them, and have them work a debate for or against something they may be vehemetly opposed to.

reply to post by Raist

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I dont know if you are a parent.....

As parents, the worst thing is having strangers influence your child, rather than you, the parents having the most influence.

Being an independent thinker, I hope my daughter will be one too. I'm am the last person that will try to brainwash someone, so that's why I'm so upset when a taxpayer funded school is trying so hard to push an agenda on such young malleable minds

reply to post by wrathchild

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Then tell her to stand for her beliefs and leave it at that.

If the teachers do not understand such an idea than they have no backbone or desire to be human and have a voice.

As for the idea of a tax funded organization guiding our children with moral ideas believe it or not each and every one of them do it. It might not have anything to do with religion what so ever, but you can bet your bottom dollar the teachers are guiding children in ways that bring them to their ideology. To do anything different would be not human. We as humans socialize this way people will either agree with some, all, or none of our ideas but we still convey them to each other. That is pretty much the basis of even this forum we are on right now. We are conveying our ideas and beliefs on things and there is always a chance (though less now as most are maturing) that someone will accept out ideas and make them their own.

Should they do this not really, but to ask them not to is to ask the teachers to be robots. Every teacher is going to have a bias on something and if a student talks to a teacher about something that teacher is going to give them their opinion on things. The only other choice you have is to relocate her to a different school, appeal to the school board (I assume Canada has those), home school her, or put up with it.


Raist

reply to post by Holygamer

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Very true. free thinking is good. But you do that by objectivelly presenting all the facts, and let them make the decision. I know, I know, scary idea letting a teen make a decision you have no control over, but that's the idea of a FREE thinker. trying to move their decision one way or the other by making them do a project with a one-sided slate is not the way.

reply to post by Raist

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I totally agree

I believe this taught her to stand for her beliefs

She also saw that her parents too, stood for their beliefs.

I e-mailed my daughter a link to this entire thread- I hope she reads it

reply to post by wrathchild

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I am a parent and I will influence my child up to a certain age. By the time children hit early teens and even before many times they start to form their own opinions on things. They do this because they are being influenced by others and taking what I taught them and comparing it to what others are teaching.

They have to make their own choices on which way to go with things. They may not make the right choice if not hope they learn from their mistake or they will repeat it.

I recall very well how my opinions formed and how I made mistakes and how I learned the hard way more than once. But I also learned not to repeat my stupid mistakes again. Your child will get most of their influence from you and some from their friends. They will also be influenced by teachers, your friends, and the media around them. If you think your beliefs are the best for them then you had better hope you have ingrained them in your child well enough. Regardless though I personally think this is a nonissue, the reason is that your daughter came to you about it meaning you should have no worries about any one pushing their ideas on her as she has either become a free thinker or taken to your beliefs quite well.

Influence is all over.

Raist

Originally posted by Raist
reply to post by wrathchild

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Then tell her to stand for her beliefs and leave it at that.

If the teachers do not understand such an idea than they have no backbone or desire to be human and have a voice.

As for the idea of a tax funded organization guiding our children with moral ideas believe it or not each and every one of them do it. It might not have anything to do with religion what so ever, but you can bet your bottom dollar the teachers are guiding children in ways that bring them to their ideology. To do anything different would be not human. We as humans socialize this way people will either agree with some, all, or none of our ideas but we still convey them to each other. That is pretty much the basis of even this forum we are on right now. We are conveying our ideas and beliefs on things and there is always a chance (though less now as most are maturing) that someone will accept out ideas and make them their own.

Should they do this not really, but to ask them not to is to ask the teachers to be robots. Every teacher is going to have a bias on something and if a student talks to a teacher about something that teacher is going to give them their opinion on things. The only other choice you have is to relocate her to a different school, appeal to the school board (I assume Canada has those), home school her, or put up with it.


Raist

I agree with the last part about relocating or put up with it. This IS a Catholic school system and abortion IS a black and white issue within the Catholic Church.
I don't agree with generalizing and calling teachers in a Catholic school "robots." These people are just as free of thinkers you and me. Now just because they have a set moral value system and the school backs up that moral value system encouraging them to teach it, doesn't make them robots.

The problem here is what we are teaching out kids, not what the Catholic Church is teaching. Teaching a child that when they don't like something, or something hurts their feelings make a big issue out of it is irresponsible in my opinion. What's going to happen when she grows up and her boss makes her turn in a report that she doesn't "believe in?" Is she going to quit every job that she has because she was taught to be an "independent thinker?"

reply to post by Holygamer

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So we can teach your kids how to use sex toys in a homosexual encounter, and you'll be all for it? I just want to make sure I'm hearing you right.

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