The Sorcery Conspiracy

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posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 02:22 PM
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reply to post by asmeone
 


That's an interesting idea that drugs empty the spirit or make one almost soul-less. I say that with a scripture in mind because we are talking about opening oneself up to demons....
Jesus taught,


3"When an evil spirit comes out of a man, it goes through arid places seeking rest and does not find it. 44Then it says, 'I will return to the house I left.' When it arrives, it finds the house unoccupied, swept clean and put in order. 45Then it goes and takes with it seven other spirits more wicked than itself, and they go in and live there. And the final condition of that man is worse than the first. That is how it will be with this wicked generation."


Note I underlined what occurred to me. Now Jesus was teaching about being cleansed or exorcised of a demon and by inviting it back it brings seven of its friends with it and you're worse than when you started. I understand the "finding the house unoccupied part" to mean the Holy Spirit is not there.

Christians believe that we have the Holy Spirit dwelling inside of us. If you get high or drunk you are exposing the Holy Spirit to that subsance and state of being. I don't think the Holy Spirit likes to get high. Maybe it does leave...? until you sober up...

reply to post by Elisha4Yah
 


Hey that's Stevie Nicks in your Avatar - no fair, I'm distracted now...


Thank you for the compliment. It's funny you mention the name thing. Now you wrote Yahshua, but I have seen it as Yeshua with an 'e'. The truth is, no human knows for certain, it may have been something like Yeshua (or perhaps Yehoshua). It certainly was not Jesus that his family and friends addressed him in day-to-day conversation while he was growing up in Nazareth. I guess I use Jesus most of the time because everyone knows who I am talking about.


reply to post by ZeroG
 



I cant make sense of this thread. Is it religion (the opiate of the people) or Drugs (the substances that release the mind alterants already in us), or the responsibility to be good and loving people no matter what you do, say, use, wear, practice, create, or believe?


I have to disagree with you on the "opiate of the people" thing. And Drugs don't just release what's already there. There's no THC or ethanol already in your blood and the drugs that do work that way like '___' put a super physiological amount in you that is not natural. That said, it's really not what we are discussing. Thanks for the post.


reply to post by gb540
 


I'm really glad you noticed what I said about the clean/unclean teaching in Levitical law being 3000 years ahead of modern medicine. It's true. That is one of the little tidbits that shows the divine inspiration of the scriptures. I believe God made the rules to help us - not to keep us from anything worth having.



[edit on 3/1/2008 by Bigwhammy]




posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:00 PM
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Dear OP,

I honestly wished your "Reach For Truth" wasn't hampered by the short arms of the Bible, or religion in general.

Your thread is based on the most edited, revised, and censored book in human history. I'm not even sure you fully understand the term Bible. (You quoted from the book of Enoch, which is only part of the "Ethiopian" Bible.) There isn't one universally accepted Bible! "Our" KJV is only one version.

All the original Greek and Hebrew manuscripts are gone. So we can't go back to the source. The "current" canonized version was pieced together by Ecumenical Councils. There are many missing books (short list):

Book of Jasher (referenced @ Joshua 10:13)
Book of the Wars of the Lord (referenced @ Numbers 21:14)
The Book of Shemaiah (referenced @ II Chronicles 12:14-15)

I worry when "Disciple of Truth / Champion of Faith" blindly follow a book that was clearly written and edited with sociopolitical ideologies in mind. Has it ever occurred to you that institutionalized religions are very wary of free thinking? (Astronomy comes to mind). Maybe the use of certain herbs would enable you to "free" your mind, and put you on a direct line with God. No need for a middle man called religion! OP, I'm not talking about the rampant, perverted use of modern "recreational drugs". (That and the involvement of the Vatican's bank (OIR) in drug money laundering would be a whole new thread.)

I worry even more when people start to claim that only they can see the "real" meaning in scripture.

OP: "So why is it that we never hear this taught as it was meant to be taught? Why aren’t better translations used?"

I could argue that you are under the influence of a drug called "God complex". Without knowing you're treading on a narrow, and dangerous path.

Free your mind, deny arrogance.

Love



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:10 PM
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reply to post by crestone
 


I could spend time refuting your remarks. But I won't.

I anticipated this sort of response didn't you see the first thing I wrote?

Note: I am a Christian. The topic of this thread is not my faith or anyone else's. This is a conspiracy theory involving the suppression of a Biblical teaching. If that bothers you please have some courtesy just read another thread. I welcome people of all faiths to share insight into why this teaching might be suppressed.


There are plenty of threads trying to discredit Christianity and the Bible already up. Perhaps you should go and post in one of them.

Thanks for the post, sorry if I ruined your buzz.







