Originally posted by cpdaman
the Naomi Wolf character smearing/ deflectiion interested me so i took a look

I love how disagreement is "character-smearing" and "deflection." And here I thought "dissent was patriotic." I guess that only applies if you are dissenting against the right people. Speaking of fascism...

But I digress.

I cannot speak for anyone else, but I am not trying to character smear Naomi Wolf. I am pointing out how I do not think she is doing anything particularly brave, and how frankly, it's a bit cliche. You don't like your opponent, label them a Nazi or a fascist.

Truth is, this country has flirted with fascism/communism* in the past, skirting much closer than Bush Administration may or may not be. If you don't believe me, read what happened during the Woodrow Wilson Administration (we had our own version of the brownshirts!). Read what happened during the FDR Administration, his battles with John T. Flynn. Read about how FDR equated any disgareement with him to treason. Read about his battles with the America First Committees; he labelled them Nazis (and by default, labelled JFK and Gore Vidal, young members of AFC).

Would Naomi Wolf point this out? I doubt it. Her point isn't to warn Americans about the dangers of fascism, but to push her own political agenda.

*I lump them together. When you get down to brass-tacks, there is little to distinguish between Authoritarian governments, despite whatever labels they may attach to themselves

its funny, because Naomi Wolf and others are just realizing whats already here. We ARE a fascist society. We've been this way for almost 50 years. Our votes aren't counted, our elections faked, our journalists persecuted or murdered, our people detained, our students tased our killed, our industry focusing on war and death, and the privatization of the military and the push against liberty increasing double fold each day. This is nothing new. But it's not SUPPOSED to be like this.

Mussolini once said "Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power."

I forget who said it on this thread, but somebody stated that the "blueprint" is vague enough to be applied to any country right now. Thats sadly because the push for Corporatism is worldwide, in most first world countries. It's just as the shift for democracy actually had occurred slowly in many different countries, a shift for a new political system, more "suited" for the 21st century, is forming.

The question is, do you really want private military and corporate interests run your country, or do you want to run your country.

Think long and hard, weigh both sides, and then decide what you want to do.

I am glad that Naomi Wolfe is stating her case regarding the fine line that is the U.S. following in the footsteps of Nazi Germany. I have made this point myself before in the recent past on ATS. What she is doing is actually not new. There has been talk about this twist of fate for many many years now. That the current administation and all those cohorts that are invovled are pushing this elitist agenda is no surprise.

It would seem that the one who is elected to lead our country and actually others who lead other countries are based on those who are willing to sell themselves to the elitist heart and soul to move along the long time agenda. What many do not realize is that there is no real time table as some will try to point out. Cause the whole issue is about an ebb and flow type of process. If things seem like clear sailing, then movement is made to forward the agenda, but if to many are making to much noise or watching to closely and the numbers start to rise regarding decent against the agenda, then it all flows back in the shadows for a while.

It is about taking control of a planet and goes beyond the elitist themselves for they too have their marching orders. You can reach the pinnicle of the pyramid and yet there is one more level above that which the all seeing eye of RA is all about. Does that implicate any past charactor in history named RA, maybe but more than likely not. For everything at the higher levels is about deception beyond the means of even our smartest minds could no doubt understand. But in simple terms it's about a world wide take over and has been going on now for beyond normal comprehension.

Another point I will state once again is that history repeats itself over and over until their comes a action or reaction that sends the path in a new direction. This has not yet taken place so we are now following the steps of Nazi Germany, from gun laws, to the same fear factors that government set upon its own people and many other people of the world during that brief time in history.

If we as a collective whole population on this world continue to allow these types of games to be played upon us, then eventually the circle will be broken, but not in a "good" peaceful way. Anarchy is starting to peak over the horizon for our world and with it comes complete domination and control. If you do not like it, then you will not be asekd to leave, you will automatically just be eliminated as that too is all part of the agenda. You can not have the type of world population that we have right now and expect to exert the required type of control.

So folks, when you hear all this stuff about greenhouse effects and such, know it is just a part of the game towards planned euthanasia of the majority of population. That goes for the wars too. Sorry to all that fight those wars for valient reasons, the truth would not make most soldiers happy campers to know that they faught and that many gave their lives for an agenda that will see them dead regardless too.

It pains me to have to say these things, cause all of us are awesome people and do not deserve this type of treatment. The lies continue daily and until the truth can find its way out in the light of day and night, we are all just pawns in the game.

Remember that prophecy does not have to be, because each and everyone of us has free will of choice to make a change. Whatever and whoever you believe in, know that we each have this right regardless and so if we use it, then we are doing the real will of the GOD of all things. You have been lied too, if you think on this it will make sense. Make changes together for ourselves and this world and put a stop to the fear and take over of this world. We need to all do the right thing!

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Right.... I agree.. Partisan divides are bad? .. However.. the reason I don't like the woman, is not her outcome, but her drive.. its entirely partisan and completely biased and therefore ... is exactly as you say -- dividing.

Not to mention all of her points are politically motivated - she does not have American safety as an agenda, nor care for this nation but her own political ideologies.

I fully disagree with you. I am about as unpartisan as one can get, but she merely confirmed for me what I had concluded about what the Elite are doing to bring this country to someplace that was not where the Founding Individuals would say they had in mind.

