Proof if there's GOD?

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
Easy answer: Why not?

Harder answer: Why not... what?

What are you talking about? That's what I'm saying. I can't figure it out.

I would guess that if most people really sat down and thought about what they have in their minds for a definition of "God," they'd be surprised to find a kind of mishmash of children's stories and words they just kind of gloss over without really understanding their meaning. And nobody has yet been able to give me a good solid definition that we can seriously sit down and debate with. If you're going to throw "God is love" at me, then we basically all just go home at that point, because we've run into the incomprehensible wall again.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


Heheh...tell that to the poor platypus! He's gotta look in the mirror every morning Again, I think enviromental circumstances created the platypus - for whatever reason, millions of years ago, the shape and form of a platypus helped it adapt and survive in it's somewhat inhospitable situation. Heck, even Australians are not (ahem) really like any one else on the planet y'kow

J.

reply to post by Becker44


A jesus cracker? Maybe we've finally dug up something a little more concrete here! Do you have the eBay number?

J.

reply to post by Nohup


Why not make something you have no conceivable need for? You don't have to need or desire to do. You can, therefore you will.

As for the definition of God.. .Well, I already covered that. God isn't love, but love is god. So is indifference. And bunnies. And the herpes virus. And my pet rock. And you. And decaying seaweed.

Again though, I doubt this is what anypne's looking for, since when I say "god", I'm transcending the concept of "deity"...

[edit on 27-2-2008 by TheWalkingFox]

The way I see it, if people can wholeheartedly believe in the existance of the mysterious planet X and its inhabitance with no solid eveidence why can we not believe in GOD or a supreme being of sorts?
One of my favorite verses (apologies for quotiing the bible in a religious discussion ) is Hebrews 11:1 "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."
Without getting too deep, there a some who would say the fact that your faith is waivering is a good thing. The stronger you are with God the more you are tested....blah blah blah.....

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


It's "God is Love."
Not the reverse.

reply to post by Clearskies


I believe I made the distinction between this phrasing, and my own in a prior post, didn't I?

All things are divine. It is the sum, not the total that counts.

reply to post by Clearskies


Nope - Fox meant to say exactly what he/she said. 'Love Is God'.

J.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by Clearskies

 

I believe I made the distinction between this phrasing, and my own in a prior post, didn't I?

All things are divine. It is the sum, not the total that counts.

I think maybe you're just a shade too deep for some here But please - keep up the good work. You're not one of those darn 'multi-reincarnates' having a little jest with us poor earthly slobs are you?


J.

Originally posted by Nohup


So you're the kind of touchy-feely, "God must exist because things feel good and little bunnies are cute," kind of definer. God is a kind of kindly old artist/chemist who paints pretty pictures with chemicals. I'm guessing you're thinking white beard, too, except when you think about it really hard and get really serious and grown up. Then he's probably clean-shaven.

No I wouldn't presume anything as tame as that. When the Jewish high priest went into the Holy of Holies to make the annual sin offering, they would tie a rope around his leg. Because he would frequently drop dead at the sight of God.

Now, why would a being (if you could even call it that) that essentially has and is everything not only "desire" to create something, but be even be able to? Remember... is and has everything already.

Now why would a being as falliable and fragile as a man suppose he could
comprehend the mind of that which created him?

I know you don't believe the Bible, but I believe God knew we would ask that question. So he addressed it in his word.

7 Let the wicked forsake his way
and the evil man his thoughts.
Let him turn to the LORD, and he will have mercy on him,
and to our God, for he will freely pardon.

8 "For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways,"
declares the LORD.

9 "As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thoughts.

Isaiah 55:7-9

reply to post by jimbo999


Multi-whats? I don't think I'm a multivitamin or whatever that was. I'm pretty sure I'm Irish / Choctaw

reply to post by Bigwhammy



Finished? Right then.

Well, the OP asked for physical proof of some kind for your deity's existence. Quoting the Bible is not what he was looking for. In fact - it's probably the quickest way to alienate most people here.

Do you have any videos, pics, sound files or secret government documentation that you can offer him that may go some way to actually proving the existence of your 'god'?

That, as I understand it, was the original question.

J.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by jimbo999

 

Multi-whats? I don't think I'm a multivitamin or whatever that was. I'm pretty sure I'm Irish / Choctaw

Irish/Choctaw!! Wow! What a wierd coincidence!! I'm. well...part Irish too!! (the good part, that is. Not too sure about the other half..).

So you're SURE you're not a monotheistic multi-dimensional veganized prophet of some sort, right? I mean - you WOULD tell us right??

J.