[edit on 3/1/2008 by Bigwhammy]



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:18 PM
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My contention is there has been a conspiracy to with hold the true meaning of the Bibles teaching on Sorcery.


In ancient times people knew (generally speaking) how to drive out demons and the unwanted entities. The prophets were killed and silenced and the knowledge was lost and replaced with a coping mechanism that does not bring about change. Most people live on this merry-go-round and because they do not know the truth they do what they see other people do and what the (note: some are blind) ministers tell them they should do.

Sorcery utilizes evil spirits. It is the original (ancient) bioweapon. If you are not awake, they do not need to use much, but, when the revelation of Jesus and or the understanding of the truth comes, the “controllers” will seek to kill those whom they can not control. The teaching on this stopped because they do not want people to know how to drive out the unwanted. Therefore, people, do not even realize that they are being duped, “they are led like a lamb to the slaughter”.

The brighter side of this is that God being fully aware of the evil rulers, will not allow one to awaken until ready to do so. This is where the church has it right, you must have a solid foundation.

All sickness and disease is a form of sorcery. It may be that most people who turn to drugs are in reality trying to kill the invader. Prescriptions, try to do the same thing, and while some may not kill the invader, they allow one to be functional but, come with side effects.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:30 PM
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Originally posted by Bigwhammy

reply to post by Elisha4Yah
 


Hey that's Stevie Nicks in your Avatar - no fair, I'm distracted now...


Thank you for the compliment. It's funny you mention the name thing. Now you wrote Yahshua, but I have seen it as Yeshua with an 'e'. The truth is, no human knows for certain, it may have been something like Yeshua (or perhaps Yehoshua). It certainly was not Jesus that his family and friends addressed him in day-to-day conversation while he was growing up in Nazareth. I guess I use Jesus most of the time because everyone knows who I am talking about.



About the name (and not to get off topic) although mis translations is a big part of your topic. I have spelled Yahshua several ways. Spelling isn't an issue here at all. I've had people mis spell my name all my life lol! But it is the pronunciation that is key Imagine for a moment being in a somewhat crowded place and someone needs you from accross the room they are calling you and your name is Bob and they are calling Alan. BIG problem. You can't answer them because Alan isn't your name and in fact doesn't even sound like Bob. Stupid example, I know, but you get the point.

You missed a huge piece of what I stated before. You asked why people aren't using the correct translation because the incorrect translation can mislead. I agreed with you and pointed out the most important mistranslation of all time. Do you see how we harden our hearts??? Even me, born into a family of believers, always having been taught Jesus, even all the Sunday school songs I grew up singing with Jesus in them. After 20+ years of calling Him Jesus, it isn't easy to swallow much less accept that we've been calling Him by the wrong name. We have to abandon ourselves to Him and that means sometimes forgetting what we've always been taught and accepting that we've BEEN deceived for a very long time. The mystery of iniquity was already at work 2000+ years ago!!! The lawless one could not wait for the first fruits to leave.

Acts 5:27-29 And when they had brought them, they set them before the council: and the high priest asked them, saying, Did we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and behold you have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us. Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

So the question we have to ask ourselves is who have we obeyed over the years? Do you not think for one minute that preachers, pastors, bishops and even popes don't know the REAL name of our Messiah? I asked a preacher that comes into my work every Wednesday if he knew what our Messiahs true name was, he said yes, Yahshua. He said "I don't use that name because the people......"..Who are we to obey????? the people or God? How can anyone know unless we do tell them? These preachers and leaders of congregations have made themselves tenders to the flock while the true Shepherd is away, and they know the truth but don't preach it because...? It's not good. I'm telling you, the bible is clear on the punishment for deceiving and preaching false doctrine. The disciples gave their very lives for that name to be known. They refused to listen to even the high priest, they feared no man, no matter how he might beat them or toss them in prison for using THAT NAME.

(Rev 3:8) Yahshua's very own words....I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word and hast not denied my name

I'm not your enemy. I believe we are in the restoration period. And His name is just one of the many truths kept back that is now being restored. We can accept it or deny it, we can share it hide it.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:37 PM
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reply to post by Siren
 


Interesting post Siren! I have often wondered if all disease is a physiological reaction to a spiritual attack. When man became separated from God death came into the world. Are germs and virus' tools of the principalities, powers, and rulers of darkness that Paul talks about in Ephesians 6:12. Probably so.
I recall when Satan afflicted Job he made him sick, he caused boils to form on his body. I guess as believers it comes down to the question: "does anything really happen by accident?"

In todays world, people are quick to seek a chemical solution to what may be a spiritual problem. For instance depression that is situational and not a chemical imbalance. Are they deceived? Perhaps so. I guess that is the conspiracy for our very souls.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:43 PM
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reply to post by Elisha4Yah
 


Hey absolutely I love what your saying. I like to learn new things. I apologize if I act like a mister know it all > I don't!!