I did not see partisanship so much as historical comparison, based on a known formula, with what the administration is doing here in the US of A. I don't think she was putting forth the idea that the Democrats are the answer. She is saying it is each of us, regardless of our partisanship or party that must stand boldly and not let this happen.

Might you have voted for Bush...?

Originally posted by stangraff
This person's comparison between the USA and the Nazis is laughable. She might as well compare our healthcare system to the holocaust. I should charge this woman money for wasting my time reading the article and watching the YouTube video. All of the people in the audience should do the same. She does not know what she is talking about. It appears that she has some personal need to have people pay attention to her so she cooks up some headline that will draw people in. She should go to the humane society and adopt a dog. It would at least be productive and she may satisfy her feeling of personal emptiness. She is really pathetic.

Well, I am saddened to hear you say so. Really, I'm not sure you said anything more than "she's stupid." Tell me, are you incapable of seeing the correlations? I saw them years ago, building and coming more rapidly. The "enemy combatant" issue was both expected and grossly unnerving for me when that power was handed over to the pres.

More and more... But you keep on keeping on. Me, I'm ready to fight, the "pen" in my hand.

Everyone should read SaviorComplex's posts...

He speaks the truth about this.

She isn't doing anything THAT brave...
I mean come on, this is America, we have a cartoon making direct fun of our current president.
Try doing that in another country and see if you could get away with it.
I think she is just trying to push her political agenda...

BUT if she is right...
Then there won't be another election right?
I mean, she talks about dictators, so that would mean that the current administration doesnt plan on leaving...
This is something that we will get to see soon, so lets play the waiting game...

but SaviorComplex has it right, when it comes, it will be welcomed with open arms...
The govt will promise us this and that, and all we have to do is give up a few rights...
We've done it before.
We'll do it again.

Originally posted by Odessy

BUT if she is right...
Then there won't be another election right?
I mean, she talks about dictators, so that would mean that the current administration doesnt plan on leaving...
This is something that we will get to see soon, so lets play the waiting game...

Again, people are missing the whole point.

It has nothing really to do with partisanship, which side you choose, candidate, etc......these are all "Red Herrings", as the propaganda is also.

We have an elite cartel controlling everything here in the US and everywhere else in the world, they buy both sides in Washington long before any election takes place. To these elite a half billion dollars, to each side for elections is nothing, just like loose change on the floor of your car.

How good can people actually feel if they are always picking the less of two evils or parties that are already loyal to the cartel?

This woman is just re-iterating facts discovered and cross referencing what she sees as similar paths. Will it happen? Only if the masses allow it.

War is not the answer, but awareness is and if that takes people only being 30% correct in what they say, then so be it. I will take the 30% accuracy of the individual compared to the 100% BS that we hear from our government, media, and cartel.

[edit on 6-3-2008 by Realtruth]

Originally posted by SaviorComplexAnd when that day comes, Naomi Wolf will be among those applauding it's arrival.

What does this mean I thought she was against it?

Originally posted by Odessy
Everyone should read SaviorComplex's posts...

He speaks the truth about this.

She isn't doing anything THAT brave...
I mean come on, this is America, we have a cartoon making direct fun of our current president.
Try doing that in another country and see if you could get away with it.
I think she is just trying to push her political agenda...

BUT if she is right...
Then there won't be another election right?
I mean, she talks about dictators, so that would mean that the current administration doesnt plan on leaving...
This is something that we will get to see soon, so lets play the waiting game...

but SaviorComplex has it right, when it comes, it will be welcomed with open arms...
The govt will promise us this and that, and all we have to do is give up a few rights...
We've done it before.
We'll do it again.

Why leave the same puppet in office when you get to do damage control every 4-8 years by simply replacing them with another as loyal puppet? By not doing so the people over time will begin to smell the stench and they will come to realize the scam being perpetrated upon them. This is the main difference between a third world and a first world. The first world uses covert and coveting to advance their agenda, meanwhile the third world used old work tact.

Originally posted by WolfofWar

How's them freedom fries?

I guess you can only lead a horse to water...

Ok, now back to our regularly scheduled program Britney, Dancing with the Stars, American Idol, these are not truly not a waste of time, but true beacons for the masses.

[edit on 6-3-2008 by Realtruth]

Originally posted by RexxCrow

Originally posted by SaviorComplexAnd when that day comes, Naomi Wolf will be among those applauding it's arrival.

What does this mean I thought she was against it?

Read my earlier posts. I think I made it clear. However, just in case I didn't, I will elaborate.

She is against it, but just in the form she is warning against. If it were to present itself in a form that is appealing to her, she would embrace it. I have suggested reading the history of America during the Wilson and FDR Administrations.* Would Naomi Wolf classify what happened in those instances, particularly the FDR era, as encroaching fascism?

It is doubtful. FDR is held up by both sides and historians as one of the greatest American presidents. In many ways, the American Left has been attempting a return to that era, if only in spirit. It is safe to assume that Wolf is among those lauding the policies of FDR. However, a close examination shows that FDR skirted much, much closer to Authoritarianism than Bush may or may not have. Naomi Wolf would have applauded it, because what was happening (e.g. the New Deal) would have seemed appealing to her.

* this isn't to say that other administrations have not down similar things. Rather, I use Wilson and FDR as examples from Wolf's side of the political divide.

[edit on 6-3-2008 by SaviorComplex]

[edit on 6-3-2008 by SaviorComplex]