Alright, here's my thoughts on this:
It has been determined that if the Earth was any closer to the sun or to the moon then it could not sustain the life that it does. The gases in our air are all independently poisonous for us to breathe, yet they are perfectly mixed every second of every day for us to breathe. If our bodies just stop breathing then we die. Yet everything in our world is held in perfect check every day and we life the lives that we do. Waaaayyyyyy too many coincidences for my taste. Too many coincidences that we as humans just decided one day to grow lungs, grow legs and arms and walk out of the water and stand upright and invent Starbucks and sit around and drink coffee. Something has to be behind all of it as far as I'm concerned. That's just too many chance occurances. If Christians are wrong about God and Jesus, then we have lost nothing. If Christians are right, we've gained eternity. It's not a gamble I'm willing to take.

reply to post by Christian Voice


This is a lot like saying that horses are perfectly designed to pull carts.

The organisms on this planet developed to the conditions htey were presented, not the other way around.

Originally posted by Nohup
Here's my standard reply:

I've never seen or heard of anyone who has been able to come up with a good, coherent definition of "God" that doesn't contain within it its own fundamentally negating paradoxes or contradictions. And without a decent definition, it's impossible to debate about the existence of such a thing, or person, or whatever. The entire thing makes no sense to me at all any more, to the point where I don't even consider myself an atheist, because you at least need to have a definition or basic understanding of what you don't believe in, and I don't even have that.

[edit on 27-2-2008 by Nohup]

Hello,

Maybe your whole problem is with the term "god," which is an incorrect word in the Hebrew and which is brought over and translated into the English as a coverall "god." It's incorrect. No wonder people don't understand anything relating to the Scriptures because either (a), they listen to the false translation or (b), they're too lazy to research the fact that it's incorrect.

So I can truly see why people don't understand there is a true creator because they're too lazy to research it themselves. It figures! Everyone has the chance now to do so. In the years to come, they won't have any chance and will be begging for the chance.

Tiza

if you want video proof of god, go get your handy cam, record yourself an put the vid up here, bam you have given more proof that god exsists then of him/her/it/1 not.

Simply by being here you are proof of god or what everyone deems as god, becuz you are alive, you see birds you see other animals, the sky is blue we breath air but then u leave our wonderious planet an you have no birds, no animals just space an all the elements to make animals an birds an humans but they arent put together in that form, just here on earth that is so, prolly elsewhere but when you draw a picture you normaly use one peice of paper, but take all your drawings an put them together you have our Universe.

Yes I have proven god exsists about as much as Rodger Clemens Said he took steroids, but still we are here discussing his exsistence and really that proves alot to me, at least in my belief of God ( us all being god, humans, animals, plants, stars, etc, at more like Extensions ( limbs ) of God. All of us together Make up god ) God still thinks and is without us, but at the same time we are all apart of god.

Jesus was a example of how god wanted us to treat one another, he was a rolemodel, honestly if we all were as understanding an kind as jesus was, Would we be having the same problems as today? Most likely not, we would be having the problem of " so what do we do with all this extra food, and shelter, an all this money.... "

Life needs to be Simple, it is that once you make more of life then what it really is you start running into more an more problems ( kinda like not being happy with the Circle going thru the Circle sized hole an wanting it to go thru the triangle hole.... )

Your proof of god is in every mirror, every picture, every Youtube video you can find.... We are proof.

[edit on 27-2-2008 by Trance Optic]

[edit on 27-2-2008 by Trance Optic]

reply to post by Christian Voice


I think you've got it the wrong way round there - and most reputable scholars would agree with me 100% on this one.

The organisims on this planet - over billions of years - adapted to the conditions on this planet - not the other way around. It's called evolution. And everything science has discovered points to this being the case.

If this planet were further away from the sun, would life have evolved here? Maybe. Maybe not. But there are billions of suns similar to ours out there - any one of them likely to have evolved life forms similar, or even radically different to ours. The probablities are as endless as the number of stars - and the odds are very good that millions of planets hold intelligent life out there.

Creation??? Nah. Simple chemistry.

J.

In short:

No, there's absolutely no evidence for the existence of ANY sort of supreme being that can be labeled "God".

There is however empirical evidence as to the existence of gravity. Why not label gravity as your God?

Originally posted by Nohup
Here's my standard reply:

I've never seen or heard of anyone who has been able to come up with a good, coherent definition of "God" that doesn't contain within it its own fundamentally negating paradoxes or contradictions. And without a decent definition, it's impossible to debate about the existence of such a thing, or person, or whatever. The entire thing makes no sense to me at all any more, to the point where I don't even consider myself an atheist, because you at least need to have a definition or basic understanding of what you don't believe in, and I don't even have that.

[edit on 27-2-2008 by Nohup]

If only more Atheists took this approach, I'd have so much more respect for them. Truly an admirable position when considering evidence and rationality.

I sort-of feel the same way, interestingly enough. I, in my opinion and faith believe in One God and Two Worlds, but still yet, that One God and that "other world" cannot be defined in "this world". So why try.

If you want to believe, believe. It is within your capacity. If you do not want to, don't, but you can't say he exists or doesnt exist, it cannot be addressed.