You are convicting me on the Yeshua thing. I've heard teachers say it that way and I liked it, but I secretly wondered were they trying to impress me.


But that's most likely my ego. Oh well, live and learn. I agree with you.


edit->I gave you a star


[edit on 3/1/2008 by Bigwhammy]



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:57 PM
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reply to post by Bigwhammy
 



It certainly was not Jesus that his family and friends addressed him in day-to-day conversation while he was growing up in Nazareth. I guess I use Jesus most of the time because everyone knows who I am talking about.


This is puzzling because prior to the birth of Jesus they were instructed to call his name Immanuel and for it there are two spellings.


Isaiah 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.



Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.


Every time they rewrite the Bible there are changes and omissions which is why God said he would write the law on their hearts. Perhaps this is the underlying reason for sorcery.


[edit on 1-3-2008 by Siren]



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 03:59 PM
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Off-topic: it's beautiful here in Wichita today! Hurrah and Thank You Lord for the beautiful weather! MY old bones have been hurting so much lately.

Anyway, back on topic. From my experience, in this long journey on the this 'ole planet, is that Jesus, Yashua, Emmanuel....however you want to address Him----He's always listening and responding!

Just imagine the loss of souls if He was waiting on one specific name WITH the proper pronunciation on top of that before answering it.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by Siren
reply to post by Bigwhammy
 


This is puzzling because prior to the birth of Jesus they were instructed to call his name Immanuel and for it there are two spellings.

Every time they rewrite the Bible there are changes and omissions which is why God said he would write the law on their hearts. Perhaps this is the underlying reason for sorcery.


To be clear... they do not rewrite the Bible. They retranslate it. I don't believe there are omissions either. I don't want anyone to get the wrong impression.

It has remained remarkably accurate over time, considering it was hand copied on scrolls. They have very old Hebrew manuscripts, like the Dead Sea scrolls, that when compared to copies that were 1000+ years newer; were almost identical. That is reassuring.

However, translations are a tough thing. A words meaning can change over time. For instance if I told someone 100 years ago that they were "cool" - they would assume I meant temperature. Right? The KJV is pretty old school it was meant to reflect the common language of that time. I like the NIV. Theologians and preachers often go back to the original Hebrew and Greek text. In cases like this you look up what the Greek word means and (wow) sorcery means drugs. Who would've thought it?

I don't think Immanuel was ever meant to be a proper name but a prophecy of the messiah.

I really don't know for sure.

But I bet AshleyD does!






[edit on 3/1/2008 by Bigwhammy]



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 04:48 PM
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Okay, I'll jump in here in give my take on it. The way I interpret the word "sorceries" in the Bible, is not necessarily the substance that was used, but what the substance was used for. The fallen angels or whoever they were that taught this evil were obviously taken care of in the flood. Am I not right on that? (Don't have a check with me to see).

There were, are and always will be natural healing substances that could be used opposite of their intended purpose. I have to agree that medicines today can be both a help and a hindrance. I have many illnesses and take lots of prescribed drugs for them. I feel better when I take them, so I am glad for them. But I could take too much of one of them an die. That's definitely not good, so my point is...it's what we do with the substance, not the substance itself.

However, big pharma with it's more than large lobby of the government, puts drugs on the market before they are adequately tested for safety. This in my mind could be a form of sorcery. But I don't think that would be the same form of sorcery mentioned in the texts.

As mentioned above, I believe it's the ultimate evil created from the substance, or combining of substances, that defined sorcery.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 04:50 PM
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Originally posted by Bigwhammy
And they did not repent of their murders or their sorceries or their sexual immorality or their thefts." Gr. pharmakeus); from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion); a druggist ("pharmacist") or poisoner, i.e. (by extension) a magician: sorcerer.


When it says thefts, do you think it means file sharing, and if so, should file-sharers be worried?


[edit on 1-3-2008 by rizla]



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 04:51 PM
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May I also add something else here. The commandments given to the Israelites were given not only to show them how bad they were and what goodness looks like, but also to teach them how to live clean, healthy lives and live a long time.

I'm not talking about just the 10 commandments here, but the 613 or so commandments given in Leviticus.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 04:56 PM
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reply to post by Bigwhammy
 



There might have been "good drugs" in the Bible but you haven't shown that. To make any sort of point you should provide verses and the translations as I have done.


Plants eaten fresh are not drugs. Once a plant is harvested and preserved that is considered a drug. Today, the term drug is used differently and I believe in ancient times was called "cockle, weed and obnoxious".

Genesis 1:12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

Genesis 9:3 Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything.

Hebrews 6:7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God.

Job 31:40 Let thistles grow instead of wheat, and cockle instead of barley. The words of Job are ended.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 05:04 PM
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reply to post by idle_rocker
 



I have many illnesses and take lots of prescribed drugs for them.


Until we learn how to do differently, or remedy differently this will remain a part of our society. The fact is, the prescribed drugs you take are not a cure. If they were, you would take them and get well.

What Jesus, Immanuel, Yeshua did was get to the root of the problem. This is what we should know how to do, but, we don't.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 05:04 PM
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reply to post by rizla
 


Yes, you should be worried. You have been caught and I wouldn't open the door if I were you



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 05:05 PM
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reply to post by Siren
 


Obviously those verses refer to plants for food. I'm not sure what you are trying to say. I never said all plants were drugs.

Sorcery is using them to alter your state of mind. Fresh or not it doesn't really matter. Like idle_rocker mentioned it's more about the intent.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by Teki187
 




Pharmacy is the evolution of Alchemy and Alchemy is using chemicals, nothing else.


So is chemistry.

The version of god depicted in the bible is against knowledge. He forbade Adam from eating from the tree of knowledge and cursed him for doing so.

Science is all about knowledge and it would have been banned if it was organized during those times (when the church and Roman government were powerful & compiled the bible). Fortunately for mankind, some of us evolved and advanced intellectually beyond superstitions.

Knowledge is like acid to religion. With knowledge, we know how to test and verify if something is true. Knowledge helps free the mind to learn more about the world we live in. There are no absolutes. The last thing religious institutions want is a free thinker. Most religious ideas can not withstand scientific scrutiny and will be revealed for what it is. Superstition.

[edit on 1-3-2008 by nikolat23]



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by Siren
reply to post by idle_rocker
 



I have many illnesses and take lots of prescribed drugs for them.


Until we learn how to do differently, or remedy differently this will remain a part of our society. The fact is, the prescribed drugs you take are not a cure. If they were, you would take them and get well.

What Jesus, Immanuel, Yeshua did was get to the root of the problem. This is what we should know how to do, but, we don't.




I agree with you that they are not a cure. But I will continue to take them because I believe medicine, when properly used, is part of God's plan for healing. And without them, I would not be able to support myself.

Yes, I have prayed for healing. And when God is ready, he will heal me. Paul lived with a thorn in the flesh his entire life.



posted on Mar, 1 2008 @ 05:27 PM
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Originally posted by Bigwhammy

This was before they disobeyed God and he cursed the ground.


Where does it say in Genesis that because they disobeyed God, they no longer had access to all seed bearing plants to use? No where.



17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
"Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat of it
all the days of your life.

18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.


Right. This just means God made it more painful for Eve to have babies, and made it harder for Adam to reap crops from the Earth. This means that while Adam obviously still has access to all seed bearing plants, otherwise he could not work the ground to begin with, thus it being made more difficult by God, it's just now become more difficult, requiring more effort and time, to reap your harvests. But you shall still reap your harvests. And theres nothing in this verse that leds me or anyone else to believe for one second that God revoked the gift of permission to use all seed bearing plants to mankind, in fact, it supports the fact that God still allowed the plants, because it mentions Adam growing them, how it will be more difficult now.

On the subject of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, some in the Rastafarian sect believe that the tree of knowledge was actually Cannabis, and that they ate of the buds, becoming chastised by God. This is why they burn the plant, a symbolic burning of the tree of knowledge, so as to sacrifice the tree to God, to say .. my ancestors disobeyed you by eating of this tree therefore I shall burn it to the ground!



What about the seed bearing plant the Rosary Pea (also called castor bean)?
Is it ok to eat ? Keep in mind that one seed is fatal

Your logic sounds good on the surface. It doesn't really hold up.


You do not have to use what you are given, or find. God has given us all seed bearing plants to use, but we dont have to use them all. And Castor Beans are useful, just not to consume, they are made into something, I forget exactly what that is right now, but indeed mankind uses it. Another example which backs up my argument, you're making me look good here.
j/k



Medicine does wonderful things for mankind, but it also does horrible things. This thread is about the Bibles teaching. So far I haven't seen a shred of evidence for good drug use.


I totally wholeheartedly agree 100%. I've had bad experiences with medicines, and doctors, and so has my family. I've seen so much pain and suffering in my life and others' that I love caused by pharmaceutical medications that it is unbelievable. What's worse, the Doctors who prescribe it half the time don't even know all that they should, and fail to tell you that using this medication regularly will make it impossible to quit without slowly weening off, which in itself is a number of weeks of absolute hell, most medications anyways. I'm talking psychoactive compounds.. anti-depressants, anti-anxiety agents, pain medications, sedatives, etc.


[edit on 3/1/2008 by runetang]





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